Suggestion : remove all cp beyond 810.

preevious

It started as a joke answer in another thread, but the more I think about it, the more it looks like a good solution ..

Considering that :

1. XP after cap was never banquable in any MMO, ever. It's a specificity in ESO, and not a very good one, since it creates the current issue.
2. Max level players of today should stay on equal footing after the patch. (none of that "I played a lot" nonsense. It never worked in any other MMO. XP AFTER CAT NEVER WAS BANQUABLE.

Remove all CP beyond 810.

Cp 500 --> Cp 500
Cp 810 --> Cp 810
Cp 1000 --> Cp 810
Cp 1500- -> Cp 810
Cp 2000 --> Cp 810


The benefit will be :

1. New guys can catch up
2. No max level player loose anything relative to others.
3. It gets back to a "normal" mmo system.

It may be a bit extreme, but I think it would solve many things. Probably the most just solution.

remosito

instaquit for me

Artorias24

I am so glad this wont happen ever.

preevious

Ok, but why?

It's already like that everywhere ! Even in solo games, for crying out loud.
If you are max level, you can keep killing monsters, but no XP for you.

The fact ESO allowed to grow beyon cap made us maybe a little entitled?
We do not deserve cp beyond 810 because they weren't supposed to be earned in the first place.

I know it seems harsh. But please, try to think about the what's good for the game's balance instead of what's good for you individually.

EpicHero

Taking things away from people in a game is the worst idea ever.

How about we come to your house and take some stuff away? Just cause it's virtual doesn't mean it doesn't have value.

Horrible idea.

preevious

EpicHero wrote: »

Taking things away from people in a game is the worst idea ever.

How about we come to your house and take some stuff away? Just cause it's virtual doesn't mean it doesn't have value.

Horrible idea.

Well, I could argue that you had 810 spendable cp before, and you'll have 810 spendable cp after.
The other cp you had were just imaginary and never existed.
As in every other games ever?

ESO should never have allowed us to gain xp after cap. It's time to remedy that.
No one will really loose anything. Really, think about it.

Firstmep

It's Bank with a k, just btw.

Frankly I never understand this idea that we have to have another XP progression system after lvl cap, Its pretty much just a substitute for increased level caps.
IMHO when cp caps were introduced, we shouldn't have been able to gain any more cp after that, and when the cp cap was raised, eveyone would've been on equal footing.
Cp 2.0 just doesn't feel like it's going to help newer players catch up, especially if the XP curve isn't adjusted, and on top of that it's going divide the veteran playerbase as well now.
Pretty much the opposite of what it's supposed to do.

preevious

Firstmep wrote: »

It's Bank with a k, just btw.

Frankly I never understand this idea that we have to have another XP progression system after lvl cap, Its pretty much just a substitute for increased level caps.
IMHO when cp caps were introduced, we shouldn't have been able to gain any more cp after that, and when the cp cap was raised, eveyone would've been on equal footing.
Cp 2.0 just doesn't feel like it's going to help newer players catch up, especially if the XP curve isn't adjusted, and on top of that it's going divide the veteran playerbase as well now.
Pretty much the opposite of what it's supposed to do.

my point exactly.
I'd 'loose' cp as well, but it's certainly for the best.

(and yeah, bank .. sorry, I tend to have my english polluted by my native langage.)

Jierdanit

preevious wrote: »

It started as a joke answer in another thread, but the more I think about it, the more it looks like a good solution ..

Considering that :

1. XP after cap was never banquable in any MMO, ever. It's a specificity in ESO, and not a very good one, since it creates the current issue.
2. Max level players of today should stay on equal footing after the patch. (none of that "I played a lot" nonsense. It never worked in any other MMO. XP AFTER CAT NEVER WAS BANQUABLE.

Remove all CP beyond 810.

Cp 500 --> Cp 500
Cp 810 --> Cp 810
Cp 1000 --> Cp 810
Cp 1500- -> Cp 810
Cp 2000 --> Cp 810


The benefit will be :

1. New guys can catch up
2. No max level player loose anything relative to others.
3. It gets back to a "normal" mmo system.

It may be a bit extreme, but I think it would solve many things. Probably the most just solution.

First of, the CP cap has never been 810 CP, but has always been 3600 CP, you just could only spend 810 of those.

Also, while you might think that players who played more than others should be at an advantage over the ones who played less, I certainly do think that if I played 2000 hours more in this game i should be at an advantage, at least CP wise.

I also really am not into grinding more CP at all, so I want it to be as few as possible, cause i dont want to spend as much time as i already have in the game (or likely more) just to get to the point in character strength were i am now again.

Jierdanit

preevious wrote: »

Ok, but why?

It's already like that everywhere ! Even in solo games, for crying out loud.
If you are max level, you can keep killing monsters, but no XP for you.

The fact ESO allowed to grow beyon cap made us maybe a little entitled?
We do not deserve cp beyond 810 because they weren't supposed to be earned in the first place.

I know it seems harsh. But please, try to think about the what's good for the game's balance instead of what's good for you individually.

