Splitting the queue via Solo/Group queues will kill the Battlegrounds population

IreWorks

We've been here before. This has been one of the main issues with Battlegrounds on the live server for years and minimizing the amount of queue options was one of the most promising aspects of the Battlegrounds overhaul when PTS initially came out.

If large groups causing game imbalance is an issue in the 8v8 mode, the queue system for 8v8 should be changed to be Solo+Duo queue only. If 4 person grouping is too much, that should be the only queuing option for 8v8. This is an MMO and we should be able to play the game with friends, but limiting the group size to two people will mitigate frustrations for players who prefer to play solo and don't want to face off against coordinated groups in the "casual" environment that 8v8 is supposed to be. But splitting the queue so solo and grouped players of any size are in entirely different queues will cause horrible queue times that will kill the population. On the live server (with 12 player lobbies), it REGULARLY takes 30 minutes to an hour for groups of any size (be it duos, trios or quads) to get queue pops. The new Battleground system requires 16 players for a full match and there's also a separate 4v4 mode, so this will split the population far too much. Having separate Solo+Group queue options for 8v8 is going to massively fracture the population and cause serious queue time issues. People should not be punished for wanting to play with their friends in a massively multiplayer online game. You have such a promising thing here with this rework, please do not fumble it by making the same mistakes that have plagued the live server Battlegrounds for years.

This issue is similar for the 4v4 "competitive" queue. Make the sole 4v4 queue option for solos or groups of any size. Do not implement changes that fracture the population. This is a "competitive" mode and a solo queue mode will just devolve into "who gets lucky with the better teammates." If the 8v8 mode is for more "casual" play, as has been communicated by the developers (and if the 8v8 system is changed to be solo+duo queue only, which is what many experienced Battlegrounds players have concurred is the best move), it makes sense for the 4v4 mode to be catered to coordinated groups of players. Do not have multiple queue options for 4v4. Just let groups of up to 4 players group for the competitive mode and leave it at that. This is going to fracture the population. Do not implement changes that fracture the population. You had a good thing going here with the initial launch of PTS but the change in 10.2.2 is going to repeat the same mistakes that have plagued the live server for years. Please do not do this. Do not punish PvPers for wanting to play with their friends by forcing them to sit in 30 minute+ queues.

p.s. remove all modes other than Deathmatch from 4v4. If people want to sit on a flag and hold block, let them do that in 8v8. Sitting on a flag and holding block does not make sense in a "competitive" mode. Please let us PvP in the competitive PvP mode.

Erickson9610

I believe 8v8 Solo and 4v4 Group will be the most popular modes. Not many people group up to play Casual, or go solo to play Competitive.

LinusMain

If there is no solo queue or equivalent for 4v4, I probably won't touch it though. Feels like if you force soloers into a non-solo queue, they will just stop playing instead.

ketsparrowhawk

Agreed!! Only having 2 queues total is ideal. No need for a solo-only 4v4 mode. 8v8 should be solos+duos. If there is some technical limitation preventing that then a solo 8v8 queue is a sufficient solution imo.

Also if we're keeping "rounds" the round needs to end as soon as one player runs out of lives. Otherwise it will just be punishment for the weaker team.

Agree with removing "land grab" modes from 4v4. Don't need em.

React

I think it should be three queues.

Solo 4v4 (ranked + mmr)
Group 4v4 (ranked + mmr)
Duo 8v8 (unranked + no mmr, maximum group queue size of two players).

Moonspawn

React wrote: »

I think it should be three queues.

Solo 4v4 (ranked + mmr)
Group 4v4 (ranked + mmr)
Duo 8v8 (unranked + no mmr, maximum group queue size of two players).

And dont forget the option to check boxes to enter all 3 queues simultaneously.

jaws343

If having a group only queue will kill it, maybe people just aren't too thrilled with competing against players who treat BGs as raid groups.

At a certain point, maybe group queue BGs are the problem and not the other way around. If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Aldoss

jaws343 wrote: »

If having a group only queue will kill it, maybe people just aren't too thrilled with competing against players who treat BGs as raid groups.

At a certain point, maybe group queue BGs are the problem and not the other way around. If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Are you saying that you have 0 intention to ever group queue with anyone, ever, in the future of your playing this game, in a mode that you enjoy?

Because if that's true, then fine. I'm happy that you're happy.

However, if you ever see a future where you make a new friend, get a close friend to start playing this game that you love, or start playing this game with a significant other, then your quoted comment seems to actively work against future you.

