Why is ESO letting 30-40% of their players cheat?

danno8

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Oh wow, another "everyone cheats" thread without a lick of context or proof. 30-40% of players cheat? NONSENSE.

It is nonsense.

If there were 30-40% of people cheating we would all have hard drives full of videos showing it. The OP can't even come up with one.

PunkAben

A big problem with PVP and trials are the huge lag.
Anto cheat programs also take resources, so it will cost too much to make a good anti-cheat without it cost more lag.
I check for a long time ago cheat software for Elder Scrolls Online on the internet and found fast 3 different pages where you can buy undetectable software.
It cost a lot but also gives player extreme high damage, resources and immortal.
I even heat about a page that can unban you if you should get a ban but didn't read it myself.
Zenimax can do nothing about the cheat

Daffen

Aznox wrote: »

Daffen wrote: »

Aznox wrote: »

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic

In the eyes of a casual player, the best combinations of game mechanics are indistinguishable from cheating

https://clips.twitch.tv/SucculentAliveKuduHoneyBadger-zI94xrX392Uw8pjg

Damn, what addon does that. Makes cleave feel more powerful and gap closer.

You mean me stupidly swinging my mouse in rhythm with carve to give it more "impact" ? That would be alcohol

Ah i mistook the sound for the same one that volendrung does, would be nice to have addon that changed cleave sound to volendrung sound lol.

Gaebriel0410

'Every class is OP except the one I play.'
'Everyone cheats except me.'
'I died, it was lag and had nothing to do with my opponent's skill or my lack of it.'

Online gaming in a nutshell.

itscompton

PunkAben wrote: »

A big problem with PVP and trials are the huge lag.
Anto cheat programs also take resources, so it will cost too much to make a good anti-cheat without it cost more lag.
I check for a long time ago cheat software for Elder Scrolls Online on the internet and found fast 3 different pages where you can buy undetectable software.
It cost a lot but also gives player extreme high damage, resources and immortal.
I even heat about a page that can unban you if you should get a ban but didn't read it myself.
Zenimax can do nothing about the cheat

Even if that was true in the past it's not anymore.This thread made me curious to see how easy it was to find and use them so I looked up cheats/hacks yesterday and found this on a site that sells cheat codes and hacks:

Elder Scrolls Online Hacks

Possible hacks in ESO include: Walking through terrain and obstacles (noclip), flying around, jumping very high, running very fast (speedhack), highlight enemies and other players. Hacks are not as useful in MMORPGs as they are in shooters, but they can still be quite useful in PvP. But use caution when using hacks around other players: If you are being obvious about using hacks, then you will get reported and might lose your account. Hacks do inject code into your game process and are for that reason detectable. So watch out for outdated hacks and always make sure that the software you are using is not detected, else you might endanger your account. Hacks are usually not worth the risk of use in any MMORPG, since bots are much more effective in leveling and farming. However, if you are super competitive in PvP, then you might want to consider using a few smaller hacks there, such as speed and teleport hacks, since they are hard to notice if you are using them right

TESO Gold Hacks, Item Generators, God Modes and Level Adders

In any MMO there are certain values that are not processed on your PC but on the game server. While in Single player games you are able to change any value, this is not the case for 99% of all multiplayer games. The values processed on the server are generally very important values that could potentially kill the game if they were at all editable on the client side. Imagine what would happen if people could simply change their Health in The Elder Scrolls Online using a simple hack or generator. – Within a very short time everyone would use this very overpowered hack, the game would stop being any kind of challenge and would ultimately dies. So the very fact that ESO is still up and running should be proof enough that this kind of cheat is impossible.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

itscompton wrote: »

PunkAben wrote: »

A big problem with PVP and trials are the huge lag.
Anto cheat programs also take resources, so it will cost too much to make a good anti-cheat without it cost more lag.
I check for a long time ago cheat software for Elder Scrolls Online on the internet and found fast 3 different pages where you can buy undetectable software.
It cost a lot but also gives player extreme high damage, resources and immortal.
I even heat about a page that can unban you if you should get a ban but didn't read it myself.
Zenimax can do nothing about the cheat

Even if that was true in the past it's not anymore.This thread made me curious to see how easy it was to find and use them so I looked up cheats/hacks yesterday and found this on a site that sells cheat codes and hacks:

