Okay why did ZOS think it was a good idea to introduce these sets for PvP?

Vevvev

Ah yes, the set that scales with the target's resistances. This was ZOS's attempt to make a counter to people that stacked over 33k resistances to try and fight back penetration and armor reduction abilities/enchantments. The set procs on immobilization and stuns so having an immovability potion is one way to counter the set. Another is stacking damage mitigation not associated with resistances like Major/Minor protection, Dragonknight's Magma Armor ultimate, and stage 3 Vampire's Undeath.

In practice though you're going to get immobilized and stunned at some point so the set is going to end up being pretty strong against the average high resist PvP build. Doesn't help it dumps that damage after a stun either, and that it hits everyone around the target to.... so if you're standing next to your team's dedicated punching bag when they get hit by this thing it's going to hurt you... a LOT!

moo_2021

Defending wrote: »

Hrothgar's Chill is probably intended to be a great counter to Pariah since everyone seems to recommend/shift towards that set as the defensive option.

So we're going to shift to high HP + low resist + Hrothgar's Chill + immobility poison?

NylAR

Seeing as tanks always stay end up using everything designed against them more effectively than everyone else it's time Zenimax introduces some mechanic that will directly reduce damage done the more mitigation you have. Provided you hit some reasonable cap of course.

Sounds absolutely ridiculous, I know, I just don't know what else at this point. Like ... This is just nuts.

I'm being driven away from the game more and more every day by these dumbfounded design choices.

PvE and PvP needs to be separated by an 999999999999 light years thick impenetrable wall and serious balancing needs to take place. There needs to be a system that sets apart what a tank or damage dealer is that will specifically prevent such idiotic combinations.

Zekka

We miss you, King.

techyeshic

I now have not played for over a month, and every time I think about it to just go PVP with friends; I see questionable design decisions and think about lag, and see these posts or streamers.

It's sad because the game was a meme from lag, and is becoming a meme from proc sets as well. It's not rewarding to play well when so much power is out into sets.

stybbe17b16_ESO

3 players I believe got hit by it. By two other players. I'm not even a tank, 23k armor and held block. Just aoe dmg?

Greasytengu

ZOS: "We have heard your concerns about the proc set meta and made procs dependant on stats for damage."


Also ZOS: "Hey check out these new OP proc sets!!"

jaws343

stybbe17b16_ESO wrote: »

3 players I believe got hit by it. By two other players. I'm not even a tank, 23k armor and held block. Just aoe dmg?

Whether you are a tank or not isn't relevant if you weren't the one it initially procced on. If the player it procced on had crazy resists then that is the damage it calculates off of for everyone who gets hit.

stybbe17b16_ESO

jaws343 wrote: »

Whether you are a tank or not isn't relevant if you weren't the one it initially procced on. If the player it procced on had crazy resists then that is the damage it calculates off of for everyone who gets hit.

I already see the pain with troll tanks just running around killing their teammates..

FluffWit

Haven't had a chance to play with them yet but they all sound really promising in terms of giving counter play to some of the games biggest problems.

ResidentContrarian

FluffWit wrote: »

Haven't had a chance to play with them yet but they all sound really promising in terms of giving counter play to some of the games biggest problems.

I am glad I don't stack resists. In fact, I play with little to no armor just so the damage is roughly always the same from every skill or encounter. Not investing in it means I can hybridize and get 25-30k stam on my mag builds with little consequence and keep my damage and sustain for the most part.

That's a huge advantage over being tanky through resists, believe it or not...Even tank a zerg without any resistances stacked, which probably isn't balanced but no one has shouted on the forums about it yet.

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

Sounds like a bit of a cheesy set indeed.

I can feel the screen shots incoming over the next few months...

SkadiMZ

I haven't played this game long enough to see shifts in the meta, but is this potentially what is happening here?

It seems the go to in recent patches has been to stack high resists and become as tanky as possible, get to ~30k health and then put the rest into damage or use malacath.

Now that sets like this exist, doesn't it just signal a change to the meta? I know someone mentioned it previously by saying something along the lines of "low resist, high hp" and I believe they're right. Mitigation options have increased, so maybe stop wearing pariah and fortified brass?

MadeInVN

The point completely flies over half of the people in this thread…

Jameson18

VaranisArano wrote: »

Why did ZOS add those sets?

Because everything else ZOS has tried to nerf ballgroups has failed, usually making the ballgroups either stronger than opponents or just plain stronger.

