Nerf assassins will

OBJnoob

@Tommy_The_Gun
I put a melee magblade build together recently. For the record I'm not a very good magblade... But hitting 20+k bows isn't hard. I hit several in the 3 days I was playing it. Max was like 26k I think. And I suppose it's easy to say "well those were squishy targets... Those were bad players," but they were the same random assortment of players I see when I'm on any other character as well. And none of my other characters hit nearly that hard. Like not even 50%.

@ketsparrowhawk You had me for a second. I gave you an awesome but then took it back because I realized you were being facetious LOL.

I sort've see what you're saying about NB burst but also kinda still see it my way. On one hand-- your hand-- NBs have no delayed burst ability so it's difficult for them to create burst without an ultimate and 5 stacks. On the other hand-- their ultimate is very cheap and the condition for building stacks isn't that great.

Ultimately I disagree for one real reason and one hypothetical reason. The real reason is that Concealed hits for like 6 or 9k by itself... So they are capable of pressure if they so choose. The hypothetical reason is that they could have more pressure if they wanted to. They could use ele sus, they could use Debilitate, they could use poisons, they could use proc sets. The ONLY reason why they don't is because they don't have to.

It's kinda funny, really. Templars are one-trick-ponies right now. So are NBs. Templars don't like their trick so they are unhappy. NBs love their trick and refuse to learn any others. The less funny part of the joke is that Templars would love some more tricks but don't have any. NBs call Major Berserk and Major Cowardice trash and not worth a bar slot.

Edited to finish the funny joke: Templars got their old trick replaced with a new trick. NBs have had the same trick for 5+ years.

Finedaible

The only players I manage to kill with Assassin's Will alone are the new players that don't have any semblance of a pvp build. Tanks can usually shrug it off even if they do get hit. It's bad enough that there is an addon which detects and tell players to dodge an incoming Assassin's Will proc or Teleport Strike. I really wish they would do something to nuke that addon from orbit.

MEBengalsFan2001

How about AW damage is based on the damage of the five light attacks. If AW and all five light attacks hit the same target AW gets a boost to its damage done to that target. This way in PVE if you are fighting a boss you get some bonus damage, maybe even a boost to its current total damage potential. In PVP it would do less damage due to the 5 light attacks having reduced damage and than AW also getting reduced damage. This would be a way to balance out AW without killing it in PVE.

Mayrael

20k bow means you would receive around 10k damage from any regular spamable and that's a fact. If you receive such damage from regular spamable you should be more focused on improving your build than on nerfing other classes.

Maybe just maybe get a PvP build... OP joined march 2022 so for me it's a very fresh player and that's the reason of this whole thread. I played mag sorc for years, yes the class is not what it used to be but NB is also only a shadow of past glory.

Solariken

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

Imo the issue with NB's is that their defensive kit is WAY too good for a class than can turn invisible on demand and has the burst potential they have. Their combo SHOULD hit hard but that should come at the expense of survivability and right now that just isn't the case.

100% this.

I've always said that nightblade should not have Major Resolve or the max health bonus passive in its class kit.

Nightblade should be the highest risk and highest reward class IMO.

Caribou77

Assassin's Will is overtuned.

Fix Lingering Flare and Inner Light so that NBs cannot immediately return to cloak when they are revealed. The skills state: "...exposed enemies cannot return to stealth or invisibility for 4 seconds." But that doesn't happen. They re-cloak immediately after being revealed, all of the time.

I posted a thread about this on Bug Reports a few weeks ago. Not a single NB commented. Stealthy indeed.

Panderbander

40k HP, 30k resistances, still got 3 tapped. Yes, I know how to dodge and block.

Turtle_Bot

MurkyWetWolf198 wrote: »

Honestly, the best solution I can think of is to make the buff from Concealed count as Major Berserk, so it can't stack with stuff like Sea-Serpent's (Hence nerfing the total damage done by 10%). It would remove synergy with the set Kinras for PvE, but Pillar is already better usually. After that, increasing all player's base-critical resistance would be quite beneficial, or just giving more classes access to a crit resistance buff.

I am tired of all of the nerfs to classes, why don't we counter Nightblade's power by buffing other classes to fight back?

honestly just do this, make the concealed buff into major berserk so it doesn't stack and that would be enough. Still very strong, but not overtuned.

And completely agree, DK already matches NB for overall power, wardens do currently (for pvp) but are getting nerfed a bit, meanwhile sorcs, plars and cros just can't catch a break at the moment. Bring those 3 up to the same level as DK/NB and don't take wardens down.

