Mara's Only PART of the Problem
fripplethorn
✭✭✭
So, this is the most boring and uninviting PvP "meta" since I've been playing the game. And it's not just because of the idiotic Mara's set. Yes, that set is a farce, and should never have made it to Live (especially with all the warnings and evidence presented to Zos during the PTS). But mitigation and healing are absolutely laughable in the current state of Cyrodiil PvP. Solo heals are way overtuned, and "troll" block tanks make up more than half of the "participants" in any given battle. Literally an entire EP guild in the NA/Grayhost campaign is made up of nearly unkillable blockbots just taking down doors and/or burning siege. It should be embarrassing for them as supposed PvP players; and more importantly embarrassing for Zos for allowing this kind of loophole to exist this far into the life of a game.
When the servers were replaced, the queues shot up to prohibitive numbers, but people still sat for an hour in order to finally play the game as intended. And now, there's no queue at all. It's not because Zos suddenly upped the threshold of players in a given campaign, nope. It's because fewer and fewer people are willing to put up with this drudgery.
Point fingers at Mara's all you want. It's a joke. But until Zos addresses the real issue, this will get worse and worse as these kids play Tag Simulator instead of actually engaging in PvP.
When the servers were replaced, the queues shot up to prohibitive numbers, but people still sat for an hour in order to finally play the game as intended. And now, there's no queue at all. It's not because Zos suddenly upped the threshold of players in a given campaign, nope. It's because fewer and fewer people are willing to put up with this drudgery.
Point fingers at Mara's all you want. It's a joke. But until Zos addresses the real issue, this will get worse and worse as these kids play Tag Simulator instead of actually engaging in PvP.
19
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OrlaxxSoul ShrivenNumbers dropping noticeably on NA GH. Who wants to play in this environment?
As our keep was being sieged, I found a guy firing a meatbag up on the walls. My NB burst him with about 50k straight out. He glanced at me and continued firing his meatbag. I dumped another 100k or so on him with same result. Granted he could not hurt me at all but this is stupid.
6 -
xxslam48xxb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭People won't want to hear it, but dying is an important and healthy part of competitive pvp. When dying becomes impossible in 1v1 scenarios how are you supposed to figure out who is the better pvper? What is the point of competing if it always is a stalemate?
Zos please play your own game. If you want I can bring you on a grand tour and show you the absolute state of ruin Cyrodiil is in. Ill bring you to the ball groups and let you attempt to kill them for an hour. Then we will stop by the lovely resource towers and ill introduce you to the tower "lovers" who make their home inside them(watch out they bring friends). Ill stand by the flag and let you evict them since this is clearly a part of your "vision" for pvp and you should easily be able to handle them without my help. Finally we will meet face to face with the OAKEN MARA KNIGHT, supreme lord of pvp and skill. I think if you come on this tour with me you will know exactly what to fix next patch.Edited by xxslam48xxb14_ESO on September 5, 2022 6:38PMI wrote a poem that I titled, "The ganker's delight."
As you lay upon the ground, cry not little pawn.
The pain will pass as quickly as my blade did take you,
but my delight will last and you will respawn.
My heart simply cannot contain my joy, when I ply my trade.
The fault lies with you, your skill was lacking.
Now your salt is mine forever, can't you hear the laughing?
Once you were so proud and now you are reduced to this.
A miserable, loud deuced fool.
With every tear you drip, with every excuse you let slip.
All of your insecurities and worries bring a smile to my lip.
From your despair I have ripped endless glories,
but our affair is over now. Be afraid for I will return for more.
I have received many titles, to my allies I am The sniper Emperor and Grand champion hero of the Pact. However these titles mean little to me, it is the ones given to me by my victims that I prefer. To them I am "Xv1er", "trash", "no balls", "zerger", "noob", "cringe", "no skill", "camper", "100% new", "the reason this game is dying", "pathetic", "a sack of piece of [snip]", "mediocre", "absolute inbred", "beyond a virgin", "ganky dork", "fat smelly 40yr old virgin", "little girl", "daddy", "exploiting loser", and every [snipped] word known to man.20 -
Ralamil✭✭✭✭The other part of the problem is the [snip] devs who, time and again, keep doubling down on the idea that a player's sets need to do all the work for them.
