Time for a Cleansing Ritual change

Wolfpaw

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_Kevin

I apologize for the @zos knock, but Cleansing Ritual is getting out of hand in Cyrodiil: synergy priority, size of Cleansing Ritual, trolls/cheaters

Updated for reasonable solutions

Please reduce the size of Cleansing Ritual to 6meters
or
Make Cleansing Ritual a GROUP only synergy, Purify
or
Make Purify synergy priority below all other synergies
or
In game combat options an Opt-out for certain synergies or synergy types


Edit: accommodate pve feedback

Thank you.

maxjapank

No

Wolfpaw

maxjapank wrote: »

No

A group/player doesn't need a 12m area dot cleanse, at almost no cost.

The size of this skill is absurd, and long overdue to be adjusted with the synergies priority update. This could be handled in pts now if ZOS wants to improve Cyrodiil.

Ratzkifal

Wolfpaw wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert

I apologize for the @zos knock, but Cleansing Ritual is getting out of hand in Cyrodiil. Gaining popularity, is the use of Cleansing Ritual to intentionally Plague break bomb "friendly" players/faction. These players are spamming this skill, placing Purify Synergy above all.

Please reduce the size of Cleansing Ritual to a 6meter area, 12 is unnecessary.

Thank you.

Wolfpaw wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

No

A group/player doesn't need a 12m area dot cleanse, at almost no cost.

The size of this skill is absurd, and long overdue to be adjusted with the synergies priority update. This could be handled in pts now if ZOS wants to improve Cyrodiil.

How do you know they are intentionally doing it? And furthermore if they really are intentionally doing it, why would they use Cleansing Ritual and not Purge - you know, the skill that doesn't give you a choice if you want to activate a synergy or not.

Also the synergy has been adjusted with the synergies priority update already and it was deemed most important as long as you have a negative effect on you. Don't forget PvE players are using this skill too and if they can't cleanse a lethal effect because someone is spamming orbs...

You know what is an L2P issue though? Not activating that synergy when you know you have Plague Break on you. Sure, you cannot control everyone in your zerg, but that is kind of the point of a zerg killer set isn't it?

Wolfpaw

Ratzkifal wrote: »

Wolfpaw wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert

I apologize for the @zos knock, but Cleansing Ritual is getting out of hand in Cyrodiil. Gaining popularity, is the use of Cleansing Ritual to intentionally Plague break bomb "friendly" players/faction. These players are spamming this skill, placing Purify Synergy above all.

Please reduce the size of Cleansing Ritual to a 6meter area, 12 is unnecessary.

Thank you.

Wolfpaw wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

No

A group/player doesn't need a 12m area dot cleanse, at almost no cost.

The size of this skill is absurd, and long overdue to be adjusted with the synergies priority update. This could be handled in pts now if ZOS wants to improve Cyrodiil.

How do you know they are intentionally doing it? And furthermore if they really are intentionally doing it, why would they use Cleansing Ritual and not Purge - you know, the skill that doesn't give you a choice if you want to activate a synergy or not.

Also the synergy has been adjusted with the synergies priority update already and it was deemed most important as long as you have a negative effect on you. Don't forget PvE players are using this skill too and if they can't cleanse a lethal effect because someone is spamming orbs...

You know what is an L2P issue though? Not activating that synergy when you know you have Plague Break on you. Sure, you cannot control everyone in your zerg, but that is kind of the point of a zerg killer set isn't it?

Good questions,

We know because we have setup scenarios and watched players try to cleanse their PB, with 20k health, running into friendly groups. We know because the same "friendly" players seem to show up when fighting/taking keeps while their buddy on enemy faction is spamming PB+Silver shards. We know because that's the only skill they activate.

Purge is a group only skill.

Group PvE synergy is done in a safe space instance.

Beside the point of cheating, the size of this skill cancels all synergies when spammed.

Cut the size in half, or make it into a group only skill for Purify.

guarstompemoji

I'm willing to believe some players are being malicious, but imagine more are just used to casting the skill. Others view it as the best purge available, as it's selectable by the user.

It's also a good HoT for placing under ram or other areas where there is consistent, incoming damage.

If someone wanted to be more markedly malicious, they could use Purge. Purge hits an area, and doesn't give friendlies an option. They could use Curse Eater, which offers no to little visual cue that it's being used.

Too, there's plugins that block synergies, or certain synergies.

The issue isn't really the class; it's the item set.

One of the reasons that it'd be nice to have Oakensoul separated from ww is it lets them be balanced separately, and similar reasons which HackTheMinotaur outlined rather eloquently.

Wolfpaw

guarstompemoji wrote: »

I'm willing to believe some players are being malicious, but imagine more are just used to casting the skill. Others view it as the best purge available, as it's selectable by the user.

It's also a good HoT for placing under ram or other areas where there is consistent, incoming damage.

If someone wanted to be more markedly malicious, they could use Purge. Purge hits an area, and doesn't give friendlies an option. They could use Curse Eater, which offers no to little visual cue that it's being used.

