Is stam sorc that bad?

Ryuvain

katorga wrote: »

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

Stam sorcs do not have tankiness of stam warden/ Necro/ dk or the damage of a stam blade. Pretty much a bottom tier stam pvp class except they can run around real fast like headless chickens mag sorcs

Ironically, I prefer sorc over necro right now. Necro mechanics can be an exercise in frustration with server performance as it is. I preferred Necro during MYM when performance was better.

We also don't talk about magnecro.

SOLDIER_1stClass

Dracane wrote: »

Stamsorcerer is very much meta in pvp at the moment. There are so plenty of them and they are formidable.
At least in no cp and battlegrounds. Can not comment on cp.

This!

Qbiken

From a NOCP PvP perspective, stamsorc is the strongest spec in the game currently, while at the same time being a very forgiving and easy class to play. Stamden and stamcro is indeed strong in NOCP, but compared to stamsorc they fall short in my opinion.

In CP they´ll sometimes lack the damage to kill tankier opponents. But in NOCP stamsorcs are the kings of PvP.

Ryuvain

Qbiken wrote: »

From a NOCP PvP perspective, stamsorc is the strongest spec in the game currently, while at the same time being a very forgiving and easy class to play. Stamden and stamcro is indeed strong in NOCP, but compared to stamsorc they fall short in my opinion.

In CP they´ll sometimes lack the damage to kill tankier opponents. But in NOCP stamsorcs are the kings of PvP.

Stamsorc better than stamden? No way. Stamcro also has a lot more tools. I really don't see how stamsorc is the easiest and best.

oscarovegren

2 extremely good (but not intended) sets on stamsorc for the moment

1. Utfathomable darkness gets the hurricane buff so that procset can do up to 150% more damage then intended
2. Ravager procs from every tick of hurricane which it shouldnt

stat stamsorc?
Sword-singer, tonal torc, trainee, 7th and engine guardian

proc stamsorc?
Unleashed terror, malacath, trainee, syvarra and engine guardian

There is also builds which include briarheart, truth, spriggans, stuhns, NMA, azureblight, master DW/SnB, BRP DW, vMA 2H, eternal vigor, sellestrix or balorgh

L_Nici

Stamsorc is pretty good in PvE, a lot of Damage and Heal thanks to hurricane+Surge. Thanks to your class passives you can get pretty high DPS even if you use mainly weapon skills. And you can easily play 7 pieces of medium armor to rise your damage insanely high, in PvE Stamsorcs have nothing to fear.

In PvP well...Stamsorcs are pretty weak compared to other classes in CP campaigns, they have no class execute, they have no strong class heal. Stamsorc needs to make up for what they don't have by using sets, while other classes can complement their strengths even further.
The strongest thing about Stamsorc in PvP I would say is its Speed, which sadly got negated with the wild hunt ring, you can kite endlessly, Streak through opponents hit them from various angles while they can't even turn quick enough. Briarheart is a very often used set thanks to its heal and damage on Crits which Stamsorc can provide a lot of. That also negates Malacaths Ring for Stamsorc, since then Surge would be lost as heal and Briarheart as well, which leaves Stamsorc without a heal over time aside from weapon skills. And you have no burst heal either, unless you use one of the pets, but honestly who does that? Thats 2 lost spaces.
The lack of executes and class bursts forces you on 2h to use D Swing and Executioner, or Dualwield for Spin to Win. I personally pair 2h and DW (for yet another Heal over time: Bloodcraze with Master Swords), but many Stamsorcs use Sword and board to make up for the lack of defensive options.
In PvP you can play Stamsorc with medium armor as well, but currently thats a bit dangerous since Procs can nuke you to Oblivion, so I am on heavy for now, which still works very well, but you need to make up for the lost speed, or you loose one of your biggest advantages as mentioned.

Your best bet is to play a Stamsorc full offensive with high Weapon Power and Crit and use your mobility to avoid getting hit. You don't need much Staminaregeneration thanks to Dark Deal.
You should never just stand there and try to tank incoming damage, you can't heal against it and don't get stunned, in the current lag you get murdered before you broke free.
Or you play with Sword and Board with 2h on front with procsets like Crimson, Unleashed terror, Maelstrom 2h, Syvarra, Engine Guardian and so on paired with Malacath, but to be fair you can technically play any class like that atm.

Ryuvain

L_Nici wrote: »

Stamsorc is pretty good in PvE, a lot of Damage and Heal thanks to hurricane+Surge. Thanks to your class passives you can get pretty high DPS even if you use mainly weapon skills. And you can easily play 7 pieces of medium armor to rise your damage insanely high, in PvE Stamsorcs have nothing to fear.

