this game is pretty insulting to your time

MrDenimChicken

Got excited that I "thought" I would be able to finish a build today. It was a hard week of work for me, but hey I get to play one of my favorite games today.

Got everything I needed, finally, and was off to craft the last piece to my set

lo and behold! I need to research 2 more traits!

Turns out, the research takes 10 days and 19 hours each. DANG! But wait! I have some "research scrolls". I check my inventory, and I have 8...hey at least that takes the sting out of it a little bit! Oh no, not so fast! You can only use a scroll once every 20 hours. OR you can just go to the crown store and buy some that have no cooldown!

[snip] It's hard not to take it personally that the developers of a video game want to squeeze you into buying more crap for real money, and the way they do it is to force some ridiculous timer mechanics that are an obscene amount of time.

I thought this Sunday would be a fun day I get to play with a new build I've been working at for a while. Instead I'm reminded how corporate America wants to just keep squeezing people until their eyes burst out and dollars come out.

[Edited to remove Bashing]

Karmanorway

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

Got excited that I "thought" I would be able to finish a build today. It was a hard week of work for me, but hey I get to play one of my favorite games today.

Got everything I needed, finally, and was off to craft the last piece to my set

lo and behold! I need to research 2 more traits!

Turns out, the research takes 10 days and 19 hours each. DANG! But wait! I have some "research scrolls". I check my inventory, and I have 8...hey at least that takes the sting out of it a little bit! Oh no, not so fast! You can only use a scroll once every 20 hours. OR you can just go to the crown store and buy some that have no cooldown!

[snip] It's hard not to take it personally that the developers of a video game want to squeeze you into buying more crap for real money, and the way they do it is to force some ridiculous timer mechanics that are an obscene amount of time.

I thought this Sunday would be a fun day I get to play with a new build I've been working at for a while. Instead I'm reminded how corporate America wants to just keep squeezing people until their eyes burst out and dollars come out.

If you are on EU i can craft it for you free of charge 😉

DUTCH_REAPER

If u r PC NA i can craft it for u no problem and no charge

BlueRaven

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

Got excited that I "thought" I would be able to finish a build today. It was a hard week of work for me, but hey I get to play one of my favorite games today.

Got everything I needed, finally, and was off to craft the last piece to my set

lo and behold! I need to research 2 more traits!

Turns out, the research takes 10 days and 19 hours each. DANG! But wait! I have some "research scrolls". I check my inventory, and I have 8...hey at least that takes the sting out of it a little bit! Oh no, not so fast! You can only use a scroll once every 20 hours. OR you can just go to the crown store and buy some that have no cooldown!

[snip] It's hard not to take it personally that the developers of a video game want to squeeze you into buying more crap for real money, and the way they do it is to force some ridiculous timer mechanics that are an obscene amount of time.

I thought this Sunday would be a fun day I get to play with a new build I've been working at for a while. Instead I'm reminded how corporate America wants to just keep squeezing people until their eyes burst out and dollars come out.

Some crafted sets are more powerful then others. The difficulty of crafting that set is tied to the power level of the set.

Yes, I guess it would be a bit annoying that you can’t craft it yet, but you need a higher proficiency in crafting before you can make it.

Ask in your guilds, I am sure you can find a veteran player who can craft it for you. I got to max proficiency (back in the day) without the aid of research scrolls. You should be glad those scrolls exist at all.

Kwik1

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

lo and behold! I need to research 2 more traits!

I feel for ya, but I have to ask...

Shouldn't you have known from the beginning you would need more traits?

I start alts all the time and I always know before I start what set I want to have for a specific toon whether it is crafted or a drop, and I make sure of the prereqs.

Getting mad at ZOS because you didn't bother looking beforehand seems pretty childish to me and simply refusing tpo accept the fact it was your own mistake.

idk

I fail to see how not planning and getting one's research done is an insult to our time when thousands of players have completed their research without complaining.

Further, it is easy to ask a guildmate to craft armor. Many that do not care to get involved with crafting at all tend to go this brought.

Between the two the system works very well.

Ode2Order

All I read is passing the blame to ZOS bc you didn't see what still needed to be researched. Try add-ons like Research Assistant and CraftStore instead of posting your anger outbursts on the forum.

Castagere

For me, I'm just spoiled with how crafting works in other MMO's. My favorite being EQ2. I love crafting that game and hate it in ESO. So I just don't bother with it anymore. Waiting to research either a long time or buy something in the cash shop that makes it faster doesn't work for me.

Red_Feather

This reminds me to check my timers to see if I can do more research. It's been at least a week.

