Imperial Race is still locked behind paywall

Aertew

Seriously, the imperial race is one of the things that really hurts this game's reputation and image. Imagine trying to get a friend into ESO and then they ask if they can play as a imperial.
"Well for $20 yeah! Or you can just sub $15 to unlock all the DLC" Seriously races should never be locked in a TES game. Imagine if Skyrim had a imperial race DLC? I don't get it.

Not only that but they made Imperial city free. So it's not like they can't just make it free. People who bought the pack can still play any race any faction. It's the imperial race-behind-locked-behind-$20 that is just dumb and predatory. I get the devs want people to pay for subs and try to make it appealing, but we already have to do deal with painfully slow research times and the mounts being trained only once a day. I get paying for expansions and DLC. But a race? Really?

Please, just make it part of the game like it should've been long ago.

Araneae6537

You don’t get the Imperial race as part of ESO+ and purchasing it does not give you Any Race, Any Alliance. I know, as I’ve had ESO+ since I started by only recently purchased the Imperial expansion to play one in Blackwood.

And you can dislike that something costs extra, how much it costs, and so forth, but that does not make it “predatory” so that’s a bit absurd.
Overpriced =/= Predatory

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

It's a bit strange yes. In no other ES game did you have to buy a race, right?

*shakes head*

BlueRaven

The imperial race was always a separate addition since the game started. I got the Imperial (collectors) Edition that had the race as part of it. It also came with any race, any faction.
For everyone else it was a separate purchase.

Goregrinder

Youyouz06 wrote: »

It's a bit strange yes. In no other ES game did you have to buy a race, right?

*shakes head*

In WoW (another MMORPG) I believe allied races require you to purchase an expansion pack, which is just a non-ESO term for Chapter. You have to pull out your wallet in order to unlock those.

Mythreindeer

You also have to pay for 2 of the classes. At least with the Imperial race you’re not missing much as far as gameplay.

It is what it is. Pay or not pay. In the end it’s not that big a deal.

Starlock

Mythreindeer wrote: »

You also have to pay for 2 of the classes. At least with the Imperial race you’re not missing much as far as gameplay.

It is what it is. Pay or not pay. In the end it’s not that big a deal.

If you as a customer value your time and money, it is rather a big deal that video game developers these days have taken to cutting out content from finished products to sell back to the customers for an additional fee.

RedMuse

Youyouz06 wrote: »

It's a bit strange yes. In no other ES game did you have to buy a race, right?

*shakes head*

Counter, no other TES game has been an MMO. They were single player games.

Starlock wrote: »

Mythreindeer wrote: »

You also have to pay for 2 of the classes. At least with the Imperial race you’re not missing much as far as gameplay.

It is what it is. Pay or not pay. In the end it’s not that big a deal.

If you as a customer value your time and money, it is rather a big deal that video game developers these days have taken to cutting out content from finished products to sell back to the customers for an additional fee.

As an MMO ESO isn't a finished product, it's an eternally ongoing product until the day they shut down the servers. Also by that logic you should never have had to pay for expansions to the single player games either, such as Tribunal or Mournhold. I honestly don't think you'll get far anywhere with that logic.

Kartalin

I bought it at launch via the imperial edition.

While it does offer a unique set of racial bonuses, I don't think it's significantly better than most of the other races depending on role. Sure you can find a guide that might say it's best race for role x in scenario y, but unless you're extreme min-maxing it's not really an issue.

If you think it's worth paying for, then do it. But by no means is it required or OP for any content.

Kiralyn2000

Aertew wrote: »

Imagine trying to get a friend into ESO and then they ask if they can play as a imperial..

Do people that you have to "try to get into ESO", really ask that? And have it be a deal-breaker?


(disclaimer: I'm also baffled by the "why do they hate Bretonians so much" thread. I just have a hard time understanding being so into the lore or a specific race, that you'd get incensed about how much coverage they get in a game. So maybe I just don't get it. /shrug)

Starlock wrote: »

If you as a customer value your time and money, it is rather a big deal that video game developers these days have taken to cutting out content from finished products to sell back to the customers for an additional fee.

Honestly, I know it's been a common claim the last decade or so, but I rarely see DLC as "cut content". Especially when it's about DLC made afterwards.

