Best Patch In Years

sabresandiego_ESO

Despite the outcries, this is likely one of the best patches in years. It addresses power creep, item balance, class balance, weapon balance, overpowered cross healing, and also raises the skill floor. [snip] Great patch

[Edit for Baiting.]

xylena_lazarow

I'll be fine, to me most of it just spins the wheels without moving much in the big picture.

Do you have any specific examples of those improvements you listed?

You can't say the floor was raised when the guy who derps into a Vet dungeon doing 5k dps spamming one button is... still going to do exactly that, worse if his one button was light attack. Low to mid tier PvEers will be hit hardest.

helios777

Hey guys, I found the player who has been playing for less than a month.

ixmike

I just spam abilities, and almost never "weave".

So life is good.

p00tx

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

[snip]

Or maybe you could listen to feedback from players who are currently playing the game at a higher level than any of the devs, including "Rich Lambert", and have a much deeper and more nuanced understanding of how the game works from a holistic standpoint. This patch as it stands is a load of flaming hot garbage. I recognize the game needed a little tuning, but not this sledgehammer treatment. It was very poorly thought out and carelessly implemented.

[edited to remove quote]

Jaimeh

Sure, if you like things on fire

MindOfTheSwarm

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Despite the outcries, this is likely one of the best patches in years. It addresses power creep, item balance, class balance, weapon balance, overpowered cross healing, and also raises the skill floor. [snip] Great patch

[Edit for Baiting.]

Light Attacks nerfs needed to happen. Not sure in the same way but I guess I’ll live with it. Ground DoT nerfs we’re not needed at all. They needed damage buffs to help zone in PvP. Winter’s Revenge 33% damage nerf, but Grave Yard gets 33% damage buff? Please. My Frost Warden is gonna get shelved if this goes through. I’ll have to make a Frost Necro instead and it will probably do a better job…. Although I have a half mind to quit ESO completely.

Players getting attached to character? What do you expect? Players spend their free time working hard to fine tune their characters into how they want them, only for you to negate all that and have them grind again. No thanks. This is supposed to be a game, not a full time job where the pay off is taken away from you a few months later.

sabresandiego_ESO

p00tx wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

[snip]

Or maybe you could listen to feedback from players who are currently playing the game at a higher level than any of the devs, including "Rich Lambert", and have a much deeper and more nuanced understanding of how the game works from a holistic standpoint. This patch as it stands is a load of flaming hot garbage. I recognize the game needed a little tuning, but not this sledgehammer treatment. It was very poorly thought out and carelessly implemented.

Completely disagree. I pvp at a high level. Patches like this keep the game fun and interesting by switching around the meta, and introducing new things. I really love this patch so far

[edited to remove quote]

prof_doom

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

p00tx wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

[snip]

Or maybe you could listen to feedback from players who are currently playing the game at a higher level than any of the devs, including "Rich Lambert", and have a much deeper and more nuanced understanding of how the game works from a holistic standpoint. This patch as it stands is a load of flaming hot garbage. I recognize the game needed a little tuning, but not this sledgehammer treatment. It was very poorly thought out and carelessly implemented.

Completely disagree. I pvp at a high level. Patches like this keep the game fun and interesting by switching around the meta, and introducing new things. I really love this patch so far

You PVP at a high level... when's the last time you finished a vet trial? Because 90% of the people giving negative feedback right now are PVE players.

[edited to remove quote]

pklemming

He doesn't think about PVE. As long as he is happy, nothing else really matters.

There are a lot of concerns from people who play PVE at a 'really high level'.

sabresandiego_ESO

prof_doom wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

p00tx wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

[snip]

Or maybe you could listen to feedback from players who are currently playing the game at a higher level than any of the devs, including "Rich Lambert", and have a much deeper and more nuanced understanding of how the game works from a holistic standpoint. This patch as it stands is a load of flaming hot garbage. I recognize the game needed a little tuning, but not this sledgehammer treatment. It was very poorly thought out and carelessly implemented.

Completely disagree. I pvp at a high level. Patches like this keep the game fun and interesting by switching around the meta, and introducing new things. I really love this patch so far

You PVP at a high level... when's the last time you finished a vet trial? Because 90% of the people giving negative feedback right now are PVE players.

They should add difficulty sliders for pve for that issue.

