My patience with competitive multiplayer toxicity is paper thin

hexentb16_ESO

Teabagging, Tiny Violin, Weak Pushups, "Kiss this" emote, rubbing the salt into the wounds is the best part of pvp! I don't care when people do it to me either. Pvp is a lot more fun when you stop caring so much about losing.

ArchMikem

hexentb16_ESO wrote: »

Teabagging, Tiny Violin, Weak Pushups, "Kiss this" emote, rubbing the salt into the wounds is the best part of pvp! I don't care when people do it to me either. Pvp is a lot more fun when you stop caring so much about losing.

There's also a thing called being a sore winner.

exeeter702

I grew up playing fighting games in the arcades in socal. *** talk, popping off, being humbled and knowing how to take a loss when you are outplayed is all engrained into my DNA and will never bother me. Being bothered or offended by someone anonymously teabagging me or typing something "toxic" on the internet is not something I think i will ever be able to understand.

The fact that teabagging is against the ToS is really disheartening.

ArchMikem

exeeter702 wrote: »

I grew up playing fighting games in the arcades in socal. *** talk, popping off, being humbled and knowing how to take a loss when you are outplayed is all engrained into my DNA and will never bother me. Being bothered or offended by someone anonymously teabagging me or typing something "toxic" on the internet is not something I think i will ever be able to understand.

The fact that teabagging is against the ToS is really disheartening.

Then you're missing the point. How we treat competition reflects on our character. Respecting the defeated and accepting your defeat. Let me quote myself again.

Go back to the good days when everyone used /Honor after a fight. I was here for that, you all used to be nice once.

exeeter702

ArchMikem wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

I grew up playing fighting games in the arcades in socal. *** talk, popping off, being humbled and knowing how to take a loss when you are outplayed is all engrained into my DNA and will never bother me. Being bothered or offended by someone anonymously teabagging me or typing something "toxic" on the internet is not something I think i will ever be able to understand.

The fact that teabagging is against the ToS is really disheartening.

Then you're missing the point. How we treat competition reflects on our character. Respecting the defeated and accepting your defeat. Let me quote myself again.

Go back to the good days when everyone used /Honor after a fight. I was here for that, you all used to be nice once.

I assure you, I know full well the point.

WaywardArgonian

I kind of feel you. I know teabagging is used to throw people off their game, but I still find it fun to zap the teabagger out of a zerg with my little Nightblade. Especially because in my experience the person doing it is always the one who got 1 hit in at best when you were zerged down. At the end of the day I don't take it so seriously though. It's just people screwing with your mind in a video game.

Skullstachio wrote: »

Just so you know, there was an update to the Terms Of Service a while back, with the addition that it is strictly against the ToS to Teabag other players, so if you can, get the name of the offending player, Report them with the in-game report system and leave it at that. Or DM ZoS staff via Support and Leave it at that as ToS violations are taken to a serious extent. (Just don’t expect any responses as it is usually dealt in a private manner.

The wording was different. It's not that teabagging is against the ToS, it's that repeatedly doing things to upset another player after they ask you to stop is considered harassment. Teabagging someone repeatedly after they ask you to stop is against the ToS, not the act in and of itself. Source: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6962775/#Comment_6962775

Elo106

Think you just have a weird mindset (weird as in unusual not bad) you seem extremely casual just playing on pve builds and not caring about winning or losing but on the other hand caring so much about an emote.

Some people dont see tea bags as toxic its just a "haha got you" type of thing. I always thought they were toxic but some friends did it to me and now we have been doing it to each other ever since.

Taunting isnt always a bad thing it can be fun

Minyassa

ArchMikem wrote: »

I've been paying ESO since September of '15. Started dipping into Cyrodiil the following year, and got more series with how to play PvP around 2017. My main's AvA rank is in my Sig, I also have mid level AvA ranks on two other less played characters. I'm no stranger. In fact I've mained the same Campaign (currently Blackreach) thru several Updates that I consider myself one of the Vets, even if I'm still not a good player.

