How long will it take ZOS to bankrupt the old guard?

ClowdyAllDay · July 1

So i for one have noticed that my stuff isnt selling. Gold mats and crafting tables are just flooding the market and no one can find your stuff to buy it. More and more the game seems to cater to new players and it seems zos is also trying to tank the economy in game to bring down prices. I'm just wondering how long until the 'old guard' are bankrupt and the prices come down to sane levels anyway. At some point the gold sink will have sunk everyone to about the same level of poverty and even guild store prices will have to come down eventually to where sane amounts of in game gold can buy a vendor spot. How long will it take?

xylena_lazarow · July 1

Much like the real world, never.

ApoAlaia · July 1

Things are currently in flux; the upheaval that the changes to listing duration has brought coinciding with the summer slump has created an interesting situation where sales are down across the board while bidding on traders remains as if this wasn't happening.

It certainly is putting a strain on the coffers but eventually it will settle into a new 'equlibrium'.

AnduinTryggva · July 1

ClowdyAllDay wrote: »

So i for one have noticed that my stuff isnt selling. Gold mats and crafting tables are just flooding the market and no one can find your stuff to buy it. More and more the game seems to cater to new players and it seems zos is also trying to tank the economy in game to bring down prices. I'm just wondering how long until the 'old guard' are bankrupt and the prices come down to sane levels anyway. At some point the gold sink will have sunk everyone to about the same level of poverty and even guild store prices will have to come down eventually to where sane amounts of in game gold can buy a vendor spot. How long will it take?

How can you go bankrupt on virtual gold? Just because "profit" no longer is as high as it has been?

LaintalAy · July 1

There's no doubt that the market has been flooded with mats during the past few months.

I currently don't subscribe to ESO+ and recently cleared my craft bag out. I'm storing crafting mats in my bank and everything else in chests. It's a bit harder to manage, but not much.. I want to avoid DLC dungeons for the time being.

From here on, I will be harvesting as I need and there will be less available from my efforts to pass along to other players.
I also be crossing the floor and moving to selective harvesting.

There will be no change to the big end of town until players can find time to travel outside of the big hubs for their purchases.

joergino · July 1

I don't know what "cheap" materials people keep talking about. Whenever I look, I see lots and lots of posted stuff at +300 or even 600 %, while there is virtually nothing at all at "normal" non-marked up prices, definitely absolutely nothing that is being sold cheaply. I'm only looking for basic materials.

Wereswan · July 1

AnduinTryggva wrote: »

ClowdyAllDay wrote: »

So i for one have noticed that my stuff isnt selling. Gold mats and crafting tables are just flooding the market and no one can find your stuff to buy it. More and more the game seems to cater to new players and it seems zos is also trying to tank the economy in game to bring down prices. I'm just wondering how long until the 'old guard' are bankrupt and the prices come down to sane levels anyway. At some point the gold sink will have sunk everyone to about the same level of poverty and even guild store prices will have to come down eventually to where sane amounts of in game gold can buy a vendor spot. How long will it take?

How can you go bankrupt on virtual gold? Just because "profit" no longer is as high as it has been?

This right here. In the real world, people have bills they have to pay. Where's the ESO equivalent?

Araneae6537 · July 1

Wereswan wrote: »

AnduinTryggva wrote: »

ClowdyAllDay wrote: »

So i for one have noticed that my stuff isnt selling. Gold mats and crafting tables are just flooding the market and no one can find your stuff to buy it. More and more the game seems to cater to new players and it seems zos is also trying to tank the economy in game to bring down prices. I'm just wondering how long until the 'old guard' are bankrupt and the prices come down to sane levels anyway. At some point the gold sink will have sunk everyone to about the same level of poverty and even guild store prices will have to come down eventually to where sane amounts of in game gold can buy a vendor spot. How long will it take?

How can you go bankrupt on virtual gold? Just because "profit" no longer is as high as it has been?

This right here. In the real world, people have bills they have to pay. Where's the ESO equivalent?

Exactly, unless some are bankrolling trader bids in excess of what they bring in, and no doubt there are some rich enough that they my do so.

