Dark prospects of ESO ingame economy

DinoZavr

Amottica wrote: »

In other words, how limiting that information is makes it very misleading.

Misleading? Why?
My goal was to indicate the gold inflation we are discussing now, and as i have already mentioned in my previous post here it is largely caused by the combined effects of U28 (StickerBook) plus U32 (Curated Drops)).
Crown exchange networks happily accept Chromium Plating instead of gold.
I don't have Gold to Crowns exchange rate recorded, so i used Chromium Plating instead as it is one of the means to convert one's gold into something more inflation-resilient.

i started playing about 3 years ago and 300:1 Gold/Crown rate was typical at these times, not it is 2000:1..2500:1 at PC EU
or what am i missing?

jaws343

Woozywyvern wrote: »

DinoZavr wrote: »

I ll just leave it here.

PC EU - Chromium Plating


Courtesy of UESP: https://esosales.uesp.net/?text=chromium+plating&level=&quality=&trait=&itemtype=&equiptype=&weapontype=&armortype=&timeperiod=31558150&saletype=all&server=EU

I do find it interesting that the price was pretty much stable until Blackwood. Something changed with the Blackwood release? Certainly puts doubt on the crafting writ argument as they have been the same ease of access for PC players for ages.

Looks more like market manipulation to me.

PVP was undergoing a ton of overhaul around the time of Blackwood release. So many players were constantly changing up their setups.

The Crit cap was introduced later in the year, which led to even more shake up in builds and requiring even more mats for crafting.

So the demand is following an expected progression. But it is also important to note that PC has always had higher pricing at the base for items compared to console. Trading add-ons just work to compound price increases. For example, on Xbox, Chromium Platings were around 80-90K per this time last year, and with the Blackwood and Deadlands updates, that price is now around 100K per right now. So only a 10-20K increase or so. We see inflation and price increases due to updates, but, it is far more controlled without the centralized trading information available on PC.

Amottica

Below is Tempering Alloy which is a much more widely used gold upgrade material than Chromium. It's cost seems to have decreased over the past year which is deflation.

Rosin for wood. It shows a slight increase in price from a year ago, but a decrease in price from about 340 days ago.

there does not seem to be an indication of the inflation some are claiming.

I looked at Rubedite ingot, which did not show any inflation, and Rubedite ore, which has decreased in price over the past year, to see if the base material showed notable inflation. I did not post them here as the post would become annoyingly long, if not already.

I will also note that USEP considers this system to be Early Beta. It also appears to gather data from players using a specific addon USEP developed. So while it uses "real" information it may have a limited number of users.

Amottica

DinoZavr wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

In other words, how limiting that information is makes it very misleading.

Misleading? Why?
My goal was to indicate the gold inflation we are discussing now, and as i have already mentioned in my previous post here it is largely caused by the combined effects of U28 (StickerBook) plus U32 (Curated Drops)).
Crown exchange networks happily accept Chromium Plating instead of gold.
I don't have Gold to Crowns exchange rate recorded, so i used Chromium Plating instead as it is one of the means to convert one's gold into something more inflation-resilient.

i started playing about 3 years ago and 300:1 Gold/Crown rate was typical at these times, not it is 2000:1..2500:1 at PC EU
or what am i missing?

@DinoZavr

Please look at my post above as I have provided the information from two other materials and noted what another two indicated. One item can be very misleading, as seems to be the case with Chromium.

Also, the gold to crown state is irrelevant as that is not truly in-game. It requires players to spend real-world money which has real-world influences that are not reflected in-game.

DinoZavr

@Amottica

yes, i do understand these trends.
unfortunately, i am absolutely not an economist.

i'd subdivide tradeable commodities into 4 big categories:
1) Crafting material, including raw, processed and improvement materials (might be obtained predictably)
2) BoE armor, weapons and jewelry (now, with StickerBook + Curated drops these prices dropped)
3) Furnishing plans, motif pages (this depends on RNG, also after Elsweyr, motif pages got cooldowns - prices went up)
4) Event and Luxury vendor stuff

i'd prefer not to make a separate categories for Companions' gear, Crafted furniture and sealed Crafting Writs,|
hoping theirs share on the market is low.