Elder Scrolls Online Hacks

Possible hacks in ESO include: Walking through terrain and obstacles (noclip), flying around, jumping very high, running very fast (speedhack), highlight enemies and other players. Hacks are not as useful in MMORPGs as they are in shooters, but they can still be quite useful in PvP. But use caution when using hacks around other players: If you are being obvious about using hacks, then you will get reported and might lose your account. Hacks do inject code into your game process and are for that reason detectable. So watch out for outdated hacks and always make sure that the software you are using is not detected, else you might endanger your account. Hacks are usually not worth the risk of use in any MMORPG, since bots are much more effective in leveling and farming. However, if you are super competitive in PvP, then you might want to consider using a few smaller hacks there, such as speed and teleport hacks, since they are hard to notice if you are using them right

TESO Gold Hacks, Item Generators, God Modes and Level Adders

In any MMO there are certain values that are not processed on your PC but on the game server. While in Single player games you are able to change any value, this is not the case for 99% of all multiplayer games. The values processed on the server are generally very important values that could potentially kill the game if they were at all editable on the client side. Imagine what would happen if people could simply change their Health in The Elder Scrolls Online using a simple hack or generator. – Within a very short time everyone would use this very overpowered hack, the game would stop being any kind of challenge and would ultimately dies. So the very fact that ESO is still up and running should be proof enough that this kind of cheat is impossible.

I once saw a listing for unicorn droppings on ebay, and yes it was dog crap covered in glitter. A large number of online cheat codes, gold sales, etc, are nothing more than a scam to begin with.

I dont think anyone is suggesting that cheat engines or botting doesnt exist. But most of us don't believe it is even close to as prevalent as OP suggests, and anything that would give you a significantly competitive edge is going to get caught and banned very quickly.

SeaGtGruff

Sephyr wrote: »

Next it's going to be potions, poisons, and enchantments.

Someone already reported that someone got reported for using a Detect potion. I don't feel like hunting down that post, but it linked to a clip of an ESO streamer who was in Cyrodiil (IIRC). It showed him put a stack of Detect potions in his Quickslots, then while he was fighting another player who was trying to Stealth he would use a Detect potion to spot him. IIRC, the other player basically had a meltdown and started whispering to the guy that he was a game tester, he knew everything that the game could and couldn't do, and he was reporting the guy for cheating. The streamer had gone back to add text and pointers to his clip to call viewers' attention to when he slotted the Detect potions.

gariondavey

9/10 dentists agree...
There may be some cheating but it isn't widespread to 30-40 percent. That's absurd. Maybe 0.1 percent of the entire population...

Merforum

Merforum wrote: »

itscompton wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

RevJJ wrote: »

Ok, serious question. If getting hit by more skills per second than the global cooldown should allow is because of server lag/desync, why is it always the same players that seem to be benefiting from this?

Because when you get kills with a certain set/skill combo you don't stop. They'll keep doing what they're doing sometimes oblivious to what is actually occuring on their opponent's screen. Sometimes these skill combos are how the class is meant to be played and these players have no choice but to play that way or die.

I'd agree that besides what I wrote in my previous response this is something else that plays into the perception people cheat when it's just the game being wonky.
Certain combos that weave skills and basic attacks seem to desync the client/server consistently and if you have moderate to high ping you're more susceptible. As Vevvev says it might be them just playing and not realizing what they're doing or it might be they know it will happen and are doing it on purpose, but either way it's not the result of using a third party software hack.

There are actually several levels of what can be called 'cheating', not sure which one the OP is talking about but 30-40% could be correct.

1. one level might just be called CHEESE, as another poster wrote 'magnum shooting people over a cliff' or the dude who was on edge of bridge using warden pull to throw people off the bridge. Also saw someone who was using siege weapon to destroy a bridge so people running thru would fall to death. Also stuff like camping doors and other transition points to just kill people before they transition. This one might be considered smart but is still kind of cheese, running with a pocket healer/tank, saw so many people get absolutely destroyed over and over in all PVP areas then become a killing machine with a pocket healer, solo BGs is probably the only place where this crutch is not possible.

