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Solution for Gold inflation AND Fake Taking
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Actually multiaccounts generating golds from daily writs would benefit from limiting maximum gold amount.
As they have hundreds of multiaccounts, it will not affect them but normal players with one account would be punished.
I don't know why people don't learn basic about inflation.
Inflation is always caused by generating money out of thin air.
In ESO it is the problem of automated daily writs/botting/multiaccounts.
Nothiing else helps then excluding golds from daily writs rewards
But ZOS don't want to do it as normal players used to do daily writs as well.
ZOS is reluctant selling crownstore items for golds directly (because they want $$$$$$$, not golds).
So the schema continues without remedy and worsens.
Cheaters are generating golds from writs in massive scale -> pumping gold economy with their dirty golds and causing inflation -> as number people willing buy crowns for $$$$$ is still the same and golds are hoarding by trillions, the ratio gold/crowns worsens.
Gold sinks will not help as ZOS don't want to put good things in gold economy (as they want to sell as much as possible in crownstore for $$$$$$)
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RodneyRegis✭✭✭✭✭SaintJohnHM wrote: »I think that regular people from playerbase absolutely underestimates the scope of the gold inflation catastrophe.
We are not talking about millions and billions but trillions of golds wich are accumulating and not being destroyed.
By trading you dont destroy golds, just change owner.
Gold sinks don't exist as nothing valuable enough exists in gold economy and the biggest spending is hiring NPC traders.
In Vivec it is 50-100M per week,in other good locations 30-50M per week and in poor locations 4-10M per week / my estimation as the winning bids are top secret BUT as you can see, even this amount of golds is less then generated.
I call it writ disaster as majority of these golds are generated by daily writs but I was already marked as conspiration teorist by moderators...
So we are not facing "gold inflation", we are not facing crowns to gold exchange shift from 300:1 to 3000:1 in one year period, everything is nice and normal and uner control, don't worry.
Yep, that's why the proposed transmute purchases from game vendor(s) should be account bound. I would spend millions on transmutes, and I know others would too. I think there are a few areas where they could introduce gold sinks that would mostly only affect players with lots of gold who want some QoL options.
Ugh. That would just make the game even more pay-to-win than it already is.0 -
Marolf✭✭✭May I suggest that the solution for "fake tanking" is for those who are truly bothered by it to create a tank! Outside of a Vet DLC dungeon I have no issues with a fake tank provided they stand still.
But if I'm on a Magblade with inner fire slotted does that make me a fake tank?
Yes.0 -
b101uk✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »the solution to inflation is to cap the maximum gold you can have, anything over the cap is just removed.
else
have tax caps, that above which increasingly larger % of all gold income is removed as tax, at the top end 100% tax would mean you only wall get 0% of the total income of gold, and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.
then Zos just need to implement maximum item prices.
Easily broken. Have dummy accounts that hold gold or keep it in guild banks instead of on players. You'd be rewarding players that have the resources for multiple accounts and punishing the vast majority that likely only have one account. As long as gold can be transferred, a gold cap does nothing. Players could even just store gold as items and materials as many do already in order to combat inflation.
you missed the part "and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.", just chucking gold into alts or a bank wont get around the span of time, especially if that span encapsulates ALL characters on your account.0 -
redspecter23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »the solution to inflation is to cap the maximum gold you can have, anything over the cap is just removed.
else
have tax caps, that above which increasingly larger % of all gold income is removed as tax, at the top end 100% tax would mean you only wall get 0% of the total income of gold, and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.
then Zos just need to implement maximum item prices.
Easily broken. Have dummy accounts that hold gold or keep it in guild banks instead of on players. You'd be rewarding players that have the resources for multiple accounts and punishing the vast majority that likely only have one account. As long as gold can be transferred, a gold cap does nothing. Players could even just store gold as items and materials as many do already in order to combat inflation.
you missed the part "and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.", just chucking gold into alts or a bank wont get around the span of time, especially if that span encapsulates ALL characters on your account.
