The play-ability of the tri-focus lightning staff change.

BalticBlues

jaws343 wrote: »

9 years? Oakensoul didn't even exist before a year ago.

If the new Oakensoul Mythic creates a problem, then Oakensoal could be nerfed.

THE ART OF GAME DESIGN MEANS FINE-TUNING.
Especially for a game which is 9 years old.

If Lightning Staff's TRADEMARK bonus for AoE attacks by 5/10% is too strong, it could be nerfed, for example to 3/6%. Entirely killing this CORE functionality, killing an entire play style with ten thousands of customer builds, is not the right way.

ZOS, please respect the game's design and your customers.
This way customers can trust the game and respect you.

markulrich1966

Problem is, that the AOE often saved the ass of casual players.
You want to do worldboss dailies?
It is group content, unfortunately xbox servers are so dead meanwhile, that you often have to solo them. Not even on the long-dead EU, but meanwhile also on NA pretty often.

Problem: soloing a WB, you often don't die by the boss itself, but by the mobs he spawns, like the mudcrabs of Queen of the Reef in Summerset, or the poison spitting nagras of B'Korgen.
With a lightning staff, you can deal with them because of its AOE damage, if that is removed, you are lost.
This is not just inconvenient, it is a total showstopper.

ESO lost 19% players on steam in may, gained 4% with Necrom, and now just lost 3.7% again over the last 30 days.
Fallout76 just gained 30%, becaused they introduced changes to make the content easier. When will ZoS wake up and gain new players again, or keep the old ones?

tim77

i feel you, OP.

i didnt realize until now how dependent I was on that spash damage in overworld to enjoy it.

its just no fun to make ten 3/4 heavy attacks when you have ten mobs around you, instead of one.
this is clearly a nerf on the lower end of the foodchain, and i dont get why, apart from taking fun out of the game.

if this goes life, and i think it will because they just dont care about feedback, then im very likely done with this game for good.

Seraphayel

BalticBlues wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

I really don’t understand the problem.

Have you even cared to read what the OP wrote?
Do you not understand why he and his wife suffer?

The changes do not just adjust values - the changes remove a known core functionality of ESO.
People with builds around this functionality cannot use these builds and gear anymore.

Then they need to adapt and overcome, like everyone does all three months when they release a new update. This is simply how this game works for the last years.

And seriously, suffer? Your reaction just seems way too dramatic and extreme for something that most likely won’t be recognized at all in game unless you‘re staring at DPS meters.

Weckless

Seraphayel wrote: »

I really don’t understand the problem. Content is too easy and mobs die to fast so you don’t get the full channel, yet you need the AoE from Lightning Staff to kill them?

I mean even if you just have 5 bar slots, just slot one AoE ability. That’s basically part of every build or class. Even if I try, I really don’t see any issue here, especially not for the type of content you (OP) do on a frequent basis.

I think the reaction towards the Destruction Staff changes are just too extreme for how minor the real impact (outside of parsing / max DPS) is. No offense, just my take on the entire situation. It‘s not so dramatic.

Nah they ruined inferno too

ADarklore

Here is the problem... ZOS does not like it when the majority of players use a specific skill or specific weapon, so they nerf what is overly used, to try and force players to use something else. They claim it's to make things 'balanced' but it's not, it's simply taking away a choice and forcing us to play, "how ZOS devs want us to play".

I knew this change to Lighting staff would come, because almost every magicka build and even some stamina ones, are based around lighting staff; most of Deltia's builds utilize lightning staff due to the AOE component. So if ZOS sees that everyone is pushing the use of something, they will nerf it to push players into choosing something else or developing a new build. It's been this way for years and years. So again, not a surprise.

BlueRaven

markulrich1966 wrote: »

Problem is, that the AOE often saved the ass of casual players.
You want to do worldboss dailies?
It is group content, unfortunately xbox servers are so dead meanwhile, that you often have to solo them. Not even on the long-dead EU, but meanwhile also on NA pretty often.

Problem: soloing a WB, you often don't die by the boss itself, but by the mobs he spawns, like the mudcrabs of Queen of the Reef in Summerset, or the poison spitting nagras of B'Korgen.
With a lightning staff, you can deal with them because of its AOE damage, if that is removed, you are lost.
This is not just inconvenient, it is a total showstopper.

ESO lost 19% players on steam in may, gained 4% with Necrom, and now just lost 3.7% again over the last 30 days.
Fallout76 just gained 30%, becaused they introduced changes to make the content easier. When will ZoS wake up and gain new players again, or keep the old ones?

Necrom has been pretty devastating to average players. I am actually surprised the drop off isn’t higher. But maybe it’s because the story is actually not bad this time.

In the coming months though, I expect the player base to truly crater. No added content and the constant nerfing to casual players, there is just nothing to do but retread old content. And quite honestly there are better games out there, and this autumn has cyberpunk and starfield.

I too have started playing f76 again as well, and was pleasantly surprised by the changes.

Eso has some dark days ahead.

Suna_Ye_Sunnabe

BlueRaven wrote: »

markulrich1966 wrote: »

Problem is, that the AOE often saved the ass of casual players.
You want to do worldboss dailies?
It is group content, unfortunately xbox servers are so dead meanwhile, that you often have to solo them. Not even on the long-dead EU, but meanwhile also on NA pretty often.