2. another level is using either broken or exploitable game mechanics, there are 100s of these, like running around and around a pillar/any solid object where even being ON TOP of someone but can't target at all. Or the idiotic fact that in PVP players are NOT solid, meaning you can run right thru people (I've seen people running back and forth thru groups of people making completely untargetable, players should NOT be able to run thru other players).

A related exploit is insane speed that is available in the game like 'wild hunt' or 'Orc/minor/major expedition' builds, this speed also makes people untargetable and I've tested this, you can move so fast at times you can run right thru AOEs and take no damage also be untargetable. Plus running fast while moving side to side or jumping also has untargetable effect, not sure exactly if this creates positional desyncs and/or the game allows movement that is faster than the game/servers can register.

Real questions How often does server get positional info from player, how fast is player allowed to travel, how fast is position of one player showing on the screen of another player? How fast can a player run, how fast does server respond to movement input, can someone move faster than ability to target them or ability for aoe to register, what happens if movement is faster than server can handle? I still think ZOS should test slowing things down a little bit to see it that reduces lag/desyncs.

3. then there are cheat engines that allow amazing ways to cheat and I agree the obvious cheats are very rare and probably only when the creator is testing stuff that you see it or when someone is going to quit the game and does care about getting caught. At least once a week I see someone run past me using one of the functions of cheat engine, where they are sprinting very fast past me and the sprint animation isn't going, they are in the standing animation and also floating just above the ground, I have been looking and the names of users is always different. I think this cheat engine is widely used by certain people but more subtlety like to add 10-50% speed and/or cause positional desync and/or use camouflage ability and/or create position offset, meaning people can use the cheat engine for a huge advantage but not obvious.

Most times when cheating is brought up I always see people claim they are hit by many attacks in a second and others come to say it is impossible because GCD, and claim you need a combat metrics readout to prove it. But this is a red herring, I think most people who use cheat engines use then DEFENSIVELY with positional and speed buffs, NOT OFFENSIVELY to get more hits per second.

OMG these threads always touch a nerve. I love the 'we know there are cheat engines, and even though we exploit every design flaw, bug, broken build, cheesy tactic, real or artificially created lag/desyncs, NOBODY WOULD THINK OF USING CHEAT ENGINES'.

Anyone can be using the super speed, position offset of the cheat engine to take little to no damage unless they just stand there, and no one would be able to prove it. BTW there are tons of vids and evidence already but just calling everything that looks weird LAG is as silly as calling everything cheating. Anyone who says that there's only cheating and no lag or vice versa, you have to question their motives.

TPishek

It's true, I cheat 40% of the time.

Aznox

Merforum wrote: »

Anyone can be using the super speed, position offset of the cheat engine to take little to no damage unless they just stand there, and no one would be able to prove it. BTW there are tons of vids and evidence already but just calling everything that looks weird LAG is as silly as calling everything cheating.

Send

the

vids.

If you don't have any, I'm playing hours each week at the highest MMR of PC EU battlegrounds and I'm recording most of it to twitch, feel free to browse through it and point me to the times where you think a player isn't taking the damage they should, and we'll discuss it.

xaraan

Most of the time when a player thinks someone is cheating its lack of education about how systems work or the game works, even if they think they've played a long time and think they know better, they don't. Some have already explained what causes some of the things people see that they think is cheating, read it and learn it and then you'll be able to actually see the ones that are cheating. (And some of the ones that do, you'd never even know it from anything you see that's obvious).

stefj68

[snip]
bring us logs!

[edited for baiting]

WaywardArgonian

If you play PVP regularly you will eventually get accused of cheating.

Not saying cheaters aren't out there, but as a general rule don't ascribe to cheating what can also be blamed on lag. 30-40% is of course ludicrous.

Sephyr

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Sephyr wrote: »

Next it's going to be potions, poisons, and enchantments.

Someone already reported that someone got reported for using a Detect potion. I don't feel like hunting down that post, but it linked to a clip of an ESO streamer who was in Cyrodiil (IIRC). It showed him put a stack of Detect potions in his Quickslots, then while he was fighting another player who was trying to Stealth he would use a Detect potion to spot him. IIRC, the other player basically had a meltdown and started whispering to the guy that he was a game tester, he knew everything that the game could and couldn't do, and he was reporting the guy for cheating. The streamer had gone back to add text and pointers to his clip to call viewers' attention to when he slotted the Detect potions.

