Zos should put more effort and time into Eso economy

XSTRONG

I feel the Eso economy is as bad as it gonna get and Zos needs to do something to shake up the economy abit.

Right now o ps5 eu, Gold sellers/buyers rule the whole server

Erickson9610

No

Leave ZOS out of the economy and let players sort it out through supply and demand.

Tandor

No

There isn't really an effective economy in ESO, the guild trader system is limited in its application. It's only those players who sell high who can afford to buy high. Supply and demand only goes some way to balancing things given that many players simply don't participate in the economy. Opening up the whole trading structure is the only way to change things, and there's no evidence that that will ever happen.

SilverBride

No

I'm not sure what is meant by gold sellers and buyers.

Is this referring to players selling and buying crowns from other players for gold?
Or is it referring to selling gold for real life money?

wolfie1.0.

Maybe?

Depends on what you mean by economy and how you suggest a shake up.

Right now things are settling still from the last shake up.

XSTRONG

Yes

Erickson9610 wrote: »

Leave ZOS out of the economy and let players sort it out through supply and demand.

I think zos needs to put more new things into the market like sets, new mats etc.

Over the Last year or longer there havent been any real new item to the market.
If Zos want the economy to be around materials then they need to come up with something new that put your material to use.

kargen27

No

If the gold sellers are selling gold for real world currencies that is an issue that you can report in game. Gold being transferred between players shouldn't be having much of an impact on the economy. I think what we are seeing now is the result of a much needed correction in the economy and a saturation of materials to the market. Both happening at the same time caused the economy to overcorrect but it is beginning to adjust.
ZOS trying to artificially control the market would probably create unintended results. Best to let it sort itself out.

XSTRONG

Yes

SilverBride wrote: »

I'm not sure what is meant by gold sellers and buyers.

Is this referring to players selling and buying crowns from other players for gold?
Or is it referring to selling gold for real life money?

Im referring to gold sellers o pseu.

Gold on PSeu are ALOT more expensive one pseu then pc,xbox or psna

VoxAdActa

No

I'm voting no, with the caveat that every time a thread pops up about "the economy," it's historically been a way to sneak in advocacy for a central auction house, which I will always oppose.

I don't like having a bot-running cartel dictate that I can only sell a [whatever] for a specific price, because the scraping bots will instantly snatch it out of the hands of real players and flip it if I'm 1gp lower, and it will never sell at all if it's 1gp higher (because of the 8 million [whatevers] at the dictated price that have to sell before anyone sees mine). It only takes less than a dozen people to do that, too, like we've seen in WoW and GW2.

I like being able to shop for deals, and I like being able to time the market when I sell, and I like being able to choose whether I want to make a quick sale vs when I'm willing to wait for the price to increase. I like being able to list some expensive item at 40% below market rate just to give someone a surprise deal. I like seeing what small guilds in out-of-the-way traders are selling; I've picked up some rare, expensive motif pieces I was missing out by some nowhere wayshrine before.

An auction house just turns traders into NPC vendors with extra steps.

SilverBride

No

XSTRONG wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

I'm not sure what is meant by gold sellers and buyers.

Is this referring to players selling and buying crowns from other players for gold?
Or is it referring to selling gold for real life money?

Im referring to gold sellers o pseu.

Gold on PSeu are ALOT more expensive one pseu then pc,xbox or psna

I'm still confused about which type of gold seller is being referred to.

Lumsdenml

No

A central auction house is a horrible idea. That will ruin the economy faster than anything.

Grizzbeorn

No

No.

FatnissEverdeen1

No

VoxAdActa wrote: »

I'm voting no, with the caveat that every time a thread pops up about "the economy," it's historically been a way to sneak in advocacy for a central auction house, which I will always oppose.

I don't like having a bot-running cartel dictate that I can only sell a [whatever] for a specific price, because the scraping bots will instantly snatch it out of the hands of real players and flip it if I'm 1gp lower, and it will never sell at all if it's 1gp higher (because of the 8 million [whatevers] at the dictated price that have to sell before anyone sees mine). It only takes less than a dozen people to do that, too, like we've seen in WoW and GW2.

I like being able to shop for deals, and I like being able to time the market when I sell, and I like being able to choose whether I want to make a quick sale vs when I'm willing to wait for the price to increase. I like being able to list some expensive item at 40% below market rate just to give someone a surprise deal. I like seeing what small guilds in out-of-the-way traders are selling; I've picked up some rare, expensive motif pieces I was missing out by some nowhere wayshrine before.

