Skyshards in PVP zones WHY?

VisitHammerfell · May 25

Sksyhards are optional

For alts, I don't want to get Skyshards in Craglorn delves, or have to ask around for teleports to Coldharbour. Should ZoS remove skyshards from Craglorn and Coldharbour too?

I despise random dungeons with PUGs and dislike running too many dungeons (get burnt out quickly). Except I have to do them for skill points and gear and transmutes and monster sets. Why am I pushed into doing dungeons? Speed runner this, fake tank that, oh god another battle axe, where is my drop, etc. I like to do trials and PvP and dailies and craft and dungeon achievements, is it fair I am pushed into random dungeons? Is it fair PvP mains are pushed into dungeons?

Adamant anti PvPers are some of the most entitled out of the player base

LaintalAy · May 25

Desiato wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

NPC mobs dont hunt you. They dont make it their mission to kill you. They don't find pleasure in defeating you and they don't rub it in your face by bagging you. It has nothing to do with difficulty, it has everything to do with who is behind the controls of what is attacking you.

So? Who cares? Dying in a game shouldn't matter, regardless of the circumstances. If it does, it's not an issue with the game.

Plenty of people care about it. It's why they resist playing in this area.

The stakes aren't high and if you don't make an issue of it, the player killing you will completely forget about it pretty shortly after.

Keep playing in Cyrodiil then, but you'll probably need some help.

Tornaad · May 25

I remember when I got the last Skyshard in Cyrodiil for one of my Pact Characters. I was sneaking up to Dominion front trying to get the scroll near the temple of Altadoon, and initially, I found the gate closed, at the time, I was so new to PVP that I did not know you had to have captured the closest keep to get the gate to open. As I was waiting there, trying to figure out what to do, I found a Covenant army had not only captured keep and thus opened the gate, but that an army of Dominion troops came and started trying to stop the Covenant from getting the scroll.
I managed to sneak through the two opposing armies and got to the sky shard and then got killed on my way out, but I still got my last sky shard. It was great.
I have gotten much better at PVP since that first time. I still suck badly, but I can occasionally win a one on one, and can occasionally not instantly pop when in a 1vX.
I really don't mind the sky shards in pvp. I look at it as the ultimate game of stealth.

Wereswan · May 25

LaintalAy wrote: »

Wereswan wrote: »

snip
Meanwhile, it takes 586 skill points to fill in every skill line and morph every active skill on one character.

But hey, at least we're getting closer to having enough.

Why would you need every skill line filled?
Once you finish trait researching, you don't need those filled.

Having those filled improves your chances of getting master writs.

Desiato · May 26

Tornaad wrote: »

I remember when I got the last Skyshard in Cyrodiil for one of my Pact Characters. I was sneaking up to Dominion front trying to get the scroll near the temple of Altadoon, and initially, I found the gate closed, at the time, I was so new to PVP that I did not know you had to have captured the closest keep to get the gate to open. As I was waiting there, trying to figure out what to do, I found a Covenant army had not only captured keep and thus opened the gate, but that an army of Dominion troops came and started trying to stop the Covenant from getting the scroll.
I managed to sneak through the two opposing armies and got to the sky shard and then got killed on my way out, but I still got my last sky shard. It was great.
I have gotten much better at PVP since that first time. I still suck badly, but I can occasionally win a one on one, and can occasionally not instantly pop when in a 1vX.
I really don't mind the sky shards in pvp. I look at it as the ultimate game of stealth.

Imagine making a game out of... a game!

What inspires me to fight for my faction are all the players who try their best despite not being the best at pvp. I love their spirit.

Sakiri · May 26

EdjeSwift wrote: »

I'm gonna leave this right here.

Of the 544 Skill Points currently available; 50 come from Alliance War Rank, 15.33 from Cyrodiil and 5.3 from IC, that's a total of a little under 13% of all skill points available in game currently. I don't even have all 50 from Alliance War Rank on that character and I'm still sitting at 172 unassigned points. In the past PvP skyshards were more important but these days they're more than optional.

How did you get the one from the wailing prison? My character from launch, that most certainly DID get that skyshard, doesn't have it shown as obtained.

LaintalAy · May 26

Wereswan wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Wereswan wrote: »

snip
Meanwhile, it takes 586 skill points to fill in every skill line and morph every active skill on one character.

But hey, at least we're getting closer to having enough.

Why would you need every skill line filled?
Once you finish trait researching, you don't need those filled.

Having those filled improves your chances of getting master writs.

I think it's having completed the research that improves the chances.

I'm not getting any writs dropping currently

Sakiri · May 26

LaintalAy wrote: »

Wereswan wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Wereswan wrote: »

snip
Meanwhile, it takes 586 skill points to fill in every skill line and morph every active skill on one character.

But hey, at least we're getting closer to having enough.

