One FREE Respec per CHARACTER!

zamiel

martymart76_ESO wrote: »

Resistances/Armor are a wasted point to whom? Which class? Not to tanks. You are trying to come off as if you are an elitist gamer here, and elitist gamers routinely min/max and squeeze every ounce of bonus passive into their builds. I can see that for PVE DPS, but not for tanks.

Thank you for proving my point.
Now go back and read my post, then read what mark target does. Thank you.

martymart76_ESO

zamiel wrote: »

martymart76_ESO wrote: »

Resistances/Armor are a wasted point to whom? Which class? Not to tanks. You are trying to come off as if you are an elitist gamer here, and elitist gamers routinely min/max and squeeze every ounce of bonus passive into their builds. I can see that for PVE DPS, but not for tanks.

Thank you for proving my point.
Now go back and read my post, then read what mark target does. Thank you.

I know what it does. It reduces target's armor and resistances to your attacks by 75%, and does the same to you against theirs. What does any of that have to do with having one free respec that doesn't affect YOUR gaming experience negatively in any capacity? So someone who BECOMES informed, wanting a respec somehow lessens your game experience? You have no valid reason to back up anything you say, and you're just arguing to be a jerk and just to argue at this point.

zamiel

Blackwidow wrote: »

So, you want the fact that ESO has bad information about character stats give you some edge in your character being better than someone elses?

But, to follow your logic, then still would not know about this information if they did a respec, right?

You are terrible at logic it seems. Mark target is a great example. It's not bugged. It does exactly what it is written. But it is extremly useless in a pve environment.

Why?

The answer is written all over the forums.

And this is why respec for money is a good thing. It will make players like you learn about the game.

pjwrwb17_ESO

I like this idea; the ability to respec any time by paying PLUS the knowledge that you get a free respec at certain levels would be great.

They should probably not be hoardable, a single-use exclusive BtC token granted at 10/20/30/40/50 (or even 10/30/50) would be fine.

Advantages are:

1. It helps new players who make mistakes
2. It reduces the gap between vets building a new character (who will have plenty of cash) and those just starting out
3. It genuinely gives players the opportunity to experiment so that the laughable tip "try new combinations" might actually be practical
4. It makes the game more fun.

Gisgo

zamiel wrote: »

And this is why respec for money is a good thing. It will make players like you learn about the game.

Does it? I dont think so.

nazgull2k1ub17_ESO

I love the people trying to stupidly defend the ridiculous prices this game has, and acting like it's the norm. It's not, its completely ***, and screams "F2P MODEL INC!"

42,000 gold for a horse... suck my .. yeah..

And yeah, before I cancelled my account, my level 20 had like 5 skill points wasted on crappy powers that did absolutely nothing. But I wasnt about to spend the stupidly high price to respec either, as I was still trying to save for the ridiculously overpriced mount, the stupidly overpriced repairs, the gargantuanly overpriced "Mail" system..

5 months and counting till this goes F2P

Aci

I like that little consequences: Item decay, respec costs, mount prices. Im totally fine with that. Honestly im glad there is a respec option at all.

Some people tend to demand everything to be easier or served on a silver plate. I hope Zenimax will never listen to them!

Gisgo

Yeah because asking for a free respec equals demanding everything to be easier.

Logic on the internet, it does not exist.

Blackwidow

zamiel wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

So, you want the fact that ESO has bad information about character stats give you some edge in your character being better than someone elses?

But, to follow your logic, then still would not know about this information if they did a respec, right?

You are terrible at logic it seems. Mark target is a great example. It's not bugged. It does exactly what it is written. But it is extremly useless in a pve environment.

Why?

The answer is written all over the forums.

And this is why respec for money is a good thing. It will make players like you learn about the game.

It will?

Making me pay for respect will make me do my homework?

Golly.

You assume I don't do my homework. Mistakes are not the only reason to respec.

Also, and I don't mean to put a fine point on this, but even if you were right, which you are not, how does this hurt YOUR game?

Also, you act like people are asking for a free respec at all times. It is once every 10 levels.

So, if people are going to do homework, it might be when they can do a respec.

So, to follow your logic, people would do research every 10 levels. However, if it costs a large amount of gold, they might not respec at all, so no homework done at all.

So, it would seem free respects give people reason to look stuff up.

zamiel

Blackwidow wrote: »

It will?

Making me pay for respect will make me do my homework?

Golly.

You assume I don't do my homework. Mistakes are not the only reason to respec.

Also, and I don't mean to put a fine point on this, but even if you were right, which you are not, how does this hurt YOUR game?