I didn't miss it, just assumed it was another variable that clever players would work around. Whatever time this span is, players would figure it out and probably even create an addon telling them what time they are able to shift money around to safely avoid taxes. It would create yet another hoop that clever players avoid while the masses get dinged.0 -
Vaoh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think that regular people from playerbase absolutely underestimate the scope of the gold inflation catastrophe.
We are not talking about millions and billions but trillions of golds wich are accumulating and not being destroyed.
By trading you dont destroy golds, just change owner.
Gold sinks don't exist as nothing valuable enough exists in gold economy and the biggest spending is hiring NPC traders.
In Vivec it is 50-100M per week,in other good locations 30-50M per week and in poor locations 4-10M per week / my estimation as the winning bids are top secret BUT as you can see, even this amount of golds is less then generated.
I call it writ disaster as majority of these golds are generated by daily writs but I was already marked as conspiration teorist by moderators...
So we are not facing "gold inflation", we are not facing crowns to gold exchange shift from 300:1 to 3000:1 in one year period, everything is nice and normal and uner control, don't worry.
A proper gold sink would work though.
Imo the best solution is this:
• On my server the exchange rate is 100:1
• All old seasons of crown crates would become available from a special vendor in each zone based on the crate theme.
Ex: Psijic Crates from NPC in Artaeum.
Ex: Xanmeer Crates from NPC in Murkmire.
Ex: Frost Atro Crates from NPC in Windhelm.
• Pricing correlates to the stabilized exchange rate for each server. For my server, 15x Crown Crates is 500,000 gold. For your server, it would probably be 15,000,000 gold. Etc.
• If the exchange rate noticeably changes overtime, then the price would change overtime. This really would only affect PC players.
Players would begin destroying their gold to buy Crown Crates rather than having that gold trade hands.Edited by Vaoh on May 24, 2022 4:24PM2 -
orgin_stadia✭✭✭After doing thousands (literally) of daily dungeons I would say that the majority of people doing them are not people who "actually want to play it" as you phrase it. It's definitely the other way around, the majority just want to finish them off as fast as possible. People who are collecting items for the sticker book, the xp reward, transmutes or simply just for the sheer fun of finding out the quickest way to finish it. Filling up a complete sticker book section takes about 50 runs give or take and most sane people wouldn't want to do that in slow mode.
Remove the majority of the people playing daily dungeons and it'll just become a ghost town. Besides, everyone playing dungeons on the slow burner sooner or later moves over to the other camp anyway, which would then even further deplete the number of people wanting to play them.
So no, removing the incentives to run rnd's / normal dungeons would not benefit anyone.1 -
b101uk✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »redspecter23 wrote: »the solution to inflation is to cap the maximum gold you can have, anything over the cap is just removed.
else
have tax caps, that above which increasingly larger % of all gold income is removed as tax, at the top end 100% tax would mean you only wall get 0% of the total income of gold, and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.
then Zos just need to implement maximum item prices.
Easily broken. Have dummy accounts that hold gold or keep it in guild banks instead of on players. You'd be rewarding players that have the resources for multiple accounts and punishing the vast majority that likely only have one account. As long as gold can be transferred, a gold cap does nothing. Players could even just store gold as items and materials as many do already in order to combat inflation.
you missed the part "and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.", just chucking gold into alts or a bank wont get around the span of time, especially if that span encapsulates ALL characters on your account.
I didn't miss it, just assumed it was another variable that clever players would work around. Whatever time this span is, players would figure it out and probably even create an addon telling them what time they are able to shift money around to safely avoid taxes. It would create yet another hoop that clever players avoid while the masses get dinged.
the argument of a small number of players with more IRL money than sense to buy multiple copies ESO is not really relevant.
for most people they have 1 account, and the span of time for ALL characters on said account and a global gold limit per account would help, and would be far far far better than now.
likewise Zos hard-limiting the maximum price items can be listed for would also help.0 -
Kazren✭✭✭Fake tanks (and fake heals) are reportable, since they're exploiting the game to avoid waiting in the queue. I report them every time.0
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Ishtarknows✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think that regular people from playerbase absolutely underestimate the scope of the gold inflation catastrophe.