That said, the Imperials weren't made afterwards. But I can still see why they were considered "additional" when ESO launched. Given the Cyro/PvP/Three Banners War setup, not being able to pick a race that wasn't in one of the Three Big Factions made sense. Realistically, they shouldn't have given the option to be Imperial at all.

(of course, "Any Race, Any Alliance" kind of throws that out the window. And yeah, I got that automatically with my "ESO - Tamriel Unlimited" boxed copy of the game.)

Reverb

Yes, the Imperial race is locked behind a paywall. So is the ability to play any race in any alliance. So are 2 classes, a crafting line, 4 guild skill lines (2 of which are pretty much essential for end game), 12 zone maps, a handful of trials, and dozens of dungeons.

It’s a b2p MMO. Paywalls are literally how they keep the game running.

Aertew

Araneae6537 wrote: »

You don’t get the Imperial race as part of ESO+ and purchasing it does not give you Any Race, Any Alliance. I know, as I’ve had ESO+ since I started by only recently purchased the Imperial expansion to play one in Blackwood.

And you can dislike that something costs extra, how much it costs, and so forth, but that does not make it “predatory” so that’s a bit absurd.
Overpriced =/= Predatory

I thought imperial came with any race any alliance bundle. My bad.

That just makes it worse.

And no, the pricing isnt predatory, the pay wall itself is. They are taking something that was always part of the game and locking it away. That's what it is.

orion_1981usub17_ESO

Corperate commander demands his dues if you want to play the full game. Been that way since day one... not gonna change either.

Nastassiya

This is g game that requires funds to operate. They have developers, artists, writers, qa, customer service, managers, shareholders, server costs, and so on. The game may be "free to play" but it needs to bring in funds. Pretty much, unless you are ESO+ and/or buy all the chapters + dlc, peoples free to play enjoyment is being subsidized by people that do pay money.

Aertew

Reverb wrote: »

Yes, the Imperial race is locked behind a paywall. So is the ability to play any race in any alliance. So are 2 classes, a crafting line, 4 guild skill lines (2 of which are pretty much essential for end game), 12 zone maps, a handful of trials, and dozens of dungeons.

It’s a b2p MMO. Paywalls are literally how they keep the game running.

At least with the classes and skill lines there is work that is put into them that gives them value. The animations, lightning ect that goes into combat skill lines and coding and testing for stuff like antiquities. While classes would be nice to be added base game, they do put alot of ttime into them.


Imperial race is just a race. It's a pre-established race in the elder scrolls, it's not something new and it's like the devs spent a month creating it.

They took something that shoudve been in the base game and it has NO reason to be pay walled either to make money.

I dont care about the 'oh its a MMO so you should have to pay for every tiny thing' they devs already amke a load of money from subs, expansions, cosmetics and crown crates. Again like I said before they made imperial city free, and THAT most likely took more work than the imperial race. So you cant act like making the imperial race free is some sort of far fetched idea as ZOS did it with imperial city.

Nastassiya

You do understand that the money they make off this doesn't only fund ESO, right? What is being made from ESO is helping fund other projects, like TESVI. Also, if they suddenly make the Imperial race free then they would have a lot of people upset that paid money just to get that race.

zvavi

I am very confused, is his argument that since they made IC free they should make imperials free too? I can't see the logical jump here.

Aertew

zvavi wrote: »

I am very confused, is his argument that since they made IC free they should make imperials free too? I can't see the logical jump here.

Imperial race is paywalled.
Imperial race was a base game race for other Elder Scroll games like Skyrim.
Imperial race should be base game.

People shouldn't be against it as the devs already have many sources of income in the game.

Imperial city DLC was made free as well, so it wouldn't be the first

TL;DR make imperial race part of the base game.

Aertew

Nastassiya wrote: »

You do understand that the money they make off this doesn't only fund ESO, right? What is being made from ESO is helping fund other projects, like TESVI. Also, if they suddenly make the Imperial race free then they would have a lot of people upset that paid money just to get that race.

They made imperial city free and I don't think anyone complained.

Also it's $20???? you act like if we take away this $20 the company is gonna go bankrupt? I mentioned a bunch of other sources of Income they have in ESO.

jaws343

Aertew wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

I am very confused, is his argument that since they made IC free they should make imperials free too? I can't see the logical jump here.

