Worlds First Kyne's Aegis No death, Hard Mode, Speed Run trifecta.

MaddPowered

4D completed the trifecta tonight. I have lots of feedback to give if a dungeon developer would like to message me privately.
I hope this is not the final version of the trial, as it is kind of sad that the trifecta achievement was achieved on the PTS.

Also the memento we get as a reward is awful. Please change it to something else like a costume, polymorph, skin or mount

Banana

You fullas are just to good

kabs12

hm lol
Funny trial tho, is kinda sad that we just did shield spam tricky strats for most bosses and still got a sub 22min pull
This doesn't mean that the trial is bad, is just **not that end game** :kappa:

Audens

hehe

Veale

A skin of Falgravn's glowing red eyes would be very cool and would give lots of players an incentive to push for the title, or even a polymorph would also be cool.

MaddPowered

Veale wrote: »

A skin of Falgravn's glowing red eyes would be very cool and would give lots of players an incentive to push for the title, or even a polymorph would also be cool.

Yeah, As it stands right now there is no incentive to push for the title since the reward is a giant let down.

Disturbed_One

Yup, let's balance content around the person with 31 Immortal Redeemers. That's sure to keep as many people engaged as possible.

A_mean_old_cat

It does seem very disappointing that the trifecta is a memento, I haven’t talked to a single person that is excited about that. A poly morph of a vampire lord or sea giant would be much cooler

HEIIMS

Unique weapon/armor styles would be really nice imo. Similar to monster set arms packs with unique particles like alkosh and such. The momento as it stands is just lame for what you have to do to get it, it could be cool as a different reward for completing all side achievements or something, it's just underwhelming atm.

satanio

Congrats, but

MaddPowered wrote: »

I have lots of feedback to give if a dungeon developer would like to message me privately.
I hope this is not the final version of the trial, as it is kind of sad that the trifecta achievement was achieved on the PTS.

Wtf? -> use official feedback forum ?

edit: or ingame /bug feature?

DyingIsEasy

Disturbed_One wrote: »

Yup, let's balance content around the person with 31 Immortal Redeemers. That's sure to keep as many people engaged as possible.

I agree. Imagine if there was 1% of the content made specifically for players that really like challenges.

Olupajmibanan

nud3_voxel wrote: »

Not hard when using exploits such as light attack weaving.

Approved by the game itself.

ninibini

I don't think ZOS should balance content for 0.01% or less of the player base.

Olupajmibanan

ninibini wrote: »

I don't think ZOS should balance content for 0.01% or less of the player base.

ZoS should balance content based on target audience. Trial Hard Modes are targeted at the 1%, so this field should be balanced for them.

Disturbed_One

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

ninibini wrote: »

I don't think ZOS should balance content for 0.01% or less of the player base.

ZoS should balance content based on target audience. Trial Hard Modes are targeted at the 1%, so this field should be balanced for them.

Sure, but they're not the 1%. They're the 0.01% or even 0.001%.

It's like balancing the entire economy around Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and Warren Buffett

MaddPowered

Disturbed_One wrote: »

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

ninibini wrote: »

I don't think ZOS should balance content for 0.01% or less of the player base.

ZoS should balance content based on target audience. Trial Hard Modes are targeted at the 1%, so this field should be balanced for them.

Sure, but they're not the 1%. They're the 0.01% or even 0.001%.

It's like balancing the entire economy around Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and Warren Buffett

The trifecta achievement should be balanced for the "1%". It is supposed to be one of the hardest achievements.

Disturbed_One

MaddPowered wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

ninibini wrote: »

I don't think ZOS should balance content for 0.01% or less of the player base.

ZoS should balance content based on target audience. Trial Hard Modes are targeted at the 1%, so this field should be balanced for them.

Sure, but they're not the 1%. They're the 0.01% or even 0.001%.

It's like balancing the entire economy around Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and Warren Buffett

The trifecta achievement should be balanced for the "1%". It is supposed to be one of the hardest achievements.

yeah, that's what I agreed to. It's fine balancing for the 1%. But you all are not the 1%.

HEIIMS

Only competent players are capable of stress testing new content, because they will always find the most efficient way of completing it, which provides devs with feedback on what's over/under performing. Or do you want them to balance trials around players who wipe in nMOL to simple mechanics? People get this misconception of "if devs are balancing around the very best, they will just make it all insanely hard" which is not true if devs are smart about it. If anything it's only fair, that the hardest achievements should be challenging to obtain, and should represent said challenge with unique/special rewards, [snip]

[edited for baiting]

Ramber

great job having got it on the first try and all.

