How long will it take ZOS to bankrupt the old guard?

CrashTest

What do you consider "old guard"? If you mean the billionaires on PCNA, then never bc they don't have gold sinks, just gold printers.

Alaztor91

tbh this year's Anniversary Event flooded the market with mats more than previous years. Afaik it was the first time you could get boxes from stuff like simply killing a WB, and a lot of people were farming the gold style pages.

In my personal case I probably farmed like 10x the amount of boxes compared to previous years since I don't really like spamming crafting writs on multiple characters and killing a WB is way faster than doing other kind of daily quests.

LaintalAy

GuuMoonRyoung wrote: »

I have no idea what you are talking about, was trying to buy some motifs that frequently come up in master writs, and they were all priced at an abysmal figure. Columbine going for 1800-2K, Aurbic Amber priced at 70K, Perfect Roe at 60K... I don't know what you are talking about... everything is overpriced now...

So then, did you pay these prices? Or walk away?

The motif prices were pushed up because I (and possibly everyone else) were buying one or two to satisfy the 10000 guild spend as one of three Zenithar options.

Columbine is lying around on the ground, if you can find the time to pick it up.

Aurbic Amber is available free, if:

• You have Summerset.
• You have ground the quest to see the Portals
• You have the time to farm portals
• Someone else hasn't milked the amber from the portal already

Perfect Roe is available free, if:

• You have the time to fish
• You can wait to fillet 1000 fish at one time
• RNG doesn't surprise you.

The problem is really that no-one wants to do the activities required to get these mats anymore.
That's what's pushing the prices up.

oldbobdude

Alaztor91 wrote: »

tbh this year's Anniversary Event flooded the market with mats more than previous years. Afaik it was the first time you could get boxes from stuff like simply killing a WB, and a lot of people were farming the gold style pages.

In my personal case I probably farmed like 10x the amount of boxes compared to previous years since I don't really like spamming crafting writs on multiple characters and killing a WB is way faster than doing other kind of daily quests.

It did. And that has slowed my sales way down. I usually sell at the low price in the TTC recommended range. Typically gold mats, fairly rare plans and motifs and some overland sets that are easily farmed and used to sell (looking at you Mothers Sorrow). But with all the stuff from jamboree the stuff I’ve been listing just goes to a new low price. That coupled with the new listing time means I’ve just been relishing at lower price. So, nope, I’ll hold my stuff. I take the time to farm stuff. My time is worth compensation even in a game

Jaraal

ArchMikem wrote: »

Isn't it also the "Old Guard" who have tens of millions of Gold?

Most of the old guard has hundreds of millions of gold, and there are a significant number of ESO billionaires. And the new players are cashing in on the well defined, well explained methods of making gold that are on every other web page and YouTube video. It's the middle class that doesn't have time to/can't be bothered to farm stuff for gold that are suffering the most.

The old guard can start over on another server and be multi-millionaires in less than a week. Economic blips such as we are currently experiencing are not nearly as drastic as they are being made out to be.

SpiritKitten

I have half a billion or more in assets (like housing, etc...), and am starting to bleed gold from my over 100 million gold bank, because I am not replenishing it as fast as I am spending it (on housing). I am starting to worry.

ArchMikem

Wereswan wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

Isn't it also the "Old Guard" who have tens of millions of Gold?

You're off by a couple orders of magnitude; the whales have literal billions of gold.

Even in video games there's a 1%, huh.

bmnoble

ClowdyAllDay wrote: »

So i for one have noticed that my stuff isnt selling. Gold mats and crafting tables are just flooding the market and no one can find your stuff to buy it. More and more the game seems to cater to new players and it seems zos is also trying to tank the economy in game to bring down prices. I'm just wondering how long until the 'old guard' are bankrupt and the prices come down to sane levels anyway. At some point the gold sink will have sunk everyone to about the same level of poverty and even guild store prices will have to come down eventually to where sane amounts of in game gold can buy a vendor spot. How long will it take?

Once you have enough capital be it gold or materials to sell, your pretty much insulated from sudden or even long term changes in the economy, unless they choose to quit, the games more likely to be shut down, or the players kick the bucket, then for many of them to go bankrupt.

New players and players that are entirely reliant on their income from sales, they are the ones that are going to bare the brunt of the pain of any economic troubles in the game, that is not to say they won't be able to make gold, their just not going to get it as quickly as they would like.

karthrag_inak

This is delightful. As GM of trading guild, khajiit is strapping in for some bumpy roads ahead keeping the guild going, but as a player interested in the continued health of the game - something only possible if new players have an easier time of it, especially crafting.

