Playing a Khajiit in the Ebonheart Pact

Xithian

I was excited when I found out I could play my race of choice in whichever faction I wanted. I still am, and I am having a blast.

However... I recently did the quest line involving the dark elves, the khajiit, and the summoned spirits. There is a fair bit of dialogue during that quest that is completely out of place if you are playing a khajiit. NPCs refer to yourself and the npc khajiit as "you and the cat", implying that I am not a cat myself. They also openly bash on khajiit as a whole, which I am fine with since khajiit get little love from the other races...but they do it all buddy-buddy with you, again ignoring the fact that you yourself are a khajiit.

Rather than speculate on why this dialogue is like this, I'd just like to ask if there will be more situations like this in the future due to NPCs not being prepared to deal with races outside of the norm for your faction. Also, will things like this be smoothed out at some point? With all of the trouble to make sure immersion remains intact in ESO, it was a shame to run into that dialogue.

Brozgar

Yeah, I've came across around such quests too, but as the Dunmer (Ebonheart). It actually was the same with some quests in previous TES games, so I can't say I'm surprised, considering how many quests there are it's probably impossible to make different dialogs for different races everywhere. But completely avoiding direct approach in dialogs could also damage the immersion. That's a tricky task and all the solutions that I can think of have disadvantages that might also damage the immersion.

Nox_Aeterna

Yeap , one of my greatest problems atm. Playing nord in the AD , still thinking about rerolling a high elf.

This is an option given only to people that preorder , guess they did not care about it much.

Alyrn_Grey

There is an odd quest in the EP where if your an argonian it gets a bit surreal as you are asked to intercede between the argonian's and the dark elves because of the issues between them.

Korah_Eaglecry

Xithian wrote: »

I was excited when I found out I could play my race of choice in whichever faction I wanted. I still am, and I am having a blast.

However... I recently did the quest line involving the dark elves, the khajiit, and the summoned spirits. There is a fair bit of dialogue during that quest that is completely out of place if you are playing a khajiit. NPCs refer to yourself and the npc khajiit as "you and the cat", implying that I am not a cat myself. They also openly bash on khajiit as a whole, which I am fine with since khajiit get little love from the other races...but they do it all buddy-buddy with you, again ignoring the fact that you yourself are a khajiit.

Rather than speculate on why this dialogue is like this, I'd just like to ask if there will be more situations like this in the future due to NPCs not being prepared to deal with races outside of the norm for your faction. Also, will things like this be smoothed out at some point? With all of the trouble to make sure immersion remains intact in ESO, it was a shame to run into that dialogue.

Most likely. But this isnt anything new. If you played Skyrim and selected a character that wasnt a Man...You were in for some xenophobic conversations that were laughable considering you could be playing a race the NPCs were talking trash about.

murdurp

i'm in the same boat, basically... i play an orc in the Ebonheart Pact and there is a lot of animosity in NPC dialogue toward the Daggerfall Covenant exclusively for being "filthy orc lovers" and such... like, come on, dude, look who you're talking to... but yeah, as Korah said, it is typical for NPCs to ignore the player character's race. it would probably create way too many new dialogues to write and record for every single NPC reacting to every possible race. (and i had the same confusion in skyrim, playing a khajiit. they never let any khajiit in cities, but for some reason i was instantly granted entrance? sure...)

Gierolf_Whitecoatb16_ESO

you all have to remember, originally the 3 factions WOULDNT HAVE ALL THE RACES IN THEM. and there is supposed to be ANIMOSITY BETWEEN THE RACES. the fact that you have been given the ability to play every race in any faction because you pre-ordered, was due to everyone bitching that one faction would be better then others purely because of racials. so quit yur complaining.

jakenaftalb14a_ESO

I can see how it'd be awkward to play an Orc in the EHP with the racial epitaphs and all. Having played so many MMOs with much less attention to detail (concerning the addressing of players) I'm not so bothered by it here.

Still it's a bit funny

Captainkrunch96

Do you know how hard it was to rp an Indoril? I mean, yeah I was banished, but still, you would think they would remember there cousin or the fact that they are my ancestors too

Thete

I'm going to guess that the facility to play any race in any faction was a decision made to boost sales and came long after the quests were written. The authors of future quests may bear it in mind.

KhaiRul

Captainkrunch96 wrote: »

Do you know how hard it was to rp an Indoril? I mean, yeah I was banished, but still, you would think they would remember there cousin or the fact that they are my ancestors too

Same here. I planned on rolling as Indoril too. RPing as one of their ancestor xD. I guess, we need to wait a while before we're able to play immerse-ly

Wolfster

It's going to happen, you're not a race of that faction and it seems unlikely they were going to have race responsive dialog for each relevant conversation based on an option that only a small minority of players have. They may not even have planned the preorder bonus when the dialog was scripted. I think it's a small price to play to be able to bring your favourite races to whatever faction you like

KhaiRul

Yup. I believe that was the case

Kinsaven

I think giving people the option to play any race in any faction was a bit of a last-minute decision, and thus none of the conversations really match your race if you play any race that doesn't belong in the faction you're in. I play an Altmer in the Ebonheart Pact myself, since most of my friends play there but I really like Altmer.

It feels a bit silly at times, and I do wonder sometimes if I wouldn't have been better off just playing a Nord and creating a High Elf in the AD. The interesting RP opportunities are too great to pass up though.