In PvP well...Stamsorcs are pretty weak compared to other classes in CP campaigns, they have no class execute, they have no strong class heal. Stamsorc needs to make up for what they don't have by using sets, while other classes can complement their strengths even further.
The strongest thing about Stamsorc in PvP I would say is its Speed, which sadly got negated with the wild hunt ring, you can kite endlessly, Streak through opponents hit them from various angles while they can't even turn quick enough. Briarheart is a very often used set thanks to its heal and damage on Crits which Stamsorc can provide a lot of. That also negates Malacaths Ring for Stamsorc, since then Surge would be lost as heal and Briarheart as well, which leaves Stamsorc without a heal over time aside from weapon skills. And you have no burst heal either, unless you use one of the pets, but honestly who does that? Thats 2 lost spaces.
The lack of executes and class bursts forces you on 2h to use D Swing and Executioner, or Dualwield for Spin to Win. I personally pair 2h and DW (for yet another Heal over time: Bloodcraze with Master Swords), but many Stamsorcs use Sword and board to make up for the lack of defensive options.
In PvP you can play Stamsorc with medium armor as well, but currently thats a bit dangerous since Procs can nuke you to Oblivion, so I am on heavy for now, which still works very well, but you need to make up for the lost speed, or you loose one of your biggest advantages as mentioned.

Your best bet is to play a Stamsorc full offensive with high Weapon Power and Crit and use your mobility to avoid getting hit. You don't need much Staminaregeneration thanks to Dark Deal.
You should never just stand there and try to tank incoming damage, you can't heal against it and don't get stunned, in the current lag you get murdered before you broke free.
Or you play with Sword and Board with 2h on front with procsets like Crimson, Unleashed terror, Maelstrom 2h, Syvarra, Engine Guardian and so on paired with Malacath, but to be fair you can technically play any class like that atm.

That's exactly how I felt about the class in pvp. Doesnt have much to use, barely using it's own skills. I also use 2 hand/dw masters. Seems to do well.

Just hate knowing almost every other class is so much better in pvp. Don't even get a spammable since Crystal weapon is so clunky and unreliable.

Brrrofski

Ryuvain wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Stamsorcerer is very much meta in pvp at the moment. There are so plenty of them and they are formidable.
At least in no cp and battlegrounds. Can not comment on cp.

I don't see stamsorcs at all. It's all wardens, nightblade, and templars.

Solariken wrote: »

Crystal weapon + Vateshran + any other proc into Dawnbreaker makes you an absolute wrecking ball in PvP.

Haven't looked at vatesh. Hate breaking 5-5-2 sets though.

You don't have to.

Just use a 5 piece set you only need on backbar.

Like 7th, alchemist etc

Ryuvain

Brrrofski wrote: »

Ryuvain wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Stamsorcerer is very much meta in pvp at the moment. There are so plenty of them and they are formidable.
At least in no cp and battlegrounds. Can not comment on cp.

I don't see stamsorcs at all. It's all wardens, nightblade, and templars.

Solariken wrote: »

Crystal weapon + Vateshran + any other proc into Dawnbreaker makes you an absolute wrecking ball in PvP.

Haven't looked at vatesh. Hate breaking 5-5-2 sets though.

You don't have to.

Just use a 5 piece set you only need on backbar.

Like 7th, alchemist etc

Never tried backbar sets but can look into them.

JinMori

Stam sorc is definitely not terrible.

Even in pve it does some of the higher stam dps.

relentless_turnip

katorga wrote: »

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

Stam sorcs do not have tankiness of stam warden/ Necro/ dk or the damage of a stam blade. Pretty much a bottom tier stam pvp class except they can run around real fast like headless chickens mag sorcs

Ironically, I prefer sorc over necro right now. Necro mechanics can be an exercise in frustration with server performance as it is. I preferred Necro during MYM when performance was better.

Totally agree with this, stamcro is too clunky and buff intensive to enjoy.

Zodiarkslayer

L_Nici wrote: »

Stamsorc is pretty good in PvE, a lot of Damage and Heal thanks to hurricane+Surge. Thanks to your class passives you can get pretty high DPS even if you use mainly weapon skills. And you can easily play 7 pieces of medium armor to rise your damage insanely high, in PvE Stamsorcs have nothing to fear.