EF321

karthrag_inak wrote: »

This is delightful. As GM of trading guild, khajiit is strapping in for some bumpy roads ahead keeping the guild going, but as a player interested in the continued health of the game - something only possible if new players have an easier time of it, especially crafting.

New players are the ones selling materials to buy other stuff. There is hardly anything else that new player can offer.

Jaraal

EF321 wrote: »

karthrag_inak wrote: »

This is delightful. As GM of trading guild, khajiit is strapping in for some bumpy roads ahead keeping the guild going, but as a player interested in the continued health of the game - something only possible if new players have an easier time of it, especially crafting.

New players are the ones selling materials to buy other stuff. There is hardly anything else that new player can offer.

While materials are indeed easy for new players to acquire, rare items can bring a lot more gold a lot faster, and don't require CP to be effective, as material farming does. And there are plenty of rare item farming guides out there... although none of them are really comprehensive. A lot of it is just experience and a lot of trial and error, but if you have time, you can get rare stuff relatively easily.

Idelise

bmnoble wrote: »

ClowdyAllDay wrote: »

So i for one have noticed that my stuff isnt selling. Gold mats and crafting tables are just flooding the market and no one can find your stuff to buy it. More and more the game seems to cater to new players and it seems zos is also trying to tank the economy in game to bring down prices. I'm just wondering how long until the 'old guard' are bankrupt and the prices come down to sane levels anyway. At some point the gold sink will have sunk everyone to about the same level of poverty and even guild store prices will have to come down eventually to where sane amounts of in game gold can buy a vendor spot. How long will it take?

Once you have enough capital be it gold or materials to sell, your pretty much insulated from sudden or even long term changes in the economy, unless they choose to quit, the games more likely to be shut down, or the players kick the bucket, then for many of them to go bankrupt.

New players and players that are entirely reliant on their income from sales, they are the ones that are going to bare the brunt of the pain of any economic troubles in the game, that is not to say they won't be able to make gold, their just not going to get it as quickly as they would like.

This. The change will mainly impact the 'middle class' of the game, not the billionaire whales. It's the casual players who don't have time after their 905 to spend hours upon hours grinding stuff to sell and had their small but tried and true niches of earning money will get truly impacted.
Which will lead to two things:
- them giving up on trying to earn money and getting maybe disassociated with the game where they cannot afford anything
- them buying gold
- them leaving for the game where 'getting into' trading is far easier, with a central auction system and a less volatile economy...

I don't know about you but I don't have the time to spend days analysing market fluctuation in a virtual economy after work. In any other MMO, you can find niches that won't make you rich, but at least will give you -enough- to afford what you want without gold trading. Spending hours of your life just to figure out what sells/maybe will sell every week is... leaving very little time to spend on activities that you do enjoy doing in an MMO. And I'd hate to treat ESO as an extension of my work xD

Estin

I think everybody has the same idea of liquidating their assets. I'm having a hard time selling items like Dreugh Wax 1000-2000 under the average TTC price, and that's even at a Vvardelfell trader. I list it for that much under, and within 2-3 days, my listings are 1000-2000 above the average price. Even things that I wouldn't expect to be crashing are, like Dwarven Construct parts from AS. I don't think they were given out from anniversary boxes, but I was selling them for ~90k earlier in the year. Now they're half the price. It's still for the best to sell what you have stored since come the end of the year, PC/NA will have prices similar to consoles.

ClowdyAllDay

My focus has been making gold in game to buy crowns to get summerset on all my base accounts and put a crafter on each account. Since I can’t make gold to do that with the mats and writ vouchers that my crafters have generated then I’m not sure there’s anything to do in this game as I haven’t liked any of the more recent chapters. I’m not scrying or playing cards or ever playing an arcanist nor will I ever touch scribing. The one thing I was doing is being sabotaged deliberately and with good reason and while it’s good for the game it leaves me with nothing to do and no more reason to play. I’m betting I’m not the only one.

sarahthes

sh4d0wh4z3 wrote: »

I think everybody has the same idea of liquidating their assets. I'm having a hard time selling items like Dreugh Wax 1000-2000 under the average TTC price, and that's even at a Vvardelfell trader. I list it for that much under, and within 2-3 days, my listings are 1000-2000 above the average price. Even things that I wouldn't expect to be crashing are, like Dwarven Construct parts from AS. I don't think they were given out from anniversary boxes, but I was selling them for ~90k earlier in the year. Now they're half the price. It's still for the best to sell what you have stored since come the end of the year, PC/NA will have prices similar to consoles.

