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EA Crystalline, Ferocious and Scorching Visions have poor RNG

SilverBride
SilverBride
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Collecting 3 Visions in each of these categories unlocks a corresponding Verse, but all 3 Visions in a category must be found in the same EA session for this to happen. The rate of finding these Visions has been very low and I have only unlocked one of these after multiple hours of playing. Have others had this same experience?
PCNA
  • Braffin
    Braffin
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    Yeah, collecting those visions can be an pain for people with consistently bad rng like myself. Sometimes I wonder how exactly I angered the gods of rng, lol.

    That said, the upgrade enabling you to choose out of 3 visions (I think it's the one from filer's wing) helped a lot with that.
    Never get between a cat and it's candy!
    ---
    Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.
  • SilverBride
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    Braffin wrote: »
    Yeah, collecting those visions can be an pain for people with consistently bad rng like myself. Sometimes I wonder how exactly I angered the gods of rng, lol.

    That said, the upgrade enabling you to choose out of 3 visions (I think it's the one from filer's wing) helped a lot with that.

    I've had that upgrade for awhile now and still having poor luck.

    Once 2 of the 3 were Crystalline but I could only pick one. :/
    PCNA
  • Kisakee
    Kisakee
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    p7i1a4ok5zw0.png
    Can't relate.
    "I don't know who you are, but i will find you and i will rob you." - Liam Thiefsson
  • EdjeSwift
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    It's not that bad, there are 16 Unique Offensive Visions, 16 Unique Defensive Visions, and 15 Unique Utility Visions.

    It's just math, you're looking to pull 1 specific vision from each of these pools, the longer your run, the better your chances to get a full stack and then the verse due to the fact that the pool gets smaller with each elemental vision you pull. If you're a "2 Arcs and you're out" there's not going to be that great of a mathematical chance to get all 3 and the verse in time. Each Arc is 5 chances and outside of the 9 Elemental Ones, they repeat so you're looking at a similar pool per pull.
    Antiquities Addict
  • spartaxoxo
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    I have 2 of these 3 achievements, but the last time I got the 3 visions necessary for the Ice one, I died before the Ice Avatar was ever offered to me as a verse. I don't think it's guaranteed to even get the verse after getting the 3, just highly likely.
    Edited by spartaxoxo on December 10, 2023 3:35AM
  • SilverBride
    SilverBride
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    I thought once you got the three Visions then you could get the Verse any time after that, and not required to get it in the same session as getting the three Visions.
    PCNA
  • EdjeSwift
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    spartaxoxo wrote: »
    I have 2 of these 3 achievements, but the last time I got the 3 visions necessary for the Ice one, I died before the Ice Avatar was ever offered to me as a verse. I don't think it's guaranteed to even get the verse after getting the 3, just highly likely.

    It's far from guaranteed, sometimes you get all 3, go for a few more Arcs and no joy. If you're achievement chasing keep popping candy when you can to get it.
    Antiquities Addict
  • EdjeSwift
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    I thought once you got the three Visions then you could get the Verse any time after that, and not required to get it in the same session as getting the three Visions.

    Nope, same run, all 3 visions and the verse.
    Antiquities Addict
  • SilverBride
    SilverBride
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    EdjeSwift wrote: »
    I thought once you got the three Visions then you could get the Verse any time after that, and not required to get it in the same session as getting the three Visions.

    Nope, same run, all 3 visions and the verse.

    Well that really irks me. I guess I just lucked out when I got the Scorching one and got the Verse the next portal.
    PCNA
  • CGPsaint
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    If you're planning on doing a deep run, then always grab the Avatar Visions when possible, as that will remove 9 Visions from the pool and give you better odds of getting other Visions towards your build.
    "Some enjoy bringing grief to others. They remind M'aiq of mudcrabs—horrible creatures, with no redeeming qualities."
  • SilverBride
    SilverBride
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    I never do a deep run. I've yet to get past Arc 3 Tho'at although we keep getting closer as a duo.

    But after 2 hours of continuous battle I'm just too exhausted to keep going anyway.
    Edited by SilverBride on December 10, 2023 5:54PM
    PCNA
  • Theignson
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    The worst RNG is for the most important vision: focused efforts.

    I've had streaks with zero focused efforts in 60 bosses in our duo.