Turtle_Bot

Mayrael wrote: »

20k bow means you would receive around 10k damage from any regular spamable and that's a fact. If you receive such damage from regular spamable you should be more focused on improving your build than on nerfing other classes.

Maybe just maybe get a PvP build... OP joined march 2022 so for me it's a very fresh player and that's the reason of this whole thread. I played mag sorc for years, yes the class is not what it used to be but NB is also only a shadow of past glory.

Question, is that "joined the forums or joined the game?

If you're basing them being a new player just because they only recently joined the forums, you're going to be way off there.

Next, a 20k bow is very common right now, especially on PC NA but even on other servers where players are generally tankier, with all of the unique passive bonuses to damage that NB gets, bow hits (especially crits) insanely hard even if its tooltip at rest is nothing to write home about.
Spec bows generally get the following buffs to their at rest tooltip which is about 1.5 times higher at base than all other delayed burst in the game:
+20% from incap
+10% from concealed
+10% from sea serpents major berserk
+430 base weapon/spell damage from major courage
+300 base weapon/spell damage from the stacks
+20% from major sorcery/brutality
+10% from minor sorcery/brutality (not as common, but still there if they are grouped with DK or plar)
+215 base weapon/spell damage from minor courage
+5% from minor berserk (camo hunter)

That's a total of +945 raw weapon/spell damage (translates to roughly +34% not counting the extra scaling this raw damage gives to the other percentage modifiers) with additional +65-75% from percentage modifiers and this is all before accounting for crit modifiers which many raise to near cap being a +125% damage increase.

On an ability that tooltips at rest for 10k (pretty standard for other class burst abilities, while NB tooltip at rest for generally 13k+ AW) that is going to be 21k tool tip easily when buffed up (which it is when it is used) which if that crits at/near the 125% crit damage cap is essentially a 47k tooltip on assassins will if it had the same damage as other regular "delayed burst" abilities.

Assuming 30k resistances (45% mitigation), no breach, no pen and base crit resist (20% mitigation) it will hit for nearly 21k (20.79k) in actual damage against someone who is not blocking the ability (i.e. if they are stunned from incap/off balance medium weave etc).

In saying this, I don't think the ability itself should get nerfed, simply make concealed weapons bonus into the named buff major berserk to prevent it stacking with all the other buffs and this will bring it back into line with other burst.

Panderbander

It needs some sort of counter play that isn't just dodge it. The damage number itself isn't necessarily a problem but the abruptness of that damage and the utility and output provided by the rest of the NB kit makes it so it's difficult to recover from a single missed dodge (or latency hiccup). Spread the damage out over a second or two with multiple smaller shots, turn it into a five second or so DOT, make your next few light attacks hit for extra damage after firing it, etc. There's so many options to fix this so it can be properly (and enjoyably) played with and against without nerfing its damage potential.

The_Titan_Tim

Panderbander wrote: »

It needs some sort of counter play that isn't just dodge it. The damage number itself isn't necessarily a problem but the abruptness of that damage and the utility and output provided by the rest of the NB kit makes it so it's difficult to recover from a single missed dodge (or latency hiccup). Spread the damage out over a second or two with multiple smaller shots, turn it into a five second or so DOT, make your next few light attacks hit for extra damage after firing it, etc. There's so many options to fix this so it can be properly (and enjoyably) played with and against without nerfing its damage potential.

As I mentioned in the Molten Whip thread, adding visuals that are actually visible, to players when they have burst moves chambered would be a massive step in the right direction for combat in ESO.

Damage doesn’t need to be adjusted, the ability to see when massive damage is waiting without having to play an internal number game in your head or in first person to hyper focus on slightly glowing eyes, would be a step in the right direction… because when you’re getting jumped on by multiple people, all those tiny “visual” cues go right out the window.

AndreNoir

The_Titan_Tim wrote: »

Shadowy Disguise should have a stacking cost like Streak

On top of an unblockable aoe stun with a damage u mean, right ?

TechMaybeHic

Panderbander wrote: »

40k HP, 30k resistances, still got 3 tapped. Yes, I know how to dodge and block.

No investment in crit resist. Surprised it took 3

Meanwhile, meta sets like Rallying Cry and Maras give some crit resist. Not sure why people chose to ignore it altogether and sit at base, then blame abilities being OP.

I've been against an AW nerf and for toning down their damage buffs of soul harvest and hidden; but as I see this, I am really feeling it's more on the targets.