Xithian

I was mostly interested in seeing where else people had run into this. I understand the reasons that this happens, and I agree that it's probably due to a late design change.

Someone said that they'd have to have dialogue for every race to prevent this but that is untrue. It would only require two separate dialogue options (everyone else/race in question), and only for the parts that directly reference a particular race in such a way that conflicts with common sense as far as the dialogue goes. ("<khajiit player> and the cat...", the nord's pup and cat line)

While it's awesome that there is literally voice acting for every line of dialogue, it makes me wonder if that will hold back changes later due to cost and whatnot. Even Everquest kept track of factions enough to treat characters appropriately in different areas. (You will never know the satisfaction of simply standing in the middle of Freeport as an ogre shadowknight.)

Jeremy

This is one of the biggest issues when you try to program a game with both an immersive story and many customizable features the player can choose for themselves. It becomes an absolute nightmare to manage and to try and keep all of the dialogue tailored for that individual player. There are just so many different variables involved, and I shudder to think of the work load on a game like this that would involve.

iJackyLegz

I wish it was restricted to what race you can choose depending on the alliance chosen. Would be cool, but the majority would rather have free choice.

Beerbong_Ginn

I think originally only Imperials were allowed to choose their alliance.

Mix

I did find it very funny in Stonefalls where you heal the peasants burned by the volcano. The argonian healer asks you to heal them because the dunmer leader doesn't trust argonians. I play as an argonian. (I took it as the dunmer didn't trust the local argonians, and being a foreigner I was ok.)

Gierolf_Whitecoatb16_ESO

Beerbong_Ginn wrote: »

I think originally only Imperials were allowed to choose their alliance.

Originally Imperials were not supposed to be playable period, We knew of the explorer pack race swap before the imperials even. both were added purely as pre-order incentives.

waziban

jakenaftalb14a_ESO wrote: »

I can see how it'd be awkward to play an Orc in the EHP with the racial epitaphs and all. Having played so many MMOs with much less attention to detail (concerning the addressing of players) I'm not so bothered by it here.

Still it's a bit funny

My main is an Orc on EHP. I read off the mean things said about Orcs to my room mates.

Xithian

Mix wrote: »

I did find it very funny in Stonefalls where you heal the peasants burned by the volcano. The argonian healer asks you to heal them because the dunmer leader doesn't trust argonians. I play as an argonian. (I took it as the dunmer didn't trust the local argonians, and being a foreigner I was ok.)

I think that's the one that, somewhere in the dialogue, specifically mentions "because you are an outsider". I know I've run into that somewhere.

Beerbong_Ginn

Gierolf_Whitecoatb16_ESO wrote: »

Beerbong_Ginn wrote: »

I think originally only Imperials were allowed to choose their alliance.

Originally Imperials were not supposed to be playable period, We knew of the explorer pack race swap before the imperials even. both were added purely as pre-order incentives.

Yeah, I remember being bummed that the Imps were non-playable. Glad they offered the option, personally.

mullinsthegreatb14_ESO

I can totally understand where your coming from here, being an altmer in the pact can at times feel . . . Awkward. Still love it though

Mordria

I don't think they originally intended on any race in any faction until people started complaining about the fact that they couldn't do that. Which is why the quest would be like that.

Jice

At first when I saw the Khajiit in Stonefalls as slaves, playing as a Khajiit made it feel pretty awkward. But then talking with the Khajiit fighters guild member who was looking down from a cliff at them saying her heart weaps for them, just reminded me that I too am unique to my race by being in the ebonheart pact to begin with and have to handle the racial slurs that go with it.

It's essentially the same as a grandma going "I'm not racist but..." Someone isn't going to stop hating through biggotry just because they meet one they like. Ask some conservatives with a 'gay friend' about their thoughts on homosexuality and it'll be about the same feeling I get being in the pact.

Xithian

It has nothing to do with the "racist" moments. As I said earlier, I know that khajiit are looked down upon in ES. This is the fourth ES game I've played a khajiit in. I'm talking about the lines of text that make the NPC look mentally handicapped. See someone else's example above, where the NPCs wont deal with argonians but happily accept help from an argonian NPC with no change in dialogue.

Daggers

Mordria wrote: »

I don't think they originally intended on any race in any faction until people started complaining about the fact that they couldn't do that. Which is why the quest would be like that.

This seems to be the case, though I saw it happen first as an Argonian in the Pact... aren't Argonians a Pact race? (not sure as I have the Imperial edition).

Not game breaking, but it's a pretty big slap in the toosh for all the effort gone in to setting it all up.

On another line of thought... don't you get to do the other faction quests as Veteran? Or is that different?

juice2000b16_ESO

Xithian wrote: »

It has nothing to do with the "racist" moments. As I said earlier, I know that khajiit are looked down upon in ES. This is the fourth ES game I've played a khajiit in. I'm talking about the lines of text that make the NPC look mentally handicapped. See someone else's example above, where the NPCs wont deal with argonians but happily accept help from an argonian NPC with no change in dialogue.

Maybe they aren't mentally handicapped their just mocking you to your face like the how in society we see the rich mock the poor directly to their faces. In the EP especially i would expect this, just because the NPC'S ask for your help doesn't mean they like you lol

mikeyyyc_ESO

As a Nord in the Pact, I find it slightly awkward and unfortunately warm, especially in all this heavy armor.

Ratataplan

is this (playing all classes in all alliances) something you can do with normal edition too or with Imperial edition only ?