Auction house is a must!

Thunder

Seraseth wrote: »

I'm sure there are people out there that enjoy sitting in town spamming for hours to sell or buy stuff. Good for them. I'd rather take the proverbial cheese grater to my eyeballs.

Just what is it that you feel you must sell or must buy?

You're speaking very generally. Give us an example where the game forces you to sit around trying to buy or sell something instead of going out and doing the things you prefer doing.

I'm not in any trading guilds. None. I hate the entire idea. I hate that someone that spams a hundred or so random invites to their trading guild are awarded a free 500 slot guild bank for their own personal use. I hate that trading guilds dilute the ability to join 5 actual guilds because so many people are in 1 actual guild and 4 trading guilds.

Obviously I don't use the non-existent AH for trading either. I certainly don't sit around spamming /zone chat with trade offers. I've never offered anything on /zone chat for trade for that matter.

Yet, somehow I manage to not just get by, but actually prosper. In ESO there's really nothing you can't get on your own, so there's really no need to sell things either.

As I said in the post right above yours, I would like an auction house, but after accepting the lack of one I realize I don't need one. The need for an a traditional AH is a mental attitude you bring from other games and it just doesn't apply to ESO.

Malediktus

Please please please do NOT give us an auction house. It will ruin the game.

lecarcajou_ESO

I'd love to have an AH. Most, if not all, other MMO's have one, and if some of those games were or are ruined, it was not the presence of an auction house that did it. It's kinda silly in my opinion to have to join a guild—if not several—just to be able to shop. I can see how not having an AH is meant to limit the activities of gold sellers, but won't they just organize in guilds to do their thing, instead?

Seraseth

@Thunder

You're right, I don't *have* to sit around and sell things, I actually refuse to. For me (on some things) it's not really about the money, it's that I hate throwing things away someone could use.

I found this nice little blue ring, that I'm sure someone with a different build could have really used, but it wasn't worth the hassle of finding them, so it was vendor trash. A total waste.

I daily trash a multitude of lockpicks, trait stones, and alchemy water that I'm sure people wouldn't have minded picking up for less than vendor price but with no convenient way to sell it, it's all just trash.

As for the buying, the other day I was trying to finish off provisioning so I'd have more room. I had over 150 combwort, but not enough of the secondary mats (broth, meal, etc). I'm sure I could have found a bunch of different players each with a small amount of them to sell, but the time and hassle of finding and making deals with 5-10 different players to get the quantity wasn't worth it.

You're right, it's not life and death must sell and must buy! But it is a strong quality of life factor, and those little things add up to a big effect on someone's enjoyment of a game.

alexj4596b14_ESO

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/comment/752990#Comment_752990

Just want too throw this out there! An idea I had I think would work vary well

Makkir

Jeremy wrote: »

So your argument is basically public markets suck in MMOs because it establishes market based pricing and people can feel confident when they buy something they aren't being ripped off.
.

If you want to put a twist on my statement, then yes. Over the years, the introduction of Auction Houses in MMOs has fed the "Instant Gratification" generation of MMO-gamers. You loot Item A, check Auction House for Item A, then undercut cheapest Item A by 1 copper. All it takes is one idiot to put Item A for a very low price, then 100 more are listed to undercut it.

If someone is willing to pay 1,000 gold for a weapon, then how is this person being ripped off? On top of that, what prevents you from emailing that player and saying "Hey if you (weapon) doesn't sell for 1000gold, I would offer you 650gold for it instead?" Additionally, fees are so steep in this game right now I much more eager to make a deal face to face or via trade chat than on a guild store. Yes, there should probably be a trade channel or a trade zone.

In all reality, an item is worth what someone is willing to pay for it which is why I liked economies like this one and EverQuest (in loot centric games). Star Wars Galaxies would be on that list as well, but that was more of a sandbox and had a player-centric economy.

I have also played 20-something MMOs since 2000 and every single game with an Auction House is just "bad for business." Gold Sellers also have a much harder time farming items/mats and then selling them in a world without Auction Houses.

The "better" solution: Maybe a zone created for commerce (think back EverQuest Commonlands tunnel or the Bazaar).