Why would you need every skill line filled?
Once you finish trait researching, you don't need those filled.

Having those filled improves your chances of getting master writs.

I think it's having completed the research that improves the chances.

I'm not getting any writs dropping currently

Me either. Not sure why.

Wereswan · May 26

LaintalAy wrote: »

Wereswan wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Wereswan wrote: »

snip
Meanwhile, it takes 586 skill points to fill in every skill line and morph every active skill on one character.

But hey, at least we're getting closer to having enough.

Why would you need every skill line filled?
Once you finish trait researching, you don't need those filled.

Having those filled improves your chances of getting master writs.

I think it's having completed the research that improves the chances.

I'm not getting any writs dropping currently

Number of passives filled is one of the factors, along with number of traits researched and number of motifs known.

LaintalAy · May 26

Wereswan wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Wereswan wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Wereswan wrote: »

snip
Meanwhile, it takes 586 skill points to fill in every skill line and morph every active skill on one character.

But hey, at least we're getting closer to having enough.

Why would you need every skill line filled?
Once you finish trait researching, you don't need those filled.

Having those filled improves your chances of getting master writs.

I think it's having completed the research that improves the chances.

I'm not getting any writs dropping currently

Number of passives filled is one of the factors, along with number of traits researched and number of motifs known.

Did you have any supporting documentation? Everything I've looked athttps://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/3811984/#Comment_3811984 says:

'traits researched'
'complete motifs'
'all enchant combos researched'
'all alchemy traits researched'

Never anything about skill points.

Mik195 · May 27

I have level 10 in the alliance skills and all the Cyrodil skyshards. And don't pvp. I think I currently have 14 PVP kills and 7 of them came because the only keep AD had on the map was Dragonclaw under attack and I wanted to leave so I set up a catapult, shot it, waited to be killed.

If your alliance has the opposing gates open, you can sneak between the NPC defenders and not have to fight anyone. I had a bunch of invisibility potions, snuck in and snuck everywhere. Took a while, but got them and never have to go back. I had all the stealth passives and 15 second invisibility potions.

Theist_VII · May 27

OP, you might find this video useful if the idea of getting killed in PvP is intimidating you.

https://youtu.be/BZJxVKFg230?si=Ac32kPmObVaNs5c6

kyle.wilson · May 27

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Best ways to get these are if you don’t like PvP are:

During Whitestrake Mayhem, find a campaign your alliance dominates and it’ll be easy

Go on a dead/quiet server and get them.

Before you reach level 50 go into lowbie and get them.

has the <50 gotten better? it used to be full of twinks with max gold gear farming noobs.

Tornaad · May 27

Telos_Tim wrote: »

OP, you might find this video useful if the idea of getting killed in PvP is intimidating you.

https://youtu.be/BZJxVKFg230?si=Ac32kPmObVaNs5c6

I might give that a try. Thank you.

Theist_VII · May 27

Tornaad wrote: »

Telos_Tim wrote: »

OP, you might find this video useful if the idea of getting killed in PvP is intimidating you.

https://youtu.be/BZJxVKFg230?si=Ac32kPmObVaNs5c6

I might give that a try. Thank you.

I love PvP in ESO, but I still made that build and threw it on my Templar for some fun halting an entire faction.

There are some classes it works better for, like Dragonknight and Necromancer, but it works on each of them.

LaintalAy · May 27

Telos_Tim wrote: »

OP, you might find this video useful if the idea of getting killed in PvP is intimidating you.

I had real trouble with the accent, so I used the closed captions.
Turns out that the CC had trouble with the accent too, which was entertaining...

As a stick-wielding sorc for most of the past 8 years, it looks like Cyrodiil is as far away as ever.
Weirdo tourist that I am.

Much as I'm grateful for the tips contained here, you Filthy Professionals make some erroneous assumptions about PvE players.

Whilst looking at the abilities, it turns out that some are one hand and shield. At a guess, I'd say most people not wanting to PvP, have probably never used one hand and shield. If they have that Skill Line at all, it's because it came from a book reading in a dungeon somewhere. So we'll have to change weapons and actually play with them for a while to skill up.

I might have to stick to my day job of a backyard pharmacist, selling to the local knife-wielding junkies. All the while singing "Col-Um-Bine" to the tune of Eidelweiss.

Parrot1986 · May 27

Because when the game launched Zos cared enough about pvp to put things that mattered in it.

Now you can have almost any set up with armoury and the current skill point limit without any pvp contributions for any build.

If you are bothered because achievements are linked to them I’m not sure why that really matters when you have so many pvp specific achievements which i assume you also won’t have since if you don’t like pvp.

Theist_VII · May 27

LaintalAy wrote: »

Telos_Tim wrote: »

OP, you might find this video useful if the idea of getting killed in PvP is intimidating you.