We can have it all and now is/was the time to put pressure on ZOS to do it. It will be years before they devote this amount of resources to this system again.

jaws343

Aldoss wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

If having a group only queue will kill it, maybe people just aren't too thrilled with competing against players who treat BGs as raid groups.

At a certain point, maybe group queue BGs are the problem and not the other way around. If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Are you saying that you have 0 intention to ever group queue with anyone, ever, in the future of your playing this game, in a mode that you enjoy?

Because if that's true, then fine. I'm happy that you're happy.

However, if you ever see a future where you make a new friend, get a close friend to start playing this game that you love, or start playing this game with a significant other, then your quoted comment seems to actively work against future you.

We can have it all and now is/was the time to put pressure on ZOS to do it. It will be years before they devote this amount of resources to this system again.

The problem isn't the 2 or 3 people who occasionally group without any forthought for a BG.

The problem is the fully optimized 4 man groups who make the queue absolutely miserable for anyone who isn't equally optimized.

Y'all are happy with burning the entire game mode down if it means you getting to chat in group with some friends on occasion. You could also just go into cyrodil and do the same thing.

And again, if you need solo players to fill out your queue, maybe group queue isn't as popular as you want it to be.

And yeah, I have never queued into a BG with other people. Not once in the 6 years the game mode has existed. If I want to group up with friends for PVP, I go to cyrodil.

Urvoth

LinusMain wrote: »

If there is no solo queue or equivalent for 4v4, I probably won't touch it though. Feels like if you force soloers into a non-solo queue, they will just stop playing instead.

There were always plenty of solo queue players back when there was no solo queue. In fact, the population in general was significantly larger and queue times were much faster without a solo queue.

ketsparrowhawk

jaws343 wrote: »

Aldoss wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

If having a group only queue will kill it, maybe people just aren't too thrilled with competing against players who treat BGs as raid groups.

At a certain point, maybe group queue BGs are the problem and not the other way around. If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Are you saying that you have 0 intention to ever group queue with anyone, ever, in the future of your playing this game, in a mode that you enjoy?

Because if that's true, then fine. I'm happy that you're happy.

However, if you ever see a future where you make a new friend, get a close friend to start playing this game that you love, or start playing this game with a significant other, then your quoted comment seems to actively work against future you.

We can have it all and now is/was the time to put pressure on ZOS to do it. It will be years before they devote this amount of resources to this system again.

The problem isn't the 2 or 3 people who occasionally group without any forthought for a BG.

The problem is the fully optimized 4 man groups who make the queue absolutely miserable for anyone who isn't equally optimized.

Y'all are happy with burning the entire game mode down if it means you getting to chat in group with some friends on occasion. You could also just go into cyrodil and do the same thing.

And again, if you need solo players to fill out your queue, maybe group queue isn't as popular as you want it to be.

And yeah, I have never queued into a BG with other people. Not once in the 6 years the game mode has existed. If I want to group up with friends for PVP, I go to cyrodil.

It's called competitive mode for a reason. The casuals should stick to 8v8 if they don't want a fight

jaws343

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

Aldoss wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

If having a group only queue will kill it, maybe people just aren't too thrilled with competing against players who treat BGs as raid groups.

At a certain point, maybe group queue BGs are the problem and not the other way around. If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Are you saying that you have 0 intention to ever group queue with anyone, ever, in the future of your playing this game, in a mode that you enjoy?

Because if that's true, then fine. I'm happy that you're happy.

However, if you ever see a future where you make a new friend, get a close friend to start playing this game that you love, or start playing this game with a significant other, then your quoted comment seems to actively work against future you.

We can have it all and now is/was the time to put pressure on ZOS to do it. It will be years before they devote this amount of resources to this system again.

The problem isn't the 2 or 3 people who occasionally group without any forthought for a BG.

The problem is the fully optimized 4 man groups who make the queue absolutely miserable for anyone who isn't equally optimized.

Y'all are happy with burning the entire game mode down if it means you getting to chat in group with some friends on occasion. You could also just go into cyrodil and do the same thing.

And again, if you need solo players to fill out your queue, maybe group queue isn't as popular as you want it to be.

And yeah, I have never queued into a BG with other people. Not once in the 6 years the game mode has existed. If I want to group up with friends for PVP, I go to cyrodil.

