8.1.2 Is Not Adequate. No You Did Not Listen to Us.

acastanza_ESO

The DOT/HOT changes were only the tip of the Iceberg with our dissatisfaction with this patch, you have still completely failed to address how ANY of these changes address "accessibility".

You're still nerfing light and heavy attacks into the ground - a major source of damage for new and learning players.

You're still nerfing Sorcerer into the ground because one overperforming set made it seem too strong (it wasn't), and a bunch of other unnecessary punitive changes some other classes like warden and necro.

You're still adding ridiculous sets to the game like Nocturnal's Ploy that are practically girftwrapped for the worst part of PVP (ballgroups).

What part of stop this madness did you not understand? [snip] Stop this now.

[edited for bashing]

coop500

And werewolves got ignored, so they're really dead now.

YandereGirlfriend

Scorch is still an abomination with its timing changes - the next update MUST FIX THIS.

xDeusEJRx

I said before in combat changes post, ZOS are gonna keep doubling down till it passes through live server and once everyone in the community hates it we might get actual change after months of pain. Same as every other update.

As usual

Arthtur

I feel bad for all ppl who spend their time testing all this stuff. ZOS is still pushing what They wanted [snip]

[edited for bashing]

fiender66

Sigh...

Jazraena

As stated before, this patch is not salvageable. The one point you did address with 'DoT Harmonization' just results in sticky DoTs being uninteresting for damage and timers even more all over the place than your initial harmonization was, which was already worse than live despite the stated target to make it simpler for people.

Revert. Everything. No exceptions. Go back to the drawing board, return when there is a clear concept and well-thought out approaches to get there.

Everything else will just result in different degrees of a mess.

neferpitou73

Whoever thought up Nocturnal's Ploy does not PvP. You didn't listen to us about DC, you didn't listen to us about PB but I'm begging you ZOS please scrap this set.

divnyi

Waited to see the changes Week 3.
I'm done. Maybe if my words doesn't matter, my uninstall will.

WrathOfInnos

There's still more work to be done, let's keep the constructive feedback flowing. 8.1.2 exceeded my expectations, with a fix to Bound Armaments, a creatively improved and versatile Crystal Weapon, and the return of many 10s DoTs to make rotations more active and proc enchants/effects more frequently. Hopefully more to come next week, we just need to be clear about the problems.

shadyjane62

The only thing I looked for was the word jabs. Did not see it. Nothing changed for me. Still leaving.

Dark_Lord_Kuro

Well they did listen , they just did not act uppon all of it, big differance

Te dot hot problem was as i understood it the biggest(or one of) problem for pve
Yeah la and ha hard cap will it hard but saying its a major source of dps for new player is completely false as most new player i played with did not even try to weave in their rotation. Sure mid tier to high end player will benifit massivly from la weaving but not a brand new player

Troodon80

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

Yeah la and ha hard cap will it hard but saying its a major source of dps for new player is completely false as most new player i played with did not even try to weave in their rotation.

No one specifically said weave, though. A lot of new players act like companions in that they light attack with abilities sprinkled in for flavour. They don't have a rotation as such. Nerfing light attack damage does impact them. Other players spam abilities without doing light attacks and then heavy attack when they run out of resources. Nerfing heavy attack damage affects them. Decreasing damage from AoEs and DoTs across the board affects everyone, including those new players who may only rarely use those abilities.

jecks33

I don't know but the combat was fun and clear untill they introduced the hybridization, then everything has become confused patch after patch. Big changes, nerfs, double nerfs, and reverts make me confused about my classes and that is not fun.

I think i'll take a break untill the combat team will have a clear and stable vision about the game

DarcyMardin

Arthtur wrote: »

I feel bad for all ppl who spend their time testing all this stuff. ZOS is still pushing what They wanted [snip]

I do too, but many years of PTS testing and comments being ignored convinced me not to bother testing on the PTS anymore. The devs are going to keep pushing their extreme vision of constant changes, no matter how much we plead for them not to. They have their spreadsheets and their “data,” after all. No more need for class reps or paying customers’ “anecdotal” comments.