And I'll admit that. I suck at PvP. Mostly at my own choice. I've fought my way up the ranks using a PvE build. Cyrodiil is a place to waste time. After I've done the majority of the PvE content each Update I go into Cyrodiil for some AP and to help the Reds until the next content releases. I know all about the Tryhards, the bullies, the players with parts of their brains that haven't matured yet, and I keep Chat open because I want to callout and see callouts. But I have a problem, where I very easily form grudges. This only happens if I've been, "wronged" for no valid reason. I have a live and let live mindset. I NEVER bag anyone. I never taunt or harass of my own accord, cause I'm just here to play. If I engage, and actually win a fight, I'll leave. I don't do anything else to them. I even came up to a resource and got jumped by two players. I actually won a 1v2, for the first time in forever. What did I do? I used /Humble. I even wanted to message one of them noting how close they almost got me several times and say good game. WHY CAN'T EVERYONE BE LIKE THIS?

Instead the common experience for me is frustration. I literally have not gone a single session in Cyrodiil without being bagged by someone, and there's where my grudges come in. Once someone does that to me, their Gamertag is placed on a list. I will actively hunt them down, fight them, follow them, look out for them, and if given the chance return what was given in kind. After that, I leave. It's only fair.

Just last night I went to a keep that had just been capped by us and stopped at one of the resources cause I noticed someone fighting the guards. I demount, buff up and attempt to fight. Being a StamBlade my only good methods of fighting is trying to surprise burst and cloaking out when at a disadvantage. I'm not a brawler, and a lot of the time even my damage isn't enough. This fight though I managed to draw out for a while cause the other player was your cookie cutter StamSorc with the 1H&S back bar. Eventually I got pressured and exhausted of Stam and lost. The player then bagged me. THEN I got a whisper. Dude said it was amazing I've played the game so long and am still so trash at it. So what just happened here? In my eyes I had an honest 1v1, by the time I actually got to them all the Guards had been defeated, and instead of just leaving after winning, they had to bag AND send a hate whisper. So of course the list adds a new name and I reply, "I'm a PvE build, I just don't give a crap."

Of course though the rest of my night is pretty much crap cause I spent most of it under the influence of a grudge. Several, in fact. Just after this player a 4-player blue group decided to farm Arrius and one of the Nightblades decided my corpse was comfortable every time I lost to a 1v4. Even when I caught the player by themselves the rest of the group came charging up. The ones who taunt from winning unfair fights are especially, irksome. I never got to settle that one.

tl;dr

Cyrodiil is annoying, full of annoying immature players. But it's the only content left to do between updates. Y'all need to stop being rude. Go back to the good days when everyone used /Honor after a fight. I was here for that, you all used to be nice once.

I think hunting them down is great if you have the energy for it and you are up for the fight, but I would advise against returning the gesture after you kill them. That only teaches them that "everyone does it"--they need to see more examples of people who don't do it. Other than that I think you're doing what you need to do to let off steam. Just don't stoop to their level doing it.

erio

I mean, im sure they would be toxic since youre playing a low damage cloak nightblade, and it can be annoying to fight since youre constantly cloaking. (Thats also not the only way to play nightblade btw)
Theres a decent amount of toxic players, but theres definitely a lot of nice ones. Im in a very tight pvp community any everyones super nice.

geonsocal

whenever I see an ally bagging dead folks - I run on over and have the redguard dance remote slotted just for that...

it provides a unique visual to discourage that type of behavior...

xillion

99% of tbaggers are pathetic players. I always record a video (win+alt+R) when I die and report the player if tbagged. When they get a ban, they'll think twice before tbagging next time...

exeeter702

xillion wrote: »

99% of tbaggers are pathetic players. I always record a video (win+alt+R) when I die and report the player if tbagged. When they get a ban, they'll think twice before tbagging next time...

Yeah no... not really. But you do you man.

Tberg725

It still makes me laugh that people get soooooo bent out of shape because someone bagged them lol its a video game and crap talking and taunting is fun when someone bags after managing to kill me I make sure to target them in their group and bust out the shovel emote it’s good times

Brrrofski

Like I kind of agree with you OP.