If you get a global auction house in this game, you will not be able to sell your easily obtained blues and purples.

Makkir

Jeremy wrote: »

I just want to get in there, get what I want, then get back to doing what I enjoy.

Yes we get it, you and the rest of the horri-bad generation want to buy in to MMO-Welfare.

While we're at it, lets put legendary vendors up too so people can get orange gear for tokens and don't need to work for it

Crumpy

Jeez guys come on we need a proper AH - widening your scope of potential buyers and sellers is GOOD not bad.

Makkir

nerrollus wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

I never played EQ. But I have never enjoyed a trade spam economy. Not on any game. They are a complete turn off for me and something I will not deal with. I would rather do something else with my time.

Totally understandable, certainly not something everyone likes.

I'm just one of those people that are totally burned out with the reskinned WoW games and enjoying the differences.

We had limited options for MMOs back then. So we kind of had to make the best of what we had to play, but EverQuest to this day is still successful and still producing expansions. I quit playing EQ in 2003-ish (whenever SWG launched).
Granted, I am sure a lot of people stopped playing EQ because of the other MMOs that started popping up, and the fact the graphics are just horrid compared to today's games. But working for what you had was "fun" for most of us, and rewarding. The WoW-reskins will continue to reoccur because WoW player base is a large market of gamers. Games (MMOs) can't survive without a paying player base, and being inventive and trying something new in this relatively small market is risky business.

Greydog

I don't see where broadening the market has to equate to a WoW reskin.

There are many ways to open it up without even changing what is implemented now ..but by adding to it.

Gidorick

ugh... I hope Zenimax doesn't listen to you people. I like the way it works now... the game doesn't NEED an auctionhouse and IMO it would be lore-breaking.

alexj4596b14_ESO

Crumpy wrote: »

Jeez guys come on we need a proper AH - widening your scope of potential buyers and sellers is GOOD not bad.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/comment/752990#Comment_752990

alexj4596b14_ESO

gideon_nine_ESO wrote: »

ugh... I hope Zenimax doesn't listen to you people. I like the way it works now... the game doesn't NEED an auctionhouse and IMO it would be lore-breaking.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/comment/752990#Comment_752990

Genomic

I think Zenimax has tried to be both cautious and innovative, in much the same way that they tried to make an MMO with single game elements. Both of these were admirable goals, but unfortunately the execution was uneven and the result was a hybrid that was lacking in both elements.

I think the reasoning was that other MMOs have been successful, so to appeal to a large playerbase, replicate many of those tried-and-true elements (and like it or not, ESO has many elements similar to WoW - progression through marked questing chains for one) but they also tried to add some different features so as to stand out from the crowd.

The guild trade is a perfect example of that. They tried something different from WoW et. al. auction house, which is a nice idea, but they didn't replace it with anything solid. The 'let's do something innvovative' is a great idea, but if the innovation is poorly implemented then it defeats the purpose.

eliisra

Really unhappy about the lack of AH. Dysfunctional guild stores, making it even worse.

The filtering function and the interface is a complete mess. Keeps bugging out to and I have to relogg just to do a search. Never enough items in them.

I'm in 3 trading guilds, no room for more since I need spots for PvP/social/PvE guilds. This is no way near a substitute for a proper AH.

Reason I love AH is because it saves me time to enjoy the actual game. If I'm missing items for something (that refuses to drop) I can just buy it quickly, no hassle, no worries about being ripped of, no arguing about prices with some annoying dude from zone chat.

sociald100ub17_ESO

eliisra wrote: »

Really unhappy about the lack of AH. Dysfunctional guild stores, making it even worse.

The filtering function and the interface is a complete mess. Keeps bugging out to and I have to relogg just to do a search. Never enough items in them.

I'm in 3 trading guilds, no room for more since I need spots for PvP/social/PvE guilds. This is no way near a substitute for a proper AH.

Reason I love AH is because it saves me time to enjoy the actual game. If I'm missing items for something (that refuses to drop) I can just buy it quickly, no hassle, no worries about being ripped of, no arguing about prices with some annoying dude from zone chat.

No instead you will be lamenting the price ( loudly to everyone else probably ) of that one item you are needing and cant find because joe bot just bought up all of them and now selling them at quadruple the price and no one else has any.