An auction house just turns traders into NPC vendors with extra steps.

Just curious what you think about my idea. I've always thought it would be cool if there was a compromise in the form of an alternate PVE Imperial City (IC). If implemented with a lore justification like mirror dimensions (Mirrormoor magic) or time travel (Akatosh magic), etc., we can have both a PVP & PVE IC.

In this scenario, each guild trader has a counterpart in IC, so buyers can conveniently access all the traders in the game in one location without a central auction house existing. Frankly, implementing this might even reduce the server load from re-zoning too. The caveat would likely be that traders would be instanced inside buildings in IC because the game would probably struggle to render ~197 NPCs + players in one place. As such, finding traders could be relatively easy since you would go to a "Treasures of the Alik'r" or "Curios of Northern Elsweyr" building in IC to find IC representatives of the guild traders in those zones.

On TTC, you'd still see an item listed in Alik'r or Norhtern Elsweyr NOT IC, but having a little familiarity with IC, you'd still be able to hunt down the item you're looking for with ease. Of course, traders in outlaw refuges would be in an IC outlaw refuge.

Ultimately, it would be a lot like the guild trader system we have now but with less re-zoning, and it would give players a resplendent new zone to explore. There are so many more things that could be done with a PVE IC, but this is one idea.

Dragonnord

SilverBride wrote: »

I'm not sure what is meant by gold sellers and buyers.

selling and buying crowns from other players for gold?

When you are selling or buying crowns you are giving your crowns or your gold, you are not selling your gold.

The response and what the OP refers to is obvious, and they clarified it already on comment #8.
 

Amottica

No

Erickson9610 wrote: »

Leave ZOS out of the economy and let players sort it out through supply and demand.

If the Supply is not there, it demands that a player pay a high price or farm it for themselves. If the price is low then it means there are not enough players interested in buying it so farm something else.

Supply and Demand works better than having developers start to control things.

SilverBride

No

Dragonnord wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

I'm not sure what is meant by gold sellers and buyers.

selling and buying crowns from other players for gold?

When you are selling or buying crowns you are giving your crowns or your gold, you are not selling your gold.

The response and what the OP refers to is obvious, and they clarified it already on comment #8.
 

I also asked "Or is it referring to selling gold for real life money?" to which the reply was "Im referring to gold sellers o pseu".

That would have answered it for me but adding that "Gold on PSeu are ALOT more expensive one pseu then pc,xbox or psna" made me wonder what they are asking to have done.

Thus the confusion.

VoxAdActa

No

FatnissEverdeen1 wrote: »

VoxAdActa wrote: »

I'm voting no, with the caveat that every time a thread pops up about "the economy," it's historically been a way to sneak in advocacy for a central auction house, which I will always oppose.

I don't like having a bot-running cartel dictate that I can only sell a [whatever] for a specific price, because the scraping bots will instantly snatch it out of the hands of real players and flip it if I'm 1gp lower, and it will never sell at all if it's 1gp higher (because of the 8 million [whatevers] at the dictated price that have to sell before anyone sees mine). It only takes less than a dozen people to do that, too, like we've seen in WoW and GW2.

I like being able to shop for deals, and I like being able to time the market when I sell, and I like being able to choose whether I want to make a quick sale vs when I'm willing to wait for the price to increase. I like being able to list some expensive item at 40% below market rate just to give someone a surprise deal. I like seeing what small guilds in out-of-the-way traders are selling; I've picked up some rare, expensive motif pieces I was missing out by some nowhere wayshrine before.

An auction house just turns traders into NPC vendors with extra steps.

Just curious what you think about my idea. I've always thought it would be cool if there was a compromise in the form of an alternate PVE Imperial City (IC). If implemented with a lore justification like mirror dimensions (Mirrormoor magic) or time travel (Akatosh magic), etc., we can have both a PVP & PVE IC.

In this scenario, each guild trader has a counterpart in IC, so buyers can conveniently access all the traders in the game in one location without a central auction house existing. Frankly, implementing this might even reduce the server load from re-zoning too. The caveat would likely be that traders would be instanced inside buildings in IC because the game would probably struggle to render ~197 NPCs + players in one place. As such, finding traders could be relatively easy since you would go to a "Treasures of the Alik'r" or "Curios of Northern Elsweyr" building in IC to find IC representatives of the guild traders in those zones.