But when I get killed by about 7 people and bagged now I find it funny that someone is so concerned with me, that they find the need to bag. Like I've also annoyed them or made an impact that they feel like they have to bag me. Kind of a compliment.

Most players I kill I just move on. I don't care who they are. I don't even bag people back. I'm not bothered by them. Only thing I do is the bow emote if I had a good 1v1 fight with someone.

And to be fair, it's not just this game. Most online games I've played has this. Like Call Of Duty used to be crazy for it, especially before they introduced party chat on xbox. Pre game lobby and in between round of search and destiny were ridiculous looking back.

I guess what makes whispers worse in this game is that doing that over xbox live for instance can mean you get a comms ban if you say anything offensive or that can be deemed as harassment. Whereas they're isn't anything in game like that, so whispers are are not held accountable.

If anyone is on xbox eu and plays as AD in cyrodiil, or plays BGs, you'll have come across one of the worst offenders of this. You know who I mean.

NOOB
TRASH

Over and over in zone chat. And I mean for HOURS. Like he must be standing still somewhere and just doing that for hours.

Abd then when he decides to message you on xbox it's all one word messages.

N
O
O
B

T
R
A
S
H

So you can't really report a message for being abusive as it's technically just a letter.

Ellimist_Entreri

Just wait until you find out certain endgame trials guilds not only teabag in pve vet trials where they specifically recruit newer players so they have someone to abuse, they even have an add-on they use to track how many times they teabagged someone (in pve). Those are the truly toxic, abusive players - regardless of what end-game trials they clear as a group.

VoidCommander

PvP players get SO RILED UP when I politely ask them to not T-Bag. They love bringing up “zos won’t do *** lol”, then I inform them that harassment reports only work if you t-bag after I’ve asked you to stop, then they usually shut the *** up.

MirelaUmbrella

VoidCommander wrote: »

PvP players get SO RILED UP when I politely ask them to not T-Bag. They love bringing up “zos won’t do *** lol”, then I inform them that harassment reports only work if you t-bag after I’ve asked you to stop, then they usually shut the *** up.

This is why my fiancé and I play in offline mode nowadays

[snip]

[Edited to remove Baiting]

ArchMikem

erio wrote: »

I mean, im sure they would be toxic since youre playing a low damage cloak nightblade, and it can be annoying to fight since youre constantly cloaking. (Thats also not the only way to play nightblade btw)
Theres a decent amount of toxic players, but theres definitely a lot of nice ones. Im in a very tight pvp community any everyones super nice.

My character is a glass cannon StamBlade, I can only cloak at max four times if I have a full Magic bar and time each cast just right. Since I'm also casting Channeled Acceleration, cut the cloaks down to two or three casts.

megasurge93

I agree. It would be very nice if PvP could be less like 12 year old bully children in zone. That said, I just block everyone who is a jerk to others in zone or just being rude. Needless to say, I have a very large block list but my zone chat when in PvP is much more pleasant.

Minyassa

MirelaUmbrella wrote: »

VoidCommander wrote: »

PvP players get SO RILED UP when I politely ask them to not T-Bag. They love bringing up “zos won’t do *** lol”, then I inform them that harassment reports only work if you t-bag after I’ve asked you to stop, then they usually shut the *** up.

This is why my fiancé and I play in offline mode nowadays

[snip]

[Edited to remove Baiting]

That's when you just ask in zone chat. Ask everyone at once. Not your fault if they don't see it, you asked, and it'll be on record, and then you can report away. If ZOS isn't going to cover offline mode specifically they have to honor any attempt you make.

wazzz56

I don't typically bag ppl, Falkreath Frolic is a much better choice, but I do catch bags a lot.....Have had entire guilds hunt me through cyro to fill a "bounty" put on me and bag me 30 and 40 ppl deep at times..I have had lines of 20 ppl take turns emoting and bagging over me etc and not once did the thought " I should report these guys" cross my mind....some of y'all let pixels bother you too much.... I can't imagine reporting and clipping every bag I got....In all honesty, the report and try and get everyone banned behavior is just as, if not more toxic...you can be all pretentious and holier than though, but trying to get people banned over something as petty as tea bags is lame too.....