It’s sad, but that’s where we are (and where we’ve been for several years).

[edited to remove quote]

pklemming

Too little and too late.

At this point it is becoming very evident you either don't have any people who play at a high level in PVE, or you don't listen to them. You are still losing players. You are losing content creators and their followers. How could you possibly think this would make people happy with the changes?

You are going to push something after week 5 and those on the fence will then decide if they are going to leave too.

We never asked for any of these changes. We have been extremely vocal about the dislike of these changes, but you are so stubborn, you would rather push a bad patch live and lose people, than admit that this is a massive mistake.

Your stance on giving LESS support to disabled people too, is... well... interesting... for a company. You get that this is a double nerf with the reduction of the Oakensoul ring, and also the way you have implemented nerfs. I don't think I have ever seen a company actively reduce accessibility for those people who need it most.

Nevidyra

For the first time in my history playing this game, I have unsubbed over these changes. I'm about to uninstall, too. I'm done. We're constantly ignored [snip] by the developers. A game I love and was incredibly passionate about has turned into something I can barely motivate myself to play thanks to the direction this [snip] combat team has taken it.

I can't even PvP anymore thanks to the Nocturnal set.

[edited for bashing]

fiender66

Hey, combat team! Do you know how long I've been looking for you?

shadyjane62

fiender66 wrote: »

Hey, combat team! Do you know how long I've been looking for you?

I'm taking Stuga to WoW with me where she will be appreciated.

StarOfElyon

Nocturnal's ploy will be cancer.

washbern

i agree with the masses.

while the slightest tweaks to a few dots are appreciated, are you seriously not going to address Sorcs and Wardens? Are you seriously going to leave a 10% discrepancy between ranged and melee weapons?! WHY?! Daggers already outperform staves. Why beat staves and bows into the ground??? So much for build diversity for anyone who wants to play bow / bow or staff / staff. Are you seriously going to ignore the ONE SINGLE THING that gave accessibility to many plaers (Oakensoul ring)?

Ratzkifal

I feel it's already a big improvement, but it's still far from being good.

Is it so hard to make every weapon meant for damage to be a viable damage option for front and off bar? Is it so hard to nerf the overpowered sets that favor "the ceiling" and buff sets with easy uptimes? The reason Silks of the Sun etc were locked at 400 weapon/spell damage as opposed to the 600 that War Maiden and Swamp Raider enjoy is because their effects could be made use of by light attacks of the respective element. If LAs don't scale anymore then at least buff these sets. If you want to close the skill gap then please just close the skill gap instead of messing with everybody and not even doing what you wanted to be doing.

But why do I even bother. My feedback won't be read and even if I went into meticulous detail, am I the one who's job it is to balance this game? No. Then why does it feel like we players are the ones who have to do all the work here?

Stx

Was really hoping to see the jabs nerfs reverted, or at least the new animation reverted.. but alas, I won't be playing.

VixxVexx

First dark convergance, plaguebreak, then oakensoul, savage werewolf, now nocturnal's ploy...
I am in pain.

GaianSpirit

This is it, canceled my ESO+ subscription.
You have a whole community that have suggested many better ways to achieve your goal of creating accessibility, based on their vast experience of playing the game for years. Instead of allowing these valuable wells of knowledge guide you towards a better game you stubbornly go out of your way to implement changes that have the opposite result of your stated goals. I dont wanna slander, but its just incompetent.
You have teams that dont seem to communicate, one team creates content and sets that increase group dmg higher and higher with each patch for years
You have another team that nerfs the dmg, and fails to create their stated goal of accessibility
You cancel the Class Rep program, the only sliver of direct community feedback, when you should invite the community to have more influence.
This game is just dying a slow death, and this patch seems to be the deathblow. Watch out for when AoC comes out cause it will steal any remaining players.
Im sad to leave, but you pushed me to do it.

qcell

Agree. Still a DPS reduction. Bad update.

