Just started playing again, and the 'meta' is making me really concerned.

NineChameleon

Thanks for the advice everyone.

Ultimately I think I'm going to try not to think about it as some be all and end all. Since according to everyone here most of the game excluding HM Vet stuff can be done with just average dps.

I'm just coming off endgame in another MMO and tbh, I started to not enjoy it because my static just got so parse/dps obsessed that they would prioritise it over y'know... clearing. It was enough to put me off playing dps in any kind of endgame setting in MMO's. I switched to healing in said other game now and enjoy it a lot more and honestly find it far less stressful.

So ultimately if I ever do endgame here it'll be as a healer.

So for now I'll go through the game with what I find enjoyable and then see how I am after getting to the higher cp ranks. Honestly what I've read here has already prompted me to re-organise my bars slightly and stop seeing it as an aoe vs single target thing and more a laying down dot aoes, buffs and debuffs, then switching to my normal damage rotation. (which at the moment is just light attack cancelling with either force pulse for single target or destructive clench for aoe)

So thanks everyone!

oterWitz

Glad everyone here could help you I just want to add some tips about finding guilds so they don't feed your meta fears, but can help alleviate them instead.
1) Use the guild finder in game, but also use the search filters on it help find a guild that does the content you're interested and at about the same time you typically play.
2) Read the guild recruitment blurbs closely, it will give a surprisingly good idea how the guild is run and how active it is. Also, many guilds advertise as being welcoming to new and returning players, only for those players to still feel lost and/or left out after joining. Not to knock those guilds, but if you are ever feeling lost or left out or anything else negative, don't feel bad about leaving to find a better guild for you.
3)Also browse/post in your platform and server's section of the Guild Recruitment section of the forums with a little about yourself and the kind of guild you are looking for. The choices there will be less numerous since many who play aren't on the forums, but it's another way of finding a good fit for you.
Good luck!

Amerises

For anyone that says gear is anything about 50% is crazy. I'd bet naked with a purple weapon I could get half what I get fully geared dps-wise. Rotation Rotation Rotation! You can animation cancel with s weapon swap and after a light attack. Timing is what messes with most people's rotation.

Nome of that is particularly important for any content you'll be doing. For best dps, lay down all DoTs and then spam an attack until you need to refresh DoTs. It's easy to think "well I hit for 3k with my spamable but my DoT only does 800 damage, so I'll just spam my main attack." But 800 damage over 10 seconds is 8k. For that SINGLE cast you did twice the damage as your main attack. Get 4 or 5 DoTs and now you increased your damage from 3k to 6.2k. Add a light attack for 2k and you almost tripled your dps...

Numbers don't really matter, but the point is, your dps comes from your DoTs and your main attack (spammable) is just filler.

WrathOfInnos

You don’t need to worry about meta builds anytime soon. They’re mostly for squeezing out a little more DPS on high level characters. If you want to do well and don’t mind testing things yourself then feel free. You’ll likely end up somewhere close to a meta build after optimizing everything, but you certainly don’t have to take anyone’s word for it and blindly follow. Builds are a starting point, and a quick reference for those that don’t want to spend hours (or weeks/months) testing all the alternatives.

Amottica

Any and every MMORPG I have played has had a string "meta" to do well. Often it is rotations need to be in a specific order to build procs to get maximum benefit. Games that have a choice of gear have specific gear that is best for certain roles and situations. Heck. I have seen in other games different tank builds for different raids and ESO has similar as the CP can change depending on the fight and trial (old CP at least).

Even then, the meta is not truly demanding in ESO as there are other sets and such that can be used and still do extremely well. It is getting the most out of every action that is more important in ESO for doing damage as DPS comes down to damage per action.

Fennwitty

Nearly any build guide online is starting with the assumption you've unlocked all your class passives and are at least CP 160.

Then the max numbers come from ideal conditions parsing against 21 million HP trial dummies that provide a ton of buffs.

Treeshka

Well if you want to comfortably complete the hardest dungeons and hardest stuff in the game you need to have meta builds. Other than that whatever you use you can complete the normal content but of course with meta it takes less time to complete which is nice for everyone in your group.

zathera45

"...Or should I just look for an off meta guild so I can have less fear about playing outside the meta system?"

