Etiquette in PVE?

Bookslinger

I'm new (8 characters from 4-20) so have barely scratched the surface. I often run a delve ( ? Is that the right term?) and see other players. I never know if it's considered rude to jump in and fight alongside them or whether I should hang back. I discovered it can take quite a bit before respawn if I do hang back, and I need that XP and drops, too. But I don't want to be rude. Can you kill steal, etc., here? Are there hard and fast, "Don't be that guy" rules?

FluffyReachWitch

Hi, welcome to the game!

Kill stealing isn’t really a thing in this game. Most of the time everyone gets experience and loot for participating in a fight and it’s common practice to just jump right into an active battle. You will rarely encounter players who want an area of enemies to themselves; experienced players who want to level grind tend to prefer instanced areas where only their group members can join them.

Loot can be scarce when there’s a large crowd fighting the same thing. The 12 people who do the most damage get loot. This is usually only a problem when a new zone DLC is released and everyone wants to do the new bosses, or when there’s a special event and everyone has quests to go fight the same boss. In those scenarios I try to grab my boss loot and get out of the way so someone else can have a chance.

General PvE etiquette:

• If someone is fighting a group of monsters next to a treasure chest, or trying to pick the lock and failing, just let them be. Chest sniping is usually frowned upon.
• The above does not apply in group dungeons or trials. Every single group member gets their own loot from those chests and heavy sacks. In trials there are some places where you will need to wait to open chests, and a good trial leader will let you know when those times are.
• Try not to leave unwanted stuff at chests or resources if you can help it. People don’t like finding nothing but bugs when they go to harvest cloth.
• When it comes to dolmens, people usually like to leave all four pinions open until every single monster has been killed. This lets people get more Fighters Guild points and increases the time other people have to get to dolmens before the boss fight.
• If your character has combat pets, it’s good etiquette to unsummon them in towns, especially around crafting areas and writ turn in points. This is because they can block people from talking to NPCs or activating objects. You can unsummon them by opening your character’s stats, finding them in the buffs list, and right clicking on them.
• Once you acquire mudballs, don’t mudball players at outfit stations, and don’t mudball anyone who asks you to stop.

redspecter23

For delve bosses, if you miss one and are waiting on a respawn, leave the room and reenter. Typically about 50 feet or so is fine. If it's your first time killing that boss, you can force a respawn much faster, often less than a minute since it was killed previously. That way you won't necessarily feel rushed to get to the boss for credit and keep up with others that may be going faster.

As for whether other players find it rude for you to fight alongside them, that's up to that player I guess. If you get the feeling the other player is trying to shake you off, feel free to hold back a moment. If it looks like they may be slowing down and waiting on you, feel free to keep up.

I also wanted to reiterate an important point from above and elaborate. If someone asks you to stop doing anything, it's a good idea to examine if you really, need to do that thing and perhaps stop it if it directly affects that other player. Mudballs were mentioned, but anything that another player feels is harassment can be reported and potentially acted upon by game moderators. T bagging in pvp is a good example of something that in isolation isn't bannable, but never continue it if asked to stop. It's probably best not to do it at all, but definitely stop if asked by another player to do so.

El_Borracho

The only time I have encountered someone not wanting company is fishing. While most of the time people want more players as it ups the chances for a rare fish, some players are there to farm the fish for a chance at Perfect Roe and they don't want you taking "their" fish

Necrotech_Master

El_Borracho wrote: »

The only time I have encountered someone not wanting company is fishing. While most of the time people want more players as it ups the chances for a rare fish, some players are there to farm the fish for a chance at Perfect Roe and they don't want you taking "their" fish

whenever i fished trying for rare fish, i generally preferred fishing alone because the fishing hole ran out faster and the absolute minimum bonus you get for fishing with others i feel is completely negated by this

i never stopped someone from fishing with me though and sometimes fished with friends too lol, but that is one thing i noticed about it is you get like roughly 14-16 fish catches when you are at your own hole, and that number gets reduced based on people fishing with you, less casts per hole = more running around finding new holes and less chances (casts) to get rare fish

Bookslinger

Thank you, everyone. I always try to be considerate of those around me, but I feel better about jumping in sometimes. And I do hang back at others just because you get that "feeling." Can't imagine ever continuing to do something after someone asked me to stop--or even starting anything--but you never know. I was worried I might steal kills if I jumped in, so that's a load off.