But I think most people are spending less, certainly I have been, after initially spending more on Zenithar sales, I bought less than I’d originally thought to when it became clear my trader sales were much less than anticipated. I am now neither buying nor selling much, just gathering as I quest like I always have, wait and see.

Calastir · July 1

However will I feed my virtual family now?

spartaxoxo · July 1

I made bank this past Zeal of Zenithar. Lower your prices if you're not selling. Hold items that are expensive until things settle down. It won't happen that the rich players will stop being rich. But this is exactly what PC has been calling for ages now. 🤷🏿‍♀️

belial5221_ESO · July 1

Events gave too much,and now not many need to buy things.Happens every year after anniversary,and some people probably still opening boxes.And with zenithar ppl farming boxes again,so more stuff flooding markets.By the time market starts to recover,there will be another farming event.I sold all my excess mats fast at good prices,just harder to sell style pages,and furnishings that everyone is getting.

LaintalAy · July 1

joergino wrote: »

I don't know what "cheap" materials people keep talking about. Whenever I look, I see lots and lots of posted stuff at +300 or even 600 %, while there is virtually nothing at all at "normal" non-marked up prices, definitely absolutely nothing that is being sold cheaply. I'm only looking for basic materials.

They get posted, I put up 3M worth of items with more than 50% off and they all sold within 24 hours of being listed.
Most provisioning supplies went for the default 3gp.

I'm sorry that you missed out.

Wereswan · July 1

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Wereswan wrote: »

AnduinTryggva wrote: »

ClowdyAllDay wrote: »

So i for one have noticed that my stuff isnt selling. Gold mats and crafting tables are just flooding the market and no one can find your stuff to buy it. More and more the game seems to cater to new players and it seems zos is also trying to tank the economy in game to bring down prices. I'm just wondering how long until the 'old guard' are bankrupt and the prices come down to sane levels anyway. At some point the gold sink will have sunk everyone to about the same level of poverty and even guild store prices will have to come down eventually to where sane amounts of in game gold can buy a vendor spot. How long will it take?

How can you go bankrupt on virtual gold? Just because "profit" no longer is as high as it has been?

This right here. In the real world, people have bills they have to pay. Where's the ESO equivalent?

Exactly, unless some are bankrolling trader bids in excess of what they bring in, and no doubt there are some rich enough that they my do so.

But I think most people are spending less, certainly I have been, after initially spending more on Zenithar sales, I bought less than I’d originally thought to when it became clear my trader sales were much less than anticipated. I am now neither buying nor selling much, just gathering as I quest like I always have, wait and see.

And the logical next step there is that the trader prices will start to crash if maintaining a location ends up bleeding guilds dry.

Mathius_Mordred · July 1

5 years ago we used to get a certain trader spot for 15-25K gold each week, now even 1 million won't get it. As a result we no longer trade, we only did it for a bit of fun and a small social guild like ours can't afford or raise 50 million gold to secure a crappy spot. If some big trading guilds are bankrolling spots then I doubt they will do it for long and prices will inevitably fall. Just like IRL prices will eventually equalise to what the market wants to pay and I look forward to that day.

Tandor · July 1

Are mat prices falling? I imagine there's a reduced demand for them now that people have to devote so much time to harvesting in order to get a single luminous ink if they're lucky. That may change when ZOS follow-up on their recent comment on inks, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

ssewallb14_ESO · July 1

Your prices are too high, likely because you won't adapt.

This is not a real world economy, the ancestor silk farm will never file for bankruptcy and shut down. The game can literally print stuff. The sky is not falling.

Deflation means the currency is worth more, so that "old guard," assuming they're not stupid, should be wealthier than ever. Many sellers are making more than they ever have, myself included. I got top seller status in my guild today for the first time since 2016.

The MM graph line doesn't have to go up to accumulate wealth, I promise, just learn how the market works, and adapt accordingly.

Bucky_13 · July 1

I make around 600k / week just from the gold reward for doing daily writs. So the answer is: it's not gonna happen unless they remove that gold reward.