We are not talking about millions and billions but trillions of golds wich are accumulating and not being destroyed.
By trading you dont destroy golds, just change owner.
Gold sinks don't exist as nothing valuable enough exists in gold economy and the biggest spending is hiring NPC traders.
In Vivec it is 50-100M per week,in other good locations 30-50M per week and in poor locations 4-10M per week / my estimation as the winning bids are top secret BUT as you can see, even this amount of golds is less then generated.
I call it writ disaster as majority of these golds are generated by daily writs but I was already marked as conspiration teorist by moderators...
So we are not facing "gold inflation", we are not facing crowns to gold exchange shift from 300:1 to 3000:1 in one year period, everything is nice and normal and uner control, don't worry.
Don't tar all the servers with the same brush. This is a PC problem. Consoles don't have such a volatile economy and as such shouldn't be penalised in the way you propose.
Also people run randoms for the XP too. Got a skill you need to remorph? Quick random or two and it's levelled. The transmutes are a bonus. I'm swimming in them. Half my chests are full of reconned staves ready to decon at cost should I need to.0 -
redspecter23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »redspecter23 wrote: »the solution to inflation is to cap the maximum gold you can have, anything over the cap is just removed.
else
have tax caps, that above which increasingly larger % of all gold income is removed as tax, at the top end 100% tax would mean you only wall get 0% of the total income of gold, and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.
then Zos just need to implement maximum item prices.
Easily broken. Have dummy accounts that hold gold or keep it in guild banks instead of on players. You'd be rewarding players that have the resources for multiple accounts and punishing the vast majority that likely only have one account. As long as gold can be transferred, a gold cap does nothing. Players could even just store gold as items and materials as many do already in order to combat inflation.
you missed the part "and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.", just chucking gold into alts or a bank wont get around the span of time, especially if that span encapsulates ALL characters on your account.
I didn't miss it, just assumed it was another variable that clever players would work around. Whatever time this span is, players would figure it out and probably even create an addon telling them what time they are able to shift money around to safely avoid taxes. It would create yet another hoop that clever players avoid while the masses get dinged.
the argument of a small number of players with more IRL money than sense to buy multiple copies ESO is not really relevant.
for most people they have 1 account, and the span of time for ALL characters on said account and a global gold limit per account would help, and would be far far far better than now.
likewise Zos hard-limiting the maximum price items can be listed for would also help.
You believe a gold cap will help. I believe it will hurt rather than help. I don't think we can say anything else other than we agree to disagree.0 -
b101uk✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »redspecter23 wrote: »redspecter23 wrote: »the solution to inflation is to cap the maximum gold you can have, anything over the cap is just removed.
else
have tax caps, that above which increasingly larger % of all gold income is removed as tax, at the top end 100% tax would mean you only wall get 0% of the total income of gold, and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.
then Zos just need to implement maximum item prices.
Easily broken. Have dummy accounts that hold gold or keep it in guild banks instead of on players. You'd be rewarding players that have the resources for multiple accounts and punishing the vast majority that likely only have one account. As long as gold can be transferred, a gold cap does nothing. Players could even just store gold as items and materials as many do already in order to combat inflation.
you missed the part "and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.", just chucking gold into alts or a bank wont get around the span of time, especially if that span encapsulates ALL characters on your account.
I didn't miss it, just assumed it was another variable that clever players would work around. Whatever time this span is, players would figure it out and probably even create an addon telling them what time they are able to shift money around to safely avoid taxes. It would create yet another hoop that clever players avoid while the masses get dinged.
the argument of a small number of players with more IRL money than sense to buy multiple copies ESO is not really relevant.
for most people they have 1 account, and the span of time for ALL characters on said account and a global gold limit per account would help, and would be far far far better than now.
likewise Zos hard-limiting the maximum price items can be listed for would also help.