ArchMikem

wazzz56 wrote: »

I don't typically bag ppl, Falkreath Frolic is a much better choice, but I do catch bags a lot.....Have had entire guilds hunt me through cyro to fill a "bounty" put on me and bag me 30 and 40 ppl deep at times..I have had lines of 20 ppl take turns emoting and bagging over me etc and not once did the thought " I should report these guys" cross my mind....some of y'all let pixels bother you too much.... I can't imagine reporting and clipping every bag I got....In all honesty, the report and try and get everyone banned behavior is just as, if not more toxic...you can be all pretentious and holier than though, but trying to get people banned over something as petty as tea bags is lame too.....

A deliberate action tantamount to harassment has been declared a reportable offense by the higher ups of this Service. Attacking those who wish to not let the offenses go unanswered is also just as lame. It doesn't matter if people view it as petty. Petty Crime is still Crime.

finehair

the most toxic people i've seen in this game were in some random veteran dungeons; where one dd was accusing of the other for being noob and not dealing damage as he does.
I ended up kicking them in the group since it is easy to get majority against that kind of person. you have the accused people with you already, and if the other person isn't one of those "closed chat" players you are good to go.

Worst ones i've seen in pvp where getting hate whispers from some dudes getting trampled by the zerg and me accidently stepping over his corpse while i'm literally listening "wipe out" by surfaris while surfing on the lfg zerg

It is fun to play solo and smallscale; but leaving your mind behind and joining the peasant mob that rushes through keeps with bazillion people is another thing while spamming random skills around and being fodder. It has its own taste.

Zski

Behavior of PvP anymore is too trash to make it worthwhile. Every death is someone bagging, saying dumb things in whispers, and generally being the vile 12 year old from Xbox Live I went to MMOs specifically to avoid. Its impossible to just have a chill night because 15 Little Jimmies gotta get their flex on after smashing Surprise Attack x3, or something.

Maybe it's because I came up playing tournaments with a code of conduct, and BM would get you disqualified because literally no one intelligent likes it, but bagging is just utterly vile trash behavior.

For the guys spouting off about "pixels bothering us too much" - pixels dont bother me. You bother me. Your awful behavior being on 1 out of every 3 people bothers me. I'm not upset at a game, I'm upset at having to deal with you everywhere I go, in every game I play.

Leave people alone, they just wanna play the game. The actual game. Not whatever weird troll subframe you think everybody wants in on. We dont. Go away.

hafgood

Skullstachio wrote: »

Just so you know, there was an update to the Terms Of Service a while back, with the addition that it is strictly against the ToS to Teabag other players, so if you can, get the name of the offending player, Report them with the in-game report system and leave it at that. Or DM ZoS staff via Support and Leave it at that as ToS violations are taken to a serious extent. (Just don’t expect any responses as it is usually dealt in a private manner.

Nope. Not the case, the last communication on this was from Gina where it was stated that it could be considered harassment if you are continually teabagging someone and they ask you to stop and you then carry on. If you know otherwise please provide the link to the updated ToS.

Zski

10-15 man zonechat dogpile at 5 in the morning over nothing.

The PvP playerbase is unsalvageable.

Disgusting.

fargo_viper

Ellimist_Entreri wrote: »

Just wait until you find out certain endgame trials guilds not only teabag in pve vet trials where they specifically recruit newer players so they have someone to abuse, they even have an add-on they use to track how many times they teabagged someone (in pve). Those are the truly toxic, abusive players - regardless of what end-game trials they clear as a group.

lol

OolongSnakeTea

Mostly full time PVE'er here- but I whole heartly agree the PVP community needs a bone, and some healing. I would totally be fine with a whole cycle of content just being PVP focused if it meant you guys got something good and what you wanted.