Too, there's plugins that block synergies, or certain synergies.

The issue isn't really the class; it's the item set.

One of the reasons that it'd be nice to have Oakensoul separated from ww is it lets them be balanced separately, and similar reasons which HackTheMinotaur outlined rather eloquently.

ZOS could make this skill group only synergy, Purify.

Ratzkifal

Wolfpaw wrote: »

guarstompemoji wrote: »

I'm willing to believe some players are being malicious, but imagine more are just used to casting the skill. Others view it as the best purge available, as it's selectable by the user.

It's also a good HoT for placing under ram or other areas where there is consistent, incoming damage.

If someone wanted to be more markedly malicious, they could use Purge. Purge hits an area, and doesn't give friendlies an option. They could use Curse Eater, which offers no to little visual cue that it's being used.

Too, there's plugins that block synergies, or certain synergies.

The issue isn't really the class; it's the item set.

One of the reasons that it'd be nice to have Oakensoul separated from ww is it lets them be balanced separately, and similar reasons which HackTheMinotaur outlined rather eloquently.

ZOS could make this skill group only synergy, Purify.

And then you can't be solo anymore because all of your helpful skills only work on groups. No thanks.
As Guarstompemoji says, it's the set that's the problem not the skill. The only change ZOS could make that would make sense is lower the synergy's priority in Cyrodiil only.
But let me ask you, what other synergy is so important in PvP it needs to be activated so much that your group keeps wiping because they accidentally use the cleanse synergy?

BahometZ

If people are actually intentionally purge bombing their own people, then let them, they are sad weird creatures deserving pity.

renne

BahometZ wrote: »

If people are actually intentionally purge bombing their own people, then let them, they are sad weird creatures deserving pity.

This.

And it's certainly not a "at almost no cost" skill in the slightest.

Ratzkifal

BahometZ wrote: »

If people are actually intentionally purge bombing their own people, then let them, they are sad weird creatures deserving pity.

And probably reportable creatures too. The question is just if something will be done about it or not. Proving intent can be pretty tough.

YandereGirlfriend

Ravenwatch exists and we like this skill the way that it is.

M0ntie

Absolutely not. It’s a weaker heal and it has the disadvantage of being centred on the caster so not OP and a nice part of the Templar healer’s kit. There is nothing wrong with it in PVE. Fix Plague breaker if there is a problem with that.

M0ntie

Also making the size smaller wouldn’t stop this trolling your own faction in any case.

merpins

Nope, it's not time to cut this skill in half. It's time ZoS actually starts balancing PVP and PVE separately so the game can actually become balanced rather than constantly teeter-tottering back and forth between PVE and PVP. Don't nerf PVE skills because PVP skills are overtuned, and don't buff a skill for PVE only to be surprised that it's overperforming in pvp. Just balance both sides of the game separately already, for god's sake, ZoS.

renne

M0ntie wrote: »

Also making the size smaller wouldn’t stop this trolling your own faction in any case.

If anything that could make it worse because people would bunch up for the heal.

RaikaNA

Stop nerfing ***. Leave this skill alone.

FeedbackOnly

It's requiree little skill for what it does too Half the size would make it better.

Pevey

This is one of the few remaining skills that make templars unique.

If you have a saboteur in group, kick them out. Problem solved.

JanTanhide

Nope. Stop asking for nerfs.

kojou

If a player wanted to be malicious wouldn't it be easier to cast Efficient Purge and not have your trolling be optional? It seems to me like the "good guys" would use Ritual so a friendly player would have the option to cleanse when it made sense for him/her.

Pevey

kojou wrote: »

If a player wanted to be malicious wouldn't it be easier to cast Efficient Purge and not have your trolling be optional? It seems to me like the "good guys" would use Ritual so a friendly player would have the option to cleanse when it made sense for him/her.

Agreed. I think this other player is probably trying to help, and a little communication would go a long way.

BXR_Lonestar

Wolfpaw wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_Kevin

I apologize for the @zos knock, but Cleansing Ritual is getting out of hand in Cyrodiil. Gaining popularity, is the use of Cleansing Ritual to intentionally Plague break bomb "friendly" players/faction. These players are spamming this skill, placing Purify Synergy above all.

Please reduce the size of Cleansing Ritual to a 6meter area, 12 is unnecessary.

Edit: Cleansing Ritual a group only synergy, Purify.

Thank you.

It has its uses in PVE. Not sure why PVP should dictate balancing decisions for the entire game. IMO it is fine as is.

Kahnak

You want to nerf an ability because, you allege, people are using it to sabotage groups.

It couldn't be because people are just using the ability and other people are not paying enough attention to their debuffs. It's got to be sabotage by some malicious outsider secretly working for another faction...who used a heal/cleanse on your group?