I've only been in on one dolmen and have no idea what pinions are. (Yet another thing to look up!). I was mudballed the other day or at least in the way of it happening to someone else. It was in town and I shrugged it off. Not sure if it was even aimed at me. Don't even know how to do it. Seems the sort of thing you might do with buddies when goofing around. Told you I'm new!

Still waiting to learn how to fish. I'll figure that one out eventually! I imagine it's a side quest? When I do, I promise no poaching fishing spots. I might not have known not to share fishing spots, so thanks for the tip.

FluffyReachWitch

Pinions are the things that pop up as monsters die at dolmens, and you reach your hand in to close it. There are four that appear around the dolmen during the fight, and then a final one is closed to get rid of the dark anchor at the end and make the chest appear.

Mud balls are a holiday item! At the end of the year there's an event called New Life that lasts for a couple of weeks. During New Life, you go to Eastmarch to get quests to do holiday activities around Tamriel. One involves flinging mud balls at people and doesn't require you to have the items. In each box of New Life rewards, you have a chance to get a few individual mud balls, and there is a small chance of getting a collectable item called a Mud Ball Pouch, which lets you throw infinite mud balls. If you have gold, you can try visiting guild traders to buy these things instead of waiting all year.

Fishing only requires bait. Bait is all over the world and easy to collect naturally over time, especially if you kill small animals like frogs and giant centipedes, and loot plenty of undead. Other than having the right bait for the water, it's really just a matter of casting your line and waiting for a bite. All characters have a fishing rod and no quest is required.

By the way, the chance of getting rare fish is increased the more people fish at the same hole. So while some people prefer to fish alone, others hope you'll join them. There are other ways to increase your chance of rare fish once you've been playing a while.

El_Borracho

@Necrotech_Master agreed. But fishing was the only time I've ever had someone ask me to leave. I did. But it stood out

Danikat

Just to clarify one important point: there is no kill stealing, XP stealing or loot stealing in this game. The only reason someone may prefer to fight solo is because they want to see if they can do it or if they're testing a build or something.

Most of PvE is pretty easy so anyone with a decent build can wipe out enemies in seconds and that can make it hard to gauge how effective you would be alone. But anyone doing that in public areas (including delves) will be aware that other people can and will show up and shouldn't object to you joining in, even if they wanted to do it solo.

Also the rules mentioned above for treasure chests also apply to crafting materials. If someone is fighting enemies right on top of a material node it's probably because they were about to collect it when they were attacked and taking it while they're fighting is rude.

AcadianPaladin

In overland, I generally jump in on bosses.

There is one situation I don't try to 'help'. If I see a character running around gathering lots of foes into a big group, then burning them down all at once before looking for another group, I leave them alone. They are trying to rack up XP and kills and having help is less efficient for them. This is not the same as taking down a boss where whoever gets some hits in gets XP for the kill. With large groups like these XP farming players are farming, the foes generally die in one hit from their burst so it is counterproductive for them if you 'help'. Other than that one situation, I usually jump right in. Even though I can and do solo many World Bosses, I never object if other players join in.

ellmarie

That's such a nice question to ask! I know, I try to be nice. Because I was once new too. I always like to help people out. But if I see a lower level I try to hang back so they can get their XP in. I will go slower. But obviously for a boss, I'll jump in and do a few jabs. It's hard to know what others want, unless they say something in zone chat. I'll never object to help either.

WhiteCoatSyndrome

If you start running dungeons, after you kill the last boss check with your group if they need you to hang around a while - reason being, when everyone leaves the group the game starts a countdown before kicking everyone out, and they might have a quest to complete.

Ilsabet

WhiteCoatSyndrome wrote: »

If you start running dungeons, after you kill the last boss check with your group if they need you to hang around a while - reason being, when everyone leaves the group the game starts a countdown before kicking everyone out, and they might have a quest to complete.

