PTS 10.2.2: Solo queues available for both 8v8 and 4v4

taugrim

ZOS team / @ZOS_Kevin et al, please delete this thread, there's already an existing one, so this is an unneeded duplicate.

Necrotech_Master

the biggest problem i can see (at least with the 8v8) will be queue times

the BG population is not huge, and 8v8 requires 16 players (4 players more than currently)

taugrim

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

the biggest problem i can see (at least with the 8v8) will be queue times

the BG population is not huge, and 8v8 requires 16 players (4 players more than currently)

Yes, queue times are the obvious downside.

But honestly, if you're a solo player, which would you rather have:
1. longer queue times, but you won't be matched against a premade
2. shorter queue times, but you may get matched against a premade, resulting in a lopsided outcome

During prime time on PC NA, solo queue typically pops with a few minutes. Acceptable IMO.

And I think when U44 launches, there will be more people queuing because the content is new, and I've heard 8v8 is a ton of fun.

CameraBeardThePirate

I think the happy middle ground would be 1 queue for 8's capped at solo or duo queue only, with a solo 4's queue and a group 4's queue.

A duo will be effective, but not gamebreaking in an 8 man environment, and cutting the casual queue to only 1 queue would help immensely with queue times.

Necrotech_Master

taugrim wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

the biggest problem i can see (at least with the 8v8) will be queue times

the BG population is not huge, and 8v8 requires 16 players (4 players more than currently)

Yes, queue times are the obvious downside.

But honestly, if you're a solo player, which would you rather have:
1. longer queue times, but you won't be matched against a premade
2. shorter queue times, but you may get matched against a premade, resulting in a lopsided outcome

During prime time on PC NA, solo queue typically pops with a few minutes. Acceptable IMO.

And I think when U44 launches, there will be more people queuing because the content is new, and I've heard 8v8 is a ton of fun.

will have to see what happens for sure lol

i still think one of those queues will end up becoming dead or near dead after awhile, i dont know if it will be able to retain players for that long

i dont usually queue into BGs solo, my most fun times in BGs were queuing with a friend as a duo, which is not possible in the solo only queue

right now on live matches already feel pretty lopsided because there is not enough players in the queue, so even though i only see myself as a mid level pvp player, i still get matched up with sweats about 80% of the time, making the matches already feel lopsided

so i dont really care if i go against premades as a solo, the biggest problem is more the population in the queue is not enough to even let an MMR system work properly

Aldoss

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

I think the happy middle ground would be 1 queue for 8's capped at solo or duo queue only, with a solo 4's queue and a group 4's queue.

A duo will be effective, but not gamebreaking in an 8 man environment, and cutting the casual queue to only 1 queue would help immensely with queue times.

This is what I'm advocating for. I'm sad that this bandaid fix means that my wife and I will continue to experience a game that has horrible queue times and still maintains a chance that we get paired against a coordinated, optimized 4-man that can slaughter the entire lobby.

Capping the queue at duo provides a best of both worlds option.

taugrim

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

I think the happy middle ground would be 1 queue for 8's capped at solo or duo queue only, with a solo 4's queue and a group 4's queue.

A duo will be effective, but not gamebreaking in an 8 man environment, and cutting the casual queue to only 1 queue would help immensely with queue times.

I didn't see @Ire'Works other thread on this forum.

Yes, I agree that that would be a happy middle ground.

licenturion

Third thread about this. Lol

So I will also repeat here that I am very happy with the decision to not abandon solo players and provide an option to have a fair playground for matches.

I would rather wait a bit longer for a fun match than have a quick lopsided stomp because of coordinating premade groups with set and ability synergy and discord voice chat going on. Cause then I would rather play not at all. We solo players have no effect on the group queue times, because a lot of people just wouldn’t queue at all if there wasn’t a solo queue.

Sorry for repeating but new threads keep popping up about this subject and I feel it is important the voices of solo players are important, even now that they made changes in our favour. As long as this isn’t on live, the battle is not yet won.

taugrim

Mods, @ZOS_Kevin:

Please delete this thread. It's an unneeded duplicate of this thread:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/666660/splitting-the-queue-via-solo-group-queues-will-kill-the-battlegrounds-population

Theist_VII

Solo queue with MMR is going to artificially inflate the wait times on 8v8 and kill it in the cradle.

Theist_VII

Not only is it going to have that effect, but the problem of players all on the same MMR bracket solo queuing at the same time and grouping players down in that solo queue at the same time.

Iriidius

Solo players already get matched against premades in Cyrodiil and Imperial City and should not loose battleground solo queue as the last place where they can avoid fighting premades. Not every player has a group of always available friends and those who have are already dominating Cyrodiil, Imperial City and group BG queue. A lot of Cyrodiil smallscalers are doing solo battlegrounds when their smallscale is not available and go Cyrodiil/IC whenever they have smallscale but never alone. Removing solo queue will probably drive off more solo players from battleground than there are premades total and reduce battleground population and increase queue time overall. Choosing solo or premade queue is actually more important than choosing between 4v4, 4v4v4 and 8v8 IMO.

Iriidius

Alternatively insteat of seperating queues ZoS could also try to equalize the fights between premades and solo players by either queueing premades with a higher MMR for beeing premades (so that bad premades fight against average solo players, average premades fight against good solo players and good premades fight against the best solo players and the best premades still fight against best premades as there is no other fair match for them) or give them debuffs debuffing them to the strength of the solo players/ give the solo players buffs buffing them to same strenght as premade.

ecru

Theist_VII wrote: »

Solo queue with MMR is going to artificially inflate the wait times on 8v8 and kill it in the cradle.

?????

it works fine in every other game, and if queue times are too long, devs can loosen matchmaking rules. what is with ESO players and thinking ESO will somehow have all of these issues that no other game has ever had? is this a console player thing, since most of you have never played another MMO?

we had *visible* solo queue MMR in Rift, a game with a small fraction of the population of ESO. i had the highest MMR for my class in north america, and i still got fast queues during primetime. i did have to wait 10-20 minutes at times in the middle of the night, but that's to be expected with such a high mmr, a small population, and off primetime for my region.

i'm also not against allowing a group of 4 to queue into an 8v8, as long as they are always queued up against another equal mmr group of 4 on the opposite team. this way you'd have premade+pugs vs premade+pugs. things would balance out. duo queues in my opinion should not be subject to the same matchmaking rules though, just treat them as a solo queue and combine their individual mmr.

ZOS_GregoryV

Greetings all,

Per the OP's request, we have closed this thread as there another thread on this topic, which can be found here.

Regards,
-Greg-