HAHAHAHA! The good ol' "I'm a game tester!" The hubris of some people, I swear, never ceases to amaze me. If you find it, I'd love to see it.

I feel bad for the streamer, though. They get enough grief from stream snipers.

etchedpixels

The game is certainly full of not-quite-exploits. There are several world bosses you can kill at level 3 by standing in the right spot. If you move fast enough a lot of the detection logic in the mobs doesn't seem to go off reliably. That used to be a quirk but with all the speed stuff you can now easily stack it's rather noticably broken. Several of the dungeon bosses are utterly trivial if you stand in just the right spot, at least one supposedly unsoloable boss can be done solo by using a companion (who is immune to the mechanics) and standing out of the mechanic range healing the companion like crazy.

For PvE though all you are affecting materially is yourself - and quite frankly if they keep on this idiotic forcing people into imperial city I'm glad IC is full of cheeses and ways to do the quests while invulnerable.

HumbleThaumaturge

I have suspected "cheating" from time to time. My betters tell me that the incidence of cheating is somewhere between "impossible" and "rare." I sometimes suspect cheating, but in nearly all cases it was because I did not understand something about the game.

However, from time to time, I still wonder if a player is using keyboard macros. I mean, gee, either they are using macros, or they took 15 years of piano lessons, and their fingers are just that fast?

As others have said, most "cheating" is either:
- Lag . . . a time-delay between client-side (local computer) and server-side (ZOS mega server), such that the player (the client) is not seeing what is happening on the server in real time. Lag can occur even when your Latency number is good. There are many articles on the web on how to tweak ESO and your computer and your router to reduce lag. Of course, you'll never achieve zero lag. But, for example, set your router to give highest priority only to your gaming computer, and reset your router prior to a PvP session or if you are having issues during game-play. And, of course, close programs and Addons (maybe one at a time) if you are having lag issues.
- Failure to understand how certain features of the game work. For example: (1) failure to understand how unfamiliar class abilities (passive and active) work; (2) failure to understand how group and single-target buffs and debuffs work; (3) failure to understand how specific sets work; (4) failure to understand how rotations work; (5) failure to understand how potions work.

Now, I still wonder how a player on foot can outrun my 60/60/60 horse with "Major Gallop," but I am told that is entirely possible without cheating. Hmmmmm.

And, sometimes, I wonder about Twinks ("Golden Pros") in the under-level-50 campaign. These are highly experienced players in extremely good gear who: (1) are almost impossible to kill (are extreme tanks), yet; (2) have such high dps they can kill 10 average players in a flash. Personally, I have a failure to understand how such builds are possible. I also don't understand why Twinks are allowed in this campaign, but that's an entirely different discussion.

Veinblood1965

I just started pvping but noticed something odd the other night. Had a templar hit me with puncturing sweep about 5 or 6 times in under a second. I wasn't noticing any lag at the time. He was CP 37 also which was odd also. I died instantly it was weird. Not saying it's cheating it could be server issues but it was the first time I've noticed that. My other toon is a templar so I know how quick it can be used.

runningtings

Gambino108 wrote: »

What makes you sure people are cheating?

This has my attention because I just spent past hour with 10 people telling me I've been reported for cheating and my account banned, purely on the reason I've made all of you look like dandelions in a monsoon.

PC EU in this instance, but literally my whisper's flooded because I've intercepted a scroll group of about 20, surprised them and then spent 15 mins by myself standing on a cliff corner magnum-shot people into the fishes.

God help me - I am there for the taking if you know how to walk the cliffs XD

Haha I love your work 😉

ganj1234

lag, proficient LA weaving... and if it's not that its prob just crystal weapon vate maul combo LUL

Skullderic

Its really simple, a lot of players are going w/ its sever lagg, 1-2 sec all the damage at once. No, 6-8 casts of the same skill spam no weaving light, Mid-heavy or Heavy attacks. even in 2-3 secs can't happen w/ the in game cooldowns on skills either. It's 100% cheap, Cheat. w/e name you want to call it.
Cyro/BG/iC. I play everywhere. Like I stated in my first post it started like 5 months ago, for this Rabidfire like cheat.

Not talking about good players using skill stacking & proc sets. for a 1 shot effect.
Or good gank builds w/ burst damage that knocks your socks off or 4v1 Blast damage from groups.

