compensation for the pts/live bug/exploit

WhiteCoatSyndrome · April 15

Adaarye wrote: »

noblecron wrote: »

1 day extension and maybe compensation for character or characters deleted if they can't restore them

Why would they need to delete characters?

To try out something on the PTS if, for example, all your character slots are filled and you wanted to make a template character to test out a build, get access to sets, or any of the other goodies that are available to test with on a template.

irswat · April 15

just give us all the style pages and im happy

ArchangelIsraphel · April 15

Seraphayel wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Stridig wrote: »

This has to be a joke thread, right??? Compensation? If this is a real request, I'll be convinced that zero adults play this game anymore. Server down 20 minutes and the Compensation threads already start.

Compensation for all those that finally got their style pages only to have the game rolled back to before they got them. Not just because of the server going down.

And for those in general for all the time they spent and loot they received only to have it all gone now.

My goodness, mistakes like these happen and they acted rather quickly by taking the servers down. We’re talking about less than two hours of progress, if at all. The damage for the entire economy could be waaaaaaaaaay worse by not rolling servers back. Yes it‘s annoying, but the timeframe is rather small. We’re not talking about hours or days of progress here.

I'm sorry, but given the horrible way in which this event has been handled with the RNG on the style page drops, I am not feeling at all forgiving of ZOS. If they do a rollback without properly compensating the players who got these incredibly hard to get style pages during this time, it will reflect very, very poorly on them. Players who put out time and effort to get these items do not deserve to be punished for ZOS's mistakes.

My own losses will be minor if there is a rollback, but I feel for those who finally got these pages only to have their progress reverted. For them, this is not minor or merely annoying- its days and days of work down the drain.

This is the 10th anniversary of the game. If they let it become memorable for such a deeply negative reason, I don't even know what to say.

Seraphayel · April 15

SilverBride wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Stridig wrote: »

This has to be a joke thread, right??? Compensation? If this is a real request, I'll be convinced that zero adults play this game anymore. Server down 20 minutes and the Compensation threads already start.

Compensation for all those that finally got their style pages only to have the game rolled back to before they got them. Not just because of the server going down.

And for those in general for all the time they spent and loot they received only to have it all gone now.

My goodness, mistakes like these happen and they acted rather quickly by taking the servers down. We’re talking about less than two hours of progress, if at all. The damage for the entire economy could be waaaaaaaaaay worse by not rolling servers back. Yes it‘s annoying, but the timeframe is rather small. We’re not talking about hours or days of progress here.

Those are 2 hours that I spent grinding for a page that never dropped which was bad enough, but to think now that none of it "really" happened if they roll back is more than a little disturbing. Yes there should be compensation.

What kind of compensation are we talking about? If they rollback the servers, your stuff you farmed in that timeframe is lost. I’m pretty sure extending the event is not sufficient, so what kind of compensation? It‘s a difficult topic and I see both sides, but mistakes happen and as I said, ZOS acted rather quickly instead of letting this ravage servers for hours and hours. The moment it became known they already took both servers offline.

barney2525 · April 15

Oh, we should make it easy on them

Extend this event to the first of the year.

ZOS_Hadeostry · April 15

Greetings,

After removing some unnecessary back and forth from this thread, we would like everyone to keep posts on the subject at hand, civil, and constructive.

If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please feel free to review them here

Calm_Fury · April 16

virtus753 wrote: »

tomofhyrule wrote: »

I doubt we'll lose that much time in a rollback.

The PTS copy is usually taken on Saturday, so I think the most that would get lost is about 36h. Which, yes, is problematic.

However, I'd assume there's a more recent state that they could roll back to so we only lose a few hours at most.

Yeah, it shouldn't be when PTS was copied but the most recent Live backup before the PTS went live today.

If they just "pointed" PTS servers to the production DB, then it was using whatever data was live.

They might have "copied" the characters on Saturday, but from the looks of it they just messed up the DB credentials so the actual PTS DB was not even touched, it was using the live DB straight away.

They probably have point in time restores of the live DB that they can target in a rollback for a few minutes/hours before PTS servers started writing to the production DB.

kyle.wilson · April 16

If players are going to be the QA/QC for this game, maybe it's time to incentive a bounty system for people that identify issues on the pts server. That way we stop seeing game breaking bugs reach the live server.
There were people that knew that tarnished nightmare scaled with inevitable det on the pts and it still went live.

virtus753 · April 16

kyle.wilson wrote: »

If players are going to be the QA/QC for this game, maybe it's time to incentive a bounty system for people that identify issues on the pts server. That way we stop seeing game breaking bugs reach the live server.
There were people that knew that tarnished nightmare scaled with inevitable det on the pts and it still went live.

