This reminds me of the days when MMOs were more hardcore

Pretext

I somewhat agree, but there are many easymode features as well. I only hope they do not take over the game.

Gohlar

Pretext wrote: »

I somewhat agree, but there are many easymode features as well. I only hope they do not take over the game.

With anything other than the lowest common denominator getting gutted and nerfed, they already are.

This is a game for people who like to casually go through easy quests.

Yankee

Gohlar wrote: »

This is a game for people who like to casually go through easy quests.

Then you will see some QQ when they get to a certain level 40 and also a certain level 50 solo quest.

mutharex

Yankee wrote: »

Gohlar wrote: »

This is a game for people who like to casually go through easy quests.

Then you will see some QQ when they get to a certain level 40 and also a certain level 50 solo quest.

Oh they are already QQing for Doshia and all the Guild Quests. Or any content that is "too hard"

UnknownXV

I have to respectfully disagree. I'm 23. I've played my share of hardcore games. In terms of progression, as well as experience. Hardcore progression? Look no further than Runescape. Hardcore experience? Darkfall and EvE. Full loot, extensive world PvP.

I feel that ESO does a great job on story, immersion, and the leveling is well-paced for someone who enjoys the long haul. This isn't a relic to me, it's a rebirth. I only hope that it gains the popularity it deserves.

Easy MMOs are only good on paper. In practice, everyone maxes out, completes all the achievements, does most of what you can do. Nothing is special, and it defeats the point of playing for me.

fredarbonab14_ESO

I do believe ESO is very 'casual' friendly. They go even more in that direction, then starts loosing long-term appeal. It is just about right for me p[ersonally, easy enough, but not a facepalm like other games have become.

Dahkoht

Play at your own pace and quit "worrying" about how fast you are going or keeping up with the ones who have more playtime.

As a 40+ with a career and family , who played EQ at launch , I'm very much enjoying what playtime I do have here.

Not every game needs to be easy mode speed rush to end.

Also "escapism" is not bad. Not being able to control yourself is what is bad. Sounds the like some have their own issues with self control.

Some of us are fine with self control.

Celuwen

OP, I understand what you're trying to say, but I feel you're projecting massively here. A key part of your argument is that MMOs are huge time syncs and thus you cannot play them and also have a Real Life. Except that most people to do just that, they play around their Real Life responsibilities, families lives and hobbies.

You talk about another addiction: smoking. I'd like to use a similar example to help highlight something for you. An alcoholic often cannot understand how people can have just one drink. Their relationship with alcohol is broken so when they look at social drinkers, it can possibly take a lot to fathom that casual association with drinking.

Alcohol can and does ruin lives, as can MMO gaming. I put it to you that your relationship with MMOs is similarly broken and you cannot understand that people can pick and choose how to play. They can have a casual relationship with this form of escapism that perhaps you never can have again.

This game reminds you of your addiction and as such you should run as far away from it as possible. You've done a great thing by moving on with your life, please don't jeopardise all of that.

WyeVxndzz

I agree with the "there is progress" and "have work/life/game balance" sentiments.
I play WoW, and have for years, and I've watched it become a button-mashers-gimmie-reward game. We can go there for that instant gratification "wanna run instance X and get Y result."
I like that ESO is slower and immersive means that it's not got the cheap feeling, like the game is a movie "hey lets pop this in for an hour and twenty minutes and get a complete story arc and a satisfying wrap-up ending."
I'm baffled by people screaming in PRE-RELEASE that leveling is too slow, like they want the game to be over already..
Go to Blizzard's site and buy a 90.
How's that feel?

Gohlar

WyeVxndzz wrote: »

I agree with the "there is progress" and "have work/life/game balance" sentiments.
I play WoW, and have for years, and I've watched it become a button-mashers-gimmie-reward game.

To be fair to WoW, that's only on the low end of the skill curve. The game has some deep and difficult content with heroic raiding. What WoW does well is appeal to a wide audience and multiple styles of play.

drzycki_ESO

DJ_Pandatripp wrote: »

I have the opposite feelings on this game than you. I love the fact that not everything is hand fed to me, and I actually have to try and work for items/quests/dungeon completion. I'm so sick of easy MMO's, where I get max level in a week, or have the best gear in a month. I am absolutely in love with ESO, and I'm super excited to see what new content we'll get in the future.

This quote is how I feel. Other recent MMOs have been so easy they were boring so I didn't play them very long. I love the difficulty in ESO. It makes me have to think and plan.

I have played open world pvp games and the idea sounds appealing but the the actuality is awful. Getting ganked over and over again while I'd rather be doing something else isn't my idea of a good time.

It's ok to have differing opinions. That's why there are different games. Find one that makes you happy.

elder42

I understand we all have differing opinions, but I hope this thread is still available for me to view in even just 3 months after official launch. I think they are going to see a lot of blowback due to the general player-unfriendly nature of this game compared to modern games, and it's going to make all the people who are invested in this game as a means to turn profit demand adjustments.

