can we get class change tokens if you guys are not going to balance classes?

Wing

i get it, class balance is tricky.

but at this point it seems your either aware of the discrepancy in classes and unwilling to balance them, OR, unware of the discrepancy in class balance.

neither of those options is good.

so if we could get a class change token to just balance ourselves for you, that would be solid.



pre countering the "just level a new character" argument:

-first of all im aware you can zerg level a new character in less then a day, are you aware this is not an argument? if it only takes a few hours, then what is your problem with someone just changing classes?
-my character is more then just its class, i have played the same character since launch, class is the most trivial thing i have put time into on my character, and those years cannot be re done in a day.
-alot of classes are not what they were when we first picked them, and others simply did not exist at the time.
-i think if FF14 has proved anything its that there is no need to lock people into a class forever.



i think most can agree that it would be nice if all classes were balanced equally and you didnt feel like you were gimping yourself by playing a class, but baring that, the ability to switch and play something thats both fun AND strong / competitive would be nice.

Jaraal

Because ZOS would rather have you pay to level mount speed and guild skills on a new character than to just let you avoid the grind by swapping all that time over to a new class.

This is why there will never be class change tokens in ESO.

VaranisArano

Leaving aside the way that ZOS monetizes making alt characters, I'm also concerned that a class change token would effectively lead to monetizing class balance.

Consider that players buy race change tokens whenever ZOS makes major changes to racial balance, and ZOS does not usually give out free name/race change tokens in compensation. Class change would be similarly and much more frequently monetized, and likely more expensive.


Unlike some, I don't think it will never happen. I just expect class change tokens to happen much later in ESO's life cycle when players no longer have the appetite to grind or pay for alts, but they will pay to quickly swap over their main to a different class.

ldzlcs065

I vaguely recall in a live show zos has hinted that there is some technical difficulty regarding class change token.

James-Wayne

Totally agree, I have been through some ups but mostly downs with my Templar since 2014 but as all my progression for the last 7 years is on this one character I'm kind of stuck and don't tend to play my other 15 characters very much at all.

If we cant have class tokens can we please have account wide progression on everything including achievements.

katorga

Playing Devil's Advocate:

How can you claim classes are unbalanced when the streamer channels are flooded with "OP", "INSANE", "UNKILLSABLE" builds for every single class?

Joy_Division

katorga wrote: »

Playing Devil's Advocate:

How can you claim classes are unbalanced when the streamer channels are flooded with "OP", "INSANE", "UNKILLSABLE" builds for every single class?

Streamers flood their channels with stuff like that for clicks, not because they represent an objective analysis of the classes.

katorga

Joy_Division wrote: »

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katorga wrote: »

Playing Devil's Advocate:

How can you claim classes are unbalanced when the streamer channels are flooded with "OP", "INSANE", "UNKILLSABLE" builds for every single class?

Streamers flood their channels with stuff like that for clicks, not because they represent an objective analysis of the classes.

And ZOS watches it. Judging from the mimicry of the the language in the 7.1 dev notes.

And no one is objective. Ever.

Camelord

I don't think the classes have been as close as they are in terms of balance in a long time. Except for magplars (and they are getting a nice buff with Waking Stam DLC) (i dont really play pvp but i feel like your post was more aimed at pve). I agree with account wide achievements though.

Vevvev

ldzlcs065 wrote: »

I vaguely recall in a live show zos has hinted that there is some technical difficulty regarding class change token.

They did, but in a similar vein they also said that about alliance change to. Then they found a way to make that work in their system by basically doing a full on reset of the character's faction specific quests and setting their location to the alliance capital.

CaptainVenom

Vevvev wrote: »

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ldzlcs065 wrote: »

I vaguely recall in a live show zos has hinted that there is some technical difficulty regarding class change token.

They did, but in a similar vein they also said that about alliance change to. Then they found a way to make that work in their system by basically doing a full on reset of the character's faction specific quests and setting their location to the alliance capital.

I was going to say that. If they did Alliance change tokens, they can do class change too.

Calypso589

katorga wrote: »

Playing Devil's Advocate:

How can you claim classes are unbalanced when the streamer channels are flooded with "OP", "INSANE", "UNKILLSABLE" builds for every single class?

