Pragmatic Fatecarver Shield

BasP

I wouldn't mind having to spend 3 Crux to get the maximum benefit from the shield (from a PvE perspective).

But if it'd really be that problematic in PvP, couldn't the strength just be nerfed with Battle Spirit?

Necrotech_Master

BasP wrote: »

I wouldn't mind having to spend 3 Crux to get the maximum benefit from the shield (from a PvE perspective).

But if it'd really be that problematic in PvP, couldn't the strength just be nerfed with Battle Spirit?

shields are already nerfed with battle spirit (-50%)

some people were showing that you could reach a tooltip of 20k shield with the skill, which would be 10k in pvp due to battle spirit

BasP

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

BasP wrote: »

I wouldn't mind having to spend 3 Crux to get the maximum benefit from the shield (from a PvE perspective).

But if it'd really be that problematic in PvP, couldn't the strength just be nerfed with Battle Spirit?

shields are already nerfed with battle spirit (-50%)

some people were showing that you could reach a tooltip of 20k shield with the skill, which would be 10k in pvp due to battle spirit

Yeah, I meant an additional nerf on top of that. I apologize for not being clear about that.

Sharrum

Make the shield scale the same as dmg does. 33% for every crux consumed. Problem solved.

Tessitura

They just need to not let it scale with weapon/spell damage. Make it act like a normal shield and it will be fine. I have been testing it in pvp and you still get stunned out of it, same in pve. Even with these changes it still leaves you vulnerable to getting cc'ed and burst down.

Those insane shield numbers can only be achieved by going in full stam/medium armor builds. It looks way worse on paper then it actually is in performance. I still think it probably needs to have the w/s damage scaling removed but the shield and interrupt immunity are fine.

As far as the no cost thing goes, my first knee jerk reaction was "Oh no" But now after playing with it and seeing others play with it I am not sure it's the issue I thought it was. You lose a lot of damage in order to make that work, the shield is just not as good as it looks on paper either. People learned real quick to save their stun for when the beam popped and that made the shield a none issue. Sure you could break free and spam the beam but you would find your self stammed out real quick if you kept trying to break free, and without crux building the beam honestly does not do that much damage in pvp.

Arcanist even with these changes is still getting burst down in seconds by other classes. It hasn't made them immortal. I do still think there needs to be some adjustment but I have become less and less worried about this issue the more and more I play the pts.

Even with all that said, their probably needs to be a minimum that the cost can be reduced to on Fatecarver. Or the cost reduction enchants need to be changed to be percent based.

acastanza_ESO

Tessitura wrote: »

Or the cost reduction enchants need to be changed to be percent based.

This would be an excellent change! We constantly see this kind of issue with low cost abilities being made free to cast with cost reduction glyphs. It baffles me that ZOS hasn't done this already.

EramTheLiar

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

Tessitura wrote: »

Or the cost reduction enchants need to be changed to be percent based.

This would be an excellent change! We constantly see this kind of issue with low cost abilities being made free to cast with cost reduction glyphs. It baffles me that ZOS hasn't done this already.

Also, it would made cost reduction enhancements a lot more useful overall. I'd be a lot more willing to slot a % cost reduction on a piece of jewelry than I would a flat 120 magicka or stamina reduction which does effectively nothing for a skill that costs 3k.

Maybe .5% base, 1% green, 1.5% blue, 2% purple, 2.5% gold

TheTuSiK

This skill is going to be problematic. It looks cool in trailers or on paper but due to how the game works it's almost impossible to make everyone happy about it. Either Arcanists will complain about the skill being to easy to interrupt, therefore losing a lot of damage, or everyone else complaining it's too difficult to interrupt. I like how it looks, I like the idea but just like Taylor Swift sings "I knew you were trouble".

Panderbander

EramTheLiar wrote: »

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

Tessitura wrote: »

Or the cost reduction enchants need to be changed to be percent based.

This would be an excellent change! We constantly see this kind of issue with low cost abilities being made free to cast with cost reduction glyphs. It baffles me that ZOS hasn't done this already.

Also, it would made cost reduction enhancements a lot more useful overall. I'd be a lot more willing to slot a % cost reduction on a piece of jewelry than I would a flat 120 magicka or stamina reduction which does effectively nothing for a skill that costs 3k.

Maybe .5% base, 1% green, 1.5% blue, 2% purple, 2.5% gold

Cost reduction on jewelry as a whole is incredibly problematic with it being a flat amount, and I guess ultimately my concern with this ability is really based solely around that. The beam heal becomes free, the beam shield becomes free, and we're already dealing with a ridiculous tank meta on the PVP side of things. This also isn't the first ability to have this problem, the DK ash cloud should never have been capable of becoming a free heal--and I say this as a DK main when I'm not playing werewolf.

