The Etiquette of... Teabagging?

Telel · May 13

A lot of people seem to be intent on either gaslighting or appealing to triviality in their rebuttals. Neither of which are all that effective in building up a good reason to allow people in a video game to hunt down other people (many of them under aged), and then grind their digital groins upon them.

If that's what you want your bestest best buddy to do for you in a game then that's your thing. But it is by no means something that should be involuntarily inflicted on others.

Especially when the one doing the inflicting is doing so in order to 'intimidate' or shame someone they claim to dislike. Especially when the aggrieved party is now technically being cyber stalked by someone harboring ill intent.

mdjessup4906 · May 13

Idk i just think it's funny. Been done to me a few times. Thing is i suck, so easy target, then that? Lol glad I made ur day.

aetherix8 · May 13

Telel wrote: »

A lot of people seem to be intent on either gaslighting or appealing to triviality in their rebuttals. Neither of which are all that effective in building up a good reason to allow people in a video game to hunt down other people (many of them under aged), and then grind their digital groins upon them.

If that's what you want your bestest best buddy to do for you in a game then that's your thing. But it is by no means something that should be involuntarily inflicted on others.

Especially when the one doing the inflicting is doing so in order to 'intimidate' or shame someone they claim to dislike. Especially when the aggrieved party is now technically being cyber stalked by someone harboring ill intent.

Tbagging seems to be a complex issue. On the one hand, there are players who are survivors of sexual assault and tbag might trigger their trauma. These players avoid PvP cus tbag might happen (even if it happens in PvE realm as well…). This attitude is perfectly valid.
On the other hand, there are players who think tbags are ok, they convey a message (“u suck!”) and that’s it. It might be friendly or less friendly, but it’s ok all along. Basically, tbag here is seen as a cultural aspect of PvP / gaming, and that’s perfectly valid too.

I got more than my fair share of tbags and other fancy animations, and I can’t say that it really affected me. My mentality vis a vis a tbag is usually “I know I suck so tell me something I don’t know or get lost”. These petty tbagers that don’t even kill are the funniest kind cause they are so pathetic.

I don’t usually have the reflex to tbag people, although it did happen a few times. Some time ago I defeated this emperor with the help of a bunch of npcs - emperor faction owned everything - and after a victory jump I went straight for a tbag but was too slow. I don’t know if the player was distracted or just tired, normally I would not have scored a kill there but I did, and the way it happened imo totally guarantees a tbag. I would actually miss this option if ZOS were to ban it completely. Sometimes tbag is just really the most appropriate thing to do.

And remember, if you feel harassed then try and whisper the other player, and if they are offline or ignoring, report them with screenshots of your whisper attempt.

Zama666 · May 19

This is a game where people 'kill' each other.
Isn't that more offensive than 'crouching?'

JaxontheUnfortunate · May 22

lol just replace the crouch animation with emote of dipping a tea bag into a mug

chillar · June 1

cuddles_with_wroble wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

I don't care about teabaggers, I think they are ridiculous, but I do find myself laughing at players who teabag others that they did not kill. As in they were getting wrecked, ran/streaked away, and their 5-6 buddies came to their rescue. Then they ran over and teabag like they did something. Saw someone this weekend where that was ALL they did. Like he/she was the cheerleader of the DC. Saw them once die, get rezzed, then run over and teabag someone.

It made me look back on the last few weeks and I don't think I've seen a player who either registered the kill or played a role in the kill teabag the victim. Its always someone who fled the scene or watched from the cheap seats.

If you're going to celebrate the kill like its your first time in Cyrodiil, at least play.

most likely its a bait to get you banned, in my exp when people like that t bag you they are trying to get you to t bag them back... in which case they and their buddies report you and then you get perma banned.

seen it happen at least 20 times

this

cuddles_with_wroble · June 1

im not quite sure where this SA thing comes from, t bagging has been ingrained in multiplayer forever but only recently has this become something that people say.

T bagging is a virtual taunt and nothing more, it’s a way to say “you suck” without hurling actual verbal insults or promoting actual hostility.