It's called competitive mode for a reason. The casuals should stick to 8v8 if they don't want a fight

Some competitive mode then. If it relies on throwing solo players into the meat grinder to be effective. Solo does not mean casual by the way.

gariondavey

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Agreed!! Only having 2 queues total is ideal. No need for a solo-only 4v4 mode. 8v8 should be solos+duos. If there is some technical limitation preventing that then a solo 8v8 queue is a sufficient solution imo.

Also if we're keeping "rounds" the round needs to end as soon as one player runs out of lives. Otherwise it will just be punishment for the weaker team.

Agree with removing "land grab" modes from 4v4. Don't need em.

@ZOS_Kevin please check out this post and the OP.

2 queues is ideal
3 might be passable if it is this as react said:

React wrote: »

I think it should be three queues.

Solo 4v4 (ranked + mmr)
Group 4v4 (ranked + mmr)
Duo 8v8 (unranked + no mmr, maximum group queue size of two players).

But 4 is too many.

The number of queues and the mmr system (not tied to medals) NEED to be done correctly before this releases or the last 1.5 years of work you guys have been doing will be for nothing.

ruskiii

@React has the best option, but what they have put forward now is a happy medium. Most of the people on this post were pushing for solos to be put into groups last time i asked them, @gariondavey @ketsparrowhawk ... i guess you can't make everyone happy?

ketsparrowhawk

jaws343 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

Aldoss wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

If having a group only queue will kill it, maybe people just aren't too thrilled with competing against players who treat BGs as raid groups.

At a certain point, maybe group queue BGs are the problem and not the other way around. If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Are you saying that you have 0 intention to ever group queue with anyone, ever, in the future of your playing this game, in a mode that you enjoy?

Because if that's true, then fine. I'm happy that you're happy.

However, if you ever see a future where you make a new friend, get a close friend to start playing this game that you love, or start playing this game with a significant other, then your quoted comment seems to actively work against future you.

We can have it all and now is/was the time to put pressure on ZOS to do it. It will be years before they devote this amount of resources to this system again.

The problem isn't the 2 or 3 people who occasionally group without any forthought for a BG.

The problem is the fully optimized 4 man groups who make the queue absolutely miserable for anyone who isn't equally optimized.

Y'all are happy with burning the entire game mode down if it means you getting to chat in group with some friends on occasion. You could also just go into cyrodil and do the same thing.

And again, if you need solo players to fill out your queue, maybe group queue isn't as popular as you want it to be.

And yeah, I have never queued into a BG with other people. Not once in the 6 years the game mode has existed. If I want to group up with friends for PVP, I go to cyrodil.

It's called competitive mode for a reason. The casuals should stick to 8v8 if they don't want a fight

Some competitive mode then. If it relies on throwing solo players into the meat grinder to be effective. Solo does not mean casual by the way.

No those solos you mentioned should not be there lol. They should find people to group up with and actually TRY to be competitive. There is the 8v8 for casual play.

Jierdanit

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

Aldoss wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

If having a group only queue will kill it, maybe people just aren't too thrilled with competing against players who treat BGs as raid groups.

At a certain point, maybe group queue BGs are the problem and not the other way around. If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Are you saying that you have 0 intention to ever group queue with anyone, ever, in the future of your playing this game, in a mode that you enjoy?

Because if that's true, then fine. I'm happy that you're happy.

However, if you ever see a future where you make a new friend, get a close friend to start playing this game that you love, or start playing this game with a significant other, then your quoted comment seems to actively work against future you.

We can have it all and now is/was the time to put pressure on ZOS to do it. It will be years before they devote this amount of resources to this system again.

The problem isn't the 2 or 3 people who occasionally group without any forthought for a BG.

The problem is the fully optimized 4 man groups who make the queue absolutely miserable for anyone who isn't equally optimized.

Y'all are happy with burning the entire game mode down if it means you getting to chat in group with some friends on occasion. You could also just go into cyrodil and do the same thing.

And again, if you need solo players to fill out your queue, maybe group queue isn't as popular as you want it to be.

And yeah, I have never queued into a BG with other people. Not once in the 6 years the game mode has existed. If I want to group up with friends for PVP, I go to cyrodil.

It's called competitive mode for a reason. The casuals should stick to 8v8 if they don't want a fight

Some competitive mode then. If it relies on throwing solo players into the meat grinder to be effective. Solo does not mean casual by the way.

No those solos you mentioned should not be there lol. They should find people to group up with and actually TRY to be competitive. There is the 8v8 for casual play.