Makkir

I do however wish they would fix the guild store UI as I would like to search for items by item name. And sometimes it seems buggy in that if I search for Blue Materials sometimes armor shows up...
Also if we stick without an AH, I think it'd be better to have a bit more storage options.

drschplatt

So, to you people who think an AH would allow exploiters to profit, what stops them from joining trade guilds? Nothing.

A faction AH would make no difference to gold sellers.

Khandi

gideon_nine_ESO wrote: »

ugh... I hope Zenimax doesn't listen to you people. I like the way it works now... the game doesn't NEED an auctionhouse and IMO it would be lore-breaking.

Lore breaking how?? Trade has been going on for 150,000+ years. Pawn shop type places have been around for over 3000 years. They use the wheel and axle in ESO so how far back do you actually think it is in terms of real life years?

'Lore breaking' is a ridicules argument in my opinion.

I personally believe we need something better than the 5 guild auction house style of trading. Faction wide would be better and it would bring guilds back into a better situation because as we all know you may have 200 people on the roster but only 30 people are online at any given time. Most guilds are bloated with alts that people use for storage but that's another thread....

Drachenfier

Makkir wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

So your argument is basically public markets suck in MMOs because it establishes market based pricing and people can feel confident when they buy something they aren't being ripped off.
.

If you want to put a twist on my statement, then yes. Over the years, the introduction of Auction Houses in MMOs has fed the "Instant Gratification" generation of MMO-gamers. You loot Item A, check Auction House for Item A, then undercut cheapest Item A by 1 copper. All it takes is one idiot to put Item A for a very low price, then 100 more are listed to undercut it.

If someone is willing to pay 1,000 gold for a weapon, then how is this person being ripped off? On top of that, what prevents you from emailing that player and saying "Hey if you (weapon) doesn't sell for 1000gold, I would offer you 650gold for it instead?" Additionally, fees are so steep in this game right now I much more eager to make a deal face to face or via trade chat than on a guild store. Yes, there should probably be a trade channel or a trade zone.

In all reality, an item is worth what someone is willing to pay for it which is why I liked economies like this one and EverQuest (in loot centric games). Star Wars Galaxies would be on that list as well, but that was more of a sandbox and had a player-centric economy.

I have also played 20-something MMOs since 2000 and every single game with an Auction House is just "bad for business." Gold Sellers also have a much harder time farming items/mats and then selling them in a world without Auction Houses.

The "better" solution: Maybe a zone created for commerce (think back EverQuest Commonlands tunnel or the Bazaar).

If you get a global auction house in this game, you will not be able to sell your easily obtained blues and purples.

So in other words, you want to continue to rip people off. What you describe above is the law of supply and demand. You can't continue to overcharge unsuspecting players for items when they have a broad database at their disposal for making informed pricing decisions before purchase, and you obviously don't like that.

trinta

gideon_nine_ESO wrote: »

ugh... I hope Zenimax doesn't listen to you people. I like the way it works now... the game doesn't NEED an auctionhouse and IMO it would be lore-breaking.

I would like to see you being equally vocal about crafting from the bank. That's not just lore-breaking, it's incomprehensible.

And yet you "lore" junkies who simply want to spend extra time shopping never go after that...

Khandi

trinta wrote: »

gideon_nine_ESO wrote: »

ugh... I hope Zenimax doesn't listen to you people. I like the way it works now... the game doesn't NEED an auctionhouse and IMO it would be lore-breaking.

I would like to see you being equally vocal about crafting from the bank. That's not just lore-breaking, it's incomprehensible.

And yet you "lore" junkies who simply want to spend extra time shopping never go after that...

That about sums it up. They like to throw out the word 'lore' when it comes to making changes to the trade system yet the obviously have never learned any world history.

We need a better way to trade. Period.

tylarthb16_ESO

Present trade system is primitive, clunky and kills off any specialist or small demand markets. Auction house/brokerage is really as essential to an MMO as quality of life feature, heck even standard MMO feature. 10+ years of mmo led upto AH/broker systems. In eso that garnered knowledge is ignored in the crude regression that the present state of GS represent.

lecarcajou_ESO

I don't know if this has been said before, but what if guild stores were open to the public instead of just to the respective guild's own members? That would certainly be realistic both from a historic as well as a "lore" standpoint. Let the big trade guilds compete for the market. The buyers can compare—and beware.