There is also a massive difference between being t bagged after a close fight or duel and someone repeatedly running you down and t bagging you. The first is the correct use and the second is harassment and open toxicity, yet people seem to assume they are the same or worse that people are trying to SA them (I have never met anyone who thought this in 30 years but maybe there are some freaks out there)

PvP is a competitive environment which naturally breeds toxicity and I think a lot of people just need to accept this. There’s still a big difference between competitive sportsmanlike toxicity and rivalry and open harassment and hostility tho and I think the issue is that the rules of ToS don’t apply evenly and can be abused easily. ZoS bans unfairly and with no stated reasons pretty regularly when it comes to pvp interactions and the double standards when it comes to mass reporting abuse is insane and is the main reason it’s best to just not interact with anyone in pvp ever.

To many people here seem to think in only black and white while life is much more nuanced than that and not everything is so simple

The ai can ban you for making jokes in group chat and whispers with your friends even if no one reported anyone so…

xylena_lazarow · June 1

cuddles_with_wroble wrote: »

not everything is so simple

It should be pretty simple to avoid bagging randoms that you aren't friends with. If we all did that much, this thread wouldn't exist, but if you bag someone who isn't in on the joke, you shouldn't be surprised that they react negatively.

A long time ago as a performer I quickly learned never to involve the audience if they didn't ask for it. Some things that are consensual art or performance on stage would definitely be considered SA if done without consent.

Weesacs · June 4

Who cares?

Seriously, I've been tbagged more than a tea pot lol I just laugh and ignore them.

If you ignore them they stop.

I'm actually in-game friends now with a guy who used to tbag me. He tbagged me a few times over the course of a few BG matches. When I did get him 1v1 I beat him up - which I did a few times actually. I then get a whisper asking what sets I use and we got talking. Since then, I pretty much kill him all the time in BGs as he isn't very good and he stays away from me lol.

We now always give the obligatory 'Hello' when we see each other in game. Oh and the tbagging has stopped.

Honestly, stop being so sensitive. It's only a game lol

xylena_lazarow · June 4

Weesacs wrote: »

Honestly, stop being so sensitive. It's only a game lol

Everyone draws their line somewhere, and "only a game" is not a free pass to be a jerk.

soelslaev · June 5

Telel wrote: »

A lot of people seem to be intent on either gaslighting or appealing to triviality in their rebuttals....

But it is by no means something that should be involuntarily inflicted on others.

I think what several others are clumsily trying to say is that: if a player consents to enter a game where characters kill each other, then, that person also correspondingly consents to receive gestures of degradation, because a gesture of degradation is less harmful than a simulated killing, and being killed in simulation is the thing the player has already consented to.

Now, a counter argument to that would be: the killing is simulated and performed on the character but the gesture is directed towards the player, and therefore crosses the boundary into real life from the simulation. And this idea seems to be what Zenimax has gone with in their enforcement of this gesture. After all, ESO is an activity operated by Zenimax, and Zenimax alone determines what constitutes unsportsmanlike conduct and the consequences of violating those rules.

Telel wrote: »

...the aggrieved party is now technically being cyber stalked by someone harboring ill intent.

I don't know the fancy logical fallacy at play here, but you are exaggerating to the point where you describe a different category. No one in this thread is defending the act of issuing criminal threats.

ADawg · July 4

El_Borracho wrote: »

I don't care about teabaggers, I think they are ridiculous, but I do find myself laughing at players who teabag others that they did not kill. As in they were getting wrecked, ran/streaked away, and their 5-6 buddies came to their rescue. Then they ran over and teabag like they did something. Saw someone this weekend where that was ALL they did. Like he/she was the cheerleader of the DC. Saw them once die, get rezzed, then run over and teabag someone.

It made me look back on the last few weeks and I don't think I've seen a player who either registered the kill or played a role in the kill teabag the victim. Its always someone who fled the scene or watched from the cheap seats.

If you're going to celebrate the kill like its your first time in Cyrodiil, at least play.

its 2025, this surprises you? lol

CatoUnchained · July 4

Just don't teabag. It's obnoxious and disrespectful. More importantly it makes the person engaging in the activity look like a fool and a jerk. So just don't do it.

Islyn · July 4

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

It's just trolling. An attempt to provoke a reaction, like people talking about it in zone chat, or someone making a forum thread. The real problem is the lack of an enforcement system. The trolls know they'll get away with it.

I don't even think it should be enforced or disallowed. It's such a small thing. (to be clear I do not teabag - usually)

Islyn · July 4

mrreow wrote: »

I don’t know why anyone would become angry at such act unless they were already in a pretty bad mood. I think it is a waste of time and resources to try to prevent it somehow. It barely resembles anything anyway. If tomorrow we decided that three crouches and a jump is some kind of pro slavery or oppressive symbol it would be similarly pointless to try to prevent it as the problem is not with the game but with players and their parents and we cannot ban character animations

even years back some people were saying it triggered them. and I was all .....