There are a lot of good active guilds who concentrate on working together for leveling and socializing. Midnight Cartel is a great group who sometimes has a trader, and always has nice people. Everyone works together to do trials as well as a few other events. It's a mixed bag of folks of all levels with a good core of high levelers that are happy to help all. I've been with these guys for several years now, and I will be there too.

You may not be aware, it is really important to bash your way to level 50 to get full size gear and then up to CP160 to get access to the CP skills with your first toon. Once you have gotten there with one toon, and gotten access to the CP skills, you will have them available on all other toons. You don't need to grind so hard with the others and will level up quickly with the additional power of the CP.

@zathera45

E-Zekiel

Disturbed_One wrote: »

The "Meta" is at best a 2-3% DPS increase over about a half dozen other options, and a good player in non-meta sets will easily outperform an average player in the meta.

Now... you do need to have like ~900 CP to have most of your benefits for DPS (you get about 90% of them by this point, the next 900 CP will give you the last 10%)

Depends on what you mean by "the meta" versus random builds.

I didn't follow "the meta" for a very long time and began to realize how abysmal my DPS was in veteran content. I still technically don't, but I adopted key aspects of "meta" considerations into my build and it more than doubled my damage and I'm usually top damage in most veteran groups. Not always, but usually.

That's how big of a difference it made.

On a related note I usually 1-2shot most solo mobs since adopting some of the basic principles (have a crit passive on your bar and at least 1-2 crit sets and at least one proc set)

Formerly, I just went by the color code and enchantments on gear, and I picked skills that were fun and seemed effective, rarely ever picking anything with a passive effect on it.

I'm not meta when I solo, but I have a build I swap to for group content, and it does kind of bother me that at a given time I'm generally only using maybe 3-4 actual attacks in most fights. The rest are either passives or back bar buffs/shields/whatever.

Anyway, like I said, it depends on what you mean by the meta versus your average random build. For me it was way more than 2-3%. Now if I were to swap from my current group builds to something more strictly meta, I'd probably see yeah about a 3-5% increase like you're saying. But hopefully you take my point

For the record: I'm not saying I LIKE that this is the case. Putting stuff on my bar for the passive bonus legitimately bothers me.

Tannus15

no one should worry about the "meta" at level 37.

once you're at least CP160 you can start thinking about it, but even then, only really if you're interested in trials and what not.
Additionally BiS and Meta doens't mean a hell of a lot in this game. Don't mistake dummy parses for content dps. it's not the same thing at all.

I've done trial runs in my guild where i'm deliberaly running only crafted sets just to prove that you don't need the BiS to get good dps.

Ippokrates

To clear every dungeon, trial & arena in the game & trials, i would advise you to keep a stable dps of around 20k on normal and at least 30k on veteran. Otherwise it might hurt

Now, if you don't want to rely on other in term of builds you can do your own build but you will first need to learn how the system work, because in ESO, I would say only 30% depends on equipment. Other 70% are players skills (in pve. In pvp i would say 90% are skills .

Things like:

1. being to able to keep rotation & buffs with maximum uptime (up to 30% of dmg & crits chance + dmg, or proc sets with specific conditions like Diamond's Victory that require from you to build whole rotation around it)

2. selecting skills & equipment that synergize together. For example Deadly Strikes that is possibly one of the best sets in the game BUT works only with specific skills, so depending on proper choice of skills, you can get nice 20% (now 18 ) dmg or making 5th bonus useless because of wrong skills.

3. good positioning (i would say around 20% dmg extra from things like backstabbing or minor berserk) and knowing mechanics (dead dd makes no dps) of every fight of every advanced dung, trial or arena.

4. knowledge of gameplay mechanics like how to weave or how animation canceling work - because obviously players that can keep one attack after another, would make more dmg than player that cast skills every 2 seconds or is unaware how to keep proper sustain so he run out of resource after few seconds of fight and need to make HA (Sure, there are builds for HA, but i am not talking about that or cannot aim AOE precisely

Under these conditions, there is a lot you could do. I personally love to make potato builds, especially on my stamden, cause warden have many perks that could be utilize. Bah, my first vet dungeon runs were on stamden with Stuhn's and oh boy, even with Malacath she was making 35k (and on BG I have reach my first record of 24 kills ^^). Then I switched her for Bleed armour + Deadly + Maelstrom Maces and took her on some pug trials. With proper dots & massive Bloodthirst she was clearing content in no time. And nobody ever complain that this is potato, not meta, because results were at least sufficient.