[snip]
[edited for bashing]Edited by ZOS_Icy on November 12, 2022 5:30PMKarn Wild-Blood - PC NA AD Nord Warden23 -
Rhaegar75✭✭✭✭✭xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »People won't want to hear it, but dying is an important and healthy part of competitive pvp. When dying becomes impossible in 1v1 scenarios how are you supposed to figure out who is the better pvper? What is the point of competing if it always is a stalemate?
Zos please play your own game. If you want I can bring you on a grand tour and show you the absolute state of ruin Cyrodiil is in. Ill bring you to the ball groups and let you attempt to kill them for an hour. Then we will stop by the lovely resource towers and ill introduce you to the tower "lovers" who make their home inside them(watch out they bring friends). Ill stand by the flag and let you evict them since this is clearly a part of your "vision" for pvp and you should easily be able to handle them without my help. Finally we will meet face to face with the OAKEN MARA KNIGHT, supreme lord of pvp and skill. I think if you come on this tour with me you will know exactly what to fix next patch.
I could not agree more with what you said: you summarized well the current poor state of PvP.
When palyers are not killable and this is happening in PvP the game has a problem....it's boring!!
But when you discover that their immortality is mostly related to sets and game flaws then you know that the issues are terribly serious.
Mind you I know a lot of very strong PvPer who can be extremely successful without having to platy troll tank like builds.9 -
Idinuse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It's at a comedy high atm in Cyrodiil.
You have hoards of unkillable players seemingly taking no damage at all (or CC for that matter) simply walking up to every siege engine during a siege and burning them again and again and again while their group mates pour CCs and set procs all over the place.
It is making a farce of "Player versus Player" gameplay in TESO.
Edited by Idinuse on September 6, 2022 9:45AMSed ut perspiciatis unde omnis iste natus error sit voluptatem accusantium dolorem que laudantium, totam rem aperiam, eaque ipsa quae ab illo inventore veritatis et quasi architecto beatae vitae dicta sunt explicabo. Nemo enim ipsam voluptatem quia voluptas sit aspernatur aut odit aut fugit, sed quia consequuntur magni dolores eos qui ratione voluptatem sequi nesciunt. Neque porro quisquam est, qui dolorem ipsum quia dolor sit amet, consectetur, adipisci velit, sed quia non numquam eius modi tempora incidunt ut labore et dolore magnam aliquam quaerat voluptatem. Ut enim ad minima veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullam corporis suscipit laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur? Quis autem vel eum iure reprehenderit qui in ea voluptate velit esse quam nihil molestiae consequatur, vel illum qui dolorem eum fugiat quo voluptas nulla pariatur?10 -
Ragnaroek93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭It has been like this for years. In 1v1 encounters it's usually either hard to die or impossible to die. Dueling tournaments need 3 pages of rules to prevent every fight from being a stalemate lol. I'm not saying that there aren't builds or classes out there that are killable but there's almost always a few meta builds which require extremely low effort to not die on them.I used to think that PvP was a tragedy, but now I realize, it's a comedy.0 -
Oakenaxe✭✭✭✭xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »People won't want to hear it, but dying is an important and healthy part of competitive pvp. When dying becomes impossible in 1v1 scenarios how are you supposed to figure out who is the better pvper? What is the point of competing if it always is a stalemate?
Zos please play your own game. If you want I can bring you on a grand tour and show you the absolute state of ruin Cyrodiil is in. Ill bring you to the ball groups and let you attempt to kill them for an hour. Then we will stop by the lovely resource towers and ill introduce you to the tower "lovers" who make their home inside them(watch out they bring friends). Ill stand by the flag and let you evict them since this is clearly a part of your "vision" for pvp and you should easily be able to handle them without my help. Finally we will meet face to face with the OAKEN MARA KNIGHT, supreme lord of pvp and skill. I think if you come on this tour with me you will know exactly what to fix next patch.
Hahahahaha this comment is gold! Laughed out loud at the Oaken Mara Knight part. Sadly this is all true. And resource towers should be made destructible again.a.k.a. Leo
non-native English speaker
200-300 ping and low fps player4 -
TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yeah it was pretty laughable before Maras was even farmed. Adding minor resolve to vigor and nerfing DOTs that could have actually used a buff in PvP for most abilities, and reducing the weave damage. Just not fun
The disheartening part is Maras at the moment, but it will just be another set next patch that is just recklessly thrown in without consideration for consequences. We almost had 2 this patch had they not put a very prohibitive cool down on NP. We had several with DC, PB, and Unleashed terror.