Selling golden mats that I don't need myself is just a nice bonus even if it's usually more than 600k.

Also, most older players have already spent the gold for most of the gold sinks in the game, so they don't need to spend that much gold on other things.

Desiato · July 1

I don't think ZOS is trying to lower prices.

They have a history of sacrificing the economy short-term for promos going back to the first Jubilee event.

This year, as part of the 10 year anniversary, they made the Jubilee event WAY too rewarding, and its impacts will be felt for a long time.

Another huge factor is the impact the introduction of the Arcanist had last year, and its waning impact. The massive influx of alts drove demand for many items, especially upgrade mats.

IMO, the Epic giveaway last year also stimulated the economy as it brought in new players, console transfers and alt accounts for hardcore players to develop.

When the economy is super stimulated, it drives speculation because more players see an opportunity to earn gold. The depressed economy will have the reverse affect, making players less willing to speculate.

Eventually it will all even out. This is just an adjustment period.

ClowdyAllDay · July 1

Wereswan wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Wereswan wrote: »

AnduinTryggva wrote: »

ClowdyAllDay wrote: »

So i for one have noticed that my stuff isnt selling. Gold mats and crafting tables are just flooding the market and no one can find your stuff to buy it. More and more the game seems to cater to new players and it seems zos is also trying to tank the economy in game to bring down prices. I'm just wondering how long until the 'old guard' are bankrupt and the prices come down to sane levels anyway. At some point the gold sink will have sunk everyone to about the same level of poverty and even guild store prices will have to come down eventually to where sane amounts of in game gold can buy a vendor spot. How long will it take?

How can you go bankrupt on virtual gold? Just because "profit" no longer is as high as it has been?

This right here. In the real world, people have bills they have to pay. Where's the ESO equivalent?

Exactly, unless some are bankrolling trader bids in excess of what they bring in, and no doubt there are some rich enough that they my do so.

But I think most people are spending less, certainly I have been, after initially spending more on Zenithar sales, I bought less than I’d originally thought to when it became clear my trader sales were much less than anticipated. I am now neither buying nor selling much, just gathering as I quest like I always have, wait and see.

And the logical next step there is that the trader prices will start to crash if maintaining a location ends up bleeding guilds dry.

hey you heard me it seems.

GuuMoonRyoung · July 1

I have no idea what you are talking about, was trying to buy some motifs that frequently come up in master writs, and they were all priced at an abysmal figure. Columbine going for 1800-2K, Aurbic Amber priced at 70K, Perfect Roe at 60K... I don't know what you are talking about... everything is overpriced now...

ClowdyAllDay · July 1

ssewallb14_ESO wrote: »

Your prices are too high, likely because you won't adapt.

This is not a real world economy, the ancestor silk farm will never file for bankruptcy and shut down. The game can literally print stuff. The sky is not falling.

Deflation means the currency is worth more, so that "old guard," assuming they're not stupid, should be wealthier than ever. Many sellers are making more than they ever have, myself included. I got top seller status in my guild today for the first time since 2016.

The MM graph line doesn't have to go up to accumulate wealth, I promise, just learn how the market works, and adapt accordingly.

before this event i hit top seller in the guild i'm in. since this event, i see people selling at or around the same price as me often more but there so much that after a few hours mt stuff was listed in ttc on page 13. 13 pages of everyone selling the same items at about the same price. resource prices arent dropping yet just overloaded by the flood of them

ArchMikem · July 1

Isn't it also the "Old Guard" who have tens of millions of Gold?

CrazyKitty · July 1

Sales in guild traders started tanking with U35 and they've continued to slow ever since. It was the vet players that had the gold to buy the expensive items and that did most of the theory crafting for builds, so they also purchased many of the gold mats.

Now the game is almost exclusively casuals who haven't played long enough to have any gold to buy anything.

freespirit · July 1

I suppose I must be one of the "old guard" and my sales are still fine, also because of my time playing I know when to lower my prices and which items just to sit on for the time being.

I have three accounts and I trade on all of them, I'm a terrible hoarder but this means I can also switch up what I'm currently selling to match what the market lacks.