BUT, if you are joining guild, that is aiming not for social goals but progression and have people that are chasing achievements, and most of achievements is on veteran mode, and i think nobody want to run the same dungeon dozen of times for 4 hours (my first pug vSCP XD) then obviously you can expect some discussions about preparations. Like before last quakecon Nefas was joking that he is going with Templar tank only because of minor sorcery ^^

So in this perspective META is not always about being top of the top, but rather open to some cooperation. For example, raid leader can ask you to get a Catalyst. Catalyst might not be to good for your personal dps and depending on your class, it could require some important changes in rotation (not everyone is as smooth boy as Necro ^^) but in terms of whole group, bonus to dmg would be... substantial (first an 18%, than 9, now is 15% xd), so obviously one team of people that is properly using Catalyst would have advanced over one that is using whatever they want.

And as I mentioned above regarding bonuses to Catalyst dmg, some values are changing from patch to patch, and meta apostoles are helping to keep a track of those changes. But luckily in terms of changes, ESO is probably one of the best game, because thanks to sticker book and transmute station at any moment you can get any piece of equipment you want with any trait you desire. And obviously when it comes to obtaining new equipment... It would always require some effort. But only those farming alchemy nodes in Shadowfen in first days of Blackwood know what a real effort is ^^

Coatmagic

Meta numbers are all bout dummy faction ie how much time you spend with and how good you are at
AND
as others have prob already noted, there is no need unless you are crazy competitive or looking to be in a trial guild.

Play as you like only for the love of J&J, please don't go random vetting if you are unfamiliar with the content or cannot do what is required of you =8)

Curryganz

as a main sorc I was in your same position for the longest time until I learned to rotate- It really makes a difference. I never did it because it seemed too difficult: it's really not, assign the other staff to your mousewheel and it becomes second nature. Went from 9k tops to consistently 35k on average, with 44k spikes but it seems I cant do more lol. I'm satisfied, I do well in dungeons and trials and that's all that matters

colossalvoids

There was spoken a lot so I'll just chime in quickly. Most people even the fastest and highest dps ones doesn't care of others performance in normal content. I'dd even say in veteran also if said person is quick to learn and not doing same mistakes hundred of times in a row.

You should remember words like meta two times, first time at 160 cp to have an idea what gear and traits to collect for the possible future and second time if you'd like to become a better player going out from your comfort zone in all senses after around 300+ cp, with current leveling speed I'd even say it probably comes around 700-800 for some?

Anyway meta isn't a gear copying or mandatory skills on a bar, it's a mindset where you strive for perfection and gathering knowledge from patch to patch and act accordingly to the changes. It's not that there's one master mind saying people what to wear (but a lot of people love to) but collective of people digesting and experimenting each patch to make sure they've explored all options available and if their choices are made right for the content they're going into.

Darkstorne

francesinhalover wrote: »

tbh and i know some fans will dislike this, but other games have better endgame even gw2.

Eso endgame is... blinding to understand,



this is a trial where i have visibility.

no srsly, this ain't nothing , and i have my special effects at like 5%

Where i think eso is better than other mmo's is in the story telling, the open world is alright for solo players also. so if your endgame is completing story mode. than eso should be fine. if it's raids, eso is a pain.

gotta join guilds, wait days, check youtube guides and you still die to insta kills, nvm if you are stam close range, because you can't dodge in time.

Yep! And some people wonder why ESO doesn't seem to perform well on streaming sites

The meta is a lie though, and no-one should be worrying about it outside of hard mode vet trials or leaderboard fanatics. There's such a tiny difference between "the best" set and skill choices and all the other almost countless great choices you have at your disposal. It's far more important to find a playstyle you personally enjoy and feel good at, and then figuring out which sets/skills will best compliment that and help you perform at your personal best

I say this as someone whose main character heals vet DLC dungeons, as a StamSorc with a 2h sword. I promise you the meta should be ignored. It only appears to be a thing because so many new players understandably think "it's an MMO, I should google the best builds" and content creators will always exist to try and capture those clicks. Outside of the top 0.1% of trial and battleground players, it's really not something you should ever worry about. ESO is not like other MMOs in this regard.