This is what happens when you do wild unneeded balance hits a long with aiming for a quota on new sets. Balance is hard to achieve, but you could at least procede with caution and precision3 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »People won't want to hear it, but dying is an important and healthy part of competitive pvp. When dying becomes impossible in 1v1 scenarios how are you supposed to figure out who is the better pvper? What is the point of competing if it always is a stalemate?
Zos please play your own game. If you want I can bring you on a grand tour and show you the absolute state of ruin Cyrodiil is in. Ill bring you to the ball groups and let you attempt to kill them for an hour. Then we will stop by the lovely resource towers and ill introduce you to the tower "lovers" who make their home inside them(watch out they bring friends). Ill stand by the flag and let you evict them since this is clearly a part of your "vision" for pvp and you should easily be able to handle them without my help. Finally we will meet face to face with the OAKEN MARA KNIGHT, supreme lord of pvp and skill. I think if you come on this tour with me you will know exactly what to fix next patch.
Hahahahaha this comment is gold! Laughed out loud at the Oaken Mara Knight part. Sadly this is all true. And resource towers should be made destructible again.
Why did they make resource towers immune to damage to begin with? Oh yeah, one of the game designers was a nightblade YouTube star.8 -
Idinuse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »People won't want to hear it, but dying is an important and healthy part of competitive pvp. When dying becomes impossible in 1v1 scenarios how are you supposed to figure out who is the better pvper? What is the point of competing if it always is a stalemate?
Zos please play your own game. If you want I can bring you on a grand tour and show you the absolute state of ruin Cyrodiil is in. Ill bring you to the ball groups and let you attempt to kill them for an hour. Then we will stop by the lovely resource towers and ill introduce you to the tower "lovers" who make their home inside them(watch out they bring friends). Ill stand by the flag and let you evict them since this is clearly a part of your "vision" for pvp and you should easily be able to handle them without my help. Finally we will meet face to face with the OAKEN MARA KNIGHT, supreme lord of pvp and skill. I think if you come on this tour with me you will know exactly what to fix next patch.
Sed ut perspiciatis unde omnis iste natus error sit voluptatem accusantium dolorem que laudantium, totam rem aperiam, eaque ipsa quae ab illo inventore veritatis et quasi architecto beatae vitae dicta sunt explicabo. Nemo enim ipsam voluptatem quia voluptas sit aspernatur aut odit aut fugit, sed quia consequuntur magni dolores eos qui ratione voluptatem sequi nesciunt. Neque porro quisquam est, qui dolorem ipsum quia dolor sit amet, consectetur, adipisci velit, sed quia non numquam eius modi tempora incidunt ut labore et dolore magnam aliquam quaerat voluptatem. Ut enim ad minima veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullam corporis suscipit laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur? Quis autem vel eum iure reprehenderit qui in ea voluptate velit esse quam nihil molestiae consequatur, vel illum qui dolorem eum fugiat quo voluptas nulla pariatur?4 -
ketsparrowhawk✭✭✭✭✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »Yeah it was pretty laughable before Maras was even farmed. Adding minor resolve to vigor and nerfing DOTs that could have actually used a buff in PvP for most abilities, and reducing the weave damage. Just not fun
The disheartening part is Maras at the moment, but it will just be another set next patch that is just recklessly thrown in without consideration for consequences. We almost had 2 this patch had they not put a very prohibitive cool down on NP. We had several with DC, PB, and Unleashed terror.
This is what happens when you do wild unneeded balance hits a long with aiming for a quota on new sets. Balance is hard to achieve, but you could at least procede with caution and precision
Balance is not hard to achieve. Small adjustments from one patch to the next.. eventually balance will be found. Balance is not the goal here.6 -
katorga✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The other part of the problem is the [snip] devs who, time and again, keep doubling down on the idea that a player's sets need to do all the work for them.
[snip]
Yeah, the player response to this patch, and the dev's responses to the player response, should make upper management [snip] start looking for new blood and fresh ideas.