In PvP well...Stamsorcs are pretty weak compared to other classes in CP campaigns, they have no class execute, they have no strong class heal. Stamsorc needs to make up for what they don't have by using sets, while other classes can complement their strengths even further.
The strongest thing about Stamsorc in PvP I would say is its Speed, which sadly got negated with the wild hunt ring, you can kite endlessly, Streak through opponents hit them from various angles while they can't even turn quick enough. Briarheart is a very often used set thanks to its heal and damage on Crits which Stamsorc can provide a lot of. That also negates Malacaths Ring for Stamsorc, since then Surge would be lost as heal and Briarheart as well, which leaves Stamsorc without a heal over time aside from weapon skills. And you have no burst heal either, unless you use one of the pets, but honestly who does that? Thats 2 lost spaces.
The lack of executes and class bursts forces you on 2h to use D Swing and Executioner, or Dualwield for Spin to Win. I personally pair 2h and DW (for yet another Heal over time: Bloodcraze with Master Swords), but many Stamsorcs use Sword and board to make up for the lack of defensive options.
In PvP you can play Stamsorc with medium armor as well, but currently thats a bit dangerous since Procs can nuke you to Oblivion, so I am on heavy for now, which still works very well, but you need to make up for the lost speed, or you loose one of your biggest advantages as mentioned.

Your best bet is to play a Stamsorc full offensive with high Weapon Power and Crit and use your mobility to avoid getting hit. You don't need much Staminaregeneration thanks to Dark Deal.
You should never just stand there and try to tank incoming damage, you can't heal against it and don't get stunned, in the current lag you get murdered before you broke free.
Or you play with Sword and Board with 2h on front with procsets like Crimson, Unleashed terror, Maelstrom 2h, Syvarra, Engine Guardian and so on paired with Malacath, but to be fair you can technically play any class like that atm.

Exactly that. Just ignore crystal weapon and use weapon abilities as spammable like dizzy swing.
Although, Dark Deal is a burst heal!

L_Nici

@Zodiarkslayer Dark Deal may be a heal that comes instant, but it is by no means a burst heal. There is no way to heal you with Dark Deal from 0 to 100 in one cast like Breath of Life, or the warden heal can. 4k Heal in PvP is laughable its more usefull as Stamina Sustain. Not to mention that it has a 1 second cast time, if you get interrupted you are completely screwed, because you first get an animation how you got interrupted which denies you any use of any skill for half a second and Dark Deal itself goes on a full second cooldown. Also with it having a casttime you can get stuck in it in laggy PvP, and don't get any healing or skills for multiple seconds to come.

Zodiarkslayer

L_Nici wrote: »

@Zodiarkslayer Dark Deal may be a heal that comes instant, but it is by no means a burst heal. There is no way to heal you with Dark Deal from 0 to 100 in one cast like Breath of Life, or the warden heal can. 4k Heal in PvP is laughable its more usefull as Stamina Sustain. Not to mention that it has a 1 second cast time, if you get interrupted you are completely screwed, because you first get an animation how you got interrupted which denies you any use of any skill for half a second and Dark Deal itself goes on a full second cooldown. Also with it having a casttime you can get stuck in it in laggy PvP, and don't get any healing or skills for multiple seconds to come.

You are right about everything. But technically it is a burst heal. Not useful, not allpowerful, but still a burst heal... 😉

Thraben

StamSorc is in a good shape in NoCP.

Yes, you don't have the good class setup of a Warden or Necro. And yes, you won't delete things like a Stemplar or Nightblade.

But being able to pick a fight, survive it and then disengage is something no other Stamina class can do (poor Nightblades).

StamSorcs are also the most flexible class:

Just prepare 3 different skill and set options with Alpha Gear, and you can switch between your standard bruiser mode, ganker mode and anti- ballgroup mode, whereas all the other Stamina classes can only do one of the three things with their attribute and skill distribution.

The only thing we need to get back is our beloved third bar

TwiceBornStar

Sure. Crystal Weapon may feel a bit clunky, but if you pair this ability with a clunky weapon which feels clunky most of the time, Crystal Weapon kinda suits that clunkiness just fine!

improvedai

relentless_turnip wrote: »

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=296007

That's my stamsorc build I really like it, it has a lot of incoming healing mainly from damage, but has 2k health recovery if you find yourself on your back bar. I use double dot poisons on the front bar and use health, stam and crit pots. Crit chance is important to survivability and your rate of healing.

I use crystal - rending - rapid strikes until they're in execute range.

Hey @relentless_turnip , do you have an updated link to this build? I was viewing and loved the setup, but when refreshed I now get an error.

Also curious on your thoughts for a 2h variant.

Much obliged.

LightYagami

They're one of the best classes in PvP.