Trinket61

So many good posts that have covered all the salient points...

But its patch night and i still have a ways to go before its all downloaded so i have a bit of time to put down some thoughts.

I left WoW after 14 years and started playing eso when Summerset came out. I have never regretted a single moment.

My advice is .. enjoy the journey. The devs have created a world for us and everywhere you look you and in everything you do you can see it has been a labor of love.

The community is really awesome , sure , occasionally u run into an [snip], but for the most part the extra dps you can do isn't even a factor. Just be considerate of others e.g don't do vets before you are ready and expect to be carried cause then u r the [snip].

ESO is so much more than just a game if you want it to be. For me it has become an alt-life , a place i come to hang out and share.

Peace.
[edited for profanity bypass]

KMarble

NineChameleon wrote: »

KMarble wrote: »

1. Your char isn't even half way through max level (160). Any "meta" gear you get now will be obsolete as soon as you level up (the gear/weapons/jewelry you'll find will always be the same level as your char).
This will make you a better player than going out and buying all the gold "meta" gear.

Thankfully I'm not at the stage of buying any meta gear yet. I'm not even sure i'd want to buy it when crafting is easily accessible. Been enjoying taking time out to level that to and trying to find all the traits lol.

My struggle right now is its hard to be motivated to carry on leveling if when I get to the end I'm just going to have to change all my skills around to satisfy these meta needs.

"Meta" gear isn't necessarily bought. In fact, many sets cannot be sold in guild stores.

In regards to the part I marked as bold. The time to change and test skills is NOW. Before you reach max level so that by the time you get there you'll already know what works for you.

ESO is not a game where you mindless go through silly, grindy quests so you can level up and start playing the "real" game. IMO the "real" game in ESO is figuring out how to make your character work best for YOU.

Again, the skills of the player are more important the the skills (and gear) of the character. As your character levels up you will (hopefully) learn how to use the skills that char unlocks to the best of your (player's) abilities. Because overland and beginner dungeons are more forgiving, you can test to your heart's content without becoming frustrated.

Everest_Lionheart

Let’s break down what META means.

Most Effective Tactics Available

In games like ESO that means the most effective skills, equipment, potions, CP allocation, enchants, group comps, support sets, etc.

Most of the issues I have with the META are when people think they can copy/paste a build or group comp and think that will quickly push them into some godly tier of DPS and that’s just not the case. It may give you a bump versus going it alone but there are reasons why the meta works in the specific way that it does. What you need to take away from meta builds is the what, when, why and how of the build itself in that order. What to wear/cast, when to wear/cast it, why you wear/cast it and how to execute it properly.

I was working on a training guide for one of my guilds for beginner Magblades. It shows them a basic rotation with easily obtainable gear without a single bow proc, completely static and still goes for 83K. It’s definitely not “the meta” but it’s based on the meta in that it still casts the dots in a certain order fills in the gaps with spamable and gets more streamlined in execute. It’s easy to learn and very new player friendly.

From there we add in bow procs subbing for a spamable, rotation is still static but jumps to 86K. This is a step closer to the meta and a 3K increase for adding a staple DPS skill of the class. We build upon that by adding some meta gear and introducing a mythic item, in this case the kilt and 1pc Slimecraw in place of 2pc Zaan. Using same rotation from 86k parse it’s now hitting 90K. That’s the impact of a mythic item in the Meta.

From there Bahsei is introduced which has a skill gap to use because it involves mag dumping. Bahsei contrary to popular belief is not only a parse set. It has applications based on certain fights again the what/when/why of a meta build is necessary to understand the set itself. With the introduction of Bahsei and tightening of the rotation (Merciless never falling off, a few more bow procs) the DPS creeped up to 93K. This build is very close to the meta, same gear different rotation.

I am still working out the kinks of the meta build myself because Magblade is unforgiving once you start going dynamic. Best I’ve done is 95K moving to dynamic. But I don’t want to introduce dynamic rotations to casual players. I want them in more simple builds that they can understand and complete all content with. These are people that want the boat from VKA for their house and Worm Wizard personality. They aren’t chasing Gryphon Heart or Godslayer so let’s set them up with an “off meta” build that is still effective.