The issue here was not an error that could have been caught by players on the PTS before going live - the PTS *was* Live. It was using the live PC-NA server database.

Seraphayel · April 16

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Stridig wrote: »

This has to be a joke thread, right??? Compensation? If this is a real request, I'll be convinced that zero adults play this game anymore. Server down 20 minutes and the Compensation threads already start.

Compensation for all those that finally got their style pages only to have the game rolled back to before they got them. Not just because of the server going down.

And for those in general for all the time they spent and loot they received only to have it all gone now.

My goodness, mistakes like these happen and they acted rather quickly by taking the servers down. We’re talking about less than two hours of progress, if at all. The damage for the entire economy could be waaaaaaaaaay worse by not rolling servers back. Yes it‘s annoying, but the timeframe is rather small. We’re not talking about hours or days of progress here.

I'm sorry, but given the horrible way in which this event has been handled with the RNG on the style page drops, I am not feeling at all forgiving of ZOS. If they do a rollback without properly compensating the players who got these incredibly hard to get style pages during this time, it will reflect very, very poorly on them. Players who put out time and effort to get these items do not deserve to be punished for ZOS's mistakes.

My own losses will be minor if there is a rollback, but I feel for those who finally got these pages only to have their progress reverted. For them, this is not minor or merely annoying- its days and days of work down the drain.

This is the 10th anniversary of the game. If they let it become memorable for such a deeply negative reason, I don't even know what to say.

Again, whats properly compensating. It does not exist because every case is individual.

virtus753 · April 16

Calm_Fury wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

tomofhyrule wrote: »

I doubt we'll lose that much time in a rollback.

The PTS copy is usually taken on Saturday, so I think the most that would get lost is about 36h. Which, yes, is problematic.

However, I'd assume there's a more recent state that they could roll back to so we only lose a few hours at most.

Yeah, it shouldn't be when PTS was copied but the most recent Live backup before the PTS went live today.

If they just "pointed" PTS servers to the production DB, then it was using whatever data was live.

They might have "copied" the characters on Saturday, but from the looks of it they just messed up the DB credentials so the actual PTS DB was not even touched, it was using the live DB straight away.

They probably have point in time restores of the live DB that they can target in a rollback for a few minutes/hours before PTS servers started writing to the production DB.

Yes, I think we're in agreement here. The most recent backup from PC-NA before the PTS went live should work. Anything after that will be problematic. But it doesn't need to go back a day or three to when the PTS was copied.

I'm just not sure how often the live database is backed up.

cyclonus11 · April 16

I would like one (1) Barbas Helm style page for compensatory purposes, please.

aussie500 · April 16

Civil and constructive huh.......
I accept we are going to be rolled back, and knowing our luck it will be to yesterday. So in compensation for all the time lost, how about ZOS makes it easier for us to get the style pages that are driving so many nuts? Because with all the farming they did in that time, and the few who actually managed to get some and are going to lose them, making it a lot easier to get them might help. Might.

All those endevours we have to get again, all those writs we have to do again, all that style page farming now lost, all those new characters about to be lost, those pissed off customers wondering why they are even playing ESO........

LokiPagan · April 16

kyle.wilson wrote: »

If players are going to be the QA/QC for this game, maybe it's time to incentive a bounty system for people that identify issues on the pts server. That way we stop seeing game breaking bugs reach the live server.
There were people that knew that tarnished nightmare scaled with inevitable det on the pts and it still went live.

Honestly, just remove the PTS altogether if it's going to break the game like this. I can't think of any instances, save one or two, where the devs actually listened to the players when they brought up issues on the PTS. Why even have it if feedback/bugs are going to be ignored?

Delimber · April 16

Wow, after reading about what happened, for once I'm happy my laptop had a 2 hour software update, which kept me from logging in lol.

Calm_Fury · April 16

virtus753 wrote: »

Calm_Fury wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

tomofhyrule wrote: »

I doubt we'll lose that much time in a rollback.

The PTS copy is usually taken on Saturday, so I think the most that would get lost is about 36h. Which, yes, is problematic.

However, I'd assume there's a more recent state that they could roll back to so we only lose a few hours at most.

Yeah, it shouldn't be when PTS was copied but the most recent Live backup before the PTS went live today.

If they just "pointed" PTS servers to the production DB, then it was using whatever data was live.

They might have "copied" the characters on Saturday, but from the looks of it they just messed up the DB credentials so the actual PTS DB was not even touched, it was using the live DB straight away.

They probably have point in time restores of the live DB that they can target in a rollback for a few minutes/hours before PTS servers started writing to the production DB.

Yes, I think we're in agreement here. The most recent backup from PC-NA before the PTS went live should work. Anything after that will be problematic. But it doesn't need to go back a day or three to when the PTS was copied.