[snip]
[edited for bashing & to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on November 12, 2022 5:36PM6 -
TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ketsparrowhawk wrote: »TechMaybeHic wrote: »Yeah it was pretty laughable before Maras was even farmed. Adding minor resolve to vigor and nerfing DOTs that could have actually used a buff in PvP for most abilities, and reducing the weave damage. Just not fun
The disheartening part is Maras at the moment, but it will just be another set next patch that is just recklessly thrown in without consideration for consequences. We almost had 2 this patch had they not put a very prohibitive cool down on NP. We had several with DC, PB, and Unleashed terror.
This is what happens when you do wild unneeded balance hits a long with aiming for a quota on new sets. Balance is hard to achieve, but you could at least procede with caution and precision
Balance is not hard to achieve. Small adjustments from one patch to the next.. eventually balance will be found. Balance is not the goal here.
If no MMO ever really achieves balance; I'd say it's pretty hard to achieve. Small adjustments would at least not make it not so drastic1 -
Sneakers✭✭✭From my POV maras only start to heal at very high levels once there are 5+ people and guards beating on a guy.
In 1v1 situations Mara heals almost nothing when compared to regular HoT and burst heal usage.
Not sure what kinda of ganker NB cannot kill through 5-6k healing done in 4-6 seconds time. Problem in small scale and 1v1s is obviously not Mara's, anyone who can do math realize this.
It is when u bring a huge numeric advantage to kill ONE person and all of the little zerglings start to apply status effects while at the same time not hitting very hard themselves that Mara shines and will keep that tank alive forever.
It is basically an intelligence check in PvP - first time it has been done, and we see the result. Lol.
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TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭From my POV maras only start to heal at very high levels once there are 5+ people and guards beating on a guy.
In 1v1 situations Mara heals almost nothing when compared to regular HoT and burst heal usage.
Not sure what kinda of ganker NB cannot kill through 5-6k healing done in 4-6 seconds time. Problem in small scale and 1v1s is obviously not Mara's, anyone who can do math realize this.
It is when u bring a huge numeric advantage to kill ONE person and all of the little zerglings start to apply status effects while at the same time not hitting very hard themselves that Mara shines and will keep that tank alive forever.
It is basically an intelligence check in PvP - first time it has been done, and we see the result. Lol.
As if we haven't heard this before with Crimson4 -
Sneakers✭✭✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »From my POV maras only start to heal at very high levels once there are 5+ people and guards beating on a guy.
In 1v1 situations Mara heals almost nothing when compared to regular HoT and burst heal usage.
Not sure what kinda of ganker NB cannot kill through 5-6k healing done in 4-6 seconds time. Problem in small scale and 1v1s is obviously not Mara's, anyone who can do math realize this.
It is when u bring a huge numeric advantage to kill ONE person and all of the little zerglings start to apply status effects while at the same time not hitting very hard themselves that Mara shines and will keep that tank alive forever.
It is basically an intelligence check in PvP - first time it has been done, and we see the result. Lol.
As if we haven't heard this before with Crimson
Yah and we still have unkillable tanks that do no damage and are playing just to "trolol people", crimson was nerfed to the ground and nothing changed.1 -
MEBengalsFan2001✭✭✭✭✭The problems I see in PVP is that we have high resistance, decent healing, low damage, gear that can heal us, mythic gear to make us almost immune to all CC and if you need further CC immunity pop a potion and than if you run in a ball group the fun continues to grow. Yeah fun.
I believe some additional adjustments need to happen to Battle Spirit by role to make PVP fun again.
Damage Dealers should get a buff to their base damage and penetration but a reduction to healing out and a cap on resistance.
Healers should get a buff to healing out and magika/stamina recovery and a reduction in damage and a cap on resistance.
Tanks should get a buff to their health recovery and healing in but a reduction in damage out and healing out.
Like PVE roles should matter in PVP and the best way to make roles more meaningful in PVP is to adding adjustments to battle spirit based on the role the player has when they enter the PVP zone and cannot be changed until you leave and come back to the zone.
Other changes that should happen should include removing mythical items from PVP and the updates to how CC and CC immunity works.
Edited by MEBengalsFan2001 on September 7, 2022 1:23PM1 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »People won't want to hear it, but dying is an important and healthy part of competitive pvp. When dying becomes impossible in 1v1 scenarios how are you supposed to figure out who is the better pvper? What is the point of competing if it always is a stalemate?