The gap between Meta and Viable is not as big as people make it out to be.

NineChameleon

Everest_Lionheart wrote: »

snip

See, a lot of that post sounds like a foreign language to me at the moment. But those kinds of numbers are what intimidates me. 93k dps? That seems insanely high.

I'm relieved to hear its not really mandatory skills but more just like... mandatory tactics I suppose.

At the moment I'm magsorc I suppose? Level 39. Front bar is bow with dots and buffs on it, (Arrow barrage, Acid Spray, Critical Surge, Dark Exchange for minor prophecy. I don't remember what the 5th skill is) that's all I use it for. Back bar is the Destruction staff (using lightning rn) with 2 more dots on it (unstable storm wall, and lightning flood) plus Elemental Drain to try and sustain my magicka pool. As well as that I have Force Pulse and Impulse for light attack/skill weaves while my dots are still running (have them both for switching between single target and aoe)

Of course I have nothing special gearwise rn just an overworld drop set, Dreamers Mantle I think.

I don't know if that's how I should be doing it. I don't know if its effective. Any numbers I put in here are ones I'm getting from actually playing in dungeons and overworld since I dont have access to a trial dummy. And in overworld on things that aren't regular enemies since they die pretty fast anyway at the moment has peaked at 14k. I dont know if my companion is contributing to that though, he probably is.

And as has been said by other people rn I shouldn't be expecting to do huge amounts of dps.

At the moment my strategy for the things that aren't like... regular enemies is to buff, cycle through my first bar dots. Then switch to back bar dots then weave light attacks and spam either Force Pulse or Impulse depending on if its a single enemy or a group. Then repeating once my dots run out. I dont know how to use ultimates best yet. I tend to drop them when I can. Although I want to switch Negate Magic out for either soul strike or elemental storm.

I'm not looking to be top 1% I dont even know if I'm going to do Hard Vet stuff yet. I've never heard of trials so I don't know about those either.

Is that sort of thing like.... viable? Like dots mainly? Is that what is meant by having some buffs? I'm not sure what people mean when they talk about using passives. Is that like, loading your bar with stuff you wont use so you can trigger a higher bonus from a class passive?

zathera45 wrote: »

snip

@zathera45

oh? Maybe I'll look out for you guys

At the end of the day I just wanna get better and not worry my dps is too low I suppose. Which is easier now people here have told me I dont really need to worry about specific skills or even hitting the highest numbers I can.

Ilsabet

NineChameleon wrote: »

At the moment I'm magsorc I suppose? Level 39. Front bar is bow with dots and buffs on it, (Arrow barrage, Acid Spray, Critical Surge, Dark Exchange for minor prophecy. I don't remember what the 5th skill is) that's all I use it for. Back bar is the Destruction staff (using lightning rn) with 2 more dots on it (unstable storm wall, and lightning flood) plus Elemental Drain to try and sustain my magicka pool. As well as that I have Force Pulse and Impulse for light attack/skill weaves while my dots are still running (have them both for switching between single target and aoe)

One basic principle of effective DPS builds in ESO is that you're generally better off focusing your attributes into either stamina or magicka and choosing weapons for both bars that scale with your chosen stat. In your case, if your attributes are focused on magicka, you're gimping yourself by using a bow (which is stamina-based) on one bar. Most mag builds will use destro staves on both bars, or you could use resto on one bar for mag-based heals if you want the extra survivability. The numbers you pull using bow skills on a mag-focused character will be lower than they would be if you were using a staff instead.

Everest_Lionheart

Don’t get intimidated by the big DPS numbers. Not so long ago I was struggling to break 20K at CP300 under the old CP system with my meta gear. I took my time to learn how things worked at that point and spent lots of time practicing, leveling and trying new things. To get to the point where you can hit that hard is a journey in and of itself and along that journey it’s good to learn other things about the game as well like how the mechs also work in trials and dungeons.

As for the game itself there are thousands of hours worth of content to pass the time in order to increase to those levels. You will get there in time.

Ken_Koerperich

Simple answer.

If you are not going to focus on any of the "hard" "vet" dungeons/trials....Meta is useless.

If you are, worry about it from the get go, as you "should" already have a cheat sheet of a set, skills, and what not to follow.