TTC suggests prices based on a rolling average over time. It's always going to be either too high or too low.

With the economy in freefall I've taken to checking all the other Mournhold traders in person before listing certain items.

Warhawke_80

All harbingers of ZoS switching to a Auction House based economy

sarahthes

Warhawke_80 wrote: »

All harbingers of ZoS switching to a Auction House based economy

The decimation of the trade guilds (which are also incredibly active social guilds) is why they would not do that.

Orbital78

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/653346/we-need-to-talk-about-columbine/p1

Maybe they listened to feedback, you can't have it both ways. It will be balanced out by supply and demand eventually. I was getting stacks of 20-40 Rheum during the past few events along with Columbine.



People got the supply they were wanting dropped in their laps, now to use it up for more demand.

Desiato

sarahthes wrote: »

Warhawke_80 wrote: »

All harbingers of ZoS switching to a Auction House based economy

The decimation of the trade guilds (which are also incredibly active social guilds) is why they would not do that.

Trade guilds are truly the social foundation of ESO. They draw players into the community who otherwise would not engage in it.

Once in a trade guild, they are more likely to participate in activities with other players which is essential for the health of the MMO side of the game.

There's no conspiracy here. ZOS isn't afraid to make big changes. They don't need to sabotage aspects of their game in order to make them. They aren't trying to destroy trade guilds. This is just the ebb and flow of the economy. We've been here before.

Araneae6537

sh4d0wh4z3 wrote: »

I think everybody has the same idea of liquidating their assets. I'm having a hard time selling items like Dreugh Wax 1000-2000 under the average TTC price, and that's even at a Vvardelfell trader. I list it for that much under, and within 2-3 days, my listings are 1000-2000 above the average price. Even things that I wouldn't expect to be crashing are, like Dwarven Construct parts from AS. I don't think they were given out from anniversary boxes, but I was selling them for ~90k earlier in the year. Now they're half the price. It's still for the best to sell what you have stored since come the end of the year, PC/NA will have prices similar to consoles.

With prices falling, now is the time to hold your assets, if not add to them. The exception would endless base materials that some people buy anyway, like refined silk and platinum. But I think it foolish to sell dreugh wax and other high end materials at this time.

Araneae6537

Orbital78 wrote: »

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/653346/we-need-to-talk-about-columbine/p1

Maybe they listened to feedback, you can't have it both ways. It will be balanced out by supply and demand eventually. I was getting stacks of 20-40 Rheum during the past few events along with Columbine.



People got the supply they were wanting dropped in their laps, now to use it up for more demand.

Which add-on shows the price over time? That’s a nice feature.

Necrotech_Master

EF321 wrote: »

karthrag_inak wrote: »

This is delightful. As GM of trading guild, khajiit is strapping in for some bumpy roads ahead keeping the guild going, but as a player interested in the continued health of the game - something only possible if new players have an easier time of it, especially crafting.

New players are the ones selling materials to buy other stuff. There is hardly anything else that new player can offer.

i make a lot of gold selling mats as well (kind of always have in my over 10 years playing)

i also make decent gold selling motifs

every once in awhile ill make a big ticket item sale (duplicate furnishing plans which are still rarish or from content people dont enjoy running, full book motifs i dont need, etc)

Orbital78

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Which add-on shows the price over time? That’s a nice feature.

I think that is from Master Merchant.

https://www.esoui.com/downloads/info2753-MasterMerchant3.0.html

Necrotech_Master

Orbital78 wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Which add-on shows the price over time? That’s a nice feature.

I think that is from Master Merchant.

https://www.esoui.com/downloads/info2753-MasterMerchant3.0.html

arkadius trade tools also can show a graph of the sales you seen, though the one in the image is likely MM

from what i can tell theres like 3 different price tracking addons in that one tooltip screenshot lol (eso-hub, TTC, MM)

Araneae6537

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

Orbital78 wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Which add-on shows the price over time? That’s a nice feature.

I think that is from Master Merchant.

https://www.esoui.com/downloads/info2753-MasterMerchant3.0.html

arkadius trade tools also can show a graph of the sales you seen, though the one in the image is likely MM

from what i can tell theres like 3 different price tracking addons in that one tooltip screenshot lol (eso-hub, TTC, MM)

Thank you both! I have MM and TTC — must be an option I missed or maybe turned off on my old system and then forgot about.