And so ZOS tried to hand small scale and pug players a bunch of sets that are theoretically designed to destroy ballgroups...and is hoping and praying that the ball groups don't (predictably) use those sets to destroy their less organized opponents in turn.

Sorry, but BG balance took a back seat to the complaints of Cyrodiil players this time.

The only thing that has to be done to balance the power of ball groups and the like is to simply not allow things like radiating regen to stack. If it didnt stack, half+ of the group wouldn't be using resto staves and keeping everyone in 2-4 stacks of it. Same thing with rituals and the like.

SkadiMZ

MadeInVN wrote: »

The point completely flies over half of the people in this thread…

It probably would have helped if your initial post had more information other than "seriously why?" That leaves out a lot of context and I'm sure not everyone reads every single post thereafter to figure it out.

I don't see much of an issue with the set itself. It helps combat the infinitely tanky builds that are present in BGs. I will say, I do agree that the proc should not be AOE.

I know this was meant to be a ball group buster, but the unintended effect on BGs is certainly unfortunate. Maybe either make it single target or lower the damage a bit. This set always seemed to be best used against a tanky opponent, which it looks like it accomplished. Punishing everyone else around a tank/tanky healer obviously seems problematic, as how tanky your allies are is most times out of your control.

MadeInVN

[snip]

FYI, I play with 22k armor and zero damage mitigation passives. I took a 20k proc from Hrothgar’s Chill because someone near me got stunned. [snip]

Sets like these completely remove the balance from the game. At least Vicious Death requires you to actually KILL SOMEONE. But hey it’s a good set according to the forums, so I will be waiting in a few weeks when cyrodiil and BGs are filled with dark convergence, hrothgar, and plaguebreak users 1 shotting everyone in cyrodiil. According to the forums that’s completely healthy gameplay eh?

[Edit for Bait.]

OutLaw_Nynx

Zekka wrote: »

We miss you, King.

Hurricane Wrobel 😢

SkadiMZ

Calm down there, buddy. Even in my comment I acknowledged that the aoe burst had obviously had an adverse effect on BGs.

Curious how this has worked in cyrodiil? Have those sets impacted anything AGAINST ball groups or is it much like people predicted and become the new set for those groups to dominate even more?

I ask this because the set didn't seem to be created with BGs in mind (surprise!) but more to be used in Cyrodiil. If the initial intention doesn't meet their goal, then yes, your point has even more credence.

MadeInVN

SkadiMZ wrote: »

Calm down there, buddy. Even in my comment I acknowledged that the aoe burst had obviously had an adverse effect on BGs.

Curious how this has worked in cyrodiil? Have those sets impacted anything AGAINST ball groups or is it much like people predicted and become the new set for those groups to dominate even more?

I ask this because the set didn't seem to be created with BGs in mind (surprise!) but more to be used in Cyrodiil. If the initial intention doesn't meet their goal, then yes, your point has even more credence.

There is another set that works against ball groups, but much more broken.

https://streamable.com/9kbyis

techyeshic

MadeInVN wrote: »

SkadiMZ wrote: »

Calm down there, buddy. Even in my comment I acknowledged that the aoe burst had obviously had an adverse effect on BGs.

Curious how this has worked in cyrodiil? Have those sets impacted anything AGAINST ball groups or is it much like people predicted and become the new set for those groups to dominate even more?

I ask this because the set didn't seem to be created with BGs in mind (surprise!) but more to be used in Cyrodiil. If the initial intention doesn't meet their goal, then yes, your point has even more credence.

There is another set that works against ball groups, but much more broken.

https://streamable.com/9kbyis

What a joke

ResidentContrarian

MadeInVN wrote: »

Imagine saying “wear less resists” to justify this broken set. Some of the comments here are so painful to read.

FYI, I play with 22k armor and zero damage mitigation passives. I took a 20k proc from Hrothgar’s Chill because someone near me got stunned. So according to the people here, I should just unslot all my gear and take no damage right? According to the people here I should just not play with my group in BGs right? Screw group fights let’s just not stick together.


Sets like these completely remove the balance from the game. At least Vicious Death requires you to actually KILL SOMEONE. But hey it’s a good set according to the forums, so I will be waiting in a few weeks when cyrodiil and BGs are filled with dark convergence, hrothgar, and plaguebreak users 1 shotting everyone in cyrodiil. According to the forums that’s completely healthy gameplay eh?