OmniDo

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

Instead I'm reminded how corporate America wants to just keep squeezing people until their eyes burst out and dollars come out.

Won't ever change bud unless people force it to, and effective force is rarely ever peaceful.

MartiniDaniels

Became grand master crafter in first year of play, no single crown spent on it...

Hurbster

Yup, got it done before research scrolls were a thing. Just get someone to craft it for you.

MartiniDaniels

I mean we certainly can blame ZOS for excessive monetization on cosmetics and locking OP items behind chapters, but crafting.... really it is very good in ESO. Profitable, often used for yourself and for your friends, can be mastered without crazy grind... I remember I tried to became good crafter in WoW... damn such abnormal amount of grind is required so I just given up after a month, though I liked the game.

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

More and more players are feeling the milking.

exeeter702

Naw, not really. Of all the mmos that I've played in my life, ESO ranks high in the "able to log in and actually gain something meaningful or productive to your account without egregious time gates"

ShawnLaRock

If you are on XBOX NA - my condolences - but I can craft it for you free of charge.

S.

Bradyfjord

What isn't a time sink in mmo's?

Tammany

> plays mmorpg game
> complains about huge time investment required

StarOfElyon

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

Got excited that I "thought" I would be able to finish a build today. It was a hard week of work for me, but hey I get to play one of my favorite games today.

Got everything I needed, finally, and was off to craft the last piece to my set

lo and behold! I need to research 2 more traits!

Turns out, the research takes 10 days and 19 hours each. DANG! But wait! I have some "research scrolls". I check my inventory, and I have 8...hey at least that takes the sting out of it a little bit! Oh no, not so fast! You can only use a scroll once every 20 hours. OR you can just go to the crown store and buy some that have no cooldown!

[snip] It's hard not to take it personally that the developers of a video game want to squeeze you into buying more crap for real money, and the way they do it is to force some ridiculous timer mechanics that are an obscene amount of time.

I thought this Sunday would be a fun day I get to play with a new build I've been working at for a while. Instead I'm reminded how corporate America wants to just keep squeezing people until their eyes burst out and dollars come out.

I know the pain. There's a point when the game stops being fun. Do they get paid by the hours that we play or something?

peacenote

I don't like extreme monetization however I feel this isn't really an example of it.

The research times on traits AND the horse timers are two of the few examples left of ESO having more of an old-school, classic MMO feel. It is a way for people to invest in their craft and feel like they worked towards being a crafter.

Check out this old thread about crafting traits: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/61244/crafting-traits

Research pre-dates the crown store. It pre-dates the non-subscription model of play. If anything the research scrolls were included to help you make better use of your time and to help newer players catch up to veteran players.

The issue, in my opinion, is how they didn't find a way for crafters to help you transmute for a tip (before the feature came out, I envisioned a window a little like trading), thus making it more of a requirement for all end game players to have at least one character with all the "good" traits researched. This decision undermined the crafting system because pursuing the research is no longer a specialty of crafters.

Causing many people to not even think about asking folks to make them gear. And that is the real issue.

VaranisArano

StarOfElyon wrote: »

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

Got excited that I "thought" I would be able to finish a build today. It was a hard week of work for me, but hey I get to play one of my favorite games today.

Got everything I needed, finally, and was off to craft the last piece to my set

lo and behold! I need to research 2 more traits!

Turns out, the research takes 10 days and 19 hours each. DANG! But wait! I have some "research scrolls". I check my inventory, and I have 8...hey at least that takes the sting out of it a little bit! Oh no, not so fast! You can only use a scroll once every 20 hours. OR you can just go to the crown store and buy some that have no cooldown!

[snip] It's hard not to take it personally that the developers of a video game want to squeeze you into buying more crap for real money, and the way they do it is to force some ridiculous timer mechanics that are an obscene amount of time.

I thought this Sunday would be a fun day I get to play with a new build I've been working at for a while. Instead I'm reminded how corporate America wants to just keep squeezing people until their eyes burst out and dollars come out.

I know the pain. There's a point when the game stops being fun. Do they get paid by the hours that we play or something?

Effectively, yes, if you think about the entire player base. Keeping the servers running is a fixed cost whether you've got a few players or a ton, so for it to be cost effective, you want a lot of players playing at all times. Plus if you have a lot of players playing for a length of time, you can sell more profitable incidentals like cosmetics alongside new content.

And that's the simplistic reason why most MMOs incorporate time sinks into their game.

