Please do not swap rapids with vigor – QOL deterioration

Ratinira

Keep it as it is now

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

So much content is next to impossible without a strong heal Honor the Dead’s magic return helps but is no where near enough.

May I ask you to clarify what content is nearly impossible for a low lvl stamplar without vigor?
"So much" means "a lot"? I really what to know what a lot content my stamplar has missed.
Stamplar that never used vigor...

DeepSeaDiver

We have lots of chars (over 40). YMMV but this will be ours ...

Number of chars that will need to level the Alliance rank to get the new Rapids:
25

Number of chars that could even remotely use Vigor (ignoring other chars that have class heals or Alli tree is leveled enough to get Vigor already):
2 - both of these are Cat NB dedicated thieves so its not really needed but listed just for completeness/fairness.

We use Rapids far more than Vigor. This proposed change will definitely impact us.
It appears this change will benefit the minority at the expense of the majority. Others have suggested reasonable alternatives in this thread, hope they are listened to or this change is dropped entirely.

Also has anyone considered any performance impact if lots of players go to Cyro to get the AP (don't suggest BGs as thats missing the point)?

Cheers

Nestor

Keep it as it is now

This change makes no sense.

All my characters have Rapids. None of my characters use Vigor, even the Stamina ones who have enough PvP Rank, which is, 2. Yes, in 6 Years, I have only two characters that are at 5 or better in PvP.

kadochka

Other:

(just to point out: the 'DON'T replace Rapids with Vigor' option is winning, and by a long shot. ZOS, please listen to the feedback, and change accordingly!
P.S.: the perfect fix still exists!! Make both skills the first skill in both Alliance War trees!!)

Hurbster

Keep it as it is now

kadochka wrote: »

(just to point out: the 'DON'T replace Rapids with Vigor' option is winning, and by a long shot. ZOS, please listen to the feedback, and change accordingly!
P.S.: the perfect fix still exists!! Make both skills the first skill in both Alliance War trees!!)

Yes, this. It just makes so much sense and all the players are happy. Non PvP players get their skills and PvP players don't have to put up with people who blatantly don't want to be there.

Might as well take the AOE off vigor and rapids as well. Will cut down on the calculations needed.

Zyrudin

Switch rapids with vigor

haelene wrote: »

VoxAdActa wrote: »

People actually slot Rapid in PvE? That boggles my mind. How much time is that saving you, going from the wayshrine to your quest, like a whole 6 seconds?

Anyway. This change was specifically FOR PvE people, like my dad, who refuses to PvP but who runs a stam character that needs Vigor. Now PvE stam people don't have to touch Cyrodiil for more than the intro quest, never have to see another player on the battlefield, and still get their only useful heal (for non-wardens).

As for getting to AvA 6 for rapids... I went from AvA 2 to AvA 7 in just two and a half hours of awkwardly healing and occasionally firing a meatbag at someone. Didn't even have a full five-piece set on at the time, just a weird patchwork of overland drops. It's not that hard, gang.

Everyone I know in Pve uses rapids. Everyone. And no, it's a heck of a lot more than 6 seconds - especially if you're using it to get to a timed event fast - like say, a harrowstorm or a boss battle that's already started. It can be the difference between getting there and not.

https://youtu.be/NRIr9MNmCwU

Calgrin

Other:

Just make it so rapids and vigor are both unlocked at assault 2?

Anthony_Arndt

Keep it as it is now

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

CMDR_Un1k0rn wrote: »

I just did the maths.

14 Battlegrounds games are all you need to hit Alliance 5 if you lose every game.

It's not hard.

One or two Below-50 sieges and you're talking way less, too. And if you pair it with PvP daily quests, less still.

And how Salty would you be if I was on your team and just wandered around the BG doing nothing? That is what you will get 14 games per character, through 18 characters time hundreds of players. People here on the forums Already complain about AFK BG players its not going to get better with the change.

Assist Rapid Riding has nearly a half million downloads. So it might be a bit more than a few hundred.

I, my wife, and my son are three of them. My wife and I have been feeling pretty salty about these changes.

My son turns 6 in a few weeks. He's been playing ESO since he was 2. He likes to go fast. He's all about going zoom and things blowing up. He's been using Rapids since his first character hit level 10 four years ago. I didn't introduce him to PvP to be nice to the other players (I do this in SWTOR too). We'd just run over to Cyrodil, do the intro quests to get Rapids and and then leave.

But he's got 8 characters and only his main was anywhere hear Assault 5. The three of us ran around doing PvE dailies during Midyear Mayhem two years ago. So, since this horrible change went live, I ran enough BGs to get Rapids back for him on his main. But if he wants it on the others, he's going to be doing those on his own. His other seven are at Assault 2. He'll love it, it'll be chaos. Not sure the other 2-3 players will like it with a level 10 just wandering aimlessly spamming light attacks as fast as his little fingers can click.

Tandor

Switch rapids with vigor

Never having bothered with either skill before, having read all the kerfuffle about the change I decided to have a look at Vigor which my characters now have rather than (the unused) Rapids as a result of the AP points from login rewards, me not being a PvPer. As a result, I'm all in favour of keeping the change as is. Thanks for alerting me to the benefit of Vigor which is indeed essential for a number of my stamina characters whereas Rapids remains as it always has been, of no interest or benefit to me at all - it turns out for me at least to be a great change!

That said, I do understand the frustration - but not anger, it's just a computer game after all - for those who used Rapids freely but now have to work for it, so if it was made a Level 2 skill that would certainly be a reasonable compromise.

Iamnuff

Literally never used rapids. Ever. I summon my mount, hit auto-run and tab out, like a real man.

No, but seriously, a stam-heal sounds way more useful for actual gameplay than a 30-second mount-speed buff.

Rather than whining about this, just complain that they should buff the speed of starting mounts by 20% by default.

Hurbster

Keep it as it is now

Oh, no they won't do that.

Riding lessons to sell you know.

IrishOphidia

Keep it as it is now

idk wrote: »

I agree with CMDR that this change is good for the game overall. Vigor is more important in both PvE and PvP. This is a change that makes sense.

Further, Zos has made it very easy and fast to unlock all the skills in both AvA lines. It used to require several times that amount of AP to get to the same ranks and Zos has already significantly increased the amount of AP we have gained.

Edit: The poll is likely to be skewed anyhow. Players that prefer magicka and have little to no interest in stam builds will more than likely want to keep things as they are. However, that does not reflect on this change being good or not.

Well that WOULD reflect on the change considering those Magicka players utilize rapids which debunks your original statement. This would mean that RAPIDS is the more important and widely used skill. Therefore, you proved yourself wrong. Rapids is utilized by everyone whereas Vigor is only used by stamina-based characters. However, both are easy to get to be honest.