Since when does competitive only mean premade groups?

jaws343

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

Aldoss wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

If having a group only queue will kill it, maybe people just aren't too thrilled with competing against players who treat BGs as raid groups.

At a certain point, maybe group queue BGs are the problem and not the other way around. If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Are you saying that you have 0 intention to ever group queue with anyone, ever, in the future of your playing this game, in a mode that you enjoy?

Because if that's true, then fine. I'm happy that you're happy.

However, if you ever see a future where you make a new friend, get a close friend to start playing this game that you love, or start playing this game with a significant other, then your quoted comment seems to actively work against future you.

We can have it all and now is/was the time to put pressure on ZOS to do it. It will be years before they devote this amount of resources to this system again.

The problem isn't the 2 or 3 people who occasionally group without any forthought for a BG.

The problem is the fully optimized 4 man groups who make the queue absolutely miserable for anyone who isn't equally optimized.

Y'all are happy with burning the entire game mode down if it means you getting to chat in group with some friends on occasion. You could also just go into cyrodil and do the same thing.

And again, if you need solo players to fill out your queue, maybe group queue isn't as popular as you want it to be.

And yeah, I have never queued into a BG with other people. Not once in the 6 years the game mode has existed. If I want to group up with friends for PVP, I go to cyrodil.

It's called competitive mode for a reason. The casuals should stick to 8v8 if they don't want a fight

Some competitive mode then. If it relies on throwing solo players into the meat grinder to be effective. Solo does not mean casual by the way.

No those solos you mentioned should not be there lol. They should find people to group up with and actually TRY to be competitive. There is the 8v8 for casual play.

Ah, I see. Turning BGs into raids and killing the content. Got it.

ketsparrowhawk

yep my exact words lmao

Urvoth

Jierdanit wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

Aldoss wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

If having a group only queue will kill it, maybe people just aren't too thrilled with competing against players who treat BGs as raid groups.

At a certain point, maybe group queue BGs are the problem and not the other way around. If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Are you saying that you have 0 intention to ever group queue with anyone, ever, in the future of your playing this game, in a mode that you enjoy?

Because if that's true, then fine. I'm happy that you're happy.

However, if you ever see a future where you make a new friend, get a close friend to start playing this game that you love, or start playing this game with a significant other, then your quoted comment seems to actively work against future you.

We can have it all and now is/was the time to put pressure on ZOS to do it. It will be years before they devote this amount of resources to this system again.

The problem isn't the 2 or 3 people who occasionally group without any forthought for a BG.

The problem is the fully optimized 4 man groups who make the queue absolutely miserable for anyone who isn't equally optimized.

Y'all are happy with burning the entire game mode down if it means you getting to chat in group with some friends on occasion. You could also just go into cyrodil and do the same thing.

And again, if you need solo players to fill out your queue, maybe group queue isn't as popular as you want it to be.

And yeah, I have never queued into a BG with other people. Not once in the 6 years the game mode has existed. If I want to group up with friends for PVP, I go to cyrodil.

It's called competitive mode for a reason. The casuals should stick to 8v8 if they don't want a fight

Some competitive mode then. If it relies on throwing solo players into the meat grinder to be effective. Solo does not mean casual by the way.

No those solos you mentioned should not be there lol. They should find people to group up with and actually TRY to be competitive. There is the 8v8 for casual play.

Since when does competitive only mean premade groups?

That’s the nature of competitive pvp in general, but especially in eso and MMOs. So much of the PvP experience in the game is based around class and set interaction and group dynamics.

ketsparrowhawk

ruskiii wrote: »

@React has the best option, but what they have put forward now is a happy medium. Most of the people on this post were pushing for solos to be put into groups last time i asked them, @gariondavey @ketsparrowhawk ... i guess you can't make everyone happy?

what is the point of tagging me here

Jierdanit

Urvoth wrote: »

Jierdanit wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

Aldoss wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

If having a group only queue will kill it, maybe people just aren't too thrilled with competing against players who treat BGs as raid groups.

At a certain point, maybe group queue BGs are the problem and not the other way around. If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Are you saying that you have 0 intention to ever group queue with anyone, ever, in the future of your playing this game, in a mode that you enjoy?

Because if that's true, then fine. I'm happy that you're happy.

However, if you ever see a future where you make a new friend, get a close friend to start playing this game that you love, or start playing this game with a significant other, then your quoted comment seems to actively work against future you.

We can have it all and now is/was the time to put pressure on ZOS to do it. It will be years before they devote this amount of resources to this system again.