Overamera

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

40k HP, 30k resistances, still got 3 tapped. Yes, I know how to dodge and block.

No investment in crit resist. Surprised it took 3

Meanwhile, meta sets like Rallying Cry and Maras give some crit resist. Not sure why people chose to ignore it altogether and sit at base, then blame abilities being OP.

I've been against an AW nerf and for toning down their damage buffs of soul harvest and hidden; but as I see this, I am really feeling it's more on the targets.

This is what I mean by we are forced to run meta sets like rallying. As a magsorc who likes to run shield builds im forced to run magicka sets for big shields. But since everyone is playing nb im in a bad spot. And all it takes is for me to not dodge one well timed bow and im down to 5% hp. And with the healing they have it would take 500 overload to have pressure on them.

TechMaybeHic

Overamera wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

40k HP, 30k resistances, still got 3 tapped. Yes, I know how to dodge and block.

No investment in crit resist. Surprised it took 3

Meanwhile, meta sets like Rallying Cry and Maras give some crit resist. Not sure why people chose to ignore it altogether and sit at base, then blame abilities being OP.

I've been against an AW nerf and for toning down their damage buffs of soul harvest and hidden; but as I see this, I am really feeling it's more on the targets.

This is what I mean by we are forced to run meta sets like rallying. As a magsorc who likes to run shield builds im forced to run magicka sets for big shields. But since everyone is playing nb im in a bad spot. And all it takes is for me to not dodge one well timed bow and im down to 5% hp. And with the healing they have it would take 500 overload to have pressure on them.

You don't have to use those though. Impen trait is there. I'm CP, there is a star. There are other sets with crit resist. And those resistances were applied to shields as well so effectively adds shield strength albeit not in it's tooltip.

Panderbander

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

40k HP, 30k resistances, still got 3 tapped. Yes, I know how to dodge and block.

No investment in crit resist. Surprised it took 3

Meanwhile, meta sets like Rallying Cry and Maras give some crit resist. Not sure why people chose to ignore it altogether and sit at base, then blame abilities being OP.

I've been against an AW nerf and for toning down their damage buffs of soul harvest and hidden; but as I see this, I am really feeling it's more on the targets.

I took a 23k spec bow last night while solo with Rallying Cry procced. That's an invalid argument.

Panderbander

The_Titan_Tim wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

It needs some sort of counter play that isn't just dodge it. The damage number itself isn't necessarily a problem but the abruptness of that damage and the utility and output provided by the rest of the NB kit makes it so it's difficult to recover from a single missed dodge (or latency hiccup). Spread the damage out over a second or two with multiple smaller shots, turn it into a five second or so DOT, make your next few light attacks hit for extra damage after firing it, etc. There's so many options to fix this so it can be properly (and enjoyably) played with and against without nerfing its damage potential.

As I mentioned in the Molten Whip thread, adding visuals that are actually visible, to players when they have burst moves chambered would be a massive step in the right direction for combat in ESO.

That, too, would be useful for adding counterplay. I would be in favor of adding more visual indication that a big burst is ready to be dropped.

TechMaybeHic

Panderbander wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

40k HP, 30k resistances, still got 3 tapped. Yes, I know how to dodge and block.

No investment in crit resist. Surprised it took 3

Meanwhile, meta sets like Rallying Cry and Maras give some crit resist. Not sure why people chose to ignore it altogether and sit at base, then blame abilities being OP.

I've been against an AW nerf and for toning down their damage buffs of soul harvest and hidden; but as I see this, I am really feeling it's more on the targets.

I took a 23k spec bow last night while solo with Rallying Cry procced. That's an invalid argument.

Not really because I didn't say that was a counter alone, and this is a rather anecdotal comment without context. Most I've been hit for with it was 17k, but I knew I let my buffs fall off and just had impen gear

Panderbander

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

40k HP, 30k resistances, still got 3 tapped. Yes, I know how to dodge and block.

No investment in crit resist. Surprised it took 3

Meanwhile, meta sets like Rallying Cry and Maras give some crit resist. Not sure why people chose to ignore it altogether and sit at base, then blame abilities being OP.

I've been against an AW nerf and for toning down their damage buffs of soul harvest and hidden; but as I see this, I am really feeling it's more on the targets.

I took a 23k spec bow last night while solo with Rallying Cry procced. That's an invalid argument.