Problem: soloing a WB, you often don't die by the boss itself, but by the mobs he spawns, like the mudcrabs of Queen of the Reef in Summerset, or the poison spitting nagras of B'Korgen.
With a lightning staff, you can deal with them because of its AOE damage, if that is removed, you are lost.
This is not just inconvenient, it is a total showstopper.

ESO lost 19% players on steam in may, gained 4% with Necrom, and now just lost 3.7% again over the last 30 days.
Fallout76 just gained 30%, becaused they introduced changes to make the content easier. When will ZoS wake up and gain new players again, or keep the old ones?

Necrom has been pretty devastating to average players. I am actually surprised the drop off isn’t higher. But maybe it’s because the story is actually not bad this time.

In the coming months though, I expect the player base to truly crater. No added content and the constant nerfing to casual players, there is just nothing to do but retread old content. And quite honestly there are better games out there, and this autumn has cyberpunk and starfield.

I too have started playing f76 again as well, and was pleasantly surprised by the changes.

Eso has some dark days ahead.

I'd like to see the devs actually put their money where their mouth is when it comes to raising the floor, which they've spoken of for years. They actually raised the floor with heavy attacks, successfully, without hurting the ceiling, and now they're kicking the floor down again. Why??

Concerning the speculation that things that are overused in the game always get nerfed, it seems so, but consider this: dual wield has been the highest hitter and has seen the most prominent use since hybridization was introduced. Sets like Relequen are the same. They've been the hardest hitter for years, and now they still are, with LESS alternatives to their playstyles now. The average player cannot make maximum use of these. Lightning staff playstyles did not threaten the supremecy of dual wield medium armour light attack builds. But now staff is being nerfed heavily, while the ceiling remains the same, and dual wield remains the victor in all scenarios. It always comes down to LESS alternatives every patch!

So again I ask you, Zos, to stop kicking the floor down. These changes are going to hurt the player base needlessly and destroy yet more trust in you all.

BlindingBright

The "floor" for DPS should be pegged at HA builds as they are in update 38 with the slight nerf to top end damage it had... and stopped there.

The new "ceiling" should be the arcanist, all dual bar classes need to be elevated to it's level of fun, damage, and playability. Though I 100% expect ZoS to try and nerf the cleave damage of beam builds at some point (again) past crux falling off after 30 seconds... which has already reduced burst AOE dps at the start of encounters in Arenas, Trials, and Dungeon content.

I don't understand ZoS's insistence on adding power creep, only to pull it back... Playing games is supposed to be, largely for many, a power fantasy... Besides PVP issues, there is no real reason(other than sets causing server performance issues) to try and climb back power creep. And it's pretty wild, ZoS gains subs/active players when they introduce new and powerful play style options (Arcanist, HA Builds) but then looses almost as many when they nerf playstyles people enjoyed(Update 35), and especially so when it affects a persons ability to enjoy content(either making it harder to play, or reducing power and increasing encounter length arbitrarily.)

Let me be clear- less than 150 people on PC-NA have a hard mode clear for Veteran Sanity's Edge.... ZoS shouldn't be balancing the game against those people lolol. They've claimed ESO as the "Casual" MMO, then let the power creep rise and let people have fun with insane builds that make completing content "easier" and arguably MORE FUN so more people.... engage in that content.

Suna_Ye_Sunnabe

BlindingBright wrote: »

The "floor" for DPS should be pegged at HA builds as they are in update 38 with the slight nerf to top end damage it had... and stopped there.

The new "ceiling" should be the arcanist, all dual bar classes need to be elevated to it's level of fun, damage, and playability. Though I 100% expect ZoS to try and nerf the cleave damage of beam builds at some point (again) past crux falling off after 30 seconds... which has already reduced burst AOE dps at the start of encounters in Arenas, Trials, and Dungeon content.

I don't understand ZoS's insistence on adding power creep, only to pull it back... Playing games is supposed to be, largely for many, a power fantasy... Besides PVP issues, there is no real reason(other than sets causing server performance issues) to try and climb back power creep. And it's pretty wild, ZoS gains subs/active players when they introduce new and powerful play style options (Arcanist, HA Builds) but then looses almost as many when they nerf playstyles people enjoyed(Update 35), and especially so when it affects a persons ability to enjoy content(either making it harder to play, or reducing power and increasing encounter length arbitrarily.)

Let me be clear- less than 150 people on PC-NA have a hard mode clear for Veteran Sanity's Edge.... ZoS shouldn't be balancing the game against those people lolol. They've claimed ESO as the "Casual" MMO, then let the power creep rise and let people have fun with insane builds that make completing content "easier" and arguably MORE FUN so more people.... engage in that content.

I agree with the "power creep" part. If new content is introduced consistently harder than the previous content, then why would it be an issue? Isn't progression the point of any game? Why is it a problem if more people are clearing years-old content? Who is gatekeeping this??

Until getting people vet trial hardmodes becomes much more commonplace, I don't buy into the current state of "power creep" becoming an issue. It's far more rare than people actually realize.

tsaescishoeshiner

Clarification: Has this made hard content undoable* for you? Or has it just made overland enemies die before the heavy attack finishes?