It's okay to have differing opinions, but in the business world, it's about having as many people play your game as possible. I think this game is very good at serving a specific demographic, but if they want larger monetary success (which is the core focus of any business venture), they will have to do more than open a cash shop in a P2P before it is even officially launched. They will need to make the game more accessible. This game is missing a lot of handholding features modern players have come to expect, and while it is admirable in a way to remove them to try and encourage players to take their time and figure thinks out for themselves more, and get more invested in the world as a result, I don't think it will actually have that effect. I think most people are just going to play for a little while and then leave. There are far more games on the market than when games like this used to get released. People want to run through a theme park, go "cool!", and then move on to the next game to repeat the process. I have said it a few times already in this thread, but I will repeat myself, I think this game takes too long to provide what the average modern gamer expects. We can argue a lot of things, but when it comes down to business (which is what game direction is unfortunately dictated by), it does not matter what we think. They will steer the ship in the direction of the money once they realize their mistake, because right now this game is sailing in the completely opposite direction.

A lot of what this game tries to do, it looks good on paper, but once the masses get into this game, it will very quickly become painfully obvious how many severe mistakes they made in development.

Again, not because the game is bad, but because the timing is all wrong.

I do not envy the team that made this very much at all right now. I think the next few months they spend working on this game will be very, very rough on them. I have had pieces of life where I obsessed over creating something as a labor of love, only to present it to people and be told it was garbage and that I needed to start over and do the same thing, only differently. It does not feel good, but I think that is the same message this development team is going to be receiving in the near future.

loco

snowmanflvb14_ESO wrote: »

elder42 wrote: »

Melian wrote: »

It sounds like this is more about your personal issues and prejudices than about this game. No offense...

I wouldn't say these things about "WoW" in its current form or something like "Secret World". It is very much this game.

That is because WoW was designed for the casual player. In this game you actually have to work for things. It is such a breath of fresh air to have a game that brings back the emotions and feel of EQ or DAOC.

You have lost your mind, EQ actually took work, skill, and group mechanics. Not to mention it would take you months to hit cap grinding. Gear mattered and wasn't level restricted or out leveled easy, it was open world, you had languages and alcohol tolerance skills. Spells with utility, torches cause it was dark, real exploration. Mobs took minutes to kill not seconds, regen took time, no quest progression. I could keep going, but in every way EQ was a game that is nothing like ESO, and had depth to it that would make your head explode. Oh and you could dive underwater. Ha

They do both have lizards and cats though now, so I guess that's something. Sad that a game in 1999 felt deeper and more real than one in 2014. This game is easy.

Sarenia

Keep your grubby, lazy paws off my one and only MMO that isn't a cakewalk. Please, and thank you.

Melian

Elder42, what do you hope to accomplish with your predictions of doom? You apparently have contempt for "the average modern gamer" and the games they play, but you're doing nothing but arguing that this game has to become more like them. As far as I can tell, your goal is to boost your own ego.

nlnj_a

Nobody will probably read this, but they could make is so that every campaign had their own full area of the world (including all three of the faction PvE areas). This would include the full world PvP and would make things more interesting for those that want it while those that don't can stick to the plain PvE zones.

No layering in these worlds, just a cap for each area with adjustments depending on the opposing team and current numbers etc etc.

natronosaurus

Today at work, I daydreamed about a "let's be honest" thread.

chipz88b14_ESO

I completely disagree. I have almost no experience with MMOs. I have little interest in PVP, though maybe I'll check it out from time to time. Maybe the OP has a different outlook on this game and that is the reason for differing views.

I am a huge Elder Scrolls fan... my biggest draw to them was I could play whenever I want, however I want, as often as I want. In fact, despite having put around 500 hours collectively into the last three Elder Scroll games, I have never completed the main story line of any of them. I start playing, get sucked into the plethora of side stuff, go play something else, quit playing for months or years, decide I need a new character and start over and never finish.

I've always shied away from MMOs despite being a geek because everyone I've known who plays them plays them incessantly. They can't go out an do x because that's when their guild is raiding in wow. All they can talk about is y because it just released a new expansion. When a game is all you can do or talk about it's not a game anymore, it's more like a job. And that's what has always kept me away from MMOs. In that regard I see the OP's point. If it sucks away your life it's not a game and it's not fun.

But I haven't felt that way at all about ESO. I was in the last several betas and for one of them I only played for a couple hours. I already missed a couple days of the early access. And it doesn't bother me. I don't feel like I have to keep up with anyone else. I feel like I just do my own thing on my own time. And that is what a good game is supposed to be - an enjoyable way to spend your leisure time.

elder42

7 day bump

Gohlar

Why did someone make a thread about a questing game being hardcore?

ESO does questing well, don't get me wrong, but this is absolutely an easy, modern, casual friendly game. This is a beginner level mmo, by design.

mutharex

Compared to UO or EQ and any pre-wow games, yeah this is easy mode. But it's 'harder' than anything that came out on the mass market in 10 years (and I mean mass market not some niche FFA FL sanbox). Not that I find the game hard mind you but I can see where people grown in the post-wow market might find it daunting lol

Shimond

It's pretty clear from the walls of text and the followup "I'm gonna want to read this again in 3 months" post and pointless bump all this is just narcissism. Nothing to see here, move on.

Vikova

The opposite is true, OP. The relatively slow progression (it's not that slow) is actually more attractive to less "hardcore" players - they can log on for a bit and play for a little while without running out of progress to achieve for a very long time.

Leveling quickly and hitting endgame fast is what kills it for the "non-hardcore" players.

Also, hardcore is possibly the stupidest term ever coined for a gamer.