LaintalAy

ClowdyAllDay wrote: »

My focus has been making gold in game to buy crowns to get summerset on all my base accounts and put a crafter on each account. Since I can’t make gold to do that with the mats and writ vouchers that my crafters have generated then I’m not sure there’s anything to do in this game as I haven’t liked any of the more recent chapters. I’m not scrying or playing cards or ever playing an arcanist nor will I ever touch scribing. The one thing I was doing is being sabotaged deliberately and with good reason and while it’s good for the game it leaves me with nothing to do and no more reason to play. I’m betting I’m not the only one.

You win.

katanagirl1

ClowdyAllDay wrote: »

My focus has been making gold in game to buy crowns to get summerset on all my base accounts and put a crafter on each account. Since I can’t make gold to do that with the mats and writ vouchers that my crafters have generated then I’m not sure there’s anything to do in this game as I haven’t liked any of the more recent chapters. I’m not scrying or playing cards or ever playing an arcanist nor will I ever touch scribing. The one thing I was doing is being sabotaged deliberately and with good reason and while it’s good for the game it leaves me with nothing to do and no more reason to play. I’m betting I’m not the only one.

I’m a more active player, but I am in the same boat.

I have cut prices on master writs by 30-50% to make sales. I am not seeing furnishing plan prices come down yet. That would be the only silver lining in the shortened mail change for me. That is what I spend my gold on so I have not checked other listings. Surely they cannot afford to relist those super expensive plans more than a few times before cutting into profit too much.

ClowdyAllDay

LaintalAy wrote: »

ClowdyAllDay wrote: »

My focus has been making gold in game to buy crowns to get summerset on all my base accounts and put a crafter on each account. Since I can’t make gold to do that with the mats and writ vouchers that my crafters have generated then I’m not sure there’s anything to do in this game as I haven’t liked any of the more recent chapters. I’m not scrying or playing cards or ever playing an arcanist nor will I ever touch scribing. The one thing I was doing is being sabotaged deliberately and with good reason and while it’s good for the game it leaves me with nothing to do and no more reason to play. I’m betting I’m not the only one.

You win.

It’s odd. This isn’t what I recall winning being like

Estin

Araneae6537 wrote: »

sh4d0wh4z3 wrote: »

I think everybody has the same idea of liquidating their assets. I'm having a hard time selling items like Dreugh Wax 1000-2000 under the average TTC price, and that's even at a Vvardelfell trader. I list it for that much under, and within 2-3 days, my listings are 1000-2000 above the average price. Even things that I wouldn't expect to be crashing are, like Dwarven Construct parts from AS. I don't think they were given out from anniversary boxes, but I was selling them for ~90k earlier in the year. Now they're half the price. It's still for the best to sell what you have stored since come the end of the year, PC/NA will have prices similar to consoles.

With prices falling, now is the time to hold your assets, if not add to them. The exception would endless base materials that some people buy anyway, like refined silk and platinum. But I think it foolish to sell dreugh wax and other high end materials at this time.

May I ask why it would be foolish to sell items that have been in a crash since the anniversary event? If the prices keep following the same trend they are now, they're going to be worth a lot less by the end of the year, and unless ZOS adds a new sink for these high priced items, they're not going to go back up, so there's 0 point in holding onto them. I can just rebuy when everything is cheap. It's no secret ZOS wants to make the game more accessible to players, and the easiest way for them to do that is to make things more affordable like how they done with jewelry crafting. I'm suspecting the upcoming WSM event is going to give out hakeijos like candy for the first few days due to the PvP update later this year, but who knows. I will be honest and say I received mostly junk from the zenithar event.

DoofusMax

ClowdyAllDay wrote: »

So i for one have noticed that my stuff isnt selling. Gold mats and crafting tables are just flooding the market and no one can find your stuff to buy it. More and more the game seems to cater to new players and it seems zos is also trying to tank the economy in game to bring down prices. I'm just wondering how long until the 'old guard' are bankrupt and the prices come down to sane levels anyway. At some point the gold sink will have sunk everyone to about the same level of poverty and even guild store prices will have to come down eventually to where sane amounts of in game gold can buy a vendor spot. How long will it take?

I suppose that argument works if someone is relying on guild trader sales to keep their head above water. Since I don't, it's hardly noticeable. Since you brought it to my attention, I'll factor it in when it comes to guild donations, but my day-to-day is still very much in the black and the bit of trading that I do is priced around what buyers are paying rather than what sellers are asking.