Disregarding Gold:Crowns ratio:
- materials prices are relatively stable
- gear prices dropped
- furnishing and motifs prices went up

Who favors that: new players, as now they can fill theirs StickerBooks for less price
Who get disadvantage: fashion and furnishing
Who fail miserably: CS gifts buyers

Now, do i get it right?

Parasaurolophus

God! I told! Told you! I said that crafting writs are just an extremely efficient generator of gold and materials and that it will ultimately destroy the economy. Then I received a lot of toxic comments in my address, many players urged the moderators to close this stupid thread. And the thread was eventually closed because it drowned in angry comments. Honestly, I was very upset then. Anyway, now I'm glad I was right.
Well .. Honestly, I don't care about the economy right now. ESO has never been a sandbox with a large and complex crafting system or developed trade. ESO is a content conquering game focused on casuals. Why is gold today, if motives, sets, materials can be easily farmed? If you are a new player, then just get involved in the economy and you will start receiving the same large amounts of gold. The only problem is that all gold is simply depreciating now.
Why is chromium only getting more expensive? Quite simply - it has become a new currency. There is not much of it, the players are not eager to sell it. However, gold jewelry is very different from purple jewelry.

Amottica

DinoZavr wrote: »

@Amottica

yes, i do understand these trends.
unfortunately, i am absolutely not an economist.

i'd subdivide tradeable commodities into 4 big categories:
1) Crafting material, including raw, processed and improvement materials (might be obtained predictably)
2) BoE armor, weapons and jewelry (now, with StickerBook + Curated drops these prices dropped)
3) Furnishing plans, motif pages (this depends on RNG, also after Elsweyr, motif pages got cooldowns - prices went up)
4) Event and Luxury vendor stuff

i'd prefer not to make a separate categories for Companions' gear, Crafted furniture and sealed Crafting Writs,|
hoping theirs share on the market is low.

Disregarding Gold:Crowns ratio:
- materials prices are relatively stable
- gear prices dropped
- furnishing and motifs prices went up

Who favors that: new players, as now they can fill theirs StickerBooks for less price
Who get disadvantage: fashion and furnishing
Who fail miserably: CS gifts buyers

Now, do i get it right?

I think it is right. You correctly showed chromium is subject to a serious increase in price. Considering Zenimax planned it to be rare then that seems to be working as intended. Besides we can get them for free by doing jewelry writs and that the benefit of upgrading jewelry to gold is so minuscule that the cost of that item is not an issue.

The greater economy, which is why I picked multiple items, is what shows inflation in the economy, not an item that is extremely rare by design.

So if the cost of chromium is the issue then I suggest players do crafting writs each day. They do not take long even without the PC addon so if someone really wants that then they would not find the writs an issue. Heck, it is only one writ that can drop it which makes doing the writs to get chromium even faster each day.

Fennwitty

Woozywyvern wrote: »

DinoZavr wrote: »

I ll just leave it here.

PC EU - Chromium Plating


Courtesy of UESP: https://esosales.uesp.net/?text=chromium+plating&level=&quality=&trait=&itemtype=&equiptype=&weapontype=&armortype=&timeperiod=31558150&saletype=all&server=EU

I do find it interesting that the price was pretty much stable until Blackwood. Something changed with the Blackwood release? Certainly puts doubt on the crafting writ argument as they have been the same ease of access for PC players for ages.

Looks more like market manipulation to me.

It's not specifically Blackwood. There is a regular bump with every major expansion release. More players coming back + new gear to gold out + people speculating on those factors and bumping their prices up on launch day.

EDIT: In my subjective experience ~3 years PCNA.

SerafinaWaterstar

Parasaurolophus wrote: »

God! I told! Told you! I said that crafting writs are just an extremely efficient generator of gold and materials and that it will ultimately destroy the economy. Then I received a lot of toxic comments in my address, many players urged the moderators to close this stupid thread. And the thread was eventually closed because it drowned in angry comments. Honestly, I was very upset then. Anyway, now I'm glad I was right.
Well .. Honestly, I don't care about the economy right now. ESO has never been a sandbox with a large and complex crafting system or developed trade. ESO is a content conquering game focused on casuals. Why is gold today, if motives, sets, materials can be easily farmed? If you are a new player, then just get involved in the economy and you will start receiving the same large amounts of gold. The only problem is that all gold is simply depreciating now.
Why is chromium only getting more expensive? Quite simply - it has become a new currency. There is not much of it, the players are not eager to sell it. However, gold jewelry is very different from purple jewelry.