Jeremy

Seraseth wrote: »

I'm sure there are people out there that enjoy sitting in town spamming for hours to sell or buy stuff. Good for them. I'd rather take the proverbial cheese grater to my eyeballs.

.

Same here.

How anyone could enjoy this sort of thing and consider it some kind of a great social experience is completely outside my ability to comprehend.

I liked your post and agree with everything you said. And those who want to live inside their own economic bubbles and spam WTS/WTB could still do so. But to try and force the rest of us into this kind of play isn't cool. Especially for a game that touts one of its priorities as allowing players to play as they want.

Not all of us like to role play as merchants and enjoy spending hours trying to find a bargain. And the opponents of a public auction house need to realize this and compromise on this issue - else this game is going to suffer as a result.

Jeremy

Allyah wrote: »

Seraseth wrote: »

In games like RL I want to do my shopping as fast as possible to get it over with and get back to the good stuff. These guild stores are like doing your grocery shopping at a flea market. Not only can you not guarantee fish for dinner, you can't even be sure entire food groups won't be missing.

For me staying with a game is a balance, amount of time spent doing things I enjoy vs amount of time spent doing things I dislike. When that ratio gets too high on the negative side, it doesn't matter how much I like the game itself, it's just not worth it.

It's like saying you can have x amount of hours doing something you love, but in return you're gonna get beaten with this stick for x amount of hours.

I love playing this game, I love the questing and the stories, exploring to find something cool, but the lack of an AH and the bank size issues is a stick. (And the two are related, since if you could nearly guarantee that this mat will be available, you don't need to hoard it)

I'm sure there are people out there that enjoy sitting in town spamming for hours to sell or buy stuff. Good for them. I'd rather take the proverbial cheese grater to my eyeballs.

Adding in a faction AH isn't going to prevent them from standing on a street corner hawking their wares and 'being social and meeting people'. But I will be able to run in, dump my stuff, and get back out to the fun part, being social and meeting people killing daedra at that anchor, or world bosses.

"I like everything but this one thing. It better change or I won't play anymore."?Find a new game or stop complaining about systems that are already in place that many people already enjoy.

Seraseth wrote: »

And for those worried about the state of the economy, add a check box people can click off to sell to guild only at the AH. Then you can stay inside your small safe bubble economy no matter what the rest of the game is doing.

Economies don't work that way. Think N.Korea.

Forums are a place to talk about things you are dissatisfied with and to advocate for the changes you would like to see. So if this kind of activity bothers you, I would suggest not visiting the forums. Or at the very least, staying out of threads you do not agree with. Because coming in here and essentially telling us to like it or leave is not productive.

No game is perfect after-all, and improvements can always be made. And the economy on this game is definitely one area where a lot of us feel improvements need to happen.

And no one is suggesting they should get rid of guild stores or prevent you from being able to spam advertisements in chat. So these systems you enjoy will still be in place even if a public auction house was put in place.

Seraseth

This and the inventory issues finally tipped the scales for me. I unsubscribed this morning. I love playing this game but I've gotten so frustrated with the time sinks that I don't even want to log on anymore.

I'll keep an eye on it and check for changes in the next few months and hopefully be back. I still have high hopes for this game.

p.hurst1b16_ESO

Why not hold fire on the AH demands until we see how the Kiosks pan out ?

ZoE seem to be addressing many concerns in their own way.

Terminus

Why not make the Kiosks into the Keeps in Cyrodiil?
Or does that make too much sense?

Jeremy

Seraseth wrote: »

This and the inventory issues finally tipped the scales for me. I unsubscribed this morning. I love playing this game but I've gotten so frustrated with the time sinks that I don't even want to log on anymore.

I'll keep an eye on it and check for changes in the next few months and hopefully be back. I still have high hopes for this game.

I can relate. I'm considering taking some time off in hopes they fix the economy too. Because I would be enjoying leveling my character a lot more if I could actually find the materials I needed up for sale.