Imperial race is paywalled.
Imperial race was a base game race for other Elder Scroll games like Skyrim.
Imperial race should be base game.

People shouldn't be against it as the devs already have many sources of income in the game.

Imperial city DLC was made free as well, so it wouldn't be the first

TL;DR make imperial race part of the base game.

ESO is not Skyrim. What was base game in Skyrim is entirely irrelevant for ESO.

You know what else was base game with Skyrim, the Solitude and Markarth portions of the world map. You know what requires payment to play? The Solitude and Markarth portions of the game map.

Aertew

jaws343 wrote: »

Aertew wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

I am very confused, is his argument that since they made IC free they should make imperials free too? I can't see the logical jump here.

Imperial race is paywalled.
Imperial race was a base game race for other Elder Scroll games like Skyrim.
Imperial race should be base game.

People shouldn't be against it as the devs already have many sources of income in the game.

Imperial city DLC was made free as well, so it wouldn't be the first

TL;DR make imperial race part of the base game.

ESO is not Skyrim. What was base game in Skyrim is entirely irrelevant for ESO.

You know what else was base game with Skyrim, the Solitude and Markarth portions of the world map. You know what requires payment to play? The Solitude and Markarth portions of the game map.

Again, almost as if it takes more work to make a entire new map than a single race.

Stop strawmaning.

FluffWit

Imperial Race was the first thing I bought from the crown store and its been my main ever since. Never bothered me having to pay for it.

On the other hand pay walling all the Imperial furniture is a constant pain in the ass I could do without.

jaws343

Aertew wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

Aertew wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

I am very confused, is his argument that since they made IC free they should make imperials free too? I can't see the logical jump here.

Imperial race is paywalled.
Imperial race was a base game race for other Elder Scroll games like Skyrim.
Imperial race should be base game.

People shouldn't be against it as the devs already have many sources of income in the game.

Imperial city DLC was made free as well, so it wouldn't be the first

TL;DR make imperial race part of the base game.

ESO is not Skyrim. What was base game in Skyrim is entirely irrelevant for ESO.

You know what else was base game with Skyrim, the Solitude and Markarth portions of the world map. You know what requires payment to play? The Solitude and Markarth portions of the game map.

Again, almost as if it takes more work to make a entire new map than a single race.

Stop strawmaning.

You are the one using Skyrim as the standard for Base Game. This game is not Skyrim. Base game for ESO does not, and has never, included Imperial race.

Anonx31st

Imperial is a collector edition item. Support ZOS and just pay for it if you want to unlock it.

Mythreindeer

Aertew wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

I am very confused, is his argument that since they made IC free they should make imperials free too? I can't see the logical jump here.

Imperial race is paywalled.
Imperial race was a base game race for other Elder Scroll games like Skyrim.
Imperial race should be base game.

People shouldn't be against it as the devs already have many sources of income in the game.

Imperial city DLC was made free as well, so it wouldn't be the first

TL;DR make imperial race part of the base game.

I have to take exception with your Aristotelian argument that Imperials should be in the base game of ESO. Your supposition that since Imperials are available in Skyrim then they should also be f2p in ESO is an opinion only and your conclusion therefore just doesn’t follow. ZOS can charge for whatever they want. You don’t have to like it but there’s no logical reason to support them not charging for it.

As for it only being $20 to ZOS if we multiply that by a million it adds up. OTOH if we say it’s only $20, that’s no more than lunch money, then perhaps ZOS may believe it’s a reasonable price for the majority of players.

Starlock

jaws343 wrote: »

You are the one using Skyrim as the standard for Base Game. This game is not Skyrim. Base game for ESO does not, and has never, included Imperial race.

The Imperial race was available from Day 1, wasn't it? That begs the question - why was this simply not included in the base game to begin with? The answer is, of course, profit.

I'd be hard-pressed to come up with a more transparent example of a game developer removing features from a base game release to sell it to the customer at a premium.

Froil

If Imperials were to become free, I'll take my refund. Same with ARAA.