No, nothing makes you. But if you don't respec, you'll be down 1 skill point; if you do, you'll be down with 10-15k gold compared to a player who did his homework.

It's a meagre advantage, but still, it makes players who plan and learn a bit stronger compared to those who haphazardly put points everywhere. So yes, in this sense it hurts the game by taking away the advantage of those who spent time on planning.

Aci

Gisgo wrote: »

Yeah because asking for a free respec equals demanding everything to be easier.

Logic on the internet, it does not exist.

If you dont think it makes the game easier look at the silver plate.

JohnG

Have to agree we need some free respec system in this game. Could be done every X levels or simply give every new character 3-5 free respecs, people can use them as they wish. When they run out they are stuck paying for it. The attribute points respec cost isn't so bad but the skill points is just ridiculous.

Reymas

Good idea OP, I support this idea.

Blackwidow

zamiel wrote: »

No, nothing makes you. But if you don't respec, you'll be down 1 skill point; if you do, you'll be down with 10-15k gold compared to a player who did his homework.

So, making other players poor improves your game?

It's a meagre advantage, but still, it makes players who plan and learn a bit stronger compared to those who haphazardly put points everywhere.

Again, you go back to people only will learn if they pay gold.

As said a few times now, people who could get a free respec every 10 levels would be given a reason to learn as they respec. So, they would be better players.

So yes, in this sense it hurts the game by taking away the advantage of those who spent time on planning.

Advantage where?

Where does this advantage come into play?

How is your game improved?

Gisgo

Aci wrote: »

If you dont think it makes the game easier look at the silver plate.

Farming gold isnt difficult, its tedious.
So a free respec isnt going to make the game easier, but a bit less tedious.

As i already said someone is trying to defend the perceived "advantage" of having built a good build at first try.
Which is pretty sad, little advantages for little players.

Biding_My_Time

Can't agree enough with OP. Had to blow 5100 on my respec last night (nearly all of my money). I made some really poor choices with my character while I was figuring things out. I'm still figuring things out. Stop punishing me for experimenting. I really don't want to go to a website to have someone tell me how to build my character. I want to figure it out

Thechemicals

So the general consensus is that this is just a game and it should allow free respecs or cheap respecs and horses should be cheap so we can have them very early in the game otherwise it makes things hard and not enjoyable and can cause even cancellation of subscription.

If you believe any of this is right then any issue will eventually make you want to cancel your sub and/or not have a good experience. This game has a lot more challenges than cost to respec and a 42k gold horse.

zamiel

Blackwidow wrote: »

How is your game better if another player has less gold?

Where does this advantage come into play?

Yeah, I'm sure ZOS are banning gold sellers because having gold in this game offers no advantage at all...

And if let's say the informed player lives with 1hp all due to the shiny yellow glyph he was able to purchase from the money the uninformed player spent on respec, while the uninformed player dies - there is your advantage. A prepared and skillful player should get more rewards - faster VP/XP gain, better money farming abilities, more alliance points, whatever.

Anyway, if free respec doesn't affect gameplay at all - why do you ask for it?

Gisgo

Thechemicals wrote: »

So the general consensus is that this is just a game and it should allow free respecs or cheap respecs and horses should be cheap so we can have them very early in the game otherwise it makes things hard and not enjoyable and can cause even cancellation of subscription.

If you believe any of this is right then any issue will eventually make you want to cancel your sub and/or not have a good experience. This game has a lot more challenges than cost to respec and a 42k gold horse.

No the general consensus is that one or two free respecs should be allowed if anything to "fix" broken builds due to some in game skills/description being wrong.

Everything else you made it up.

This forum is getting worse and worse.

Aci

Well, the limited opportunities for character respects is an aspect of a risk / reward structure. I think the players risk to completely fail is pretty low in this game. On the other hand, if someone decides to go a very new path with his char he has actually to pay a decent price for it.
Nothing wrong with that!

Blackwidow

Thechemicals wrote: »

So the general consensus is that this is just a game and it should allow free respecs or cheap respecs and horses should be cheap so we can have them very early in the game otherwise it makes things hard and not enjoyable and can cause even cancellation of subscription.

Nobody said it was hard to respec. We are saying the price to respec is stupidly expensive, especially with all the other gold sinks already in place.

We are also saying it would be nice for a free respec for a few very good reasons.

If you believe any of this is right

Trust me, nobody thinks anything you just said is right.

then any issue will eventually make you want to cancel your sub and/or not have a good experience. This game has a lot more challenges than cost to respec and a 42k gold horse.

