Maintenance for the week of April 6:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
The need for "I quit" threads.
-
Reevster✭✭✭✭✭
Maybe so but they dont need to post , just read....
The entire idea behind posting is to get the thing that made them leave out in the open in hopes it gets changed. Saying nothing is probably the worst way to have something changed.
I think pretty much all of the things that make/made people leave has been posted, just do a search.
Nope... as can be seen from the latest patch, devs break new things and produce new bugs, some of which is bigger than the things they fix.... So there is always new stuff which might cause people to leave.
Then why leave in the first place if they are so "interested" in the game, suck it up and pay the 15 bucks like the rest of us that play and live with it.
Edited by Reevster on June 27, 2014 2:55PM1 -
kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭
Maybe so but they dont need to post , just read....
The entire idea behind posting is to get the thing that made them leave out in the open in hopes it gets changed. Saying nothing is probably the worst way to have something changed.
I think pretty much all of the things that make/made people leave has been posted, just do a search.
Nope... as can be seen from the latest patch, devs break new things and produce new bugs, some of which is bigger than the things they fix.... So there is always new stuff which might cause people to leave.
Then why leave in the first place if they are so "interested" in the game, suck it up and pay the 15 bucks like the rest of us that play and live with it.
Why can't you just suck it up and not read those threads? There are others of us who are interested in thier point of view.3 -
I like the total elimination of "I quit" threads. If the game is not for you, then quit and leave, that simple and tell the company direct via feedback why it is not. While it sounds marvy to allow them in the general open forums for some, best not to allow them because:
1-they are not relevant to who is playing the game
2- you bet, they are bad for business, because many are posted with ill-intent, and also in such a caustic manner that they are harmful, which in many case the intent. Sorry, but there is a % of MMO that are nothing but tyrants on these MMO companies, and that has been the case for 20 years.3 -
Reevster✭✭✭✭✭
Maybe so but they dont need to post , just read....
The entire idea behind posting is to get the thing that made them leave out in the open in hopes it gets changed. Saying nothing is probably the worst way to have something changed.
I think pretty much all of the things that make/made people leave has been posted, just do a search.
Nope... as can be seen from the latest patch, devs break new things and produce new bugs, some of which is bigger than the things they fix.... So there is always new stuff which might cause people to leave.
Then why leave in the first place if they are so "interested" in the game, suck it up and pay the 15 bucks like the rest of us that play and live with it.
Why can't you just suck it up and not read those threads? There are others of us who are interested in thier point of view.
I can read whatever post I choose too and so can anyone that unsubbed but you shouldn't be able to post on here if you no longer are subbed, there is enough info posted on a regular basis that they can make an informed decision on if they want to resub or not, don't need them filling up the forums with unless posts.
1 -
kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭
Maybe so but they dont need to post , just read....
The entire idea behind posting is to get the thing that made them leave out in the open in hopes it gets changed. Saying nothing is probably the worst way to have something changed.
I think pretty much all of the things that make/made people leave has been posted, just do a search.
Nope... as can be seen from the latest patch, devs break new things and produce new bugs, some of which is bigger than the things they fix.... So there is always new stuff which might cause people to leave.
Then why leave in the first place if they are so "interested" in the game, suck it up and pay the 15 bucks like the rest of us that play and live with it.
Why can't you just suck it up and not read those threads? There are others of us who are interested in thier point of view.
I can read whatever post I choose too and so can anyone that unsubbed but you shouldn't be able to post on here if you no longer are subbed, there is enough info posted on a regular basis that they can make an informed decision on if they want to resub or not, don't need them filling up the forums with unless posts.
When you unsub you don't instantly lose access you still have your sub until the time you paid for runs out.3 -
kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭.. just so I'm clear what you are saying is that you want to be able to read the thread that you don't want to read so people shouldn't be able to post stuff you don't want to read because you want to be able to read whatever you want? Wouldn't it be a lot easier just to read what you want to read and ignore what you don't?4
-
Reevster✭✭✭✭✭
Maybe so but they dont need to post , just read....
The entire idea behind posting is to get the thing that made them leave out in the open in hopes it gets changed. Saying nothing is probably the worst way to have something changed.
I think pretty much all of the things that make/made people leave has been posted, just do a search.
Nope... as can be seen from the latest patch, devs break new things and produce new bugs, some of which is bigger than the things they fix.... So there is always new stuff which might cause people to leave.
Then why leave in the first place if they are so "interested" in the game, suck it up and pay the 15 bucks like the rest of us that play and live with it.
Why can't you just suck it up and not read those threads? There are others of us who are interested in thier point of view.