With this one I generally port out of the dungeon when we're done, so I can go about my business but I'm still in the party in case anyone has stuff to do before they leave. Then when I see on the party list that everybody's out of the dungeon, I leave the party (presuming everyone else hasn't already dropped).

newtinmpls

WhiteCoatSyndrome wrote: »

If you start running dungeons, after you kill the last boss check with your group if they need you to hang around a while - reason being, when everyone leaves the group the game starts a countdown before kicking everyone out, and they might have a quest to complete.

Also if all the chests (usually 2 chests, 2 heavy sacks) have not been found, it allows time to go back and look for them (and chests are the only other place besides the last boss where you can get weapon drops).

M_Volsung

Drop your username and what server you're on here and I'll bet you'll have quite a few people willing to help you out in game in no time.

WhiteCoatSyndrome

Ilsabet wrote: »

With this one I generally port out of the dungeon when we're done, so I can go about my business but I'm still in the party in case anyone has stuff to do before they leave. Then when I see on the party list that everybody's out of the dungeon, I leave the party (presuming everyone else hasn't already dropped).

Ooo, that’s a good idea. *makes note*

LannStone

An observation on the dolmen pinions - I agree with the principle of leaving them alone until all the monsters are dead, but remember that closing one also refreshes magicka, health and stamina, so sometimes players need to jump in for a quick refresh, [snip]

[edited for potential bait]

Amottica

FluffyReachWitch wrote: »

Hi, welcome to the game!

Kill stealing isn’t really a thing in this game. Most of the time everyone gets experience and loot for participating in a fight and it’s common practice to just jump right into an active battle. You will rarely encounter players who want an area of enemies to themselves; experienced players who want to level grind tend to prefer instanced areas where only their group members can join them.

Loot can be scarce when there’s a large crowd fighting the same thing. The 12 people who do the most damage get loot. This is usually only a problem when a new zone DLC is released and everyone wants to do the new bosses, or when there’s a special event and everyone has quests to go fight the same boss. In those scenarios I try to grab my boss loot and get out of the way so someone else can have a chance.

General PvE etiquette:

• If someone is fighting a group of monsters next to a treasure chest, or trying to pick the lock and failing, just let them be. Chest sniping is usually frowned upon.
• The above does not apply in group dungeons or trials. Every single group member gets their own loot from those chests and heavy sacks. In trials there are some places where you will need to wait to open chests, and a good trial leader will let you know when those times are.
• Try not to leave unwanted stuff at chests or resources if you can help it. People don’t like finding nothing but bugs when they go to harvest cloth.
• When it comes to dolmens, people usually like to leave all four pinions open until every single monster has been killed. This lets people get more Fighters Guild points and increases the time other people have to get to dolmens before the boss fight.
• If your character has combat pets, it’s good etiquette to unsummon them in towns, especially around crafting areas and writ turn in points. This is because they can block people from talking to NPCs or activating objects. You can unsummon them by opening your character’s stats, finding them in the buffs list, and right clicking on them.
• Once you acquire mudballs, don’t mudball players at outfit stations, and don’t mudball anyone who asks you to stop.

I agree with this except part of the first point.

If someone is fighting a group next to a chest or any node it is best to move on and leave them to that node. However, if they are picking a lock and fail that chest if fair game. There is a clear mechanism that locks them out from attempting the chest for a few seconds which is clearly designed to give someone else a shot.

With that being said, there will be some people who get upset at things that they should not. I was going for a node and someone else was heading for the same node. I beat them and harvested it yet they sent me a hate whisper for taking their node. There was nothing I could do to hinder them and I was not even using anything to increase my speed. Some people just get upset easily.

Hope you enjoy the game.

ghastley

If someone is taking on a World Boss solo, I generally check the health bars before joining. If the boss is losing, let them finish it off. If it’s winning, then give some help.
The harder choice is when someone is close, but hasn’t started combat. Are they checking their equipment and food? Do not stand behind them and toss ranged attacks to pull the boss closer!

ellmarie

Wow speaking of etiquette. So my newbie level 24 nightblade is trying to farm dolmens in deshaan and of course some level 1880 just obliterated everything in site befor I could even get a shot in...and of course when that happens you don't get squat. Gee thanks. That's the kind of crap I can't stand. We know at that level you can pretty much obliterate anything. :rollsyes: sigh