High burst, high mobility, works both ranged and melee.

relentless_turnip

improvedai wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=296007

That's my stamsorc build I really like it, it has a lot of incoming healing mainly from damage, but has 2k health recovery if you find yourself on your back bar. I use double dot poisons on the front bar and use health, stam and crit pots. Crit chance is important to survivability and your rate of healing.

I use crystal - rending - rapid strikes until they're in execute range.

Hey @relentless_turnip , do you have an updated link to this build? I was viewing and loved the setup, but when refreshed I now get an error.

Also curious on your thoughts for a 2h variant.

Much obliged.

Hey @improvedai what I'm running now is a bit different, but very effective. This feels even better to me. The other build still works, but I prefer this 👍

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=323160

Be aware this is setup for next patch with the PTS option ticked on the editor.

I was running this with clever alchemist on the back bar, but found I could kill nearly anyone without proccing it. So ended up using a defensive back bar. Pariah also works amazingly, but after testing it I really want to run 7 medium next patch. What's nice about this build is you have a lot of incoming healing when you attack, which makes your pretty tanky. Then you have defence when you are pushed onto your back bar.

You could run it with 2h, but to get the most out of briar and pale order it best to just increase the sources of damage you output as this increases your incoming healing. DW does this better because of the added dot and there is no swing time on rending. It would work with 2h, but not as well. If you want to go 2h maybe use briar 2h maul and then 2 piece balorgh. It would keep the damage about the same. you could quite comfortably run ball of lightning and rely on dizzy for the stun too 👍

improvedai

relentless_turnip wrote: »

Hey @improvedai what I'm running now is a bit different, but very effective. This feels even better to me. The other build still works, but I prefer this 👍

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=323160

@relentless_turnip fantastic, thank you for the update!

Makes total sense on 2h, great explanation. I think I'm finally ready to put the big mace down.

I'm going to start putting the pieces together and give it a whirl.

Again, I appreciate the advice.

relentless_turnip

improvedai wrote: »

relentless_turnip wrote: »

Hey @improvedai what I'm running now is a bit different, but very effective. This feels even better to me. The other build still works, but I prefer this 👍

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=323160

@relentless_turnip fantastic, thank you for the update!

Makes total sense on 2h, great explanation. I think I'm finally ready to put the big mace down.

I'm going to start putting the pieces together and give it a whirl.

Again, I appreciate the advice.

No worries man, I hope it works out 😁

Luckylancer

I enjoy Fengrush's AoE CC based build. Barrage(aoe root), streak, negate are good combo. I use red mountain, domihaus 1 pc, tonal mythic, venomous and AS dw front bar. AS dw is not OP but it is undrated in my opinion. Fengrush use twin slahes weapon but I dont have it. All medium, dw maces front bar and bow back bar.

Twin slashes slow morp, streak, hurricane, blade cloak, spin to win, negate
Surge, barrage, vigor, dark deal, magnum shot, temporal guard

Build is designed for initiating a small scale group fight then using procs and s2w to kill one enemy.

relentless_turnip

@improvedai I have been testing which is better between orgnums and pariah. Pariah is indeed better. Orgnums seems to be bugged and the health recovery doesn't kick in until 40%. Its still effective, but pariah seems slightly better. The difference is only slight mind you.

QuebraRegra

Ryuvain wrote: »

Feels like no matter what abilities I use, nothing really stacks up to the amazing tier spammables that other classes use. Am I missing something? Crystal weapon feels useless most the time and is clunky as well.

I can just look at other classes and see what they do much better and more in comparison. Any tips?

is this a joke? Sure, they don't really have a class spammable, but that's because most of their skills come from weapon skills enhanced but the class passives, and boosted by a few class skills.

I just saw an amusing dot stacking build for STAMSORC with AZUREBLIGHT (XYNODE?). STAMSORC 2H is very fun to play.

improvedai

relentless_turnip wrote: »

@improvedai I have been testing which is better between orgnums and pariah. Pariah is indeed better. Orgnums seems to be bugged and the health recovery doesn't kick in until 40%. Its still effective, but pariah seems slightly better. The difference is only slight mind you.

Interesting ok, Im still using Seventh Legion until I could craft 8 trait for the Org (soon) anyway. Just spent the last few days on the journey of getting Ring of the Pale Order from scratch.

Been playing with sub-optimal stats in a few BGs and catching people with crystal/la/rending slash has still been pretty fun so far. Can't wait to complete the build, and shed the rust of not having played in a long while.

Grianasteri

Stamsorc remains one of my best performing dps characters. Particularly for soloing and/or in add heavy content - this is mainly down to the way I have built my character, which is optimised for aoe and multiple target damage.