Not really because I didn't say that was a counter alone, and this is a rather anecdotal comment without context. Most I've been hit for with it was 17k, but I knew I let my buffs fall off and just had impen gear

It was a similar load out as far as resists go. Buffs were up at the time. Crit resist doesn't help as much as people claim it does. The problem is in the ability.

The_Titan_Tim

AndreNoir wrote: »

The_Titan_Tim wrote: »

Shadowy Disguise should have a stacking cost like Streak

On top of an unblockable aoe stun with a damage u mean, right ?

No. Streak received the stacking cost back in 2015 because it was too evasive, like Roll Dodge, a player could become a massive troll with it.

For some weird reason, Shadowy Disguise and Mirror Image, two equally if not more, evasive abilities, avoided that change.

Edit; not to mention, Major Resolve and a guaranteed crit in the right hands every time you hit Shadowy is 1,000x more deadly than an unblockable stun.

TechMaybeHic

Panderbander wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

40k HP, 30k resistances, still got 3 tapped. Yes, I know how to dodge and block.

No investment in crit resist. Surprised it took 3

Meanwhile, meta sets like Rallying Cry and Maras give some crit resist. Not sure why people chose to ignore it altogether and sit at base, then blame abilities being OP.

I've been against an AW nerf and for toning down their damage buffs of soul harvest and hidden; but as I see this, I am really feeling it's more on the targets.

I took a 23k spec bow last night while solo with Rallying Cry procced. That's an invalid argument.

Not really because I didn't say that was a counter alone, and this is a rather anecdotal comment without context. Most I've been hit for with it was 17k, but I knew I let my buffs fall off and just had impen gear

It was a similar load out as far as resists go. Buffs were up at the time. Crit resist doesn't help as much as people claim it does. The problem is in the ability.

Your screen shot says 2/4 crits to hits on it. I'm still not familiar with what those display but it seems the average is 12k so non crit would be maybe around 9k rough estimate. I'd say a 12k difference matters.

Add in that we don't see if breach was involved, or stuhns was used although I doubt it, as this seems like a crit modified build, but we don't know what part of your 3k resists are. We also don't see if you had minor protection or other, non armor mitigation. And I'm not sure where your healing is with high health and low damage and stam/mag but I assume a warden maybe? To which AW is a projectile and Wardens do have a tool for that

Like I said with my anecdotal evidence example about what I got hit for; we miss a lot of context and it would seem decisions were made that do not adequately protect yourself. No blame, as we can't do everything; but I just don't see the argument from the outcome of our decisions to ask for nerfs.

Now; if you want to go into NBs now having extra damage modifiers no one else has, and now has a burst heal and defense to rival anyone else, while still having access to the best evasive tools and can manage to opt to not even use and still be successful; I'm all ears. But I think given what class it is, it shouldn't be their damage.

Panderbander

Well like I said, I don't want the damage nerfed, I would just ask it to be spread out slightly. For other classes this other damage is via other abilities. For NB, it's all packed into this one instant roughly every five seconds and while seeing big numbers pop up is great for the endorphins it's not great gameplay overall for either party. For the one receiving it, it feels bad to go from full health to dead in the space of two seconds from a single player and for the nightblade it feels bad when you dump all your damage into one ability and it's just dodged.

The survivability and utility NB has is absolutely a problem in conjunction with the damage of spec bow. I find them tankier then most others and that just makes it feel that much worse when you've been chipping away at one for several minutes just to suddenly be oopsied to death.

Overamera

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Overamera wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

40k HP, 30k resistances, still got 3 tapped. Yes, I know how to dodge and block.

No investment in crit resist. Surprised it took 3

Meanwhile, meta sets like Rallying Cry and Maras give some crit resist. Not sure why people chose to ignore it altogether and sit at base, then blame abilities being OP.

I've been against an AW nerf and for toning down their damage buffs of soul harvest and hidden; but as I see this, I am really feeling it's more on the targets.

This is what I mean by we are forced to run meta sets like rallying. As a magsorc who likes to run shield builds im forced to run magicka sets for big shields. But since everyone is playing nb im in a bad spot. And all it takes is for me to not dodge one well timed bow and im down to 5% hp. And with the healing they have it would take 500 overload to have pressure on them.

You don't have to use those though. Impen trait is there. I'm CP, there is a star. There are other sets with crit resist. And those resistances were applied to shields as well so effectively adds shield strength albeit not in it's tooltip.

Im already using impen traits

Jammy420

Wear more armor and use damage reduction stars from CP.