I also doubt that it is going to be good for the game in general, since i dont think that players who have gotten to like 1.5k - 3k CP would be all that happy that you just take probably several thousands hours of getting XP from them.
And pissing the veteran playerbase off even more than it already is would hardly be good for the game outside of having less people complain because usually people who just leave the game dont complain as much.

Alienoutlaw

if i wanted every other MMO out there i would not have bothered buying ESO or play it.
stop comparing ESO to everything else, its different for a reason

oahaha

1. New players can have a catch up mechanism like extra xp till a point.
2. Max level players lose, all the time they put into the game, why should one lose something just because you started the game yesterday.
3. There is no such thing of a "normal" MMO System, each MMO has it's systems and that's a good thing, that's how they make ppl to play it, so similar to other things is not a good thing.

preevious

So..

I agree that all MMO are different, and all that ..

But seriously ! Let's agree a system is ridiculously bad when it is !

Lots of players never bothered to xp a lot after cap because how could they have anticipated that the cap would raise by a frigging 2790 cp? What do we tell those? "though luck"?
Many of those played just the same amount as you guys, just in activities that are less xp rewarding, because XP WAS NOT NEEDED.

[snip]
You gained lots of XP afterb the cap? I'd say ... too bad. But you anjoyed the game while doing so, right? That's what counts.

Levelling the playing field is the only way we'll have a semblence of justice.

[Edited to remove Baiting]

oahaha

I never did bother to grind cp also, and probably now i would have had much more and not just 1200, but still why should i lose anything, just because new players have less ?
Granted that the system is not that good, but maybe just maybe in the future it will get better.
I don't advocate for systems that increase your power endlessly but that's what the developer managed to give us.
I would like to see a CP system that is focused 15% of character power and the rest to character customization, different spell animations, spell effects, etc, maybe receiving specific CP points if you complete a type of content.
But that's another thing, removing something that I worked for just cos others don't have it is just communism.

preevious

hands0medevil wrote: »

No, I don't want to be the very best. You just want everyone to be equal in MMO game, that's the problem.

a cp 900 that gained xp slowly because he was doing trials is as entitled as you to remain as effective as a cp 2000 player that got his xp selling skyreach runs .
As long as xp is not equal for all activities, there can be no justice in everyone keeping their cps.

Jayroo

There's nothing to complain about (without making assumptions) until we know the exact numbers of the adjusted xp gain rate, which isn't in the PTS yet.

relentless_turnip

I am really looking forward to being able to progress again tbh.
I am cp 1200ish... The power cp now gives you on the PTS is small. It is enough to still have a progression path, but not enough to feel helpless without enough of it.

As an example uesp editor has recently added the cp system, do yourself a favour and apply cp and then toggle to switch it off. Now experiment doing the same with different amounts of cp. As a DPS is your DPS really much worse off?

Certainly isn't a sky falling scenario to me. I only play PvP and it is assumed the power difference will be huge... It isn't IMO. I will not be running from someone with 200 more cp than me 😂

Sanguinor2

preevious wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

[snip] It doesnt matter if you think that we shouldnt have been able to earn CP beyond 810, fact is we were able to so why should they get taken from us?
Back in the days of vet ranks we actually couldnt earn XP beyond the vet rank cap, only after the cap was increased we were able to earn XP towards the next vet rank. Zos decided to change that with the CP system tho so why would they walk back on that now?

[Edited to remove Baiting]

preevious

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

preevious wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

[snip] It doesnt matter if you think that we shouldnt have been able to earn CP beyond 810, fact is we were able to so why should they get taken from us?
Back in the days of vet ranks we actually couldnt earn XP beyond the vet rank cap, only after the cap was increased we were able to earn XP towards the next vet rank. Zos decided to change that with the CP system tho so why would they walk back on that now?

Indeed. But the opposite is true.
Zos could walk back on that, since it was like that before. It would then be the rule.

My argument is not absurd, mind you. I gave the pros and cons, and in my opinion, the pros outweight the con.
Actually the ratio pros/cons is better with this solution than with the others.

Of course, it's an opinion, feel free to disagree.

Sanguinor2

preevious wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

I wouldnt say that this is an entitlement issue.
We are entitled to that which we earned through means which are allowed by Zos. No one here is demanding that we get anything for free that we did not earn.
In fact you want to take away what we earned because you dont like that we were able to.
Yes I enjoyed the game, doesnt mean I would enjoy regaining something that I already earned because someone decided it would be great to simply take it away.

preevious

relentless_turnip wrote: »

I am really looking forward to being able to progress again tbh.
I am cp 1200ish... The power cp now gives you on the PTS is small. It is enough to still have a progression path, but not enough to feel helpless without enough of it.

As an example uesp editor has recently added the cp system, do yourself a favour and apply cp and then toggle to switch it off. Now experiment doing the same with different amounts of cp. As a DPS is your DPS really much worse off?

Certainly isn't a sky falling scenario to me. I only play PvP and it is assumed the power difference will be huge... It isn't IMO. I will not be running from someone with 200 more cp than me 😂

Honestly, the DPS will not be much worse, and I don't really care either way.
I am merely stating my opinion on what would be the most fair solution.