On TTC, you'd still see an item listed in Alik'r or Norhtern Elsweyr NOT IC, but having a little familiarity with IC, you'd still be able to hunt down the item you're looking for with ease. Of course, traders in outlaw refuges would be in an IC outlaw refuge.

Ultimately, it would be a lot like the guild trader system we have now but with less re-zoning, and it would give players a resplendent new zone to explore. There are so many more things that could be done with a PVE IC, but this is one idea.

Hmm. I think I kind of like some aspects of this, and kind of dislike others.

It removes the locational advantages and competing for different traders, and removes the unique market of the towns around the traders. Right now, if we get a spot in Elden Root, I can price crafting and improvement mats a little higher, because there's a lot of foot traffic and a lot of folks just want to make things and don't want to be bothered going all over Tamriel comparison shopping for the best price. If we get a spot in Belkarth, I can sell those higher-end items I've been saving, but I can't afford to sell them for anything more than a fair price, because the competition is fierce. If we get a spot in Daggerfall, lower-level stuff (especially cheaper motifs and recipes) will sell relatively quickly, but I have to sell them in such a way as new players aren't priced out of the market (so I'll end up doing high volume but with low margins). If we end up stuck in an outlaw's refuge somewhere, I have to put up at least a few "loss leaders" that will show up on the first "sort by price" page on TTC so I can draw customers to a place they wouldn't normally go, and I can't count on selling things as impulse purchases. All of that becomes kind of my endgame. Putting all the traders together in one spot eliminates that.

It would also make my market research more tedious, because now I have to see what everyone is selling and for what price, as opposed to just the four other guild traders in my town.

On the other hand, from the buyer's perspective, it makes finding that one thing you need so much easier if you can just check all the traders in one spot. It reduces or eliminates the tendency to "window shop" on traders you just happen to pass by, and it reduces the tendency to make unplanned impulse purchases (since you have to plan to go out there in the first place). All of that will help a buyer save gold. It would also make comparison shopping simpler. I feel like the competition all being grouped up will lower prices, which is kind of bad for me (we've already had a disheartening price crash), but good for shoppers.

But I worry it might depress prices to the point that common stuff simply won't be sold at all, because there's no profit in it. For example, right now, sanded maple prices are so low that you're better off vendoring it (for 4gp/ea) than selling it in the trader (for 5gp/ea, best case), because the trader will only pay you about 150gp more per stack after taxes and the guild cut, with the bonus of having to wait a few days to get that 150gp. Stuff like that can make it hard for new players (or just new crafters) to get the materials they need, and I worry it will spread to a bunch of other mats if the competition for customers gets more intense.

So I certainly don't think I'd leave the game over it (like I would eventually with an AH), but it would introduce some fundamental changes to the trading endgame and the economy. Some good, some bad.

It's not a horrible idea, though. I feel like a case could be made, and the idea could be tweaked to be something I'm fully in favor of.

sans-culottes

Yes

A central auction house would be nice. The current system isn’t exactly user-friendly and reminds me of trying to find items using EverQuest’s old Bazaar—only with fewer tools to find what you need/want. If people would quit over a central auction house, then I’m sorry to hear that.

Toanis

sans-culottes wrote: »

A central auction house would be nice. The current system isn’t exactly user-friendly and reminds me of trying to find items using EverQuest’s old Bazaar—only with fewer tools to find what you need/want. If people would quit over a central auction house, then I’m sorry to hear that.

ESO's trading system makes it difficult for casual buyers and sellers to judge what a fair price is. It's a dream come true for a vocal minority who enjoys roleplaying trade tycoons, who control the prices while gaslighting everyone else into believing that this is what would happen with a global auction house.

And while traveling to remote regions and selling goods from there at a huge profit was a thing in medieval times, so was the risk of losing the goods (and maybe even your life) on the long was home. So no, teleporting to remote markets to find bargains and instantly putting the item in your own city shop at an inflated price is in no way close to "medieval economy".

spartaxoxo

Yes

Some things I'd like to see

1) Do something about gold selling bots and bots in general
2) Make new alchemy ingredient that we can farm in an engaging way
3) Lower the prices of some of the items available for Tel-Var and Fortunes
4) Give us some more tradeable stuff to farm in dungeons/arenas/trials


What they should not do

1) More coin sinks
2) an auction house

RebornV3x

Maybe?