[edited to remove quote]

prof_doom

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

They should add difficulty sliders for pve for that issue.

I like it... let's cancel all these changes and they can work on that instead.

WreckfulAbandon

Curious what you think about one of the new PvP sets since you think this patch is so great:

Nocturnal’s Ploy – Medium
2 – Adds 1487 Offensive Penetration
3 – Adds 424 Critical Resistance
4 – Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
5 – When you apply a Major Debuff to an enemy, remove a Major Buff with a duration from the target. When you apply a Minor Debuff to an enemy, remove a Minor Buff with a duration from the target. These effects can both occur once every 2 seconds.

Most of this stuff will probably go live as is and I can adapt to most of it, but I dont see how anyone can defend this set, its completely and utterly toxic in any scenario. Think of all the ways that someone remove a major and minor debuff every 2 sec. I dont see how anyone can enjoy having to juggle buffs even more because of some busted set.

sabresandiego_ESO

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

Curious what you think about one of the new PvP sets since you think this patch is so great:

Nocturnal’s Ploy – Medium
2 – Adds 1487 Offensive Penetration
3 – Adds 424 Critical Resistance
4 – Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
5 – When you apply a Major Debuff to an enemy, remove a Major Buff with a duration from the target. When you apply a Minor Debuff to an enemy, remove a Minor Buff with a duration from the target. These effects can both occur once every 2 seconds.

Most of this stuff will probably go live as is and I can adapt to most of it, but I dont see how anyone can defend this set, its completely and utterly toxic in any scenario. Think of all the ways that someone remove a major and minor debuff every 2 sec. I dont see how anyone can enjoy having to juggle buffs even more because of some busted set.

It looks interesting. I like new gameplay elements. Most Other sets kill you, this one removes buffs. You can’t play when you’re dead but you can still fight back without your buffs. It will be interesting to see how it plays out

p00tx

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

p00tx wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

[snip]

Or maybe you could listen to feedback from players who are currently playing the game at a higher level than any of the devs, including "Rich Lambert", and have a much deeper and more nuanced understanding of how the game works from a holistic standpoint. This patch as it stands is a load of flaming hot garbage. I recognize the game needed a little tuning, but not this sledgehammer treatment. It was very poorly thought out and carelessly implemented.

Completely disagree. I pvp at a high level. Patches like this keep the game fun and interesting by switching around the meta, and introducing new things. I really love this patch so far

With all due respect, PvP is only one part of this game.

[edited to remove quote]

WreckfulAbandon

Not the response I was hoping for but nothing wrong with that. For me it is absolutely a balance issue, but aside from that this set will produce situations that are completely non enjoyable to the point that it ruins the game. I play this game for enjoyment, already find it very buff intensive, and this set seems like its just going to tip the scales a bit much for me. And by a bit much I mean bye Felicia👋. Hopefully ZOS comes out with a complete rework.

Joosef_Kivikilpi

Am I experiencing the classic "Destiny Sunset" here.... but like ... In Tamriel?? Lolz

WrathOfInnos

pklemming wrote: »

He doesn't think about PVE. As long as he is happy, nothing else really matters.

There are a lot of concerns from people who play PVE at a 'really high level'.

It's a never ending debate. A PVP player celebrates this type of patch because most of the changes make his enemies weaker (and only a few affect their class). PVE players look at these changes and see themselves and all their allies getting weaker, while the trial bosses remain strong.

starkerealm

ixmike wrote: »

I just spam abilities, and almost never "weave".

So life is good.

Well, good news! All your abilities have (probably) been nerfed beyond recognition.

kindred

It's not just the light attack thing. The patch notes are so depressing.

Cast_El

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Despite the outcries, this is likely one of the best patches in years. It addresses power creep, item balance, class balance, weapon balance, overpowered cross healing, and also raises the skill floor. [snip] Great patch

[Edit for Baiting.]

Your main is nightblade or warden I guess

fizzylu

As a PVP main, I also hate this patch. So idk what this person is on haha I think it's a terrible change for everyone.
That set also needs to go. Buffs like major sorcery/brutality and major resolve are really a MUST in almost every situation... and this game already pushes away players from the resource management style of gameplay so creating something to make that even MORE of an issue.... I really don't know what ZOS is thinking or doing and why I continue to give them money. Shame on me, really.