I can read whatever post I choose too and so can anyone that unsubbed but you shouldn't be able to post on here if you no longer are subbed, there is enough info posted on a regular basis that they can make an informed decision on if they want to resub or not, don't need them filling up the forums with unless posts.
When you unsub you don't instantly lose access you still have your sub until the time you paid for runs out.
Your not really unsubbed then if you still have game time left, you are still paying to play until the sub time ends.
0 -
hk11✭✭✭✭I think they just want to air their frustration to Zenimax and to leave their impression of the game for other players to read.
Sometimes they are pretty over the top, but I have no problem with it personally.2 -
Huckdabuck✭✭✭✭✭
That's pretty vague, isn't it? Specifically stating that you want to have a "welcoming environment" for the community is a carte blanche to eliminate unwanted criticism without really having to say why, except that it looks ... well ... unwelcoming. I hope you ZOS guys are able to draw a line here, because so many other companies and governmental bodies cannot. Just sayin'ZOS_CarolusS wrote: »(...) they usually tend (to) gather responses that are counter-productive to our goal of a fun, welcoming and safe enviroment for the ESO community (...)
Here ya go!
Moderator Edit: Removed content for NamingEdited by ZOS_SilviaS on June 27, 2014 11:42PMTexashighelf - VR16 Sorcerer EP NA - FILTHY BARBARIAN
Texasimperial - VR16 Dragonknight EP NA - How do you like your DK?
Texas'Imperial - VR16 Dragonknight DC NA - How do you like your DK?
Texas-Imperial - VR16 Templar DC NA - Queue Clogging Lagsploitter
Texas Highelf - VR16 Sorcerer DC NA - Queue Clogging Lagsploitter
Texas Imperial - VR16 Nightblade DC NA - Queue Clogging LagsploitterJessica Folsom wrote:It's a very grey area.0 -
Ohioastro✭✭✭✭williamburr2001b14_ESO wrote: »
The vast majority of them come from people who are angry, write a string of insults, and rehash issues that have been beaten to death. In many cases they are simply a demand for a different game. They draw responses in kind. More to the point, a quitting thread is a taunt thrown by someone walking out the door (I won't be here to read your responses, but here is why you're awful...)
This forum needs more aggressive moderation, not less. Otherwise it becomes a playground for a handful of abusive people with a lot of time on their hands. (I'd be very much in favor of a daily post limit per account as well.) Letting ranters set the tone leaves only ranters in the discussion.
Wow, I couldn't possibly disagree with all of this more. Yes, people are angry, because they're frustrated. Your solution is to make them shut up. That is the absolute best plan for alienating people and making them angrier.
If this forum needs more moderation, it needs moderation of posts like yours, that use words like "ranters." People are here, for the most part, looking for help dealing with game problems. The last thing they need is for people loudly, vocally, and unnecessarily objecting to their tone.
No - my solution is to say that there are boundaries on behavior. You don't have the right to walk into a business and start screaming at people because you're unhappy. You don't have a right to write whatever abusive thing crosses your mind. You don't have a right to shout down other people.
Note that *nowhere* did I say that you can't be critical. But I have been participating in internet discussions for decades. And there are bad, abusive people; people who deliberately try to make other people unhappy; people who will flood every conversation with their pet peeve. And if you let those people run wild the net result is that it silences everyone else, and the angry minority is the only voice that you can hear.0 -
Junipus✭✭✭✭✭A thread discussing the derailing of "I quit" threads being derailed by the same issues.
Pretty sure this thread has answered its own question.The Legendary Nothing2 -
mutharex✭✭✭✭✭I dont know why people who have unsubbed bother coming back here to post any thing , I mean you quit..move on already.
That's been covered quite a bit already: Many still have active subscriptions and are hoping to see the reasons for their quitting fixed prior to their subscriptions running out. It really isn't that hard to understand.
Honestly, if 10% of the people that cries "I quit" really quit, that would be already a grooss overestimate.
People who want to quit, do so. They don't write 'suicide letters' to tell people.
They just quit.
These, they just crave attention.
And for the love of [insert_divinity_here] it's a friggin' game, people should get so bent out of shape for SERIOUS things, things like government spying over you or corporations pushing for Freetrade agreements or whatever BUT NOT A FRIGGIN GAME!0 -
kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭
Maybe so but they dont need to post , just read....
The entire idea behind posting is to get the thing that made them leave out in the open in hopes it gets changed. Saying nothing is probably the worst way to have something changed.
I think pretty much all of the things that make/made people leave has been posted, just do a search.
