Scale Down Champion Points

Mykriz

I think it would be nice if ZOS took this opportunity to scale down champion points by a factor of 10. This would make the level cap 360 instead of 3600.
I just think 3600 is a little obnoxious and uneccessary.

It would make leveling up just once take longer, but it would feel a lot more rewarding since it provides a bigger boost to stats since the champion tree would also be scaled down.

It would also make the system appear less daunting, although it would remain the same time to max level. New people that look at 3600 as max level must be somewhat put off, I would be.

I know they probably won't do this as it would mean reworking a lot of stuff and people who can't math would be mad about loosing levels but I think it would be nice.

stefj68

if they could reduce cost by half, and make the max near 1800 i could be fine with it!

Ranger209

stefj68 wrote: »

if they could reduce cost by half, and make the max near 1800 i could be fine with it!

Honestly doing that, putting the soft cap in at 1200 that can be spent at the moment, and raising the soft cap by 75 per expansion or DLC. So 300 CP gain per year that is spendable will mean it will take 2 years to get from 1200 to 1800. They could keep the 1.5X modifier for those over cap like it is on live at 810.

I don't know, a lot of people will find this too limiting, but it doesn't sound terrible. On the upside this means your 1200CP at 1800 cap would be worth 2400 CP at the 3600 cap so there is that. It also gives them 2 years to start adding onto the CP system with whatever they want to do with it moving forward. Less daunting for new day 1 players when looking at max level.
Kind of like it.

edit - Taking this a step further they could also implement some kind of CP sales system where you could trade excess CP in for skins, mounts, other cool stuff to compensate those who have abnormally high CP with something they may want in exchange for unused CP. In the end as more people pass the cap by it would be used by more and more people. Just a thought.

Grandchamp1989

Imagine beginning this game from scratch and you're told:

You have to get to level 50

And then I'm done?

No my friend then you get to cp160 to get max gear.

And then I'm done?

No my friend, then you need 3600 CP points, then you're finished.

How long will that take?

Well.. If you play 6 hours a day.. Yeaaars XD

Kurat

Why does everyone wanna be max cp lol? Especially if you're mediocre player. Dungeons are full of current "max" cp810s who hit like wet noodles. Can you imagine being cp3000+ and being carried by cp300. That's what's gonna happen because the new cp system only adds 15-20% dps. People with 0 cp but with decent build and rotation can outparse high cp players. I would be embarrassed if that happened to me. So rather work on your dps than obsess about max cp.

Ranger209

Kurat wrote: »

Why does everyone wanna be max cp lol? Especially if you're mediocre player. Dungeons are full of current "max" cp810s who hit like wet noodles. Can you imagine being cp3000+ and being carried by cp300. That's what's gonna happen because the new cp system only adds 15-20% dps. People with 0 cp but with decent build and rotation can outparse high cp players. I would be embarrassed if that happened to me. So rather work on your dps than obsess about max cp.

For me it's not so much about wanting to be max CP when the new system is introduced. I am afraid it will take me 5 years or more to get from 1200 to 3600. In 5 years I am sure the max will be more than 3600, how much, who knows. But in essence I am afraid that I will never attain max level, ever.

I am promoting and endorsing ways to implement the system that in some way should ensure that I can attain max level in 2 to 3 years. It took me 6 years to get to 1200, so 12 more years to get to 3600? It goes a lot slower now so if nothing changes post 1200, 15, 20 years, really?? Sounds cool!!

It's about feeling like you are progressing and not stagnating. It is also about how long it should take a day 1, level 1, new player to attain max level, or should they never get there? It is not about being max level out of the gate. I have opposed the topic of free CP or some kind of experience conversion adjusting CP to the new XP curve. I am more worried about the long game than the short game myself. Not sure how many others share that concern, but just my 2 cents.

karekiz

Kurat wrote: »

Why does everyone wanna be max cp lol? Especially if you're mediocre player. Dungeons are full of current "max" cp810s who hit like wet noodles. Can you imagine being cp3000+ and being carried by cp300. That's what's gonna happen because the new cp system only adds 15-20% dps. People with 0 cp but with decent build and rotation can outparse high cp players. I would be embarrassed if that happened to me. So rather work on your dps than obsess about max cp.

You can literally say that about CP as a whole. So why not just cap CP at 160 and remove all the points we have now? I do think we need boosts to xp gain to compensate for the additional levels. it is literally THREE THOUSAND AND SIX HUNDRED levels with a slight "adjustment" to the curve. I am all for progression as long as I can't say "Man EQ is less grindy then this ***".

For example Randoms have not changed their values but our levels have indeed increased. We require more xp to get to "Cap" then we did before. Changing stuff like that to benefit that playerbase that don't have *** loads of gold to dump into writs is incredibly valuable. Especially to new players entering the game.