You believe a gold cap will help. I believe it will hurt rather than help. I don't think we can say anything else other than we agree to disagree.
so you think NO gold cap would be better, given that is what we have now, and it is clearly not working, due to the generation of gold out of thin air, and gold just moving around from person to person with out a mechanism to remove an amount permanently out of the system.
not to mention the rampant inflation of items being sold for ever higher prices, as there is no cap to item prices set by Zos or mechanism to remove sizable quantities of gold out of the system over time.0 -
redspecter23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »redspecter23 wrote: »redspecter23 wrote: »the solution to inflation is to cap the maximum gold you can have, anything over the cap is just removed.
else
have tax caps, that above which increasingly larger % of all gold income is removed as tax, at the top end 100% tax would mean you only wall get 0% of the total income of gold, and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.
then Zos just need to implement maximum item prices.
Easily broken. Have dummy accounts that hold gold or keep it in guild banks instead of on players. You'd be rewarding players that have the resources for multiple accounts and punishing the vast majority that likely only have one account. As long as gold can be transferred, a gold cap does nothing. Players could even just store gold as items and materials as many do already in order to combat inflation.
you missed the part "and link income too to a span of time for tax purpose.", just chucking gold into alts or a bank wont get around the span of time, especially if that span encapsulates ALL characters on your account.
I didn't miss it, just assumed it was another variable that clever players would work around. Whatever time this span is, players would figure it out and probably even create an addon telling them what time they are able to shift money around to safely avoid taxes. It would create yet another hoop that clever players avoid while the masses get dinged.
the argument of a small number of players with more IRL money than sense to buy multiple copies ESO is not really relevant.
for most people they have 1 account, and the span of time for ALL characters on said account and a global gold limit per account would help, and would be far far far better than now.
likewise Zos hard-limiting the maximum price items can be listed for would also help.
You believe a gold cap will help. I believe it will hurt rather than help. I don't think we can say anything else other than we agree to disagree.
so you think NO gold cap would be better, given that is what we have now, and it is clearly not working, due to the generation of gold out of thin air, and gold just moving around from person to person with out a mechanism to remove an amount permanently out of the system.
not to mention the rampant inflation of items being sold for ever higher prices, as there is no cap to item prices set by Zos or mechanism to remove sizable quantities of gold out of the system over time.
We agree to disagree and I'll leave it at that as to not derail the thread any further.0 -
dmnqwk✭✭✭✭✭Fixing fake tanks would involve having every dungeon boss automatically aggro the 'tank' only, coupled with applying an 80% damage debuff until they use a taunt to remove it.
If someone has a taunt, they're a tank in this game so let's help ensure they bring one and use it!1 -
MakoRuu✭✭✭✭The Solution is a Reputation System.
At the end of the match, you vote good or bad on a person depending on their performance and their role. You place a cool down on it so that you can't vote for that same person multiple times a day.
Fake tanks would have an extremely low reputation in the red, which would reduce the rewards they get from the Daily. This would be an incentive for them not to abuse the dungeon finder, and it would help your group see "Oh, this person is a fake tank/healer, and we should vote to kick them."
The penalties would be something like -
-Reduced EXP
-Reduced Drop Rate
-Reduced Transmute Crystals
-Debuffed Stats while in the dungeon
In order to keep people from abusing it, you would need to complete an activity with this person to get to vote. This way, you wouldn't have a guild just spam voting on a person to drive their rep down. And with the cool down, you yourself couldn't do it again for 20 -24 hours on THAT person. And them leaving the dungeon doesn't stop you from voting. The window would stay up for you until you choose an option.
Example
You finish Cradle of Shadows, a NB was AWESOME! So they get an upvote to Rep.