Zos please play your own game. If you want I can bring you on a grand tour and show you the absolute state of ruin Cyrodiil is in. Ill bring you to the ball groups and let you attempt to kill them for an hour. Then we will stop by the lovely resource towers and ill introduce you to the tower "lovers" who make their home inside them(watch out they bring friends). Ill stand by the flag and let you evict them since this is clearly a part of your "vision" for pvp and you should easily be able to handle them without my help. Finally we will meet face to face with the OAKEN MARA KNIGHT, supreme lord of pvp and skill. I think if you come on this tour with me you will know exactly what to fix next patch.
Hahahahaha this comment is gold! Laughed out loud at the Oaken Mara Knight part. Sadly this is all true. And resource towers should be made destructible again.
Why did they make resource towers immune to damage to begin with? Oh yeah, one of the game designers was a nightblade YouTube star.
Oh, that rogue star who designs the whole game around one class5 -
Cast_El✭✭✭✭✭How about adding passive malus to heavy armor: "when battle spirit is active you deal 2% less damage for each piece you are wearing " ?1 -
kurbbie_s✭✭✭The other part of the problem is the [snip] devs who, time and again, keep doubling down on the idea that a player's sets need to do all the work for them.
[snip]
thats the problem, most players do in fact need sets to do the work for them. Look at all the complaining about fake tanks in normal dungeons. We have this state of the game because of them, they cry they die to good players, they cry they cant stay alive. What does zos do? Add tons of proc sets to "bring them up" then nerf skill damage while keeping proc sets the same or inadvertently making them stronger.
The low skill level and refusal to get better from players has done this
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on November 12, 2022 5:37PM1 -
kurbbie_s✭✭✭xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »People won't want to hear it, but dying is an important and healthy part of competitive pvp. When dying becomes impossible in 1v1 scenarios how are you supposed to figure out who is the better pvper? What is the point of competing if it always is a stalemate?
Zos please play your own game. If you want I can bring you on a grand tour and show you the absolute state of ruin Cyrodiil is in. Ill bring you to the ball groups and let you attempt to kill them for an hour. Then we will stop by the lovely resource towers and ill introduce you to the tower "lovers" who make their home inside them(watch out they bring friends). Ill stand by the flag and let you evict them since this is clearly a part of your "vision" for pvp and you should easily be able to handle them without my help. Finally we will meet face to face with the OAKEN MARA KNIGHT, supreme lord of pvp and skill. I think if you come on this tour with me you will know exactly what to fix next patch.
I could not agree more with what you said: you summarized well the current poor state of PvP.
When palyers are not killable and this is happening in PvP the game has a problem....it's boring!!
But when you discover that their immortality is mostly related to sets and game flaws then you know that the issues are terribly serious.
Mind you I know a lot of very strong PvPer who can be extremely successful without having to platy troll tank like builds.
we can kill them, but it carries them too much. I have videos on my channel showing 2 zergs trying to kill 1 warden in maras. "its just skill bro, hes just really good" no the sets are carrying people.3 -
Cast_El✭✭✭✭✭
No templar olorime/clever build.
"The more tanks you are the less damage you do" seems good to me when I wrote it. Because tanky players(I am one) shouldn't be able to deal this kind of damage.
Just saying what I thought 🤔
Anyway, they should do something about warden, deep fissure and polar wind cross healing are a joke 🤣. But we know how they will do it: nerf them to the ground instead of just make small nerf1 -
TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
No templar olorime/clever build.
"The more tanks you are the less damage you do" seems good to me when I wrote it. Because tanky players(I am one) shouldn't be able to deal this kind of damage.
Just saying what I thought 🤔
Anyway, they should do something about warden, deep fissure and polar wind cross healing are a joke 🤣. But we know how they will do it: nerf them to the ground instead of just make small nerf
Problem is the damage sets don't do enough to be worth used over a proc set, or over a defensive set with a proc. I mean, what if stuhns scaled penetration up based on your targets health to match what pariah does? Right now, you don't even have full uptime.
I'd also argue we should have weapon/spell damage add more than what it does now to be a bigger chunk to match proportion to the built in damage that went up with CP 2.0Edited by TechMaybeHic on September 9, 2022 3:23PM2 -
tactx✭✭✭✭✭The other part of the problem is the [snip] devs who, time and again, keep doubling down on the idea that a player's sets need to do all the work for them.