I'm just not sure how often the live database is backed up.

Yes, I think I quoted the wrong post.

I'm sure we will find out this time how frequent their backups are.

ESO must have a huge, huge database, but also has a lot of revenue.

I know smaller companies with huge DBs sometimes need longer frequency of backups to save costs, but ESO might have a pretty frequent one.

We will find out pretty soon.

I've done the same thing in my current company when I joined (pointed my local setup to prod and ran a test that dropped some prod tables), so I know how bad the person responsible must be feeling.

I'm more surprised this can even happen. Most companies face this in the first few months and put safeguards to make this basically impossible to happen.

Rageypoo · April 16

I was able to get all the pages.

Did it suck...yes
Was it worth it...no.
Do I care that it was hard...no.

It was something to do. This game doesn't have a lot of rare things that players can really show off, everyone ends up getting everything in the end unless it's hidden behind money (crown store) I don't mind that it was something difficult that could be obtained, wouldn't mind if the game had more things like this.

At least it wasn't something like the jubilee horse that you actually can't get unless you buy it with some event tickets (which you wouldn't know until the final day unless you were told otherwise) I hate stuff like that.

SpiritKitten · April 16

Can someone explain, step by step, what exactly the issue is?

Delimber · April 16

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656563/what-really-happened-to-the-servers-so-people-stop-asking#latest

Kiyakotari · April 16

I just want to be able to get the daily endeavors on PC-NA that I had just started on when the server went down. A 1-day or 2-day extension on the event for people who miss tickets because of this would be nice, too. And maybe something for people's daily log-ins? I don't think "compensation" is needed, but something to deal with the fact that this unexpected downtime is preventing people from getting things they normally would be able to get.

polaris86 · April 16

Oh man I hope they don't do a rollback to yesterday, that's a lot of grinding to undo. I finally got that geyser page last night around 10pm PT after so many tries and I'll be very sad if it gets taken back.

ArchangelIsraphel · April 16

Seraphayel wrote: »

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Stridig wrote: »

This has to be a joke thread, right??? Compensation? If this is a real request, I'll be convinced that zero adults play this game anymore. Server down 20 minutes and the Compensation threads already start.

Compensation for all those that finally got their style pages only to have the game rolled back to before they got them. Not just because of the server going down.

And for those in general for all the time they spent and loot they received only to have it all gone now.

My goodness, mistakes like these happen and they acted rather quickly by taking the servers down. We’re talking about less than two hours of progress, if at all. The damage for the entire economy could be waaaaaaaaaay worse by not rolling servers back. Yes it‘s annoying, but the timeframe is rather small. We’re not talking about hours or days of progress here.

I'm sorry, but given the horrible way in which this event has been handled with the RNG on the style page drops, I am not feeling at all forgiving of ZOS. If they do a rollback without properly compensating the players who got these incredibly hard to get style pages during this time, it will reflect very, very poorly on them. Players who put out time and effort to get these items do not deserve to be punished for ZOS's mistakes.

My own losses will be minor if there is a rollback, but I feel for those who finally got these pages only to have their progress reverted. For them, this is not minor or merely annoying- its days and days of work down the drain.

This is the 10th anniversary of the game. If they let it become memorable for such a deeply negative reason, I don't even know what to say.

Again, whats properly compensating. It does not exist because every case is individual.

Event extension and putting the style pages in the shop for tickets for those affected to buy would be appropriate, IMO.

FLuFFyxMuFFiN · April 16

Seraphayel wrote: »

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Stridig wrote: »

This has to be a joke thread, right??? Compensation? If this is a real request, I'll be convinced that zero adults play this game anymore. Server down 20 minutes and the Compensation threads already start.

Compensation for all those that finally got their style pages only to have the game rolled back to before they got them. Not just because of the server going down.

And for those in general for all the time they spent and loot they received only to have it all gone now.

My goodness, mistakes like these happen and they acted rather quickly by taking the servers down. We’re talking about less than two hours of progress, if at all. The damage for the entire economy could be waaaaaaaaaay worse by not rolling servers back. Yes it‘s annoying, but the timeframe is rather small. We’re not talking about hours or days of progress here.

I'm sorry, but given the horrible way in which this event has been handled with the RNG on the style page drops, I am not feeling at all forgiving of ZOS. If they do a rollback without properly compensating the players who got these incredibly hard to get style pages during this time, it will reflect very, very poorly on them. Players who put out time and effort to get these items do not deserve to be punished for ZOS's mistakes.

My own losses will be minor if there is a rollback, but I feel for those who finally got these pages only to have their progress reverted. For them, this is not minor or merely annoying- its days and days of work down the drain.

This is the 10th anniversary of the game. If they let it become memorable for such a deeply negative reason, I don't even know what to say.