I had real trouble with the accent, so I used the closed captions.
Turns out that the CC had trouble with the accent too, which was entertaining...

As a stick-wielding sorc for most of the past 8 years, it looks like Cyrodiil is as far away as ever.
Weirdo tourist that I am.

Much as I'm grateful for the tips contained here, you Filthy Professionals make some erroneous assumptions about PvE players.

Whilst looking at the abilities, it turns out that some are one hand and shield. At a guess, I'd say most people not wanting to PvP, have probably never used one hand and shield. If they have that Skill Line at all, it's because it came from a book reading in a dungeon somewhere. So we'll have to change weapons and actually play with them for a while to skill up.

I might have to stick to my day job of a backyard pharmacist, selling to the local knife-wielding junkies. All the while singing "Col-Um-Bine" to the tune of Eidelweiss.

You could probably do the same thing with an Ice Staff if you wanted, it would be a little weaker but the result would be the same if it’s to prevent a few people from killing you.

Might even give you some satisfaction too with the fact that whoever was trying to harass instead is just wasting potions trying to bring you down, not knowing that with the correct gear it is virtually impossible to go down short of getting run over by a ball group.

Grizzbeorn · May 27

LaintalAy wrote: »

Whilst looking at the abilities, it turns out that some are one hand and shield. At a guess, I'd say most people not wanting to PvP, have probably never used one hand and shield. If they have that Skill Line at all, it's because it came from a book reading in a dungeon somewhere. So we'll have to change weapons and actually play with them for a while to skill up.

That video showcases a tank build.
One-Hand and Shield is very common on tank builds, in both PvE and PvP.

apri · May 27

From a pvp player's perspective, it would just be nice to have additional PVE instances of Cyrodiil and Imperial City. It would help those who want to do activities aside of PVP - whatever they may be. But something that seems to be often overlooked is it would ALSO help those who want to pvp. Especially in pop locked campaigns it is a nuisance for active PVP players to see people go fishing, skyshard hunting, do (town) quests, sightseeing or whatever means of interest. All those activities are legit activities. But it can be derailing from pvp if a big chunk of players is invisible because not involved (or interested) in any type of fights. The whole concept of population bars is countered by players pursuing other activities but PVP. As long as there is no separation, population tracking (despite its buggy nature) is a questionable indicator for campaign strategies.

So while I agree that it's easy to do skyshard hunting without ever engaging in any means of pvp, it would be in the best interest of everyone if there was a pve-based instance of IC and Cyrodiil, as well. Those zones are there already and making them more widely accessible is something nobody should be offended of. Ultimately, as pointed out, it would also help PVP players if those not interested in any kind of pvp don't block valuable player slots. If those PVE instanced zones would teach players how PVP works with some more in-depth tutorials and without pressure of the real heat of combat, who knows, it might actually boost the interest in PVP as a whole! The optional hammer tutorial quest by the gate is actually a good example how those tutorials could look like. Also it's just fun to run around with the hammer. Getting more opportunities to try it and familiarize with it would be a fun thing and this is just one rather tiny aspect of pvp.

Bottom line: Adding PVE-only Cyro/IC would be a win-win for everyone. Nothing to go on each other's throat for, no need to become emotional here really.

FlopsyPrince · May 27

Desiato wrote: »

They are there for players who PVP. You are not being pushed to get them. They are optional -- especially now with so many sources of skyshards and skill points in the game.

Furthermore, one can get the skyshards without engaging in PVP themselves. Yes, you may be killed by another player, but who cares? You don't actually lose anything.

To me a post like this speaks to how ridiculously easy overland content is. They've made the average mob so useless, players actually expect to be able to play without the risk of dying.

You do have to repair your equipment, so you lose some gold.

Fortunately you can get more than enough skyshards in other places now with so many expansions.

I was really annoyed that they put them in the Crown store for alts, not earnable otherwise....

FlopsyPrince · May 27

Hapexamendios wrote: »

The only reason any are hard to get is that they're behind enemy gates. There's only 4 of those. The vast majority can me acquired with little trouble.

Much easier to get those on the PC where my addon tells me where they are, especially if you do when the game is very low population there (and owns the map). More of a pain on console when you are trying to remember exactly where the skyshard is.

FlopsyPrince · May 27

KV_Tootn wrote: »

Thank you all for input.. I think i will end my hunt for greater good )) Much love to ya all

I have 44 spare skill points on my Pet Sorc main on PC-NA. I do have all of them in Cyrodiil and above ground in IC, but those are only part of this. I could put points many other areas and I don't have all from new zones past the dragon places, so you can get by without them in Cyrodiil in most cases.

I could probably burn a bunch in med and heavy armor lines, but I have most other things filled out for what I use, including the "World" lines.

LaintalAy · May 27

Telos_Tim wrote: »

You could probably do the same thing with an Ice Staff if you wanted, it would be a little weaker but the result would be the same if it’s to prevent a few people from killing you.