AcadianPaladin

ellmarie wrote: »

Wow speaking of etiquette. So my newbie level 24 nightblade is trying to farm dolmens in deshaan and of course some level 1880 just obliterated everything in site befor I could even get a shot in...and of course when that happens you don't get squat. Gee thanks. That's the kind of crap I can't stand. We know at that level you can pretty much obliterate anything. :rollsyes: sigh

This is when playing a high level healer is nice. Newbs never complain and always appreciate support from a healer since it buffs them up, keeps them healthy and, most importantly, does not obliterate foes that they're trying to kill.

ellmarie

AcadianPaladin wrote: »

ellmarie wrote: »

Wow speaking of etiquette. So my newbie level 24 nightblade is trying to farm dolmens in deshaan and of course some level 1880 just obliterated everything in site befor I could even get a shot in...and of course when that happens you don't get squat. Gee thanks. That's the kind of crap I can't stand. We know at that level you can pretty much obliterate anything. :rollsyes: sigh

This is when playing a high level healer is nice. Newbs never complain and always appreciate support from a healer since it buffs them up, keeps them healthy and, most importantly, does not obliterate foes that they're trying to kill.

It's different when your doing a dungeon or something, but when your just out an about, doing a dolmen when no one else is around, you really need to make some kills to make it count. I'm almost level 1300 so I know. When I see low level characters, I let them do it, just there to help.

El_Borracho

ellmarie wrote: »

Wow speaking of etiquette. So my newbie level 24 nightblade is trying to farm dolmens in deshaan and of course some level 1880 just obliterated everything in site befor I could even get a shot in...and of course when that happens you don't get squat. Gee thanks. That's the kind of crap I can't stand. We know at that level you can pretty much obliterate anything. :rollsyes: sigh

I don't know how that is possible if you were there from the beginning, i.e. the adds who summon the anchor. Either way, hate to break it to you, but that is everyone's problem regardless of your level. It has more to do with the server lag than the CP 1880 player.

Necrotech_Master

El_Borracho wrote: »

ellmarie wrote: »

Wow speaking of etiquette. So my newbie level 24 nightblade is trying to farm dolmens in deshaan and of course some level 1880 just obliterated everything in site befor I could even get a shot in...and of course when that happens you don't get squat. Gee thanks. That's the kind of crap I can't stand. We know at that level you can pretty much obliterate anything. :rollsyes: sigh

I don't know how that is possible if you were there from the beginning, i.e. the adds who summon the anchor. Either way, hate to break it to you, but that is everyone's problem regardless of your level. It has more to do with the server lag than the CP 1880 player.

the dolmen wont count credit or you unless you deal at least 1 point of dmg to 1 enemy that is spawned, and they were complaining that because everything was basically dying immediately on spawn, they didnt have a chance to hit anything since they were low lvl and might not have had any large aoe (like caltrops, great way to get dolmen credit)

i havent tested only healing if that works to get you credit too

AcadianPaladin

Speaking of testing on a dolmen, my healer just ran two dolmens in Grahtwood. She was there from start to finish on both and both had a nice mix of about half a dozen characters. On the first dolmen, she stayed on her resto and only cast healing/buff spells but also wove resto light attacks, generating a bit of damage. She got plenty of yellow corpses to loot and the final chest. On the second one, she was very careful to do exactly zero damage while keeping everyone healed and buffed. Not even a light attack. No corpses, no final chest.

Daewind

Amottica wrote: »

FluffyReachWitch wrote: »

Hi, welcome to the game!

General PvE etiquette:

• If someone is fighting a group of monsters next to a treasure chest, or trying to pick the lock and failing, just let them be. Chest sniping is usually frowned upon.
  
  I agree with this except part of the first point.
  
  If someone is fighting a group next to a chest or any node it is best to move on and leave them to that node. However, if they are picking a lock and fail that chest if fair game. There is a clear mechanism that locks them out from attempting the chest for a few seconds which is clearly designed to give someone else a shot.

Yeah, I can accept your remark, but chest sniping happens quite a lot: I am fighting mobs around a chest and some players see that as a cowardly opportunity to pick lock the chest while I'm entangled in the fight.
Same lack of etiquette with dungeons: you select a particular dungeon (not just rnd) because of the intro quest for the undaunted line. You get a pug, you say at the beginning you need to do the quest and ask to give you at least the time to pick up the quest and hand it it, but before you know some players are rushing to the end completely ignoring what you've asked.