I personally got more into pvp when they released BG's, as that was my favorite thing to do in warcraft and SWTOR. Small objective based skirmishes make it feel less daunting then the big scale of Cryodiil.

And then they added monster helmets to Imp City, which I'm a pokemon-syndrome person so I gotta collect them all. Thus I venture forth to get me some hats that do fun things.

Its just very very clear at this point, ZOS should really do something for PVP, and soon.

Jabbs_Giggity

ArchMikem wrote: »

I've been paying ESO since September of '15. Started dipping into Cyrodiil the following year, and got more series with how to play PvP around 2017. My main's AvA rank is in my Sig, I also have mid level AvA ranks on two other less played characters. I'm no stranger. In fact I've mained the same Campaign (currently Blackreach) thru several Updates that I consider myself one of the Vets, even if I'm still not a good player.

And I'll admit that. I suck at PvP. Mostly at my own choice. I've fought my way up the ranks using a PvE build. Cyrodiil is a place to waste time. After I've done the majority of the PvE content each Update I go into Cyrodiil for some AP and to help the Reds until the next content releases. I know all about the Tryhards, the bullies, the players with parts of their brains that haven't matured yet, and I keep Chat open because I want to callout and see callouts. But I have a problem, where I very easily form grudges. This only happens if I've been, "wronged" for no valid reason. I have a live and let live mindset. I NEVER bag anyone. I never taunt or harass of my own accord, cause I'm just here to play. If I engage, and actually win a fight, I'll leave. I don't do anything else to them. I even came up to a resource and got jumped by two players. I actually won a 1v2, for the first time in forever. What did I do? I used /Humble. I even wanted to message one of them noting how close they almost got me several times and say good game. WHY CAN'T EVERYONE BE LIKE THIS?

Instead the common experience for me is frustration. I literally have not gone a single session in Cyrodiil without being bagged by someone, and there's where my grudges come in. Once someone does that to me, their Gamertag is placed on a list. I will actively hunt them down, fight them, follow them, look out for them, and if given the chance return what was given in kind. After that, I leave. It's only fair.

Just last night I went to a keep that had just been capped by us and stopped at one of the resources cause I noticed someone fighting the guards. I demount, buff up and attempt to fight. Being a StamBlade my only good methods of fighting is trying to surprise burst and cloaking out when at a disadvantage. I'm not a brawler, and a lot of the time even my damage isn't enough. This fight though I managed to draw out for a while cause the other player was your cookie cutter StamSorc with the 1H&S back bar. Eventually I got pressured and exhausted of Stam and lost. The player then bagged me. THEN I got a whisper. Dude said it was amazing I've played the game so long and am still so trash at it. So what just happened here? In my eyes I had an honest 1v1, by the time I actually got to them all the Guards had been defeated, and instead of just leaving after winning, they had to bag AND send a hate whisper. So of course the list adds a new name and I reply, "I'm a PvE build, I just don't give a crap."

Of course though the rest of my night is pretty much crap cause I spent most of it under the influence of a grudge. Several, in fact. Just after this player a 4-player blue group decided to farm Arrius and one of the Nightblades decided my corpse was comfortable every time I lost to a 1v4. Even when I caught the player by themselves the rest of the group came charging up. The ones who taunt from winning unfair fights are especially, irksome. I never got to settle that one.

tl;dr

Cyrodiil is annoying, full of annoying immature players. But it's the only content left to do between updates. Y'all need to stop being rude. Go back to the good days when everyone used /Honor after a fight. I was here for that, you all used to be nice once.

While you're not wrong, at all, PVE content has just as toxic of players. If you're not cruising PVE content as part of a Guild of group you regularly play with people are very toxic. I play 98% AvA PVP, done so since 2018 after I got my PVE fix for 2.5 years. So going into a new dungeon not knowing the mechanics or content, or heaven forbid a Trial to get gear for PVP...yeah those players are just as, if not more toxic.

However, BG's has most toxicity.

Kordai

Just avoid pvp in eso. It's not worth it, there's a reason why the pvp is so reviled in the general community.