The problem isn't the 2 or 3 people who occasionally group without any forthought for a BG.

The problem is the fully optimized 4 man groups who make the queue absolutely miserable for anyone who isn't equally optimized.

Y'all are happy with burning the entire game mode down if it means you getting to chat in group with some friends on occasion. You could also just go into cyrodil and do the same thing.

And again, if you need solo players to fill out your queue, maybe group queue isn't as popular as you want it to be.

And yeah, I have never queued into a BG with other people. Not once in the 6 years the game mode has existed. If I want to group up with friends for PVP, I go to cyrodil.

It's called competitive mode for a reason. The casuals should stick to 8v8 if they don't want a fight

Some competitive mode then. If it relies on throwing solo players into the meat grinder to be effective. Solo does not mean casual by the way.

No those solos you mentioned should not be there lol. They should find people to group up with and actually TRY to be competitive. There is the 8v8 for casual play.

Since when does competitive only mean premade groups?

That’s the nature of competitive pvp in general, but especially in eso and MMOs. So much of the PvP experience in the game is based around class and set interaction and group dynamics.

You can absolutely have a competitive experience in random groups too, it just relies more on the actual skill of the players than having organized broken builds.

LinusMain

I don't get the logic though, if you want competitive to be premade shouldn't you be happy that premade cannot get matched against solo players?

Urvoth

Jierdanit wrote: »

Urvoth wrote: »

Jierdanit wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

Aldoss wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

If having a group only queue will kill it, maybe people just aren't too thrilled with competing against players who treat BGs as raid groups.

At a certain point, maybe group queue BGs are the problem and not the other way around. If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Are you saying that you have 0 intention to ever group queue with anyone, ever, in the future of your playing this game, in a mode that you enjoy?

Because if that's true, then fine. I'm happy that you're happy.

However, if you ever see a future where you make a new friend, get a close friend to start playing this game that you love, or start playing this game with a significant other, then your quoted comment seems to actively work against future you.

We can have it all and now is/was the time to put pressure on ZOS to do it. It will be years before they devote this amount of resources to this system again.

The problem isn't the 2 or 3 people who occasionally group without any forthought for a BG.

The problem is the fully optimized 4 man groups who make the queue absolutely miserable for anyone who isn't equally optimized.

Y'all are happy with burning the entire game mode down if it means you getting to chat in group with some friends on occasion. You could also just go into cyrodil and do the same thing.

And again, if you need solo players to fill out your queue, maybe group queue isn't as popular as you want it to be.

And yeah, I have never queued into a BG with other people. Not once in the 6 years the game mode has existed. If I want to group up with friends for PVP, I go to cyrodil.

It's called competitive mode for a reason. The casuals should stick to 8v8 if they don't want a fight

Some competitive mode then. If it relies on throwing solo players into the meat grinder to be effective. Solo does not mean casual by the way.

No those solos you mentioned should not be there lol. They should find people to group up with and actually TRY to be competitive. There is the 8v8 for casual play.

Since when does competitive only mean premade groups?

That’s the nature of competitive pvp in general, but especially in eso and MMOs. So much of the PvP experience in the game is based around class and set interaction and group dynamics.

You can absolutely have a competitive experience in random groups too, it just relies more on the actual skill of the players than having organized broken builds.

No, it’s completely rng and down to what team doesn’t get the nb snipe bot or whichever team gets a healer, etc. Yes, better players can win sometimes but with even skill levels it comes down to matchmaking rng. This also isn’t a game where classes are competitively balanced to play solo. Some classes are significantly better at it than others, and other classes require actual team coordination to be effective.

ketsparrowhawk

LinusMain wrote: »

I don't get the logic though, if you want competitive to be premade shouldn't you be happy that premade cannot get matched against solo players?

Having 4 different queues will kill this entire update. Solo players already had a haven in 8v8.

Aldoss

jaws343 wrote: »

The problem isn't the 2 or 3 people who occasionally group without any forthought for a BG.

The problem is the fully optimized 4 man groups who make the queue absolutely miserable for anyone who isn't equally optimized.

Y'all are happy with burning the entire game mode down if it means you getting to chat in group with some friends on occasion.

I'll put this back at you: Y'all are happy with burning the entire game mode down *for casual duos* if it means you never have to play against a 4-man.

The real answer is that we're not trying to burn the game down. We can have it all... IF we put the pressure on ZOS to do it. You want a healthy queue and you want to have your casual game mode without the risk of a 4-man. I want a healthy queue and to have a casual game mode without the risk of playing against a 4-man.