Kiralyn2000

Yeeeaaaaahhh.... research was the same massive timesink, long before there even were research scrolls. It takes so long because this is an MMO (yay, timesinks!), and because 'mastering' crafting generally/should take a lot of time. Not because they want to twist your arm for Crowns (as mentioned, that came much later.)

SeaGtGruff

The bad news is, if you want to experience the joy of crafting the gear yourself, you'll have to wait a while longer.

The good news is, as you've seen in several responses the playerbase is not lacking in people who are happy to help you out without asking for anything in return.

Miraslova

All in all though you have to admit apart from this that ZoS is greedy with it's marketing.

Ocerlot

I heard Hello Kitty's next mmo update is coming out next month, maybe its time to try their crafting. I think you will love it. /pogchamp

preevious

It's hard to sympathize.

Just pay a crafter.

MrDenimChicken

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Yeeeaaaaahhh.... research was the same massive timesink, long before there even were research scrolls. It takes so long because this is an MMO (yay, timesinks!), and because 'mastering' crafting generally/should take a lot of time. Not because they want to twist your arm for Crowns (as mentioned, that came much later.)

It probably wasn't designed that way to twist your arm for crowns in the beginning, but it was designed to keep people playing longer through a timegate mechanic. Now they took that timegate mechanic and monetized it.

jircris11

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

Got excited that I "thought" I would be able to finish a build today. It was a hard week of work for me, but hey I get to play one of my favorite games today.

Got everything I needed, finally, and was off to craft the last piece to my set

lo and behold! I need to research 2 more traits!

Turns out, the research takes 10 days and 19 hours each. DANG! But wait! I have some "research scrolls". I check my inventory, and I have 8...hey at least that takes the sting out of it a little bit! Oh no, not so fast! You can only use a scroll once every 20 hours. OR you can just go to the crown store and buy some that have no cooldown!

[snip] It's hard not to take it personally that the developers of a video game want to squeeze you into buying more crap for real money, and the way they do it is to force some ridiculous timer mechanics that are an obscene amount of time.

I thought this Sunday would be a fun day I get to play with a new build I've been working at for a while. Instead I'm reminded how corporate America wants to just keep squeezing people until their eyes burst out and dollars come out.

Wait till u get to the last jeweler trait at 58 days.

Kittytravel

I really thought this was gonna be a thread about mount training; which is pretty annoying that is takes a whole half year per character to level up mounts to max.

But yeah you can literally just have someone else craft it for you there are 9 trait crafters running around all the time and I know I've never charged for my services they just need to give me mats.

burglar

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

Got excited that I "thought" I would be able to finish a build today. It was a hard week of work for me, but hey I get to play one of my favorite games today.

Got everything I needed, finally, and was off to craft the last piece to my set

lo and behold! I need to research 2 more traits!

Turns out, the research takes 10 days and 19 hours each. DANG! But wait! I have some "research scrolls". I check my inventory, and I have 8...hey at least that takes the sting out of it a little bit! Oh no, not so fast! You can only use a scroll once every 20 hours. OR you can just go to the crown store and buy some that have no cooldown!

[snip] It's hard not to take it personally that the developers of a video game want to squeeze you into buying more crap for real money, and the way they do it is to force some ridiculous timer mechanics that are an obscene amount of time.

I thought this Sunday would be a fun day I get to play with a new build I've been working at for a while. Instead I'm reminded how corporate America wants to just keep squeezing people until their eyes burst out and dollars come out.

WHAT?! I'd argue the exact opposite! As far as crafting goes, the game is so considerate of your time. In ESO the value of crafting comes from trait research, rather than grinding out crafting levels for hours in front of a crafting station - which is the standard in most other games, and is incredibly inconvenient for anyone.

You can begin researching traits on the day you start playing if you know how. Then, while those traits are progressing, you can usually max all crafts leisurely in a couple of days if you know what to look for; if you're already established, you can max all crafts in one day.

Sure, research takes a long time, but I'm so thankful that there's not really much of a grind beyond making sure you put up items for research in a timely manner.

Also, those scrolls are not stiffing you! They're a damn kind gesture to those of you that are impatient to wait for traits to finish; most of us waited, because we did it before scrolls were available.

If they made everything easy to obtain, it would have no value. Just be thankful that you can continue to reach the highest levels of value in crafting while you're at work, or taking care of the kids.

Dojohoda

I thought this Sunday would be a fun day I get to play with a new build I've been working at for a while. Instead I'm reminded how corporate America wants to just keep squeezing people until their eyes burst out and dollars come out.

Whoa whoa whoa. No need to pull money from your skull holes and put those eyes back into those sockets. People can help you obtain those items.