Sub-classing and the freedom to play anything but werewolf (PTS)

Darkness734 · April 15

I've been posting about the need for buffs on werewolves for a long while now, With no Dev response. I've posted in bug reports, reporting the bugs werewolves face, such as ferocious roar not working on the first heavy attack (a bug present since 2013 it seems). Werewolves don't get access to basic weapon passives, and have nothing to make up for it. The community for werewolves is absolutely destroyed with no one playing outside of solo play or peak optimized pvp (and even then its just okay). Werewolves are something to be feared! not something to look down upon and ignored.

With the addition of subclassing (something werewolves gain little from), Werewolves will be further pushed down and facing complete useless-ness. I just want to be a mid level dps performer in a dungeon or trial (is that truly too much to ask for?).

Here are some proposed changes

-light attacks hit multiple targets, maybe speed it up a tad bit too.
-Taunt be taken off roar and placed on feral pounce to offer it real value because theres no real use for feral pounce at all and this would free up the choice between savagery and major protection.
-FIX FEROCIOUS ROAR NOT WORKING ON THE FIRST HEAVY ATTACK this has been broken for years
-Hircines rage needs to apply major berserk no matter the health percentage as major berserk is nearly unusable unless in a group PVE content with a dedicated tank
-Hircines fortitude needs a heal over time added and/or an aoe heal for groups
-Execute scaling added to ALL abilities
-piercing howl should have some sort of synergy on both morphs

Allow werewolves to benefit from weapon passive abilities!!! Explain to me why they dont have this by now its been 10 years????

Possible Scribe ability - a claw strike similar to rapid strikes from the dual wield tree!!!

Crown store skin - Different werewolf colors or fur patterns.

Darkness734 · April 15

I ask everyone reading this to please chime in. Whether you use werewolf or not, we all know its way too under powered compared to everything else

Renato90085 · April 15

1bar/can’t use class skill and scribe/now they nerf some passive werewolf can own
yes,this really need many big buff if all thing start be op…
I have a werewolf but I just use he bite someone if they want werewolf..

Tommy_The_Gun · April 15

Compared to other specs, Sub-classing is a huge nerf for a WW, as all other classes will benefit way more. You will have for example DPS builds with 3x "DPS" trees from 3 different classes. But, compared to what we have now on live, WW might get tiny pinch stronger as you will be able to pick passives from different classes and some of those work in WW, so for WW min-maxing builds - meta will change. But again, it does not matter much since as stated before - non-ww builds will benefit the most and will be light years ahead.

BixenteN7Akantor · April 15

Feels nice to see someone else acknowledge the 1st HA bug with Ferocious Roar

I recently made a HA WW build for fun, sadly I deal quite less damage with HA in WW form than without, but those fast HA are funny to see

autocookies · April 15

Werewolves were completely forgotten with hybridization… then forgotten again with scribing, and currently forgotten yet again with sub-classing. The last time Werewolf was touched directly, the update nerfed damage—but at least we no longer have to stand right next to the tank while we parse…

What did Werewolf do to be hated this badly? That’s the unanswered question.

Below is a quote taken out of context, but it perfectly fits PvE Werewolf:

HatchetHaro wrote: »

Of course people can play how they want to play. It's just that if they join a group and they underperform in their precious one-bar builds, we get to kick them because we play how we want to play: not carrying some buffoon!

Look, when you join a group, you are expected to carry your own weight. Any amount of damage you aren't able to do, the rest of the group has to deal with in the form of longer fight times, more mechanics, more chances of death, and more chances at wiping. So if you bring your Oakensoul build into a trial and you deal at least around average dps in the group, you're golden. But if you start to fall behind, people will start questioning your build.

Darkness734 · April 15

thanks for the contributions guys. All of the chatter helps bring attention to this. Hopefully more people chime in

Darkness734 · April 15

lol just learned they nerfed some of my gear RIP werewolf build

Wereswan · April 15

autocookies wrote: »

Werewolves were completely forgotten with hybridization… then forgotten again with scribing, and currently forgotten yet again with sub-classing. The last time Werewolf was touched directly, the update nerfed damage—but at least we no longer have to stand right next to the tank while we parse…

What did Werewolf do to be hated this badly? That’s the unanswered question.