This idea is a good one, though. Make it a percent-based reduction instead of flat amounts. That would put it in line with every other cost reduction in the game (Imperial, Breton, Sorc, etc.)

acastanza_ESO

TheTuSiK wrote: »

This skill is going to be problematic. It looks cool in trailers or on paper but due to how the game works it's almost impossible to make everyone happy about it. Either Arcanists will complain about the skill being to easy to interrupt, therefore losing a lot of damage, or everyone else complaining it's too difficult to interrupt. I like how it looks, I like the idea but just like Taylor Swift sings "I knew you were trouble".

The solution is really simple. Arcanist already has a shield in their kit. Rather than giving Fatecarver its own shield just make it uninterruptable when under the effects of the existing arcanist class shield. The core mechanical idea is really good, its just the implementation that was bad.

Zyaneth_Bal

First of all, fatecarver is not even usable in pvp at all as it is now. It’s a dot that doesn’t lock onto a target with a rather narrow aoe, therefore, due to desync it literally does not hit the target with a single tick. Obviously people crying over it haven’t even logged on pts let alone actually tested anything. Secondly, everyone is forgetting battle spirit for some reason, cut all the numbers you get in half. And lastly, an actually practical build that doesn’t have a single purpose of making a screenshot to post on forum, only would result in a 7k-8k shield max which is not that high at all as I’m sure you will all agree and can last 2 low damage skill at best, not to mention arcanist can not use fatecarver right after using runeward because they both consume crux, and casting fatecarver without crux is absolutely pointless due to how low the damage is then. And once again, as I’ve stated in the beginning this discussion is meaningless as the skill has absolutely no use in pvp at all as it is tight now. Please actually test stuff before so heatedly demanding unnecessary changes.

Turtle_Bot

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

TheTuSiK wrote: »

This skill is going to be problematic. It looks cool in trailers or on paper but due to how the game works it's almost impossible to make everyone happy about it. Either Arcanists will complain about the skill being to easy to interrupt, therefore losing a lot of damage, or everyone else complaining it's too difficult to interrupt. I like how it looks, I like the idea but just like Taylor Swift sings "I knew you were trouble".

The solution is really simple. Arcanist already has a shield in their kit. Rather than giving Fatecarver its own shield just make it uninterruptable when under the effects of the existing arcanist class shield. The core mechanical idea is really good, its just the implementation that was bad.

The amount of different changes made to this game over the years that falls under this category is insane....

Way too many changes have been amazing ideas in theory, the implementation however, just completely missed the mark.

As for the anti-interrupt mechanic, I'd like to see it applied to all damage shield abilities while they are active. It would make shields strong, but tbh, the shield mechanics need something at this point with how strong the block mechanic has become over the past few years. It would still have its counter play in hard CCs, so its not like you could just activate hardened ward and become CC immune permanently and tbh this interrupt immunity being added to all shield abilities would go a long way to solving sorcs healing issues in PvP without actually buffing any of sorcs heals (which for some reason so many are against).

Having this mechanic on all damage shields while they are active would also allow for more abilities and even sets to be balanced by adding cast/channel times to them/their procs to balance their high power without directly nerfing their power altogether.

TheTuSiK

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

TheTuSiK wrote: »

This skill is going to be problematic. It looks cool in trailers or on paper but due to how the game works it's almost impossible to make everyone happy about it. Either Arcanists will complain about the skill being to easy to interrupt, therefore losing a lot of damage, or everyone else complaining it's too difficult to interrupt. I like how it looks, I like the idea but just like Taylor Swift sings "I knew you were trouble".

The solution is really simple. Arcanist already has a shield in their kit. Rather than giving Fatecarver its own shield just make it uninterruptable when under the effects of the existing arcanist class shield. The core mechanical idea is really good, its just the implementation that was bad.

I don't think it's a good idea. Imagine if, for example, DK's standard was killable and only immune while you have DK's shield on you. It requires not only an extra slot but one more skill to use. Same could be applied to other classes in one way or another (killable pets on sorc, Warden, necro, nightblade, interruptable beam on templar). Besides, you can still destroy that shield and interrupt Arcanist, it's an easy target since it's at least 4.5s channeled skill and the shield can't be refreshed without recasting it.

Daggerfell0929

Just make the shield a flat value ( like 5 or 10 k) and it cannot be increased by any means