Grouping =/= organized.

We want the same thing. Your solution screws me and my wife and all the other duos that play BGs casually. My solution doesn't screw you and doesn't screw me.

jaws343 wrote: »

You could also just go into cyrodil and do the same thing.

False. BGs are not Cyro. There are players who love Cyro and hate BGs and vice versa. I am wholly disinterested in using my precious 90min of playtime to spend more than half of it playing a horse riding simulator, sitting in a keep waiting for crossed swords to appear, or zerg serfing, or being zerged down.

We like BGs.

jaws343 wrote: »

And again, if you need solo players to fill out your queue, maybe group queue isn't as popular as you want it to be.

Group queue isn't popular because of lack of support from ZOS. It's pretty ignorant to be suggesting that grouping isn't popular in a social MMO without acknowledging the circumstances that contributed to that reality.

I'll say again: We can have it all. We can all get what we want.

jaws343 wrote: »

And yeah, I have never queued into a BG with other people. Not once in the 6 years the game mode has existed. If I want to group up with friends for PVP, I go to cyrodil.

I'm happy that you have solutions that you are excited and fulfilled by. I'm sad that you're unwilling to be empathetic towards others that also find enjoyment in this game, but are getting screwed by the solutions being presented by ZOS.

Cheers.

LinusMain

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

LinusMain wrote: »

I don't get the logic though, if you want competitive to be premade shouldn't you be happy that premade cannot get matched against solo players?

Having 4 different queues will kill this entire update. Solo players already had a haven in 8v8.

But in this case, as a premade, you'll get matched against solo players, which is not competitive. Is that what you want?

If what you actually want is premade vs premade, then I don't see why the solo queue matters. It's going to be different people queueing into different place no?

ketsparrowhawk

LinusMain wrote: »

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

LinusMain wrote: »

I don't get the logic though, if you want competitive to be premade shouldn't you be happy that premade cannot get matched against solo players?

Having 4 different queues will kill this entire update. Solo players already had a haven in 8v8.

But in this case, as a premade, you'll get matched against solo players, which is not competitive. Is that what you want?

If what you actually want is premade vs premade, then I don't see why the solo queue matters. It's going to be different people queueing into different place no?

Bro do you read. It's too many queues. Long queue times. That's the reason.

SkaraMinoc

jaws343 wrote: »

If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Some solo players are competitive and enjoy queueing into Group BG with the intention of filling in missing spots. I did this the other day and was the 4th player on a team against two other premades. The BG went the full 15 minutes and we won by a single killing blow. It was fun and rewarding to know that my team likely would've been last if I hadn't queued up.

jaws343

Aldoss wrote: »

Group queue isn't popular because of lack of support from ZOS. It's pretty ignorant to be suggesting that grouping isn't popular in a social MMO without acknowledging the circumstances that contributed to that reality.

I'll say again: We can have it all. We can all get what we want.


Cheers.

Group queues mixed with solo queues literally killed the game mode for a long while and it wasn't until they broke the queues apart that any life crept back into it. No one wants to waste time queuing and facing optimized 4 man groups just so a few friends can mess around in BGs together. If the queues are mixed, BGs will die. It isn't a maybe, this already happened once and it will happen again.

jaws343

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

If groups are relying on solo players to sacrifice themselves to the group queue in order to be effective, we should just do away with the group queues altogether.

Some solo players are competitive and enjoy queueing into Group BG with the intention of filling in missing spots. I did this the other day and was the 4th player on a team against two other premades. The BG went the full 15 minutes and we won by a single killing blow. It was fun and rewarding to know that my team likely would've been last if I hadn't queue up.

Right, but a split queue still allows for that.

ketsparrowhawk

jaws343 wrote: »

Aldoss wrote: »

Group queue isn't popular because of lack of support from ZOS. It's pretty ignorant to be suggesting that grouping isn't popular in a social MMO without acknowledging the circumstances that contributed to that reality.

I'll say again: We can have it all. We can all get what we want.


Cheers.

Group queues mixed with solo queues literally killed the game mode for a long while and it wasn't until they broke the queues apart that any life crept back into it. No one wants to waste time queuing and facing optimized 4 man groups just so a few friends can mess around in BGs together. If the queues are mixed, BGs will die. It isn't a maybe, this already happened once and it will happen again.

False. Splitting the queues has caused irreversible harm to the BG community. We've been picking up the pieces ever since.