Whiskey_JG

The constant changes are tiring........like ALOT, especially for endgame players. Its extremely frustrating to realise that all the time you spent last patch perfecting and upgrading your setup, all of a sudden amounts to nothing. However we always manage to adapt to the situation, so Im confident we will find a way to optimize our groups.

What is INSULTING in this patch is not the changes themselves, but the deemed Reasons ZoS has explained. They claim the changes were done to reduce the gap between low dps and high dps players. The changes proposed are a hit to everyone. A player that used to hit 120K, will now hit 95k.........but the player who used to hit 30k, will probably hit even lower now.

This is confusing also when taking into consideration the veteran HM content being given to us. Trials and dungeons are NOT getting any easier to clear. There are some very EVIDENT DPS checks that require your to be at your best. I think that a PROPER Combat tutorial would yield much better results than all these dps changes.

ZiggyTStardust

I don't see how this raises the floor. Yes, power creep is a problem, but these changes will decrease the dps of inexpereinced players just as much, with all the nerfs to damaging abilitites.
And of course decreasing damage will lead to players struggeling to complete content they previously were able to, unless the dps checks will also be adjusted

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

We have recently removed some unnecessary non-constructive and back-and-forth posts from this thread. This is a reminder to keep the discussion civil and constructive. Please keep our Community Rules in mind moving forward.

Thank you for your understanding.

prof_doom

ZiggyTStardust wrote: »

I don't see how this raises the floor. Yes, power creep is a problem, but these changes will decrease the dps of inexpereinced players just as much, with all the nerfs to damaging abilitites.
And of course decreasing damage will lead to players struggeling to complete content they previously were able to, unless the dps checks will also be adjusted

I fully agree that it isn't raising the floor.

Let me tell you a story about my weekend. I ran vet Rockgrove with what I'd call a mid-tier group. Group DPS averages out to somewhere around 75k dps. It was a challenge... it's supposed to be, it's vet Rockgrove.

If I recall, the minimum amount of DPS you need to clear Rockgrove is about 60K. Any lower, and you can't kill the Meteors fast enough to clear Bahsei.

Everything I've read says we're losing between 10K and 25K dps.

So in the worst case scenario, a group that could clear vet Rockgrove will no longer be able to after the patch.

How it that "increasing accessibility" or "closing the gap"?

Vaoh

Oh wow, this thread has changed a LOT lol.

Guess that’s what happens when there’s overwhelmingly negative feedback.

prof_doom

Vaoh wrote: »

Oh wow, this thread has changed a LOT lol.

Guess that’s what happens when there’s overwhelmingly negative feedback.

People were saying from the Combat Preview last week this was going to be horrible.
They said to wait till the PTS was up to try it before complaining.
People tried it... it was worse than we thought.

Medicate

prof_doom wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

Oh wow, this thread has changed a LOT lol.

Guess that’s what happens when there’s overwhelmingly negative feedback.

People were saying from the Combat Preview last week this was going to be horrible.
They said to wait till the PTS was up to try it before complaining.
People tried it... it was worse than we thought.

to say it's worse is a little understatement. They really butchered it more than A-Train ran into Robin.

BloodMagicLord

You clever little contrarian, you.

CleymenZero

I was telling everyone to wait until Monday before losing our minds but Monday came and it's worse than expected.

A few observations about OP:
- you do not PvP at a high level, I don't believe you duel either which eliminates you from the "high-level" category. DoT pressure has diminished to a point where duels last half an hour and the fact that dots last so long with so little pressure makes it that, dots won't even expire and some mechanics in some classes will completely cleanse them off leading to even less pressure.
- you're wrong about people not wanting to change. I embraced all changes up to now, I'm probably one of the most versatile players out there, I can swap to any class mag or stam in a night and do very very well and this patch makes high end PvE for mid-high tier groups very bad. It doesn't help lower tier players either, they WILL do less damage
- DPS on the dummy, with 100% Major Slayer and Minor Courage, is about 20-30% down which, in a certain way, is not addressing power creep because, in relation to new content, there was no power creep. It could address power creep for other trials but not for the last 2. With this level of change, I think my group could still somewhat comfortably get every trifecta up to Godslayer but I doubt Planesbreaker is feasible with those changes.

So imo, I don't think you know what you're talking about. I don't think you play at a level where any change would matter in either PvE or PvP.