    Above arc 4 , the EA is really a slog/boring without focused efforts, imo

    In addition to the above math (47 unique visions0, there are a bunch of visions (eg boundless potential) you can get 5 times.

    Has anyone figured out how far you have to get befor eyou have "all" the visions?

    I would guess ARC 18 or so?
    Quakrson, Stam DK, Grand Overlord
    Trackrsen, Stam Warden, Grand Overlord
    Quakrsen, Mag DK, Overlord
    Tolliverson, Stam NB, General
    Farfarel, Stam Necro, Praetorian
    Spencerson, Templar, Prefect
    Phosphorsen, Stam Sorc, Colonel
    Phosphorson, Mag Sorc, Centurion
    Glimson, Arcanist, Major
    All EP/ PC NA
  • EdjeSwift
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    Let's do the math.

    47 unique visions.
    9 are one-time only visions, leaving us with 38 multiple take visions.

    If we believe that there is an upper limit of 5 times per vision, we're looking at 5*38 Visions to complete the repeatables and since we have 5 stages per Arc to beat, that's a baseline of 38 Arcs to complete them all. Math here is easy, 5 stacks and 5 stages cancel each other out for 38 Arcs.

    Then add 9 extra stages for the elemental ones, you're looking at nearly 40 arcs to get all the visions if there truly is an upper limit of 5 per.
    Antiquities Addict
  • SilverBride
    SilverBride
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    Theignson wrote: »
    Has anyone figured out how far you have to get befor eyou have "all" the visions?

    I would guess ARC 18 or so?

    I have the achievements for all the Visions and most Verses and I've not made it past Arc 3 yet. All I am missing are the Ice Avatar Verse and the Werewolf Behemoth Verse.

    EDIT: Or do you mean have them all at the same time while in the EA?
    Edited by SilverBride on December 10, 2023 7:20PM
    PCNA
  • madman65
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    If I don`t get one at the very first mini then I don`t mess with it. I have had 3 of each and never could get them to activate or maybe the rng was not there. A friend of mine has had these several times so ESO/ZOS needs to fix this as it tends to go toward some not toward all.
  • SilverBride
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    I wish they would increase the rate of these appearing. I am so focused on finding these that it's distracting from just having fun, and very frustrating to end each session with 2 of one or both of these and never finding the 3rd.
    PCNA
  • Erickson9610
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    I had this happen to me one run. I unlocked all three Ferocious Visions within Arc 1.

    oiw3xizoja22.png

    It's a shame that Attuned Enchantments (the first Vision I picked up here) doesn't even work in Werewolf Behemoth form, because weapon enchantments never proc while using the Bestial Transformation Verse.
    Edited by Erickson9610 on December 10, 2023 9:47PM
  • FantasticFreddie
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    I've been trying to get the ww and flame atro morphs for a while.... gotten all 3 visions multiple times but always have to call it quits before I get the verse.
  • SilverBride
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    I finally got 3 Ferocious Visions and found the Werewolf Behemoth Verse twice tonight. Then I found out I need to start from scratch and find all 3 of these every single time to be able to just them and that was the end for me.

    I'll try for the Crystalline for the achievement but that's it. It's just not my idea of a good time.
    Edited by SilverBride on December 11, 2023 2:10AM
    PCNA
  • Erickson9610
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    I finally got 3 Ferocious Visions and found the Werewolf Behemoth Verse twice tonight. Then I found out I need to start from scratch and find all 3 of these every single time to be able to just them and that was the end for me.

    I'll try for the Crystalline for the achievement but that's it. It's just not my idea of a good time.

    Yeah, I initially thought that unlocking the Werewolf Behemoth Verse was permanent. I was disappointed to find out that I have to do it all over again just to have another chance at getting to use it.

    I really just want a permanent Werewolf Behemoth form for as long as players can sustain it, like how Werewolf works...
  • SilverBride
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    After getting the Werewolf Behemoth twice in one session I took a break and came back later and got it again. I was shocked to see one so soon again after all the time it took to get 2 out of the 3 of these so far.