The only real problem is there should be more guild traders especially in main cities and the alliance capitals having 5 or 6 is per big city is actually kinda bad 10 would be a good number.

sans-culottes

Yes

Toanis wrote: »

sans-culottes wrote: »

A central auction house would be nice. The current system isn’t exactly user-friendly and reminds me of trying to find items using EverQuest’s old Bazaar—only with fewer tools to find what you need/want. If people would quit over a central auction house, then I’m sorry to hear that.

ESO's trading system makes it difficult for casual buyers and sellers to judge what a fair price is. It's a dream come true for a vocal minority who enjoys roleplaying trade tycoons, who control the prices while gaslighting everyone else into believing that this is what would happen with a global auction house.

And while traveling to remote regions and selling goods from there at a huge profit was a thing in medieval times, so was the risk of losing the goods (and maybe even your life) on the long was home. So no, teleporting to remote markets to find bargains and instantly putting the item in your own city shop at an inflated price is in no way close to "medieval economy".

Well said! Great post.

VoxAdActa

No

Toanis wrote: »

It's a dream come true for a vocal minority who enjoys roleplaying trade tycoons, who control the prices while gaslighting everyone else into believing that this is what would happen with a global auction house.

Boy, it sure would be nice if there were a dozen other MMOs with a central AH that we could look at and see what happens re: "tycoons" with a central AH.

Central AH is no better than NPC vendors. I'd rather ZOS just put every tradable item in the game on an NPC than do any work towards becoming an NPC vendor myself.

sans-culottes

Yes

VoxAdActa wrote: »

Toanis wrote: »

It's a dream come true for a vocal minority who enjoys roleplaying trade tycoons, who control the prices while gaslighting everyone else into believing that this is what would happen with a global auction house.

Boy, it sure would be nice if there were a dozen other MMOs with a central AH that we could look at and see what happens re: "tycoons" with a central AH.

Central AH is no better than NPC vendors. I'd rather ZOS just put every tradable item in the game on an NPC than do any work towards becoming an NPC vendor myself.

I’m sorry you’ve had this experience. However, my decades of experience are such that I’ve never felt a central auction house was like an NPC vendor.

The idea that this doesn’t occur in ESO is just false, so I’m not sure where this is coming from. It has, however, made finding what you want more annoying.

PS. Anecdotally, this is quite present on the PSN server. One person runs at least three of the major, most prominent trading guilds. So the idea that it prevents these situations goes against that example.

xylena_lazarow

Maybe?

Whatever they did last year to fix the inflation was very much welcome.

Orbital78

It was mostly a side effect of banning lots of gold sellers and lots of events dropping all the things. At this point deconstructed gear isn't worth it most of the time. Saving the need for a craft bag, which helps a lot with inventory management.

OsUfi

No

VoxAdActa wrote: »

Toanis wrote: »

It's a dream come true for a vocal minority who enjoys roleplaying trade tycoons, who control the prices while gaslighting everyone else into believing that this is what would happen with a global auction house.

Boy, it sure would be nice if there were a dozen other MMOs with a central AH that we could look at and see what happens re: "tycoons" with a central AH.

Central AH is no better than NPC vendors. I'd rather ZOS just put every tradable item in the game on an NPC than do any work towards becoming an NPC vendor myself.

Yeah, this.

Auction houses always seem to de-personalize MMORPGs to me, turning trading systems into a one stop shop always feels like it removes the player to player element of trade. If I wanted to play an RPG with less player interactions, I'd go back to Skyrim or Morrowind.

EvilGoatKing

Yes

JHartEllis who is a stream team member, has degrees in business, etc etc, did like 3 hour presentation covering the game economy & its issues and ideas for them to consider.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eg4oeeLWMqs

If they wont listen to or respond to him what chance do you think any of us have?

sans-culottes

Yes

EvilGoatKing wrote: »

JHartEllis who is a stream team member, has degrees in business, etc etc, did like 3 hour presentation covering the game economy & its issues and ideas for them to consider.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eg4oeeLWMqs

If they wont listen to or respond to him what chance do you think any of us have?

Lots of people have business degrees, though.

xXCJsniperXx7

No

There is no economy in games in the first place. If your currency is infinity sourced, digitally generated, it has no value. If there's an unlimited supply of anything for that matter it's 0 value since anybody can get as much as they want. The only value it can have is equal to Time spent, thus treating it as the currency you could say. Still this is a game which you don't need to spend your Time in.

AlienatedGoat

No

Nah. If your problem is with gold-selling, that's a botting and RMT issue, not an economy issue.