Nope... as can be seen from the latest patch, devs break new things and produce new bugs, some of which is bigger than the things they fix.... So there is always new stuff which might cause people to leave.
Then why leave in the first place if they are so "interested" in the game, suck it up and pay the 15 bucks like the rest of us that play and live with it.
Why can't you just suck it up and not read those threads? There are others of us who are interested in thier point of view.
I can read whatever post I choose too and so can anyone that unsubbed but you shouldn't be able to post on here if you no longer are subbed, there is enough info posted on a regular basis that they can make an informed decision on if they want to resub or not, don't need them filling up the forums with unless posts.
When you unsub you don't instantly lose access you still have your sub until the time you paid for runs out.
Your not really unsubbed then if you still have game time left, you are still paying to play until the sub time ends.
Unsub only means your game subscription doesn't auto renew.0 -
No - my solution is to say that there are boundaries on behavior. You don't have the right to walk into a business and start screaming at people because you're unhappy. You don't have a right to write whatever abusive thing crosses your mind. You don't have a right to shout down other people.
Note that *nowhere* did I say that you can't be critical. But I have been participating in internet discussions for decades. And there are bad, abusive people; people who deliberately try to make other people unhappy; people who will flood every conversation with their pet peeve. And if you let those people run wild the net result is that it silences everyone else, and the angry minority is the only voice that you can hear.
The problem with "boundaries on behavior" is that it can never be an objective assessment of behavior, it can, at best, only be a particular person's opinion of behavior. Most of the posts trying to scrub these forums of negativity, including yours, are not bothering to separate substance from tone. You are saying negative tone disqualifies people from speaking, regardless of whether they have substance. This is why charges of "constructive" are useless--many people view anything they don't already agree with as not constructive.
A huge problem right now is that all negativity, all criticism, all expressions of frustration and aggravation are getting filed under non-constructive, whining, QQing, crying, etc. That is an awful, terrible thing to do to people who are just reacting out of frustration. It's not only bad from a human being perspective, if tolerated that's a horrible business practice as well. A business that shoos people out the door rather than listen to their complaints dies. Personally I'd prefer ESO not become an Amy's Bakery.
I don't see "bad people" here, I see people reacting, yes sometimes emotionally, and that's okay, because they are people and often people act out of emotion rather than cold, clear logic. The consequences of people venting frustration are as follows: Nothing. It's just talk. The consequences of shutting down that avenue to vent frustration are as follows: Unsubscribes.
What this is about, is that a category of person here doesn't want to read things that upset them anymore. The solution is obvious, especially if you're enjoying the game just fine as it is: Spend more time playing the game and less time reading forums posts about bugs and imbalances. This is a way better, more honorable, use for your time rather than trying to get other people to shut up.8 -
Mortosk✭✭✭✭lecarcajou_ESO wrote: »Obviously, it exists, and I'm beginning to wonder what the point of locking these threads is—clearly people want to share their reasons for leaving the game, and I for one don't mind reading them. What's the harm, really? Maybe it's time for a dedicated "I quit" forum?
But, this post violates the rule on discussing disciplinary actions and should be closed as well."Now I stand, the lion before the lambs and they do not fear. They can not fear." --Arthas Menethil (aka, The Lich King)0 -
AngryWolf✭✭✭I think they are OK as long as they provide solid & positive feedback into why they are quitting. Positive being in providing info on parts of the game that may be broken and/or need improvement. As well, it should be info not already in a ton of posts. This is rare, and comments these gather put me on the side of agreeing the posts should be locked. 9 out of 10 times it's a childish rant. I read them for that 1 out of 10 that provides solid insight in areas of the game that may need help.3 -
Mortosk✭✭✭✭I think they are OK as long as they provide solid & positive feedback into why they are quitting. Positive being in providing info on parts of the game that may be broken and/or need improvement. As well, it should be info not already in a ton of posts. This is rare, and comments these gather put me on the side of agreeing the posts should be locked. 9 out of 10 times it's a childish rant. I read them for that 1 out of 10 that provides solid insight in areas of the game that may need help.
Can I haz their stuff?"Now I stand, the lion before the lambs and they do not fear. They can not fear." --Arthas Menethil (aka, The Lich King)2 -
Lalai✭✭✭✭Eh, I think they should do a survey upon cancellation, and would rather they keep the policy on quit threads. In forums I've read that did allow them (and most don't) there tend to be a lot of complaints about them cluttering up the forum.
If you want to give constructive feedback for the game, just post a thread and leave out the statement saying that you quit. There's no real need to include it. Contrary to what some folks like to claim, feedback is definitely allowed on these forums, and the majority of the feedback on any number of pages is negative feedback in threads that haven't gotten closed.Edited by Lalai on June 27, 2014 5:06PMFisher extraordinaire!