If you are not going to do any of the stuff mentioned, ignore the meta and build the way you want to play.

Fun is what you make it, and making the game "work" isn't fun....

NineChameleon

Ilsabet wrote: »

One basic principle of effective DPS builds in ESO is that you're generally better off focusing your attributes into either stamina or magicka and choosing weapons for both bars that scale with your chosen stat. In your case, if your attributes are focused on magicka, you're gimping yourself by using a bow (which is stamina-based) on one bar.

See this is one thing that confused me too. You're not the first person I've heard say that. I read it quite a lot when I was looking up tips. But on the other hand I've also read and heard that ultimately the attributes make only a very small difference.

So uh.. which one is it? Just so I know?

Are Hybrids completely non-viable? tbh I was using the bow mainly for the extra dots

Ilsabet

There are people who have made hybrid builds work, but it takes some extra strategizing since you're basically compensating for not having the base strength of min-maxing your main stat. I would recommend sticking with a pure build unless you really want to get into the theorycrafting.

As an anecdotal example to indicate how much of a difference it makes: I play a stamblade, and all of my points are in stamina. At one point I considered using the magicka morph of the nightblade execute because it's ranged, whereas the stamina morph is melee (and I like to stay at range on my bow bar). Even with the execute damage multiplier, the mag morph did about the same amount of damage as a regular non-execute stam attack. So I basically lost the benefit of the execute, because the base damage was so much weaker on an opposite-stat build.

NineChameleon

Ilsabet wrote: »

There are people who have made hybrid builds work, but it takes some extra strategizing since you're basically compensating for not having the base strength of min-maxing your main stat. I would recommend sticking with a pure build unless you really want to get into the theorycrafting.

As an anecdotal example to indicate how much of a difference it makes: I play a stamblade, and all of my points are in stamina. At one point I considered using the magicka morph of the nightblade execute because it's ranged, whereas the stamina morph is melee (and I like to stay at range on my bow bar). Even with the execute damage multiplier, the mag morph did about the same amount of damage as a regular non-execute stam attack. So I basically lost the benefit of the execute, because the base damage was so much weaker on an opposite-stat build.

mkay, maybe I'll try out replacing my bow with an inferno staff. Might also help solve my single target struggles as I've seen the inferno staff passives make it stronger at single target. Right now my aoe is stellar. (just did Darkshade Cavern was hitting 20k on aoe trash) but my single target is kinda sucky.

(And to clarify this is 'stellar' in terms of what it was before lol. I don't think 20k on aoe is bad for a level 40 who doesn't really know what they're doing a whole lot rn)

MrGhosty

At level 37 you're still just a baby in terms of your characters output and growth, focusing too much on endgame build goals is going to frustrate you and make you not want to carry on. before CP level 160 is the perfect time for you to try some experimenting with different builds and sets to see what you like/don't like and get a feel for what your character can do.

One of the things I like to do with my little toons is pick random crafted sets that I've not used in awhile or ever and try to put together an interesting build just looking at the numbers for myself. My wife plays with whatever gear she picks up from teh zones she's playing through and tries to build a functional build that way.

My advice would be to join a guild that advertises itself as "relaxed" or "social" that runs dungeons/trials/etc in a more chill manner. The most important thing to try and remember is to have fun, meta chasing can wait. You should be exploring every facet of the game in this time and getting a feel for what you enjoy. Once you get a feel for your character and the game you can better choose the path that works best for you.

markulrich1966

I just built a hybrid for fun. I will not use it for veteran dungeons, but it is nice for my daily delves and worldbosses.

It initially was a stam-sorcerer with dual wield and bow.
Now, for vet content you would use a rotation that could work like this:
use DoT (damage over time) stamina skills on your backbar, then spammables on your frontbar.
This simplified view shows how to max your damage.
Lets say you have jewelry with weapon damage enchantments. Both, the back- and front bar benefit from this damage. Ideal situation.

Now, to go hybrid, I switched out the bow, and use a lightning staff instead.
I no longer benefit from the weapon damage jewelry now using the staff.
But heavy staff attacks still are so strong, that I quickly can clear the mobs in a daily delve. I prefer clearing delves this way, so this build is fine in this case. In addition I get major breach and a stun from 2 destro-staff skills, that help fighting larger enemies.