Who are these streamers this forum is constantly whining about?

Legitimately wondering.

Wing

another patch, another big nothing in class balance.

NylAR

Calypso589 wrote: »

show previous quotes

katorga wrote: »

Playing Devil's Advocate:

How can you claim classes are unbalanced when the streamer channels are flooded with "OP", "INSANE", "UNKILLSABLE" builds for every single class?

Who are these streamers this forum is constantly whining about?

Legitimately wondering.

Just YouTube Kristofer ESO and watch his top 5-10 PvP highlights. Kristofer himself is not the problem and he's trying to do a good thing making these players better known, but those streamers are honestly a plague (most, not all). Along with some big names I'm not going to directly mention because enough harm has been done.

katorga

Camelord wrote: »

I don't think the classes have been as close as they are in terms of balance in a long time. Except for magplars (and they are getting a nice buff with Waking Stam DLC) (i dont really play pvp but i feel like your post was more aimed at pve). I agree with account wide achievements though.

I tend to agree. It is all subjective anyway, because balance is relative to the player, their class, and their build. The class most likely to wreck me is StamDK, which doesn't top anyone else's list.

But my point was, ZOS goes to the main streamer platforms, searches for "ESO INSANE", and the results return something for every class....why on earth would ZOS ever think classes are unbalanced? Everything appears to be just fine.

In terms of content, never forget there is money involved, and most of the "user" generated content on these platforms are part of corporate marketing campaigns. It can be a video game stream, music "reaction" video, or car review, these content creators are intimately involved with the sellers of the products. None of it is objective and you have to trust it (or not) just like any other advertising.

TX12001rwb17_ESO

How would a class change be any different to adding/removing Vampirism or Lycanthropy from your character? a class is nothing more then 3 skill lines and a few lines of text in the UI.

DrSlaughtr

I imagine they make a lot of money on new characters. Skyshards. Guildlines. Mount speed. Etc.

I hate leveling characters and I have characters I don't enjoy using, so I'd probably switch one or two but I also can see where this would get out of control.

Wing

TheEndBringer wrote: »

I imagine they make a lot of money on new characters. Skyshards. Guildlines. Mount speed. Etc.

I hate leveling characters and I have characters I don't enjoy using, so I'd probably switch one or two but I also can see where this would get out of control.

they would also make money on class changes, as well as the fact that skyshards and skill lines are one and done, class change is something players could continue to do, like race change.

DrSlaughtr

Wing wrote: »

show previous quotes

TheEndBringer wrote: »

I imagine they make a lot of money on new characters. Skyshards. Guildlines. Mount speed. Etc.

I hate leveling characters and I have characters I don't enjoy using, so I'd probably switch one or two but I also can see where this would get out of control.

they would also make money on class changes, as well as the fact that skyshards and skill lines are one and done, class change is something players could continue to do, like race change.

Yeah they'd probably charge 5k for it. I imagine the number of players who would do this over and over are slim.

Wing

TheEndBringer wrote: »

show previous quotes

Wing wrote: »

TheEndBringer wrote: »

I imagine they make a lot of money on new characters. Skyshards. Guildlines. Mount speed. Etc.

I hate leveling characters and I have characters I don't enjoy using, so I'd probably switch one or two but I also can see where this would get out of control.

they would also make money on class changes, as well as the fact that skyshards and skill lines are one and done, class change is something players could continue to do, like race change.

Yeah they'd probably charge 5k for it. I imagine the number of players who would do this over and over are slim.

i could say the same for people silly enough to actually buy things like skill lines, bag space, and mount upgrades from the store.

DrSlaughtr

Wing wrote: »

show previous quotes

TheEndBringer wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

TheEndBringer wrote: »

I imagine they make a lot of money on new characters. Skyshards. Guildlines. Mount speed. Etc.

I hate leveling characters and I have characters I don't enjoy using, so I'd probably switch one or two but I also can see where this would get out of control.

they would also make money on class changes, as well as the fact that skyshards and skill lines are one and done, class change is something players could continue to do, like race change.

Yeah they'd probably charge 5k for it. I imagine the number of players who would do this over and over are slim.

i could say the same for people silly enough to actually buy things like skill lines, bag space, and mount upgrades from the store.