Again, whats properly compensating. It does not exist because every case is individual.

I think the only proper compensation is just extending the event by a day or so depending on the length of downtime. That being said if I got a style page and then a rollback happened I would be pretty upset but not much they can do about it unfortunately.

Seraphayel · April 16

FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Stridig wrote: »

This has to be a joke thread, right??? Compensation? If this is a real request, I'll be convinced that zero adults play this game anymore. Server down 20 minutes and the Compensation threads already start.

Compensation for all those that finally got their style pages only to have the game rolled back to before they got them. Not just because of the server going down.

And for those in general for all the time they spent and loot they received only to have it all gone now.

My goodness, mistakes like these happen and they acted rather quickly by taking the servers down. We’re talking about less than two hours of progress, if at all. The damage for the entire economy could be waaaaaaaaaay worse by not rolling servers back. Yes it‘s annoying, but the timeframe is rather small. We’re not talking about hours or days of progress here.

I'm sorry, but given the horrible way in which this event has been handled with the RNG on the style page drops, I am not feeling at all forgiving of ZOS. If they do a rollback without properly compensating the players who got these incredibly hard to get style pages during this time, it will reflect very, very poorly on them. Players who put out time and effort to get these items do not deserve to be punished for ZOS's mistakes.

My own losses will be minor if there is a rollback, but I feel for those who finally got these pages only to have their progress reverted. For them, this is not minor or merely annoying- its days and days of work down the drain.

This is the 10th anniversary of the game. If they let it become memorable for such a deeply negative reason, I don't even know what to say.

Again, whats properly compensating. It does not exist because every case is individual.

I think the only proper compensation is just extending the event by a day or so depending on the length of downtime. That being said if I got a style page and then a rollback happened I would be pretty upset but not much they can do about it unfortunately.

This is it. They can extend the event, heck they could extend it for another week and people would complain, some rightfully, others just because that’s what they do. There‘s no right compensation in this case because it affected everyone differently. Next question: if they do, are they going to extend the event for everybody (so PS, Xbox and PC EU players), too? Or just PC NA? They would have to extend it for everyone. And then others feel still left out because others without issues got a compensation, too. It‘s just a neverending story.

Reginald_leBlem · April 16

I'm going to be very sad to miss the ez 200 daily endeavors

virtus753 · April 16

Seraphayel wrote: »

FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Stridig wrote: »

This has to be a joke thread, right??? Compensation? If this is a real request, I'll be convinced that zero adults play this game anymore. Server down 20 minutes and the Compensation threads already start.

Compensation for all those that finally got their style pages only to have the game rolled back to before they got them. Not just because of the server going down.

And for those in general for all the time they spent and loot they received only to have it all gone now.

My goodness, mistakes like these happen and they acted rather quickly by taking the servers down. We’re talking about less than two hours of progress, if at all. The damage for the entire economy could be waaaaaaaaaay worse by not rolling servers back. Yes it‘s annoying, but the timeframe is rather small. We’re not talking about hours or days of progress here.

I'm sorry, but given the horrible way in which this event has been handled with the RNG on the style page drops, I am not feeling at all forgiving of ZOS. If they do a rollback without properly compensating the players who got these incredibly hard to get style pages during this time, it will reflect very, very poorly on them. Players who put out time and effort to get these items do not deserve to be punished for ZOS's mistakes.

My own losses will be minor if there is a rollback, but I feel for those who finally got these pages only to have their progress reverted. For them, this is not minor or merely annoying- its days and days of work down the drain.

This is the 10th anniversary of the game. If they let it become memorable for such a deeply negative reason, I don't even know what to say.

Again, whats properly compensating. It does not exist because every case is individual.

I think the only proper compensation is just extending the event by a day or so depending on the length of downtime. That being said if I got a style page and then a rollback happened I would be pretty upset but not much they can do about it unfortunately.

This is it. They can extend the event, heck they could extend it for another week and people would complain, some rightfully, others just because that’s what they do. There‘s no right compensation in this case because it affected everyone differently. Next question: if they do, are they going to extend the event for everybody (so PS, Xbox and PC EU players), too? Or just PC NA? They would have to extend it for everyone. And then others feel still left out because others without issues got a compensation, too. It‘s just a neverending story.

They've actually done it before for a previous iteration of this event:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/406113/recent-eu-server-issues-anniversary-event-extension/p1

If that's how they have to do it, I'd rather the compensation be given rather than keeping the affected servers from having the intended opportunity to participate in the event.

Nerouyn · April 16

baratron wrote: »

We're referring to players who deleted characters on the PTS to make space for Template characters, then found that their character was deleted on Live. Which shouldn't ever happen!

I omg'ed out loud.

OOL?

Wow.