The healer was new, but they tried super hard, so they get an upvote.
You don't get to vote on yourself, but you did your best and you filled your DPS role to the best of your abilities, and were doing decent damage. You got an upvote from 3/4 people.
Fake tank, was a Necro in light armor with two destroy staves, constantly dying, never pulled aggro, ignored Group chat, left immediately after the boss was killed. Gets a downvote from 3/4 (the new player doesn't know the system well enough to decide and just leaves.)0 -
AvalonRanger✭✭✭✭✭
✭There's no " FRB" in Elder Scrolls world. That's the biggest reason.
If ZOS want to avoid gold inflation, crafting material price of the shop should be constant price.
It should never change.My playing time Mon-Friday UTC13:00-16:00 [PC-NA] CP over2000 now.
I have [1Tough tank] [1StamSorc-DD] [1Necro-DD] [1Real Healer]
with [1Stam Blade].
But, I'm Tank main player. Recently I'm doing Healer.
2023/12/21
By the way...Dungeon-Meshi(One of Famous Japanese fantasy story comic book) got finale...
Good-bye "King of Monster Eater".
2024/08/23
Farewell Atsuko Tanaka...(-_-) I never forget epic acting for major Motoko Kusanagi.0 -
ForzaRammer✭✭✭✭✭
✭might as well get rid of random dungeon at the same time to fix the group finder que bug
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Pevey✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭redlink1979 wrote: »This "solution" won't fix the "issues" since not all players run the daily random dungeon for the transmute crystals.
Agreed. That is one major reason, but the demand for normal dungeon runs will still far outstrip the supply of tanks who want to be put through that. Because:
1) Leveling undaunted on alts
2) Getting skill points on alts
3) Easier farming of gear than on vet1 -
Pevey✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The Solution is a Reputation System.
...
Fake tanks would have an extremely low reputation in the red, which would reduce the rewards they get from the Daily.
...
You're making a huge leap of logic. I really don't think this rep system idea would turn out this way. Most likely the "fake dps" would end up with the lowest rep. People who can help do the dungeons easily and quickly without being toxic could well have the highest rep. This bucket would include a lot of people you might consider fake tanks and fake healers.
IMO, all this kind of system would end up doing is punish new players and dissuade more people from doing group dungeons at all. That is exactly the opposite of what ZOS would probably want.1 -
Freelancer_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think paid transmutes might put a dent in assuming most of the gold in game is legit but, I don't think it'd fix either fully. (You'd be somewhat at cross purposes as you'd want it priced high to sink money more effectively and low to get the fake players out.)
Some people fake roles to farm dungeons for items or for the xp boost and thus would likely continue.
A reputation system would likely be hard to predict because the population participating in it might not match the normal population (You'd likely have a section of the population queuing just to ding other sections) and the frequency which people run content might also be a factor. (If you aren't after transmutes, the daily reward, or a weapon from a dungeon you probably aren't going to do it more than half a dozen times. The person farming for an item might be running it 40x. It could easily be true that the majority of the game hates the fake tanks/fake healers but, the people running the dungeons the most don't.)
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ForzaRammer✭✭✭✭✭
✭The Solution is a Reputation System.
...
Fake tanks would have an extremely low reputation in the red, which would reduce the rewards they get from the Daily.
...
You're making a huge leap of logic. I really don't think this rep system idea would turn out this way. Most likely the "fake dps" would end up with the lowest rep. People who can help do the dungeons easily and quickly without being toxic could well have the highest rep. This bucket would include a lot of people you might consider fake tanks and fake healers.
IMO, all this kind of system would end up doing is punish new players and dissuade more people from doing group dungeons at all. That is exactly the opposite of what ZOS would probably want.
I think both fake tank and fake dps will end up with low rep, which is lower don’t really matter, they just get matched together, and real tank get matched with average or better dps, great system if zos can implement it without sacrificing performance0
This discussion has been closed.