    Well I will keep trying to get the Crystalline ones for the achievement but then I am not going to worry about them any more. It's not worth the frustration.
    PCNA
  • IZZEFlameLash
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    It is very RNG dependent. Sometimes I end up never seeing any of these transformative ones.
    Imperials, the one and true masters of all mortal races of Tamriel
  • dcrush
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    I just got the achievement for defeating Tho’at fifty times, I have the achievement that gives you the “the Endless” title and I have only ever been able to get the iron atro avatar twice. Still never got all three of the ice or ww ones or didn’t get the verse needed for the transformation whenever I did get all three.

    So yeah, I think the rng is horrible. As usual.
  • Necrotech_Master
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    ive had all sorts of RNG with these visions

    ive had runs where ive had 7 or 8 of the 9 set visions before arc 4 and other runs where ive gotten like 3 total by arc 4

    the quickest ive had a set completed was mid arc 2
    plays PC/NA
    handle @Necrotech_Master
    active player since april 2014
  • kojou
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    It took me a few runs to get the achievement for all 3, but you have to get 4 lucky rolls in a run to get to a transformation.

    1. Offensive Vision
    2. Defensive Vision
    3. Utility Vision
    4. Transform Verse

    The reason it is this way is because the transformations are very powerful. When my friend and I are running we refer to the Ice and Fire ones as "I win buttons" because once you get the transformation the synergy basically wipes the board. We never take all three of the Werewolf one because it isn't very good (especially not in later arcs) and when you get it it adds one more thing to the table for your offensive verses. I only did it once for the achievement on a run that I didn't care about the leaderboard on.

    Playing since beta...
  • pklemming
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    You have 4 bosses before each Th'oat, meaning you get 5 visions in each Arc. With the number of possible visions, rng is going to be bad on a single arc. Obviously the further you go, the more chances you get. I usually end up with 2 to 3 of the morphs on each run. The verses for the actual morph are not that bad, as you can get them from every trash and mini event, or even used inventory verses.

    Builds for EA are very important. With a standard PVE build, you may get 1 or 2 arcs down, but after that, lack of resists and health are going to cripple progression. I have 4 builds I use on my Arcanist, changing as I progress through Arcs.
    Edited by pklemming on December 11, 2023 5:15PM
  • boi_anachronism_
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    Good god yes. Ive been through archive countless times to A5-7. Never once collected all of them and gotten the verse. Ive only gotten all the visions for one of them all in one run ever.
  • CGPsaint
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    pklemming wrote: »
    You have 4 bosses before each Th'oat, meaning you get 5 visions in each Arc. With the number of possible visions, rng is going to be bad on a single arc. Obviously the further you go, the more chances you get. I usually end up with 2 to 3 of the morphs on each run. The verses for the actual morph are not that bad, as you can get them from every trash and mini event, or even used inventory verses.

    Builds for EA are very important. With a standard PVE build, you may get 1 or 2 arcs down, but after that, lack of resists and health are going to cripple progression. I have 4 builds I use on my Arcanist, changing as I progress through Arcs.

    I have several sets on my character for progressing through EA, but it's a bit annoying on console since we don't have add-ons like the PC crowd, and we can't use the armory assistant so...
    "Some enjoy bringing grief to others. They remind M'aiq of mudcrabs—horrible creatures, with no redeeming qualities."
  • Theignson
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    Theignson wrote: »
    Has anyone figured out how far you have to get befor eyou have "all" the visions?

    I would guess ARC 18 or so?

    I have the achievements for all the Visions and most Verses and I've not made it past Arc 3 yet. All I am missing are the Ice Avatar Verse and the Werewolf Behemoth Verse.

    EDIT: Or do you mean have them all at the same time while in the EA?

    I mean get them all in one run!
    Five visions per arc, so I'm guessing probably 20 arcs to get them all
    Quakrson, Stam DK, Grand Overlord
    Trackrsen, Stam Warden, Grand Overlord
    Quakrsen, Mag DK, Overlord
    Tolliverson, Stam NB, General
    Farfarel, Stam Necro, Praetorian
    Spencerson, Templar, Prefect
    Phosphorsen, Stam Sorc, Colonel
    Phosphorson, Mag Sorc, Centurion
    Glimson, Arcanist, Major
    All EP/ PC NA
  • LouisaB75
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    I finally got the third avatar last week. I always try to take the avatar visions when they pop up. Though getting three avatar choices at the same time in arc 1 and then none for ages is a pain.
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