Etiquette is a nice word, but my experience is that its implication is often hard to find. I feel too many people just rush for a kick, more xp, more gold, etc. and do not care about anything else.
Not sure if this tendency towards greedy behaviour will benefit the game in the long run as that kind of players often migrate fast to another game.
It's the main reason I only take a subscription now when a new expansion comes out so I can solo a bit in peace (for which this game is still great fun).

Marginis

Just one point:

If someone is picking a locked treasure chest and fails, I will lockpick the chest, give them a flourishy bow, say thank you for the lockpicking opportunity, and trade them all the loot from the treasure chest. Not only do they not get mad, you also get to show off. Win-win. XD

kringled_1

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

ellmarie wrote: »

Wow speaking of etiquette. So my newbie level 24 nightblade is trying to farm dolmens in deshaan and of course some level 1880 just obliterated everything in site befor I could even get a shot in...and of course when that happens you don't get squat. Gee thanks. That's the kind of crap I can't stand. We know at that level you can pretty much obliterate anything. :rollsyes: sigh

I don't know how that is possible if you were there from the beginning, i.e. the adds who summon the anchor. Either way, hate to break it to you, but that is everyone's problem regardless of your level. It has more to do with the server lag than the CP 1880 player.

the dolmen wont count credit or you unless you deal at least 1 point of dmg to 1 enemy that is spawned, and they were complaining that because everything was basically dying immediately on spawn, they didnt have a chance to hit anything since they were low lvl and might not have had any large aoe (like caltrops, great way to get dolmen credit)

i havent tested only healing if that works to get you credit too

It's nearly impossible for one person to shut someone else out of dolmen credit unless they arrived very very late. All the intermediate spawns have multiple spawns on different sides of the dolmen.
If it's alikr or something similar with a crowd then yes, I can see someone not getting credit.

Necrotech_Master

kringled_1 wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

ellmarie wrote: »

Wow speaking of etiquette. So my newbie level 24 nightblade is trying to farm dolmens in deshaan and of course some level 1880 just obliterated everything in site befor I could even get a shot in...and of course when that happens you don't get squat. Gee thanks. That's the kind of crap I can't stand. We know at that level you can pretty much obliterate anything. :rollsyes: sigh

I don't know how that is possible if you were there from the beginning, i.e. the adds who summon the anchor. Either way, hate to break it to you, but that is everyone's problem regardless of your level. It has more to do with the server lag than the CP 1880 player.

the dolmen wont count credit or you unless you deal at least 1 point of dmg to 1 enemy that is spawned, and they were complaining that because everything was basically dying immediately on spawn, they didnt have a chance to hit anything since they were low lvl and might not have had any large aoe (like caltrops, great way to get dolmen credit)

i havent tested only healing if that works to get you credit too

It's nearly impossible for one person to shut someone else out of dolmen credit unless they arrived very very late. All the intermediate spawns have multiple spawns on different sides of the dolmen.
If it's alikr or something similar with a crowd then yes, I can see someone not getting credit.

thats what i kind of figured, if it was a solo or small group, the other person likely just arrived too late to hit anything, or an alikr situation where there was too much going on

as noted earlier in the thread doing only heals does not give dolmen credit, so if they got there and was healing people without attacking, it would also not have given any dolmen credit

El_Borracho

@Necrotech_Master and @kringled_1 that's what I was getting at. The only times I've been shut out are when I am there late or in Alik'r where all you see are black shadows due to too many players. Best bet in any situation is to run up and spam AOEs all over the place and hope you hit something. But I don't know how you get shut out from the beginning by one player.

Gundug

Not to belabor the dolmen conversation, but it is possible to receive full credit and rewards for dolmen by simply arriving and pulling the final pinion after the boss. You do not need to inflict any damage whatsoever. When I rarely end up soloing dolmen, I keep an eye out for a few seconds at that point in case someone should come running along to catch it. There was a case where a person did, and I indicated to them that they should close the final pinion for a reward.