StaticWave

NB is overperforming but you're asking for the wrong nerfs. Assassin's Will does not need a nerf. These are the changes that need to happen:

1) Remove 10% unnamed damage done from Concealed Weapon
2) Remove 100% dodge cost reduction from Phantasmal Escape
3) Increase base crit resist again, or make it harder to stack crit damage
4) Remove other sources of survivability for NB now that they have a burst heal

10% damage done from Concealed Weapon buffs everything in NB's kit. Combined with low base crit resistance and easy access to crit damage, a NB can easily stack high crit rate and reach the crit damage cap of 125%.

66 crit resist = 1% crit damage mitigation. Do the math and we need around 8250 crit resist to nullify a 125% crit damage NB. Most builds struggle to even reach 4k crit resist. An average build with Rallying Cry usually sits at 3.5k crit resist, which is about 53% crit damage mitigation. That means you're still taking 72% more crit damage, almost 3 times the potency of old Malacath. A non crit bow proc that hits you for 7k will now crit for 12k if you have 3.5k crit resist. If you don't use Rallying Cry and have all impen traits, you will take 94% extra crit damage. A 7k non crit bow proc will now crit for 13.5k damage.

In reality, this 7k value is lowballed. Most NBs can easily hit 9k-10k non crit bow procs before Incap because of Conceal's 10% damage buff, full pen (it's very easy to stack pen on NB), and Vulnerability/Berserk. Using the same crit resistance values, a 9k non crit bow proc will now deal 15.4k crit damage on a 3.5k crit resist build, and 17.4k crit damage on a build with all impen but no Rallying. If you have ZERO impen and no crit resist sets, you will be sitting at 1320 crit resistance, or 20% crit damage mitigation. You would be taking a 18.4k crit bow proc.

Most NBs hitting those crazy 20k bow procs are have reached the crit damage cap and were fighting people with only base crit resist. If you were in Rallying Cry and still took a 20k bow, then the NB was in a high damage build and had a bunch of extra debuffs on you.

It's actually really easy to stack crit damage on a NB while also having decent offensive stats before doing real investments. Base crit damage is 50%, then add 12% from Khajiit, 11% from shadow mundus, 10% from 5 medium, 8% from Fighting Finesse , 10% from NB passive, and 10% from Minor Force. That's 50% + 12% + 11% + 10% + 8% + 10% + 10% = 111%. Now add a crit set like Order's Wrath, a few divine pieces, and you've pretty much reached the crit damage cap with a little bit of investment.

The other issue is Phantasmal Escape. It gives you 10% cost reduction every time you take direct damage and can stack every half second. Basically, a single light attack will give you 10% cost reduction for roll dodge, giving it a 100% up time because you're always taking light attack damage. After 1 second, you will have 20% dodge cost reduction, equivalent to 3 pieces of well-fitted. This lets you drop well-fitted for more divines to increase your crit damage modifier. This ability also gives you Major Evasion, one of the best dmg mitigation ability in the game. It's too stacked of a defensive ability.

After getting a burst heal, NB needs to have Cloak/Shadow Image looked at. The class just has everything defensively at this point. It has slipperiness (Cloak/Shadow Image), mobility (Major Minor Expedition), and tankiness (Phantasmal Escape/burst heal/other HoTs). One of these 3 has to go.

I would say address these 4 points first. NB was never an issue before ZOS gave them these buffs. Do that and we won't see anymore complaints about NB being too strong.

OBJnoob

@StaticWave agree with most of what you said but not increase everyone's base crit resist again. If a suggestion like this is what comes to mind then we do in fact need to nerf NB damage.

I can get on board, overall, with the mentality that NB should be an offensive powerhouse at the expense of defensive capabilities. But when we decide EVERYBODY else needs more innate defense just to deal with it then we have obviously crossed a line that we should not have crossed.

This isn't NBs -v- everyone else. Wardens still fight DKs. DKs still fight sorcs. Sorcs still fight templars. And we still have a tank meta, with more sets every day offering crit resist. The answer is NOT buff defense.

AndreNoir

The_Titan_Tim wrote: »

AndreNoir wrote: »

The_Titan_Tim wrote: »

Shadowy Disguise should have a stacking cost like Streak

On top of an unblockable aoe stun with a damage u mean, right ?

No. Streak received the stacking cost back in 2015 because it was too evasive, like Roll Dodge, a player could become a massive troll with it.

For some weird reason, Shadowy Disguise and Mirror Image, two equally if not more, evasive abilities, avoided that change.
.