[snip]
But this is how MMOs always work. Name an MMO where they ever listened and acted based on quality feedback. Nearly every time, the devs don't play the game at any competitive level, and no one really knows anything.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on November 12, 2022 5:44PM“No one's happiness but my own is in my power to achieve or to destroy.” - John Galt, Atlas Shrugged0 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »I'd also argue we should have weapon/spell damage add more than what it does now to be a bigger chunk to match his the built in damage went up with CP 2.0
Something like that, or as I've said before perhaps increase integer Weapon Damage sources. The increase in baseline damage meant these sources became relatively weaker choices - and thus sources of Mitigation and Sustain became relatively stronger choices. Right? I'd be willing to wager that less people than ever run Warrior or Apprentice and more than ever run Lady.
Off the top of my head I guess Kvatch Gladiator is the closest thing to your idea of a reverse Pariah.
Edited by Urzigurumash on September 9, 2022 2:08AMXbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast1 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭"The more tanks you are the less damage you do"
This is already the case, for the most part Proc Scaling eliminated the worst imbalances here. (although it left a few procs in need of attention, Curse of Doylemish for instance: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/613707/curse-of-doylemish-should-have-health-or-resistance-scaling)
Heavy Armor plays an essential role in balancing Melee vs Ranged. Should an archer be wearing the same armor as a knight?
You can find a number of threads where this "Maim on Heavy" idea was argued in the past, as I said then Heavy should give a bonus to melee damage after a gapcloser because Momentum = Mass x Velocity. Matter of fact, an early iteration of Orc's passive Swift Warrior gave a bonus to gapcloser damage, presumably with this logic.
But, I think you will find broad agreement nowadays that there is plenty of room to discuss whether investments into Max Stam/Mag give sufficient returns over investments into Max HP. Might not be much but a 1 piece Trainee with Mag or Stam would be useful here, or maybe the best thing in this hybrid era is a gold food with Max Stam, Stam Regen, Max Mag, and Mag Regen as its 4 effects. Since HP Regen is useless for non-WWs I think it's possible this would be popular with PvPers, all of the other 4 effect gold foods have HP Regen - but depends how much people need a certain HP to not be gankfodder / VD procs.
Edited by Urzigurumash on September 9, 2022 2:35AMXbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
Beffagorn✭✭✭No templar olorime/clever build.
"The more tanks you are the less damage you do" seems good to me when I wrote it. Because tanky players(I am one) shouldn't be able to deal this kind of damage.
Just saying what I thought 🤔
Anyway, they should do something about warden, deep fissure and polar wind cross healing are a joke 🤣. But we know how they will do it: nerf them to the ground instead of just make small nerf
What you suggest isn't doing anything other than killing heavy armor (which barely anyone uses anymore in meta builds). Mara's being a heavy armor set has nothing to do with why it is overperforming, it since you could just use weapons and jewelry and achieve the same thing in any armor weight.
Nor do immortal builds have anything to do with heavy armor, since the absolute vast majority of builds people complain about are in medium armor, as it provides the highest total mitigation through a mix between passive and active mitigation, aswell as having the best offensive passives for stamina based characters, which in turn provides more healing.
There's this misconception with people on the forums that passive mitigation is the cause of nigh immortal builds when it actually has nearly nothing to do with it. The builds that stack passive mitigation are simply blockbots played by people wanting to roleplay a cinderblock. They're worthless and just a nuisance to deal with and that's it.
The problem with survivability in this patch not only comes from sets like Mara's that are incredibly overtuned but also other proc sets that either apply far too much pressure or simply deal too much damage, enabling players to rely on those sets and to invest more into survivability and recovery which they wouldn't otherwise have access to without sacrifices.
The ease of how you certain classes can kite almost endlessly or simply recover 80% of their HP with the press of a button, for example with Streak and Coagulating Blood (aswell as cloak to a lesser extent) only serves to intensify the problem.
As if all this wasn't enough, gutting dots in pvp pretty much forced every single dk into running Corrosive Armor which in turns created more "tank" builds.
These are the problems that need fixing. Returning dot damage to pre U35 values, nerfing overtuned abilities like Streak, Corrosive Armor and Coagulating Blood aswell as giving Mara's an ICD would solve A LOT of this patch's problemsEdited by Beffagorn on September 9, 2022 2:45AM3