So how come crafting writs have not destroyed the consoles economies?

Parasaurolophus

SerafinaWaterstar wrote: »

Parasaurolophus wrote: »

God! I told! Told you! I said that crafting writs are just an extremely efficient generator of gold and materials and that it will ultimately destroy the economy. Then I received a lot of toxic comments in my address, many players urged the moderators to close this stupid thread. And the thread was eventually closed because it drowned in angry comments. Honestly, I was very upset then. Anyway, now I'm glad I was right.
Well .. Honestly, I don't care about the economy right now. ESO has never been a sandbox with a large and complex crafting system or developed trade. ESO is a content conquering game focused on casuals. Why is gold today, if motives, sets, materials can be easily farmed? If you are a new player, then just get involved in the economy and you will start receiving the same large amounts of gold. The only problem is that all gold is simply depreciating now.
Why is chromium only getting more expensive? Quite simply - it has become a new currency. There is not much of it, the players are not eager to sell it. However, gold jewelry is very different from purple jewelry.

So how come crafting writs have not destroyed the consoles economies?

More casual base.

Kiralyn2000

Parasaurolophus wrote: »

SerafinaWaterstar wrote: »

Parasaurolophus wrote: »

God! I told! Told you! I said that crafting writs are just an extremely efficient generator of gold and materials and that it will ultimately destroy the economy. Then I received a lot of toxic comments in my address, many players urged the moderators to close this stupid thread. And the thread was eventually closed because it drowned in angry comments. Honestly, I was very upset then. Anyway, now I'm glad I was right.
Well .. Honestly, I don't care about the economy right now. ESO has never been a sandbox with a large and complex crafting system or developed trade. ESO is a content conquering game focused on casuals. Why is gold today, if motives, sets, materials can be easily farmed? If you are a new player, then just get involved in the economy and you will start receiving the same large amounts of gold. The only problem is that all gold is simply depreciating now.
Why is chromium only getting more expensive? Quite simply - it has become a new currency. There is not much of it, the players are not eager to sell it. However, gold jewelry is very different from purple jewelry.

So how come crafting writs have not destroyed the consoles economies?

More casual base.

And what explanation do you have for it not being a general increase in all prices, but just in particular extra-rare/extra-demand things like Chromium Platings? And the Crown exchange rate?

SidraWillowsky

DinoZavr wrote: »

I ll just leave it here.

PC EU - Chromium Plating


Courtesy of UESP: https://esosales.uesp.net/?text=chromium+plating&level=&quality=&trait=&itemtype=&equiptype=&weapontype=&armortype=&timeperiod=31558150&saletype=all&server=EU

Blackwood = Dark Convergence + Hrothgar were introduced, and everyone and their mom scrambled for the sets. I wonder if that caused the jump after Blackwood?

The Deadlands DLC was when Kinras' became meta for both mag and stam DDs. For mag, I believe it's used on the front bar, which means Kinras' jewelry is being used. Since prior to the DL, no mag player paid any attention to the set, I'm guessing that everyone scrambled to collect and gold it out. Medusa became the front-bar meta for a while, but even then, other mag sets were within a reasonable range in terms of DPS to justify using alternative sets. Kinras' + Bahsei has become the One Meta to Rule Them All, so people have been scrambling to collect them.

Maybe I'm wrong about that. But I've been playing for a while now, however, and the Deadlands DLC is the first time in four years that I've seen the mag DD meta shift this dramatically. It stayed the same for so long that I doubt many people needed to gold anything new out.

As far as inflation goes, my only concern is that the inflation and changes to CP are going to disproportionately affect new players, who are the ones who likely need the most gold-- it's going to take a while for someone to be able to maximize the CP stars that increase gold gained/gold found in safeboxes and chests/harvesting yield. They're probably not out there doing writs on 9 characters, nor are they likely to have put all of the points into the skills that increase chances of getting gold mats from refining. What this amounts to is new players having no extra sources of gold than before the CP rework while veteran players have many extra sources, which seems backwards...

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

Because there is a thread already open on this topic, we're going to close this one down so that all feedback can be consolidated in one place. You may continue the discussion here.

Thank you for your understanding.