Thanks for that. I've been experimenting with resto and ice lately just to see how they work.

LaintalAy · May 27

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

That video showcases a tank build.
One-Hand and Shield is very common on tank builds, in both PvE and PvP.

Sure, but I have no experience playing a tank, let alone building for that role.

From comments here it seems PvP players collect all shards and open all skill lines and max all skills. That isn't necessarily true for PvE players. e.g. I never knew about the Alliance skill lines, until ZOS started giving AP away as daily rewards, which unlocked them.

Once I have enough skill points meet a mix of crafting and combat skills, I don't go after any more shards.

I will be giving this build a go in a few weeks. The vented frustration is that many online 'build suppliers' always end up recommending abilities that are locked/hidden/never used by we filthy casual PvE players. For me, before I can try this out, I'll need to find and buy the gear, research any missing abilities and reassign my skill points.

Whilst I have experimented with stamina based morphs, my head is firmly magicka oriented.

Yamenstein · May 27

EdjeSwift wrote: »

I'm gonna leave this right here.

Of the 544 Skill Points currently available; 50 come from Alliance War Rank, 15.33 from Cyrodiil and 5.3 from IC, that's a total of a little under 13% of all skill points available in game currently. I don't even have all 50 from Alliance War Rank on that character and I'm still sitting at 172 unassigned points. In the past PvP skyshards were more important but these days they're more than optional.

Sorry can’t take you seriously - you didn’t get the tutorial sky shard.
/sarcasm

Tenthirty2 · May 27

Craft a set of stealth gear and never have to interact with anything again. Almost

I have a build I call the Introvert's Excellent Ensemble
2 sets and a mythic on a build that I use only when I don't want to be detected by anything.
I can run faster than sprint speed, crouched in stealth, with very slow stam drain and literally stand next to mobs and most players without being detected. And if I need to flee my non-stealthed sprint is insanely fast.

Fishing, no problem just crouch. Skyshards,ok yes you need to scope your surroundings but if you arrived there undetected your chances are great.

Also great for doing some of the daily alliance board missions in case you ever decide to dip a toe into the luke warm waters of PVP

I also use the build for mat farming, lets you move super fast from node to node without being slowed down by mobs.
It's not 100% effective, nothing is especially if someone drops a detect on you, but it's super hard for me to ever be seen.

My point is you don't need to engage in PVP combat if you reeeeeally need those Cyro shards, just build your own antisocial cat suit and giggle as you sprint across Cyro unseen.

Grizzbeorn · May 27

LaintalAy wrote: »

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

That video showcases a tank build.
One-Hand and Shield is very common on tank builds, in both PvE and PvP.

Sure, but I have no experience playing a tank, let alone building for that role.

Well, you made it sound like you were saying that not just you, but anyone who doesn't like to PvP wouldn't be versed in the One Hand and Shield skill line.
My point was that tanking, which commonly uses that skill line, is just as prevalent in PvE as it is in PvP.

And I'm sure that lots of PvE folks who don't tank use that skill line, too, since it's kind of traditional for melee fighter-types to use a sword and shield in video games.
I can't say that they're all tanks, but I see plenty of people running around in the same areas I frequent with sword and shield equipped.

Sluggy · May 27

KV_Tootn wrote: »

I disegree with you.. ALL the mobs are deadly , till you learn how to play , get enough levels and have enough cp power.
i love the chalange of raid boses and sttrong enemys , but not gankers who just cant run by you not starting , killing you.....
Some achiewments are linkt to those areas and you cant get them done if you not doing these quests there and get that <snip> there,.... If the achiewments wouldnt ask for those zones to be done i would ignore them....

I don't think I've died to an overland mob outside of some DLC world bosses since one tamriel came out. That's including being afk for several minutes when they respawn where I left my character. And with enough skill in playing, levels, CP, and gear are more-or-less irrelevant to anything other than the time spent killing the otherwise helpless overland mobs. But this is neither here nor there for the topic

KV_Tootn wrote: »

Some achiewments are linkt to those areas and you cant get them done if you not doing these quests there and get that <snip> there,.... If the achiewments wouldnt ask for those zones to be done i would ignore them....

So what's the value of achievements if you don't actually achieve the thing they represent?

Grizzbeorn · May 27

KV_Tootn wrote: »

Some achiewments are linkt to those areas and you cant get them done if you not doing these quests there and get that <snip> there,....
<snipped for Cursing and Profanity>

The Achievement system in any game covers the entire game; they are linked to a very wide variety of activities.
If you want ALL of the achievements, you have to play ALL of the game.
You can't expect to be a completionist if you don't want to play the complete game.
And you can't expect that they will cater an over-arching game system like Achievements to fit just YOUR desired play-style.