Some people do not understand the difference between challenging and tedious.

South_of_Heaven

Let's have infinite respecs and let's make everything free while we are at it! Because it will be more fun that way!

pjwrwb17_ESO

We *do* have infinit respecs: just pay $10 to the gold sellers and respec to your hearts content.

At least if they were cheaper the gold sellers would get less business, and as an added bonus a whole bunch of people would enjoy the game more without breaking the enjoyment of any but the most sociopathic players.

Blackwidow

South_of_Heaven wrote: »

Let's have infinite respecs and let's make everything free while we are at it! Because it will be more fun that way!

Yes. That is what we are saying. I'm glad you got the finer points of the discussion.

JessieColt

Bazzakrak wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

Bazzakrak wrote: »

So that would be 6 respecs at VR10 ?

No, just one every 10 levels. Not 6 at VR 10 but 6 chances on the way to VR 10.

I'm not sure why you want to limit it to 25/50? Where is the hard and letting people try different builds every ten levels for free?

I get 6 total respecs from lvl 1 to VR10, if we were to get a respec each 10 lvls, then we would get respecs at lvl 10/20/30/40/50/VR10 for a total of 6.

I am just thinking of limiting it to lvl 25 and 50, and then VR5, VR10 etc etc, to not give out that many free respecs and keep a somewhat goldsink ingame.

It the lvls I am thinking of, I feel people would still have a respec at a good interval in the game, where they would not get them too often.
It is a personal feeling/opinion.

But I would agree with @merwanoreb17_ESO‌ that a flexible respec system could be good.
Perhaps not where we can go in an choose a single skill to remove, but that we perhaps can choose to only respec the points in two-handed and get those points back without having to respec all of ones skills

I don't think the OP means they should be cumulative. Just that every 10 levels you have an opportunity to respec for free.

So if I hit level 10, I could respec, once, for free. But If I forget to do a respec and hit level 11, then I lose that chance and would have to pay for the respec or wait until I hit level 20.

This would let the user have enough time (an entire level worth of time) to research their skills and visit the shrine.

Heck, they do not need to even offer it every 10 levels. Just offer it at least once. Maybe level 25?

By level 25 you have enough skill points (if you are collecting shards and doing Skill Point quests) to make the respec worth investigating.

When I did my first respec, it cost over 7k gold. I am now V1 and I see where I could have made better choices since then, but I am too afraid to go see how much it will cost for another respec (100 gold per point).

As it is, I just hit V1, (spent my level up point) and have 1 skyshard (need 3) and I got nailed by a bloodfiend last night.

This means that I am going to be VERY scary a few hours after the NA server goes back on line because unlike every other skill tree in the game, you do not get your first Vamp skill for free. I have to use a point. And I do not have a point to use, and I need to feed.

Gisgo

South_of_Heaven wrote: »

Let's have infinite respecs and let's make everything free while we are at it! Because it will be more fun that way!

snowmanflvb14_ESO

The fact that there are so many skill points available makes it easy to overcome a mistake as to your use of skill points. The cost with regards to attributes is minimal. There really is no need to reduce the rates.

Mr_Majestyk

For what its worth, I think doing anything free is poor game design. However, I think the respec system needs to change. So many UI elements of the game are poorly done because of the lack of granular control for the user. The inventory management in a game with hundreds and hundreds of items, the guild store, and the respec are all great examples.

IMHO, respec cost should stay where it is, but players should be able to select a skill branch to respec. Why should my crafting skills need to be reallocated when I want to change my destruction staff allocation or a class skill branch? If they implemented more granular control, there would be no need for a free respec.

Low level players would be able to afford to fix issues, but also experiment more. Higher level players can change what they want, without have to reallocate hundreds of points they didn't want to change.

The game keeps the money sink aspects, and I think it will be more utilized even more, since granular control encourages more experimentation with versatility.
From a development point of view, this should be relatively easy to implement since all of the elements needed to do this are already in game and functioning. A little database optimization work and this could be released in the next patch or two.

Much of the debate centers on Free vs Pay, which in my opinion avoids addressing the real problems. I think the above approach is more balanced and actually solves the underlying problem with the respec mechanic of the game.

My 2gp anyway

Gisgo

Granular control FTW!

Sorry the weretroll in me is coming out... im gonna play!

vyal

The cost is fine, as long as I can remove individual skill points, rather than having to do everything at once.

If I tried a skill, and it sucks (or , in my opinion, I will never use it) then I should be able to reverse that single decision rather than have to pay thousands of gold (yes, really really) to undo one decision out of a hundred or more decisions.