When I do the daily worldboss, I switch to the frontbar, dual wield. It does more damage, because it benefits from the jewelry glyphs. It is not as good as an optimized stamina-build, as I do not have the DoTs from the backbar any longer (as that now is the staff, magica). Still, for daily worldbosses, this is ok.

So: you CAN use hybrid builds AND enjoy them. But not as a general "best for everything" setup, but you should have an idea, in which kind of content you plan to use it.

Other things to consider: not many sets support Spell- AND Weapon damage. So I was somewhat limited in my choice, and chose New Moon Accolyte, Ancient Dragonguard, and Slimecraw. They support both, but on my "magica only" characters with matching gear the spell damage/crit chance is much higher.

MirandaSharp

NineChameleon wrote: »

So, for context. I have been coming and going from this game since release. Last time I played was several years ago and I couldn't get into it then. Coming back now I've started to really enjoy the overworld content and the story and such. I do really like the more action oriented combat system to!

Now, coming from other MMO's I naturally wanted to try and do well at my role whatever I pick. The main reason I enjoyed ESO on release and the times I've come back to it is the potential variety you can have in your builds. Even now that's the main reason I want to keep playing it. However, looking up advice I've started to see just how strict and demanding the meta is. With insane numbers that seem unreachable on my lowly level 37 sorc. I've been trying to convince myself that like... 70% of that damage comes from correct gear sets and gold quality gear and champion points etc etc.

But its really hard to keep believing it the more I try to look up advice.

I don't enjoy following build guides. I dont enjoy other people making the decisions for me about what skills to pick. But above all, I dont enjoy how vapid the skill tree system is if apparently only specific builds are viable.

I started looking up advice when I was level 20 ish 17 levels later yes my dps has gone up to around 8-9k on average. (12k if we're talking aoes) from 3-5k but that is still WAY below what most advice i've read says your dps should be as a DD. (I read 15k single target for under 50's somewhere, but I can't find the source anymore so idk if I'm imagining that.)

Its getting to the point where I dont want to carry on playing because the meta demands are honestly making me anxious. I never set out to do the hardest content in the game, but I'd like to be able to at least see the dungeons and remain useful in the dlc dungeons especially (i've heard they're a lot more demanding than base game).

I told myself that worst comes to worst I can just try and focus on making a solo build or something so I dont need to worry about letting other people down or being kicked for being inadequate at my role. But honestly I'm at the stage where I'm really considering if it's worth carrying on because of this strict build meta.

All of this is a long way of asking, Is the meta really as strict as it seems? Are these numbers you need to get to mainly based on gear and cp points? Are more skills viable than it seems so long as you have breaches and damage buffs and such? Or should I just look for an off meta guild so I can have less fear about playing outside the meta system?

Just play for fun. None of the gear matters until after CP160 anyway. And reaching high dps numbers etc should only be a concern once you've slotted all the CP stars to maximize damage. And even then the numbers will probably be limited by your ability to weave and time the skills in your rotation.... For 95% of the content you don't need uber dps anyway, so don't worry about it.

Franchise408

Meta is wholly unnecessary in 100% of ESO's content, including vet DLC trials. You do not need meta to partake in, or complete, any content this game has to offer.

The only time you "need" meta is if you are score chasing in vet trials. It is for leaderboard score pushing that you will need the fullest optimization of your character and group to be able to get the highest possible score.

If you just want to play through content, including vet DLC dungeons and vet DLC trials, you will not need to play meta.

Source: I have played literally all of this game's content in non-meta builds. I don't have a single meta build in any of my characters. I have cleared every single vet DLC dungeon, and while my guild has not cleared every single vet trial, we have cleared a few of them.

While you don't need meta, what you DO need is an intentional build.

What that means is that you *will* need to have a build that is designed to perform your role. Whether you are a tank, DPS, or healer, you will need a build that is intentionally built to perform in that role. It doesn't have to be meta, but it does have to be a cohesive setup. Much of the content in this game does have certain performance standards that are needed in order to clear. You don't need meta builds to reach those performance standards, but you will need to work on your own personal skills and have a build that is built to do the job.

Kadraeus

I remember one dude who said you need 100k dps to do Vet dungeons and I'm genuinely confused as to how you'd even get to that