Send me your worms, crawlers, guts, and insect parts.
Templar Healer
Daggerfall Covenant, NA0 -
AngryWolf✭✭✭I think they are OK as long as they provide solid & positive feedback into why they are quitting. Positive being in providing info on parts of the game that may be broken and/or need improvement. As well, it should be info not already in a ton of posts. This is rare, and comments these gather put me on the side of agreeing the posts should be locked. 9 out of 10 times it's a childish rant. I read them for that 1 out of 10 that provides solid insight in areas of the game that may need help.
Can I haz their stuff?
Nope
1 -
Singular✭✭✭✭williamburr2001b14_ESO wrote: »Well, this observation comes from 15 years of Human Resources and Communication consulting:
"I quit," most of the time, is not a sincere declaration of intent to quit. This is why exit interviews are done. The stated purpose of the exit interview is to gather feedback from an employee about satisfaction, but that's only a small part.
When a person says "I quit," what they actually want is a sincere display on the part of management to show that they are taking that employee's concerns seriously. The person quitting usually has a laundry list of complaints that they've never expressed before. The exit interview is an opportunity to collect very valuable data on possible deficiencies in the workplace, but it's also management's opportunity to say "I hear you, I hear you."
In my experience, more than 90% of the time you can turn this around. Also, these people are the ones you want to keep. When push comes to shove, they're team-players; when their backs are against the wall, they can compromise. The ones who bottle it up, and then just walk away, often refusing even an exit interview, are the ones you are better off without, that are killer for morale.
The entities that say "I hear you," retain people. In all likelihood the same applies here. On the other hand, when the "I've had enough, I quit" threads are met with "Your thread is now closed due to our stated policy of not listening to you," I can pretty much guarantee that player's very next browser tab goes to their account tab, to unsubscribe.
Wow. Brilliant! I have learned something valuable, that I will take with me the rest of my life.
Thank you.War, give me war, give me war.3 -
Singular✭✭✭✭I dont know why people who have unsubbed bother coming back here to post any thing , I mean you quit..move on already.
That's been covered quite a bit already: Many still have active subscriptions and are hoping to see the reasons for their quitting fixed prior to their subscriptions running out. It really isn't that hard to understand.
Honestly, if 10% of the people that cries "I quit" really quit, that would be already a grooss overestimate.
People who want to quit, do so. They don't write 'suicide letters' to tell people.
They just quit.
These, they just crave attention.
And for the love of [insert_divinity_here] it's a friggin' game, people should get so bent out of shape for SERIOUS things, things like government spying over you or corporations pushing for Freetrade agreements or whatever BUT NOT A FRIGGIN GAME!
Hello amateur psychologist - I don't think you know what you're talking about. Do you have any data to back up your claims, or are you just providing your own personal experience on the topic of quitting?
In other words, you're just telling us what it would mean for you to write an "I quit" thread.War, give me war, give me war.1 -
ZOS_HugoP✭✭✭Greetings folks,
We closed this thread in error and have decided we’d prefer to keep it open and explain a bit more about our policy on goodbye/quitting threads. To reiterate what ZOS_CarolusS said earlier, we close goodbye/quitting threads as they typically gather responses that are flaming or nonconstructive. That being said, the reason we close these types of threads rather than removing them entirely is because the feedback provided in them is very valuable to us. Knowing why players leave our game is extremely helpful for our development team as they plan future content updates and changes.
To address another concern presented in this thread, we are very interested in reading feedback on the forums, regardless of how positive or negative it is. That being said, we do expect feedback to be provided in a constructive way and for players to abide by our Community Code of Conduct when posting to the forums.
Thank you!
7 -
kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭Greetings folks,
We closed this thread in error and have decided we’d prefer to keep it open and explain a bit more about our policy on goodbye/quitting threads. To reiterate what ZOS_CarolusS said earlier, we close goodbye/quitting threads as they typically gather responses that are flaming or nonconstructive. That being said, the reason we close these types of threads rather than removing them entirely is because the feedback provided in them is very valuable to us. Knowing why players leave our game is extremely helpful for our development team as they plan future content updates and changes.
To address another concern presented in this thread, we are very interested in reading feedback on the forums, regardless of how positive or negative it is. That being said, we do expect feedback to be provided in a constructive way and for players to abide by our Community Code of Conduct when posting to the forums.
Thank you!