Xebov

Kurat wrote: »

Why does everyone wanna be max cp lol? Especially if you're mediocre player. Dungeons are full of current "max" cp810s who hit like wet noodles. Can you imagine being cp3000+ and being carried by cp300. That's what's gonna happen because the new cp system only adds 15-20% dps. People with 0 cp but with decent build and rotation can outparse high cp players. I would be embarrassed if that happened to me. So rather work on your dps than obsess about max cp.

The problem is not max CP, its the question "How long does it take to make use of the system?".

The new CP system comes being partly "must have" vertical progression and "choices" horizontal progression.

I currently have 1350 CP on the PTS. Thats the equivalent of ~670 Million XP in the old system. For comparison 810 is ~195 Million. Based on the current XP gains on PTS a player that reaches 810 when the patch hits would require ~340 Million XP to reach me.

Lets have a look at the green tree first. It just has nice support for misc activities. With my current CP i can get a nice passive star filled and can get my 4 most important active stars. Thats it, there are no more CP left. To be just able to have more active stars to choose from i would need to get much higher in CP and that doesnt include the passive stars at all. This means i can neither complete passive bonuses nor can i get additional active bonuses to choose from during my playtime. All i can do is moving points from one side of the tree to the other every time i want to do something different. Now mind you that even in the new system CP810 is worth ~165 Million XP and CP1350 is worth ~500 Million. So gats quite an extra amount to level just to be still not able to utilize it.

Now lets look at the other 2 trees. Iam a Tank player. My CP are not enought to get all relevant bonuses for my role (cost reduction, defence, healing). I would get another 300-600 CP to get it filled. This would be ~180 to ~640 Million XP. Now look again at the XP i already earned through the time i play this game. Even best case this could take months. But i also ant to be able to utilize it for overland and arena content, so i have to get some DD stuff too. You notice where this is going?

From the examples you see that i will in no way be able to utilize the tree beyond some basic bonuses and will not be able to utilize it further for a very long time. The tree supports my playstyle perfectly, but the low CP gain prevents me from using it. Additionally they already plan to add more stars und with that likely cap raises. But how am i ever able to use it? Another important question is how is a new player ever able to use it? We are looking at years of leveling in a speed where you can be happy if you can buy an expansive star every few months.

Xebov

Mykriz wrote: »

I think it would be nice if ZOS took this opportunity to scale down champion points by a factor of 10. This would make the level cap 360 instead of 3600.
I just think 3600 is a little obnoxious and uneccessary.

It would make leveling up just once take longer, but it would feel a lot more rewarding since it provides a bigger boost to stats since the champion tree would also be scaled down.

It would also make the system appear less daunting, although it would remain the same time to max level. New people that look at 3600 as max level must be somewhat put off, I would be.

I know they probably won't do this as it would mean reworking a lot of stuff and people who can't math would be mad about loosing levels but I think it would be nice.

The problem is not the number, its the time requirement to get there. Having less points (and longer time to reach it) would be more annoying as you would get points far less often and loose interest. A steady stream is way better. Having a higher total also has benefits for balancing the tree.

phantasmalD

Saying "3600 CP will take years to acquire" is not a mindblowing feedback since that's very much the the goal. They want a system that lasts for the remaining life span of ESO, or at least the next 4-5 years.

While I also dislike having such a daunting number for the end-game progression system, I very much doubt they will lower it.
For one, there are quite a few people who are actually at the hard cap, so they can't just cut it in half or something.
Two, having a range of 1-100 allows for better jump points. You wouldn't be able to neatly do a stage that requires 2.5 CP, but you can do one that needs 25.
Three, the high number allows level ups to happen more frequently. Instead of one level requring 10M XP you can do 10 levels for ~1M each. Gives you a sense of faster progression.

But in this system it's not just an illusion. Thanks to the free-floating stars, like Arcane Supremacy, you can technically make progress every level. Since these stars give you extra stats for a single CP you can dump all your extra ones in them. And once you have enough CP to buy a stage for a less flexible star, you just take them out and buy that one.

What ZoS needs to make sure is that the vertical ceiling is sensibly low, and they are trying to do that, as evidenced by the massive stage-cut of v6.3.2

Xebov

phantasmalD wrote: »

Saying "3600 CP will take years to acquire" is not a mindblowing feedback since that's very much the the goal. They want a system that lasts for the remaining life span of ESO, or at least the next 4-5 years.

Thats not exactly true. They said they want to expand the system. Expanding it however will require raising the cap sooner or later. This makes it unlikely that the plan is to have players grind for years just to reach the current cap. This would also not be very new player friendly and the goal seems still to be to get more players hooked up.