It's weird reason called "tons of counters". You can come back with all of yours qq right after adding potion/set/skill that will turn off your streak completely

StaticWave wrote: »

NB is overperforming but you're asking for the wrong nerfs. Assassin's Will does not need a nerf. These are the changes that need to happen:

1) Remove 10% unnamed damage done from Concealed Weapon
2) Remove 100% dodge cost reduction from Phantasmal Escape
3) Increase base crit resist again, or make it harder to stack crit damage
4) Remove other sources of survivability for NB now that they have a burst heal

Next time just post: 1-4) nerf it back to unplayable trash

KingLewie_III

AndreNoir wrote: »

The_Titan_Tim wrote: »

AndreNoir wrote: »

The_Titan_Tim wrote: »

Shadowy Disguise should have a stacking cost like Streak

On top of an unblockable aoe stun with a damage u mean, right ?

No. Streak received the stacking cost back in 2015 because it was too evasive, like Roll Dodge, a player could become a massive troll with it.

For some weird reason, Shadowy Disguise and Mirror Image, two equally if not more, evasive abilities, avoided that change.
.

It's weird reason called "tons of counters". You can come back with all of yours qq right after adding potion/set/skill that will turn off your streak completely

StaticWave wrote: »

NB is overperforming but you're asking for the wrong nerfs. Assassin's Will does not need a nerf. These are the changes that need to happen:

1) Remove 10% unnamed damage done from Concealed Weapon
2) Remove 100% dodge cost reduction from Phantasmal Escape
3) Increase base crit resist again, or make it harder to stack crit damage
4) Remove other sources of survivability for NB now that they have a burst heal

Next time just post: 1-4) nerf it back to unplayable trash

When was nightblade "unplayable trash"? It's been a top 3 class in almost every meta in the last 5 years. If you want unplayable trash, go get on Necro, Sorc, or Templar.

StaticWave

AndreNoir wrote: »

The_Titan_Tim wrote: »

AndreNoir wrote: »

The_Titan_Tim wrote: »

Shadowy Disguise should have a stacking cost like Streak

On top of an unblockable aoe stun with a damage u mean, right ?

No. Streak received the stacking cost back in 2015 because it was too evasive, like Roll Dodge, a player could become a massive troll with it.

For some weird reason, Shadowy Disguise and Mirror Image, two equally if not more, evasive abilities, avoided that change.
.

It's weird reason called "tons of counters". You can come back with all of yours qq right after adding potion/set/skill that will turn off your streak completely

StaticWave wrote: »

NB is overperforming but you're asking for the wrong nerfs. Assassin's Will does not need a nerf. These are the changes that need to happen:

1) Remove 10% unnamed damage done from Concealed Weapon
2) Remove 100% dodge cost reduction from Phantasmal Escape
3) Increase base crit resist again, or make it harder to stack crit damage
4) Remove other sources of survivability for NB now that they have a burst heal

Next time just post: 1-4) nerf it back to unplayable trash

Still saw many stamblades 1vXing in cyrodiil before the unnecessary buffs. Was the class trash or were the players complaining not at the required skill level to play it efficiently?

The_Titan_Tim

AndreNoir wrote: »

The_Titan_Tim wrote: »

AndreNoir wrote: »

The_Titan_Tim wrote: »

Shadowy Disguise should have a stacking cost like Streak

On top of an unblockable aoe stun with a damage u mean, right ?

No. Streak received the stacking cost back in 2015 because it was too evasive, like Roll Dodge, a player could become a massive troll with it.

For some weird reason, Shadowy Disguise and Mirror Image, two equally if not more, evasive abilities, avoided that change.
.

It's weird reason called "tons of counters". You can come back with all of yours qq right after adding potion/set/skill that will turn off your streak completely

Having potions and abilities pull from stealth is what most would consider a bandaid fix to the problem, implemented back when Shieldbreaker still existed.

Players should not have to cater their potions, abilities, or sets to have to deal with 1/6 classes, as it’s the only class with such a demand.

If stacking cost increases were to be implemented, those “counters” that don’t come attached to every build could go, and that’s fine. There is no potion or ability to interrupt the Mirrage Image & Shadowy Disguise interaction from MagBlade. A good one will quite literally never die while weaving in the best bursts in the game.

Let’s not play pretend that it’s fine; or that it’s not overperforming. Nightblades are a difficult class to learn, but once mastered they are extremely problematic to the overall balance of this game.

Edit; any gap closer in the game turns off Streak completely, my class has a built-in one with Toppling Charge, yours too w/Ambush.