I have three alts currently loaded down with Motifs, I will not even look to start selling those until the end of the year, I could sell them now but the market is flooded and my returns would be smaller.

So in answer to your title op, ZoS is unlikely to bankrupt the "old guard" because the "old guard" knows what to sell and when to sell it!!

sarahthes · July 1

freespirit wrote: »

I suppose I must be one of the "old guard" and my sales are still fine, also because of my time playing I know when to lower my prices and which items just to sit on for the time being.

I have three accounts and I trade on all of them, I'm a terrible hoarder but this means I can also switch up what I'm currently selling to match what the market lacks.

I have three alts currently loaded down with Motifs, I will not even look to start selling those until the end of the year, I could sell them now but the market is flooded and my returns would be smaller.

So in answer to your title op, ZoS is unlikely to bankrupt the "old guard" because the "old guard" knows what to sell and when to sell it!!

I think this deflation is probably permanent, tbh. There's a lot less gold circulating at the moment.

The good news is, your gold should have more buying power!

freespirit · July 1

sarahthes wrote: »

freespirit wrote: »

I suppose I must be one of the "old guard" and my sales are still fine, also because of my time playing I know when to lower my prices and which items just to sit on for the time being.

I have three accounts and I trade on all of them, I'm a terrible hoarder but this means I can also switch up what I'm currently selling to match what the market lacks.

I have three alts currently loaded down with Motifs, I will not even look to start selling those until the end of the year, I could sell them now but the market is flooded and my returns would be smaller.

So in answer to your title op, ZoS is unlikely to bankrupt the "old guard" because the "old guard" knows what to sell and when to sell it!!

I think this deflation is probably permanent, tbh. There's a lot less gold circulating at the moment.

The good news is, your gold should have more buying power!

Every year we have these discussions, every year prices rise again!

Admittedly this year's Anniversary Event was longer and the Zenithar Event drops even more materials although not in the sheer numbers of the Anniversary.

The number of Perfect Roe drops I got this year was astounding, I also got three Ciphers. Prices are down atm but if you pick the right stuff to sell they are not down by that much'

I went shopping for cheap Aetherial Dust towards the end of the Anniversary and just after it, I screenshotted the value according to my addons at the time and I can tell you it is worth more than it was then already.

I did the same with the three alts and their motif stashes, they are also rising but not by much and not that fast.

I had discussions with Guildies about how prices might recover and how long it might take this year.... I think it will take longer and we might not see the extremes of before this year's Anniversary but I am confident it will happen!

Also PC-EU was never close to the extremes of PC-NA!

sarahthes · July 1

I do not think we will see the hyperinflation of the past year again. That's what I mean by permanently depressed.

Did you know RMT gold currently costs 10x what it did this time last year? There is just a lot less gold in the system and more materials.

(Not that I advocate breaking TOS - but it is an indicator of the in game economy and should not be discounted)

LittlePinkDot · July 1

ApoAlaia wrote: »

Things are currently in flux; the upheaval that the changes to listing duration has brought coinciding with the summer slump has created an interesting situation where sales are down across the board while bidding on traders remains as if this wasn't happening.

It certainly is putting a strain on the coffers but eventually it will settle into a new 'equlibrium'.

Sounds like the housing market

freespirit · July 1

sarahthes wrote: »

I do not think we will see the hyperinflation of the past year again. That's what I mean by permanently depressed.

Did you know RMT gold currently costs 10x what it did this time last year? There is just a lot less gold in the system and more materials.

(Not that I advocate breaking TOS - but it is an indicator of the in game economy and should not be discounted)

I have never and would never even look at RMT gold.

Is it a sad inditement of some peoples activities unfortunately yes!!

Wereswan · July 1

ArchMikem wrote: »

Isn't it also the "Old Guard" who have tens of millions of Gold?

You're off by a couple orders of magnitude; the whales have literal billions of gold.

valenwood_vegan · July 1

Considering that there's little to nothing to spend gold on, once one has been playing for a while and depending on one's interests, I would be willing to bet that the wealth of some players will outlast the game.