Mannjdyr

(
Yes ! good ZoS very thanks !

[snip] many of us are enjoying this future update.
)

[edited for baiting]

Arjuna1696

Big agree. Huge, unnecessary, un-asked for changes that do not improve accessibility or raise the floor. I would really love for the dev team to be able to eat their mistake, admit that this is all bananas, and go back to the drawing board. And I'd like them to use a much smaller, more manageable drawing board, and make much smaller, more measured changes.

StarOfElyon

Mannjdyr wrote: »

(
Yes ! good ZoS very thanks !

[snip] many of us are enjoying this future update.
)

#1 that's baiting.
#2 I'm a mid-tier semi-casual player who sees a lot of reason to be concerned so it's not just the "elitists".

[edited to remove quote]

Styxius

I know many don't agree but I'm happy with the new jabs animation, but it should do more damage than Flurry as it's part of their "class identity" that is not cared about these days. It is sad to see how few of the problems were addressed. Wardens and Sorcs were mostly uncared for the damages caused to them, They still snuck more nerfs into the situation despite that not being needed. Incredibly disheartening how poorly this was handled. Not to mention the scaling of the "sticky" DoT's sets like the Perfected Master Bow does not work, and many of the core elements that are upsetting the player base were ignored. Werewolves might as well not exist at this point. Wardens shalks are dreadful and harm a key identity to their rotation. Their bear nerfs were unwarranted. Nerfing Boneyard was unwarranted. Nerfing Maelstrom 2h AGAIN was unwarranted. This is ridiculous and absurd. What even is the point of us wasting hundreds of combined hours providing data and testing this information if it's always treated as a "well we're sending this" mentality? These cycles are too short, and the data is vastly ignored.

The fact as a community we have to plead and get enough drama stirred for news outlets to start covering our dismay towards these changes is enough to highlight the failure of communication within ZOS. Gilliam and the Combat team are completely out of touch with the games community and our wants. They have done nothing but cause staggering shifts, conflicts of identity, and devastating blows to player morale. I'm unsure how much longer I can deal with this before I jump ship. This has bordered on depressing. I enjoyed making content creation for ESO, and I'm unsure if I will/want to continue doing so. The game is painful in terms of the treatment of their community. They are, deliberately or not, misleading their casual player base with deceptive comments. (See 8.1.0 for information on Heavy attacks) Heavy attacks being a big thing the casual player base enjoy. Saying you're looking out for them and then handing them a letter showing they're receiving the biggest nerfs in history.

They treat us with comments that feel so slighted and condescending. It highlights to me that Gilliam may not be the one who needs to man this position any longer. The results of these changes and the basic fundamental math disproving the combat teams' plans and ideas do not take a professor to expose. Using the "Provide us data, not just anecdotal feedback" maybe that's highlighting a core element. The combat team is so obsessed with fine-tuning things and miscalculations involving "sticky dots" that they fail to capture identity. They are too focused on the numbers and not enough on the creativity to define things. The combat is becoming insanely cookie cutter, rotations are just blending into the same thing across the board. This is destined for failure if they can't break their mold and create a better identity.

10, 12, and 15s dots shouldn't be your standard of measurement as you're just created a cookie cutter imprint. Creativity ZOS is the key to identity. Why not 3s, 5s, 9s, 30s, variety is the key. It's incredibly painful watching the combat team do this again while the community is screaming out in hopes that we'll be heard. ZOS has a dedicated community set on giving them full feedback and information. With little to no filter on being open on it. It didn't take us long to prove that these updates suggested changes were poor. It was ignorant for it to be blown off as knee-jerk reactions or ones based on anecdotal evidence.

Enough ranting, ZOS needs to get its priorities back on identity instead of their spread sheets and focus on making the players happy not their oven. Players don't like cookie cutters.

StarOfElyon

VixxVexx wrote: »

First dark convergance, plaguebreak, then oakensoul, savage werewolf, now nocturnal's ploy...
I am in pain.

They're toxic sets that make PvP very grief inducing.