Asardes

I almost 6 years of playing I've seen a few instances of cheating:
- back in 2016 DKs could leap or use empowering chains on NPCs and players on keep walls to enter, the problem was discovered and people did get banned for it AFAIK.
- currently there are glitch ledges in certain battlegrounds: Mor Khazgur and Eld Angavar where you can glitch with the chaos ball and stay alive though you should die from fall damage

Other than that I haven't seen any people actually cheating in PvP. In fact most people I've heard complaining were just sore losers

Xandreia_

When the paranoia hits...

All the things you say are "cheating" is just bad server performance, kind of what happens when you use a 20 year old engine and expect modern day performance.

I've had people say I'm cheating because I burst them down... again... not cheating! Just playing the game

universal_wrath

Aelsioln wrote: »

Skullderic wrote: »

Players using the same skill 6-8 times in under a sec.

Pretty sure that is impossible as I've seen multiple sources state that there is a 1 second global cooldown between any skill use. I could be wrong though.

Not impossible, I saw it before, however it was not skills but Light attacks. You ser you opponent freeze abd theb you due, after you due you see his charcter speeding up Light attacks at a redicouls speed. You death cap? All light attack.

Sephyr

Veinblood1965 wrote: »

I just started pvping but noticed something odd the other night. Had a templar hit me with puncturing sweep about 5 or 6 times in under a second. I wasn't noticing any lag at the time. He was CP 37 also which was odd also. I died instantly it was weird. Not saying it's cheating it could be server issues but it was the first time I've noticed that. My other toon is a templar so I know how quick it can be used.

I've had similar, but when I'd had enough of that I asked the person if I was lagging and they literally had thought I was just waiting for them to kill me because I didn't fight back. Ended up doing a bunch of tests with that person and they were super cool about it and even sent his own logs to confirm.

On my end, I wasn't lagging and nothing indicated it. On his end, I was in a few second's lagspike despite still seeing him move.

Skullderic

danno8 wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Oh wow, another "everyone cheats" thread without a lick of context or proof. 30-40% of players cheat? NONSENSE.

It is nonsense.

If there were 30-40% of people cheating we would all have hard drives full of videos showing it. The OP can't even come up with one.

IKR! No Players Cheat in Games, That's Crazy Talk!

Ramber

When a NB can get off 7+ abilities, including LAs and abilities with cast times, in about 1 second wile you are frozen in place and never come out of cloak its probably a cheat lol. But its nothing new, you just have to be tanky enough to survive the initial attack then they run and hide from you out of fear cause thats all they know.

Magio_

Skullderic wrote: »

Its really simple, a lot of players are going w/ its sever lagg, 1-2 sec all the damage at once. No, 6-8 casts of the same skill spam no weaving light, Mid-heavy or Heavy attacks. even in 2-3 secs can't happen w/ the in game cooldowns on skills either. It's 100% cheap, Cheat. w/e name you want to call it.
Cyro/BG/iC. I play everywhere. Like I stated in my first post it started like 5 months ago, for this Rabidfire like cheat.

Not talking about good players using skill stacking & proc sets. for a 1 shot effect.
Or good gank builds w/ burst damage that knocks your socks off or 4v1 Blast damage from groups.

You can shut everyone here up by just posting a Combat Metrics/Log showing what you say is true.

Gaebriel0410

I always wonder how people can make all those calculations in their head on how they died to a specific player who did x in y seconds which should take y+1 seconds (so it must be cheating), all in the middle of a hectic battle with flashing lights everywhere and getting stuck behind a rock because you were stupid and dodgerolled wrong, and somehow retaining situational awareness of everything that happens all around. I'm not a bad player but that I definitely can't do lmao. When I die in pvp I just.. wel, die and respawn lol. Though as of late, it's more like 'oh hey it's Hhrothgar's Chill again', so I'm guessing that set is the latest noob destroyer.

I suspect that whenever random stuff happens it's more likely to be The Elder Scrolls Effect (you know, being launched by a giant or falling through the floor) than some moustache twirling hacker being the exact dude(ette) who killed you in pvp.

BloodMagicLord

It's lag, you cannot do this in ESO as others have said, there is a 1 second global cooldown on abilities.