A skilled cp 1000 will still GREATLY outperform an unskilled cp 3600, anyway.

oahaha

And what about the guys that just grinded CP just because they like it.
Why should those guys suffer, if they enjoyed grinding that pointless number just because you can, what about them ?

relentless_turnip

preevious wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

I am really looking forward to being able to progress again tbh.
I am cp 1200ish... The power cp now gives you on the PTS is small. It is enough to still have a progression path, but not enough to feel helpless without enough of it.

As an example uesp editor has recently added the cp system, do yourself a favour and apply cp and then toggle to switch it off. Now experiment doing the same with different amounts of cp. As a DPS is your DPS really much worse off?

Certainly isn't a sky falling scenario to me. I only play PvP and it is assumed the power difference will be huge... It isn't IMO. I will not be running from someone with 200 more cp than me 😂

Honestly, the DPS will not be much worse, and I don't really care either way.
I am merely stating my opinion on what would be the most fair solution.

A skilled cp 1000 will still GREATLY outperform an unskilled cp 3600, anyway.

Since we are in agreement in that respect, wouldn't you agree capping cp at 810 is unnecessary? Having a near unreachable cap on the other hand continues to give us a feeling of progression.

preevious

relentless_turnip wrote: »

preevious wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

I am really looking forward to being able to progress again tbh.
I am cp 1200ish... The power cp now gives you on the PTS is small. It is enough to still have a progression path, but not enough to feel helpless without enough of it.

As an example uesp editor has recently added the cp system, do yourself a favour and apply cp and then toggle to switch it off. Now experiment doing the same with different amounts of cp. As a DPS is your DPS really much worse off?

Certainly isn't a sky falling scenario to me. I only play PvP and it is assumed the power difference will be huge... It isn't IMO. I will not be running from someone with 200 more cp than me 😂

Honestly, the DPS will not be much worse, and I don't really care either way.
I am merely stating my opinion on what would be the most fair solution.

A skilled cp 1000 will still GREATLY outperform an unskilled cp 3600, anyway.

Since we are in agreement in that respect, wouldn't you agree capping cp at 810 is unnecessary? Having a near unreachable cap on the other hand continues to give us a feeling of progression.

unnecessary? Certainly.
More fair? I still think so.

Sanguinor2

preevious wrote: »

Indeed. But the opposite is true.
Zos could walk back on that, since it was like that before. It would then be the rule.

My argument is not absurd, mind you. I gave the pros and cons, and in my opinion, the pros outweight the con.
Actually the ratio pros/cons is better with this solution than with the others.

Of course, it's an opinion, feel free to disagree.

Zos could walk back on that but they gave no indication that they intend to and seeing as they already applied the new system to the PTS it is all but assured that they will not.
I never said that your arguments were absurd, your idea however is. I used the same arguments you used in my very non serious post btw.

Foto1

I have 1400+ cp and in general I would agree to that. although there are better ways to close the gap between newbie and old

Starlight_Whisper

Nah I played longer and deserve more power as more experienced then guy who just started yesterday

radiostar

I guess we could agree to not increasing the number of usable CP. But how does Z compensate everyone that has earned above that number? There's only so much stomping on us they can do and be fair to longtime players. We already been shortchanged enough to help out new players.

Foto1

preevious wrote: »

EpicHero wrote: »

Taking things away from people in a game is the worst idea ever.

How about we come to your house and take some stuff away? Just cause it's virtual doesn't mean it doesn't have value.

Horrible idea.

Well, I could argue that you had 810 spendable cp before, and you'll have 810 spendable cp after.
The other cp you had were just imaginary and never existed.
As in every other games ever?

ESO should never have allowed us to gain xp after cap. It's time to remedy that.
No one will really loose anything. Really, think about it.

you're not right. when the cp system was created, there was no cap, and some players got to 2000+ in a few months. and only then Zos introduced the cap. subsequently, the cap moved several times until it reached 810

KhajiitLivesMatter

so u wanna let me grind 2790 cp instead of 2400 ? that 390 doesnt make a diffrence
in my opinion the only fair way would be to look how much xp u earnd to reach cp x and give u the same amount in the new system
so if u did grind to cp 1000 and already earned 1mio xp and in the new system 1mio xp is lvl 1200 than it would be only fair the be that lvl after patch

so all players are already losing xp no need to increase it

next thing is "new player can catch up" nonsense for a new player the new system is way worse cause the diffrence between no cp and high cp will be way higher - and the catching up stuff is just useless if u play much u will get much easy system - no reason to punish the active players even more just for some newbis

SgtNuttzmeg

No, I think a lot of people would leave the game over this. It might not be a big deal for most, most people are below 1300 but there are some people that are in the 1800s or above. That took a lot of xp, significantly more than the grind to 810. It should be respected. Further the required CP to get all the passives is significantly more than 810. What we need is a shifting of how much xp is required to get CP or reducing the cost and cap of CP. Make it so you get less but make it so it proportionally costs less. This way you still get the same effective vertical and horizontal progression.