Major_Toughness · July 5

Tbagging isn't offensive or disrespectful, how it's a bannable offense I have no idea.

opethmaniac · July 7

Major_Toughness wrote: »

Tbagging isn't offensive or disrespectful, how it's a bannable offense I have no idea.

That's your perspective, and it doesn't necessarily apply to other players. Players with bad experiences (real-life) or even just women might feel harassed by such gestures and avoid PVP altogether.

JustLovely · July 7

Major_Toughness wrote: »

Tbagging isn't offensive or disrespectful, how it's a bannable offense I have no idea.

You know full well that teabagging is offensive and disrespectful. What you're really saying is "I should be allowed to behave however I want, even if offensive and disrespectful, and it should be fine with everyone else because it's fine with me."

WuffyCerulei · July 7

It's childish and simple-minded to do it to strangers, or even people you don't like. They don't know you, and you don't know how they'll take to it. They might see it as unwanted harassment, which it very much is, while others may just be blasé about it. Depends on the person, but in the end, it's about consent. Strangers don't consent to it, unless you ask them. Though obviously players won't do that as it takes away the fleeting power of possibly making someone uncomfortable for a moment.

With friends though, it's friendly and playful. They KNOW you jest and don't mean it in a mean-spirited way. And hopefully if it does bother them, they communicate with words that it does, and you stop doing it to that person.

TLDR: Teabag or clam slam your friends cuz they know you're joking, not your enemies or strangers who don't consent.

peacenote · July 7

Personally, as this is a video game, I don't take it that seriously. When it happens to me in game, I just laugh. To me it's part of MMO culture. Plus, I'd much rather have someone crouch over me than whisper insults to me, which also happens and I find to be way more aggressive.

I always have thought it seemed both overkill and unrealistic to make it a bannable offense, since it can't possibly be enforced consistently. I personally would rather see ZOS take measures to better address accessibility issues (sensitivity to flashes, sounds, color blindness, etc.) than take time replacing the crouch animation in Cyro. Both scenarios potentially impact people enjoying the game, but the former stems from medical issues that people can't control, while the latter can be solved by simply deciding not to be upset.

Of course, this is coming from someone who turns off the profanity filter immediately upon making a new character, because I find it so irritating, so I'm not easily offended/bothered.

MincMincMinc · July 7

Tbagging is bannable now, a fun gamer ritual for decades is simply not worth doing. All it takes is out of context evidence and anyone involved can lose a decade long account and potentially hundreds or thousands of dollars invested into an account.

People report for anything these days, and sadly tend to be catered to.

Islyn · July 8

WuffyCerulei wrote: »

It's childish and simple-minded to do it to strangers, or even people you don't like. They don't know you, and you don't know how they'll take to it. They might see it as unwanted harassment, which it very much is, while others may just be blasé about it. Depends on the person, but in the end, it's about consent. Strangers don't consent to it, unless you ask them. Though obviously players won't do that as it takes away the fleeting power of possibly making someone uncomfortable for a moment.

With friends though, it's friendly and playful. They KNOW you jest and don't mean it in a mean-spirited way. And hopefully if it does bother them, they communicate with words that it does, and you stop doing it to that person.

TLDR: Teabag or clam slam your friends cuz they know you're joking, not your enemies or strangers who don't consent.

No one, but NO ONE is doing that to ' possibly making someone uncomfortable for a moment' lol. No one who teabags is doing it with that much thought! I'd say using *any* of the emotes (kiss this, flip the bird, tea time, shovel, prayer, playing any music etc) actually displays more intent to be a pest than a crouch does.

I'd love to see a single person who actually would tbag say differently.

My PVP characters are NBs and always in stealth unless actively fighting - so now if I kill u and stealth and take off - UH OH I did a harassment without consent.

what?

I am gonna steer clear of this topic now - because honestly the 'content' herein is so annoying, that I'll be happier if I avoid it.

(See how that works?)

ZOS_Icy · July 8

Greetings,

We have recently removed some unnecessary back and forth from this thread. This is a reminder to keep the discussion civil and constructive. Please keep our Community Rules in mind moving forward.

The Elder Scrolls Online Team