Really?

60 days to max mount speed. Trying to PVP with a slow mount means you're getting to battles after they're done.

Mage guild? 150 or however many it is books spread out all over Tamrial, zones which you aren't going to have wayshrines for.

I can keep going.

I'm sure people would use a class change token but it wouldn't make the same amount of money for the company. Even if it did, every MMO needs new characters created.

Wing

TheEndBringer wrote: »

show previous quotes

Wing wrote: »

TheEndBringer wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

TheEndBringer wrote: »

I imagine they make a lot of money on new characters. Skyshards. Guildlines. Mount speed. Etc.

I hate leveling characters and I have characters I don't enjoy using, so I'd probably switch one or two but I also can see where this would get out of control.

they would also make money on class changes, as well as the fact that skyshards and skill lines are one and done, class change is something players could continue to do, like race change.

Yeah they'd probably charge 5k for it. I imagine the number of players who would do this over and over are slim.

i could say the same for people silly enough to actually buy things like skill lines, bag space, and mount upgrades from the store.

Really?

60 days to max mount speed. Trying to PVP with a slow mount means you're getting to battles after they're done.

Mage guild? 150 or however many it is books spread out all over Tamrial, zones which you aren't going to have wayshrines for.

I can keep going.

I'm sure people would use a class change token but it wouldn't make the same amount of money for the company. Even if it did, every MMO needs new characters created.

except FF14 it seems. . .

but its a small indie MMO so

DrSlaughtr

Wing wrote: »

show previous quotes

TheEndBringer wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

TheEndBringer wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

TheEndBringer wrote: »

I imagine they make a lot of money on new characters. Skyshards. Guildlines. Mount speed. Etc.

I hate leveling characters and I have characters I don't enjoy using, so I'd probably switch one or two but I also can see where this would get out of control.

they would also make money on class changes, as well as the fact that skyshards and skill lines are one and done, class change is something players could continue to do, like race change.

Yeah they'd probably charge 5k for it. I imagine the number of players who would do this over and over are slim.

i could say the same for people silly enough to actually buy things like skill lines, bag space, and mount upgrades from the store.

Really?

60 days to max mount speed. Trying to PVP with a slow mount means you're getting to battles after they're done.

Mage guild? 150 or however many it is books spread out all over Tamrial, zones which you aren't going to have wayshrines for.

I can keep going.

I'm sure people would use a class change token but it wouldn't make the same amount of money for the company. Even if it did, every MMO needs new characters created.

except FF14 it seems. . .

but its a small indie MMO so

Oh they just got a huge injection of users thanks to steamers mad about wow.

Ryuvain

Changing class should be so easy. Another mmo I've played made a lot of money off of class changing. Think of it this way: sure you don't have to level skill lines and shards, but you lose the class you swapped away from. You would have to swap back if the class was buffed or they fixed it up.

Seems like either way they would get money off players. No good reason why they can't do it.

Merforum

Actually a cool test would be if they tried PVP without any classes, where you just use all the skills from everything else but no class skills or passives active, but with CP enabled. Then no one would be so concerned about changing classes. And they could make classes very cool in PVE again rather than clones with a few different skills or very 'unbalanced' in PVP.

But as others have mentioned I bet they make a lot more money from the skyshard, skill line, rinding, etc. stuff. And would prefer people rolled extra toons.

Wing

still no class balance

Wing

just so everyone knows that means another couple months before we get a chance at balance again, a chance.

ADarklore

ldzlcs065 wrote: »

I vaguely recall in a live show zos has hinted that there is some technical difficulty regarding class change token.

Yes, the technical difficulty is that their finance department explains how much money they would LOSE if they implemented a class change token.

Nirntrotter

Agreed. This is not some niche system we're talking about, but one of the, if not THE core component of everyone's gameplay experience, and I'm extremely disappointed atm. It's clear from the DLC classes that the design vision moved towards all roles being viable on all classes, and they're very little to bring vanilla classes up to speed. I'd change my main class in a heartbeat if I could right now.

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

Because there is a thread already open on this topic, we're going to close this one down so that all feedback can be consolidated in one place. You may continue the discussion here.

Thank you for your understanding.