If you are interested in feedback can I suggest you take a note from pretty much every other game and have that feedback as part of the unsub process? Even if it is just a basic survey.2 -
lecarcajou_ESO✭✭✭✭HugoP, I very much appreciate the reopening as I found the discussion truly informative—and to all of you who contributed to it, let me tell you that I read every single post, even the long ones. A lot of good points for both positions were made, and so I think my initial question was answered. And for that, I thank you."Morally Decentralized."1 -
ZOS_AmeliaR✭✭✭✭✭
All players who decide to unsubscribe should be receiving a survey requesting more information about why they left. If you know anyone who has unsubbed and not received one of these surveys, please let our Support Team know by submitting a ticket.If you are interested in feedback can I suggest you take a note from pretty much every other game and have that feedback as part of the unsub process? Even if it is just a basic survey.5 -
GeeYouWhy✭✭✭ZOS_AmeliaR wrote: »All players who decide to unsubscribe should be receiving a survey requesting more information about why they left. If you know anyone who has unsubbed and not received one of these surveys, please let our Support Team know by submitting a ticket.
@ZOS_AmeliaR
Every month I canceled my sub as I wanted to make it a conscious decision to continue playing due to state of the game at launch. I have canceled my sub 3 times so far and I never received a survey.
Edited by GeeYouWhy on June 27, 2014 6:22PMKonrandir, Vampire Sorcerer2 -
Polwight✭@williamburr2001b14_ESO
Thank you for raising the level of communication among human beings in this thread. It is joyful thing to behold when groups of people actually communicate and truly express themselves and in doing so elevate the level of discourse. For that I tip my hat to you.1 -
zazamalek✭✭✭ZOS_AmeliaR wrote: »All players who decide to unsubscribe should be receiving a survey requesting more information about why they left. If you know anyone who has unsubbed and not received one of these surveys, please let our Support Team know by submitting a ticket.
Oh, interesting. Had a few guildies either unsub as a "reversible intent to quit" (one or two) or just completely rage quit (three or four). In the event they didn't give feedback, I did hear their major concerns. It came down to these major points:- Top 10 in PvP rewards: miserable with the rewards. A costume? A title? A, full, seriously decent PvP set? 42k isn't all that much. If at all possible, retroactively reward them: this is 3 months worth of dedication, guys! It does seem to have been taken lightly from your side, my good guild buddy was in PvP trying really hard to make a difference in an impossible campaign day-and-night. Make that effort go appreciated. I loved the gold I got, I'm always broke. I promise to not spend it all at once.
- Hundings Rage. It's been nerfed through the floor - I'm not one to exaggerate too much: but the set might as well be removed from the game now. All the math involved in the damage equation means that the set has no overall effect. Switch it back to 22% guys, it was the one way that stamina/melee was viable. If you saw it being used too much it was because the other options were too dreadful, not because it was too powerful. The set sort-of fixed stamina/melee.
- Crypt of Hearts rewards. The dungeon is hard (apparently, I focus on PvP now - no personal experience). The rewards are horrible. In a guild meeting with officers now and the consensus is "no real incentive to go there." Risk/reward, as always. Wiping to a boss 15 times and hitting bugs 5 times isn't all that bad if you get some sweet sweet loot. Another guildie quote, "in my opinion Crypt of Hearts is harder than trials." A lot of people want difficult content, keep it that way: just up the reward in my humble opinion.
Just trying to help, I'm not personally raging. Still subbed and still plan to continue subbing. I'm loving all the work you guys put into this game, keep it up! If you want the player names to convince them to come back, PM me. I can't do it from my side - they need these things fixed.Edited by zazamalek on June 27, 2014 6:44PM4102 -
Huckdabuck✭✭✭✭✭ZOS_AmeliaR wrote: »
All players who decide to unsubscribe should be receiving a survey requesting more information about why they left. If you know anyone who has unsubbed and not received one of these surveys, please let our Support Team know by submitting a ticket.If you are interested in feedback can I suggest you take a note from pretty much every other game and have that feedback as part of the unsub process? Even if it is just a basic survey.
@ZOS_AmeliaR
How about the folks who have already left and would love to submit feedback? Is there a submit a ticket function via the forums?Texashighelf - VR16 Sorcerer EP NA - FILTHY BARBARIAN
Texasimperial - VR16 Dragonknight EP NA - How do you like your DK?
Texas'Imperial - VR16 Dragonknight DC NA - How do you like your DK?
Texas-Imperial - VR16 Templar DC NA - Queue Clogging Lagsploitter
Texas Highelf - VR16 Sorcerer DC NA - Queue Clogging Lagsploitter
Texas Imperial - VR16 Nightblade DC NA - Queue Clogging LagsploitterJessica Folsom wrote:It's a very grey area.0