It's amazing how you have complaints about things you know exist and know will happen, yet take zero actions to prevent them and instead say its unbalanced or broken.

What if the goal of the set is changing behavior in the first place? Then you and others choosing to not change your behavior is the problem, not the set.

The set was complained about before PTS was even over and it was not changed -- that means it's likely intended to even the field for builds that are broken, and everyone knows exactly what types I am talking about, and everyone else, including the more casual players in BGs and Cyro.

I don't think that is a problem because if a build offers you an absolute advantage in nearly all scenarios, then it becoming a disadvantage in some is not unbalanced to me. Alternatively, they could always just nerf tanks and the set at the same time.

But I can guess that wouldn't be fair or balanced to players that object to this set either.

Either way, I don't slot either set or the type of build its effective against, so I don't really care what happens. But pretending that players are being victimized by a set when its only a select few on OP builds themselves or in balls that would otherwise have the complete advantage in a combat situation is pure hypocrisy.

NagualV

MadeInVN wrote: »

SkadiMZ wrote: »

Calm down there, buddy. Even in my comment I acknowledged that the aoe burst had obviously had an adverse effect on BGs.

Curious how this has worked in cyrodiil? Have those sets impacted anything AGAINST ball groups or is it much like people predicted and become the new set for those groups to dominate even more?

I ask this because the set didn't seem to be created with BGs in mind (surprise!) but more to be used in Cyrodiil. If the initial intention doesn't meet their goal, then yes, your point has even more credence.

There is another set that works against ball groups, but much more broken.

https://streamable.com/9kbyis

😂

Vevvev

This... scares me the more I think about it. Part of me wants to try it out, but I typically try to avoid going too far with nasty combos like this.



Also the new plague set is a real group annihilator. Wanted to scream at my fellow allies to stop purge spamming x.x

ResidentContrarian

Vevvev wrote: »

This... scares me the more I think about it. Part of me wants to try it out, but I typically try to avoid going too far with nasty combos like this.



Also the new plague set is a real group annihilator. Wanted to scream at my fellow allies to stop purge spamming x.x

This would almost be alarming IF purge spamming an purge itself weren't the single most OP mechanic in the game as far as grouping goes, with zero real counter other than that set.

If purge had gotten it's proper nerf or a CD/cost scaling mechanic for spamming it, then I'd have some sympathy. Since it has neither, the sympathy I have over the power of these sets drops to zero.

One thing it has done, is make me unslot curse eater though That's not exactly the end of the universe for me, though I will miss it, the set really had zero counters and did give a massive advantage... Now a set makes that into a disadvantage.

Is that really unbalanced...?

Vevvev

ResidentContrarian wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

This... scares me the more I think about it. Part of me wants to try it out, but I typically try to avoid going too far with nasty combos like this.



Also the new plague set is a real group annihilator. Wanted to scream at my fellow allies to stop purge spamming x.x

This would almost be alarming IF purge spamming an purge itself weren't the single most OP mechanic in the game as far as grouping goes, with zero real counter other than that set.

If purge had gotten it's proper nerf or a CD/cost scaling mechanic for spamming it, then I'd have some sympathy. Since it has neither, the sympathy I have over the power of these sets drops to zero.

One thing it has done, is make me unslot curse eater though That's not exactly the end of the universe for me, though I will miss it, the set really had zero counters and did give a massive advantage... Now a set makes that into a disadvantage.

Is that really unbalanced...?

I like the new plague set, just wish I wasn't in the wrong place at the wrong time lol. More worried of the Dark Convergence with Eruption since that's an unpurgable 60% + 70% ground snare with a stun that will last more than one second thanks to lag.

woe

They're fine. Sets are for diversity and people need to stop hanging on to one single build and change things up.

FluffWit

Does the Plague one only proc on the purge skill, or on other sources of cleansing too?

Vevvev

FluffWit wrote: »

Does the Plague one only proc on the purge skill, or on other sources of cleansing too?

If the proc is purged before it runs it's course it will explode for the damage that increases in damage per person in the blast radius like Inevitable Detonation in the Alliance War skill line.

MadeInVN

deflorate wrote: »

They're fine. Sets are for diversity and people need to stop hanging on to one single build and change things up.

There is no such thing as diversity when 90% of cyrodiil and bg will be running these 3 sets. Do you even PvP?