Goregrinder

Reverb wrote: »

Yes, the Imperial race is locked behind a paywall. So is the ability to play any race in any alliance. So are 2 classes, a crafting line, 4 guild skill lines (2 of which are pretty much essential for end game), 12 zone maps, a handful of trials, and dozens of dungeons.

It’s a b2p MMO. Paywalls are literally how they keep the game running.

Yeah, well you've got server costs, ISP costs for bandwidth, probably DDOS protection costs, office space lease costs, electricity costs, employee salary costs, equipment costs such as employee work stations, RND costs, etc. I hope I didn't miss anything on that list. All of those things are recurring costs, they aren't one time payments for companies. That means a company like ZOS needs to find ways to generate recurring revenue, or in simple terms: Money that consistently comes to the company more than just once a year.

If we consider the average employee salary for a year is around $50k USD, we can multiply that amount by however many employees they are. So if there are 20 employees, that's about $1,000,000 USD ZOS needs per year just to pay their employees, which means they need to make even more than $1,000,000 a year to be profitable. That does not account for executive salaries either, as I imagine some employees make more than $50k a year and I imagine they have more than only 20 employees working at ZOS.

So $10 for the base game + $15 a month subscription fee would be great IF everyone who plays ESO paid for a sub. But not everyone does. A lot of people only pay the $10 entry fee and that is pretty much it. A single $10 one time purchase is not going to put a dent into anything. So they need to find other ways to keep generating money. DLC's are a good start, same with chapters. But that's not enough. They need people who will spend $5000 on something consistently. That's really what will pay the bills.

BlueRaven

Aertew wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

Yes, the Imperial race is locked behind a paywall. So is the ability to play any race in any alliance. So are 2 classes, a crafting line, 4 guild skill lines (2 of which are pretty much essential for end game), 12 zone maps, a handful of trials, and dozens of dungeons.

It’s a b2p MMO. Paywalls are literally how they keep the game running.

At least with the classes and skill lines there is work that is put into them that gives them value. The animations, lightning ect that goes into combat skill lines and coding and testing for stuff like antiquities. While classes would be nice to be added base game, they do put alot of ttime into them.


Imperial race is just a race. It's a pre-established race in the elder scrolls, it's not something new and it's like the devs spent a month creating it.

They took something that shoudve been in the base game and it has NO reason to be pay walled either to make money.

I dont care about the 'oh its a MMO so you should have to pay for every tiny thing' they devs already amke a load of money from subs, expansions, cosmetics and crown crates. Again like I said before they made imperial city free, and THAT most likely took more work than the imperial race. So you cant act like making the imperial race free is some sort of far fetched idea as ZOS did it with imperial city.

First of all, ESO is not made by the same people who made the other ES games.

Secondly, Imperials were NOT a playable race in every ES game.

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Arena:Races

https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Races_(Daggerfall)

Third, any race takes work to implement. Imperials are not copy and pasted Bretons (if you are going to make the case they are, I would recommend just playing a Breton then). They have different faces, skin textures, voices, etc.

Fourth, in ESO they have ALWAYS been a separate purchasable race to play, always. There was nothing separated out after the fact. Every Imperial player paid to play the race.

BlueRaven

Starlock wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

You are the one using Skyrim as the standard for Base Game. This game is not Skyrim. Base game for ESO does not, and has never, included Imperial race.

The Imperial race was available from Day 1, wasn't it? That begs the question - why was this simply not included in the base game to begin with? The answer is, of course, profit.

I'd be hard-pressed to come up with a more transparent example of a game developer removing features from a base game release to sell it to the customer at a premium.

Nothing was removed. Imperials were a bonus for people who bought the CE version of the game.

Anonx31st

BlueRaven wrote: »

Starlock wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

You are the one using Skyrim as the standard for Base Game. This game is not Skyrim. Base game for ESO does not, and has never, included Imperial race.

The Imperial race was available from Day 1, wasn't it? That begs the question - why was this simply not included in the base game to begin with? The answer is, of course, profit.

I'd be hard-pressed to come up with a more transparent example of a game developer removing features from a base game release to sell it to the customer at a premium.

Nothing was removed. Imperials were a bonus for people who bought the CE version of the game.

This, it was a collectors item and since it was an CE item, I am thankful to ZOS that they didn't make it a limited one so people could still buy it later on.