Below is a quote taken out of context, but it perfectly fits PvE Werewolf:

HatchetHaro wrote: »

Of course people can play how they want to play. It's just that if they join a group and they underperform in their precious one-bar builds, we get to kick them because we play how we want to play: not carrying some buffoon!

Look, when you join a group, you are expected to carry your own weight. Any amount of damage you aren't able to do, the rest of the group has to deal with in the form of longer fight times, more mechanics, more chances of death, and more chances at wiping. So if you bring your Oakensoul build into a trial and you deal at least around average dps in the group, you're golden. But if you start to fall behind, people will start questioning your build.

There was a time when ravening packs of werewolves roamed the streets of Imperial City, and ZOS is probably concerned that any buffs will bring it back.

Darkness734 · April 16

Wereswan wrote: »

autocookies wrote: »

Werewolves were completely forgotten with hybridization… then forgotten again with scribing, and currently forgotten yet again with sub-classing. The last time Werewolf was touched directly, the update nerfed damage—but at least we no longer have to stand right next to the tank while we parse…

What did Werewolf do to be hated this badly? That’s the unanswered question.

Below is a quote taken out of context, but it perfectly fits PvE Werewolf:

HatchetHaro wrote: »

Of course people can play how they want to play. It's just that if they join a group and they underperform in their precious one-bar builds, we get to kick them because we play how we want to play: not carrying some buffoon!

Look, when you join a group, you are expected to carry your own weight. Any amount of damage you aren't able to do, the rest of the group has to deal with in the form of longer fight times, more mechanics, more chances of death, and more chances at wiping. So if you bring your Oakensoul build into a trial and you deal at least around average dps in the group, you're golden. But if you start to fall behind, people will start questioning your build.

There was a time when ravening packs of werewolves roamed the streets of Imperial City, and ZOS is probably concerned that any buffs will bring it back.

I get the notion but they are left in the dust now.

Darkness734 · April 16

@ZOS_Kevin

is anyone looking into this at all

Techwolf_Lupindo · April 16

Wereswan wrote: »

There was a time when ravening packs of werewolves roamed the streets of Imperial City, and ZOS is probably concerned that any buffs will bring it back.

I lead some of those packs. Would love to do it again.

Wereswan · April 16

Techwolf_Lupindo wrote: »

Wereswan wrote: »

There was a time when ravening packs of werewolves roamed the streets of Imperial City, and ZOS is probably concerned that any buffs will bring it back.

I lead some of those packs. Would love to do it again.

I hid from some of those packs.

It does emphasize the point, though; werewolves need something.

ColoniaCroisant · April 16

They also shadow nerfed Werewolves in this update to no longer get armor passives....so that's cool 🙄. Give us some ww scribed skills, some ww infinite archive sets, some *** BUFFS 🙌

Darth_LucSky · April 16

ColoniaCroisant wrote: »

They also shadow nerfed Werewolves in this update to no longer get armor passives....so that's cool 🙄. Give us some ww scribed skills, some ww infinite archive sets, some *** BUFFS 🙌

What? Can you confirm this?
Why on earth would they do this?

Erickson9610 · April 16

ColoniaCroisant wrote: »

They also shadow nerfed Werewolves in this update to no longer get armor passives....so that's cool 🙄. Give us some ww scribed skills, some ww infinite archive sets, some *** BUFFS 🙌

I checked on the PTS and armor passives still apply. They're not disabled the way weapon passives are.

Erickson9610 · April 16

If you're reading this and you dislike Subclassing, I implore you to try Werewolf. While every other build in the game can freely experiment with any skill at any time, Werewolf is the sole exception.