I honestly can't imagine a more poorly thought out reason to nerf an ability. Look inward, dude. The reason your groups are dying is because they don't know how to deal with a popular set.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Admittedly, I have often thought that Purge and Ritual should just be removed from the game (purge more than ritual), but this post makes me LOL. If you really were doing this intentionally, you wouldn't give groups the option of the synergy with Ritual, you would just use Purge. I am a big fan of any set that counters Purge abuse.

Dojohoda

Just because an plague break infected person synergizes ritual doesn't mean ritual should be nerfed.

spartaxoxo

Misuse of pinging all the mods just makes them less likely to pay attention to their pings.

And this is such a bad reason to nerf a skill.

umagon

Plaguebreak will also detonate when the effected target dies. With certain skill combos the plaguebreak debuff can be applied and the target killed a second later; if any of their allies are in range it amplifies the damage.

And with the hybridization changes it’s now completely viable to run mag builds in 5+ medium giving players plenty of weapon/spell damage to drive both plaguebreak and dark convergence on the same build. Allowing for ranged bombing of groups of players who stand too close to each other.

For example, medium magblade stealth bomber builds are a thing now, you just charge the meteor ult then buff the spell damage to the max and let it rip at the squishiest target in the pack. Sometimes they all blow up thinking someone used purge. It’s kind of fun at times.

Wolfpaw

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Misuse of pinging all the mods just makes them less likely to pay attention to their pings.

And this is such a bad reason to nerf a skill.

The order of operations for synergies is fine, it's when one skill can cover such a large space killing Off any opportunity for other synergies. If ZOS devs want healthy PvP this needs addressed.

The responses against speaks volumes of the basic understanding of the game's combat...Purge. Purge is group only and no synergy, those responses are easy to pass over.

So yes, half the size of Cleansing Ritual or make the synergy group only Purify and keep the size.

Just bringing this to front page will have the desired outcome I was hoping for, now every platform will see players abusing this.

Hopefully a change will happen in a pts down the road.

Wolfpaw

Ratzkifal wrote: »

Wolfpaw wrote: »

guarstompemoji wrote: »

I'm willing to believe some players are being malicious, but imagine more are just used to casting the skill. Others view it as the best purge available, as it's selectable by the user.

It's also a good HoT for placing under ram or other areas where there is consistent, incoming damage.

If someone wanted to be more markedly malicious, they could use Purge. Purge hits an area, and doesn't give friendlies an option. They could use Curse Eater, which offers no to little visual cue that it's being used.

Too, there's plugins that block synergies, or certain synergies.

The issue isn't really the class; it's the item set.

One of the reasons that it'd be nice to have Oakensoul separated from ww is it lets them be balanced separately, and similar reasons which HackTheMinotaur outlined rather eloquently.

ZOS could make this skill group only synergy, Purify.

And then you can't be solo anymore because all of your helpful skills only work on groups. No thanks.
As Guarstompemoji says, it's the set that's the problem not the skill. The only change ZOS could make that would make sense is lower the synergy's priority in Cyrodiil only.
But let me ask you, what other synergy is so important in PvP it needs to be activated so much that your group keeps wiping because they accidentally use the cleanse synergy?

Every synergy is more important than Cleansing Ritual in PvP, every single one.

I am not opposed to making Cleansing Ritual synergy Purify priority at the bottom/last, added to initial post.

Ratzkifal

Wolfpaw wrote: »

Ratzkifal wrote: »

Wolfpaw wrote: »

guarstompemoji wrote: »

I'm willing to believe some players are being malicious, but imagine more are just used to casting the skill. Others view it as the best purge available, as it's selectable by the user.

It's also a good HoT for placing under ram or other areas where there is consistent, incoming damage.

If someone wanted to be more markedly malicious, they could use Purge. Purge hits an area, and doesn't give friendlies an option. They could use Curse Eater, which offers no to little visual cue that it's being used.

Too, there's plugins that block synergies, or certain synergies.

The issue isn't really the class; it's the item set.

One of the reasons that it'd be nice to have Oakensoul separated from ww is it lets them be balanced separately, and similar reasons which HackTheMinotaur outlined rather eloquently.

ZOS could make this skill group only synergy, Purify.

And then you can't be solo anymore because all of your helpful skills only work on groups. No thanks.
As Guarstompemoji says, it's the set that's the problem not the skill. The only change ZOS could make that would make sense is lower the synergy's priority in Cyrodiil only.
But let me ask you, what other synergy is so important in PvP it needs to be activated so much that your group keeps wiping because they accidentally use the cleanse synergy?

Every synergy is more important than Cleansing Ritual in PvP, every single one.

I am not opposed to making Cleansing Ritual synergy Purify priority at the bottom/last, added to initial post.

You are saying every single one. I'm saying not even a single one. If your build doesn't have a cleanse, you will appreciate having that synergy over something useless like Feeding Frenzy from a werewolf or Orbs. Without a cleanse you are completely open to people stacking dots on you. The only one I can see actually having a big issue with the Ritual synergy being on top is Necros who want to use their own boneyard synergy to deal damage using the Harmony trait, but I'm pretty sure that your own Boneyard has priority over everything else, including cleansing ritual.