You can't mix Werewolf skills with non-Werewolf skills. It has the most identity of any playstyle in the game, and even has a very limited number of appearances you can take on. If you like restricted ability and cosmetic options, Werewolf is the playstyle for you — just don't ever expect it to challenge the meta, even with its exclusive and niche use case skills. If you want to be competitive, then play the meta.

Darkness734 · April 16

Erickson9610 wrote: »

If you're reading this and you dislike Subclassing, I implore you to try Werewolf. While every other build in the game can freely experiment with any skill at any time, Werewolf is the sole exception.

You can't mix Werewolf skills with non-Werewolf skills. It has the most identity of any playstyle in the game, and even has a very limited number of appearances you can take on. If you like restricted ability and cosmetic options, Werewolf is the playstyle for you — just don't ever expect it to challenge the meta, even with its exclusive and niche use case skills. If you want to be competitive, then play the meta.

Love the commentary. The silence from devs speaks volumes

JaxontheUnfortunate · April 16

Yeah, I had a concern when subclassing was hinted at would further widen the performance gap.

dark_hunterxmg · April 16

So.... how about those werewolf double spec bows? Could you imagine.

Darkness734 · April 22

Praying some dev hears the cries of the half dead werewolf community. I just want to be able to play pve without being shunned and do mid level dps in a group.

huskandhunger · April 22

@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_GinaBruno

Hello 👋

There is a sense among werewolf players of being left behind performance-wise with respect to scribing, subclassing and the power creep these bring in PVE content and PVP content.

Has there been any communication lately on addressing performance gaps so werewolf doesn't get left behind?

We're all avid players who are passionate about playing the game and definitely want to feel like we too belong in all areas of content, instead of neglected or out of date.

Thanks! 🙏

Kartalin · April 22

Werewolf can absolutely use subclassing as a way to get different class passives and ultimately build a stronger wolf than we see currently. Just focus on what can carry over to wolf form.

Stx · April 22

Kartalin wrote: »

Werewolf can absolutely use subclassing as a way to get different class passives and ultimately build a stronger wolf than we see currently. Just focus on what can carry over to wolf form.

Uh… okay?

As has been mentioned, wolves gain less from subclassing than everyone else putting them even further behind then they already were. No one is saying wolves gain *nothing* from subclassing.

Veinblood1965 · April 22

I'd love to play a growler however in PVP they aren't as good as just taking the Vampire passives. If there was a perk to using the passives that were at least equal to WW's I'd enjoy it. They are fun to play, but no fun being slightly less better than other options in PVP.

Darkness734 · April 22

huskandhunger wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_GinaBruno

Hello 👋

There is a sense among werewolf players of being left behind performance-wise with respect to scribing, subclassing and the power creep these bring in PVE content and PVP content.

Has there been any communication lately on addressing performance gaps so werewolf doesn't get left behind?

We're all avid players who are passionate about playing the game and definitely want to feel like we too belong in all areas of content, instead of neglected or out of date.

Thanks! 🙏

I keep tagging @ZOS_Kevin and hes dodging me hard with no answers lol. im sure hes seen my posts by now

Darkness734 · April 29

Power to werewolves!

Suna_Ye_Sunnabe · April 29

Here's to hoping for some love for werewolves. They dearly need access to more than one bar, better aoe damage, a pull for the tanks, and a reliable heal over time. They're so unnecessarily difficult to do well with, and even at their best, werewolves fall laughably low compared to other play styles. Even oakensoul heavy attack builds do better.

dark_hunterxmg · April 29

I'm okay with one bar and I prefer it, but the skills need to be updated and more options need to be available. There is a distinct lack of variety in the current werewolf kit. So many good suggestions have been made, but there has been no response so far.

Panderbander · May 1

This is what it looks like to see a group talking at a brick wall. Werewolf is a relic and will never be back. Best to just accept that and walk away from the wall (it won't respond)

Erickson9610 · May 1

Panderbander wrote: »

This is what it looks like to see a group talking at a brick wall. Werewolf is a relic and will never be back. Best to just accept that and walk away from the wall (it won't respond)

If nobody will voice the concerns we have, then nobody will hear it.