Calypso589

MaddPowered wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

ninibini wrote: »

I don't think ZOS should balance content for 0.01% or less of the player base.

ZoS should balance content based on target audience. Trial Hard Modes are targeted at the 1%, so this field should be balanced for them.

Sure, but they're not the 1%. They're the 0.01% or even 0.001%.

It's like balancing the entire economy around Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and Warren Buffett

The trifecta achievement should be balanced for the "1%". It is supposed to be one of the hardest achievements.

To be fair Madd, it’s taken two weeks (excluding week 1 for the buffs to KA that week implemented in week two) for a guild to complete the trifecta.

This is on par with how quickly it takes players to down bosses on the hardest difficulties in other MMOs so as far as the timetable goes, everything seems fine to me.

BUT....

This does not mean the design of the fights themselves is perfect. Difficulty can be artificial and hollow and that’s the impression I’m getting from that 1% right now.

But aside from the nuanced criticisms of the designs of these fights, getting everything done in a few weeks is, IMO, expected.

There is no MMO developer that I’ve seen that’s been able to design a raid that a group of elite players hasn’t been able to conquer in a couple weeks.

There’s more of us thinking about strategy than there are them & we’ll always win. We’ll always clear content fast as hell.

PandaPalace

I'm fine with balancing for top players but it shouldn't be for pc only. U all have add-ons that let u know when mechanics are happening, when to block, get to change skills/gear/cp with 1 button. These achievements need to be balanced around no add-ons so console players can get a fair shot at them too.

WrathOfInnos

PandaPalace wrote: »

I'm fine with balancing for top players but it shouldn't be for pc only. U all have add-ons that let u know when mechanics are happening, when to block, get to change skills/gear/cp with 1 button. These achievements need to be balanced around no add-ons so console players can get a fair shot at them too.

That is true. vKA is one of the easiest DLC trials mechanically, but is has the poorest telegraphs of any content ever released. No-death will be nearly impossible on consoles without any addons.

caesarvs

satanio wrote: »

Congrats, but

MaddPowered wrote: »

I have lots of feedback to give if a dungeon developer would like to message me privately.
I hope this is not the final version of the trial, as it is kind of sad that the trifecta achievement was achieved on the PTS.

Wtf? -> use official feedback forum ?

edit: or ingame /bug feature?

He's so damn good that the devs itselves need to message him, and not the opposite

caesarvs

Impressive for sure...

BUT,

Take off the addons, do this again, so we all can see the "real time" needed to clear those


Congrats!

VeiledCriticism

PandaPalace wrote: »

I'm fine with balancing for top players but it shouldn't be for pc only. U all have add-ons that let u know when mechanics are happening, when to block, get to change skills/gear/cp with 1 button. These achievements need to be balanced around no add-ons so console players can get a fair shot at them too.

That's actually very true. Add-ons put PC players on a very different footing compared to Console players.

For a comparison:
World's First Godslayer was ~roughly~ one month after Elsweyr released.
Console World's First Godslayer was almost a year after.

daemonor

Hiddle wrote: »

PandaPalace wrote: »

I'm fine with balancing for top players but it shouldn't be for pc only. U all have add-ons that let u know when mechanics are happening, when to block, get to change skills/gear/cp with 1 button. These achievements need to be balanced around no add-ons so console players can get a fair shot at them too.

That's actually very true. Add-ons put PC players on a very different footing compared to Console players.

For a comparison:
World's First Godslayer was ~roughly~ one month after Elsweyr released.
Console World's First Godslayer was almost a year after.

Might be that, or might be that console players are generally worse. Just pay attention to all the 1vx pvp videos. How many of those you see on pc compared to xbox? Pulling out of my ass the ratio looks like 1 pc to 10 xbox videos. Or would you flip that upside and say that pc players are worse cause they can't get as many 1vx videos as xbox?

MaddPowered

caesarvs wrote: »

Impressive for sure...

BUT,

Take off the addons, do this again, so we all can see the "real time" needed to clear those


Congrats!

The only addon we used was Alpha Gear. It is PTS, there are hardly any add-ons that work with the trial (and the one that does exist is unreliable). One addon that swaps gear for you won't make a 13 minute difference.

Czekoludek

MaddPowered wrote: »

caesarvs wrote: »

Impressive for sure...

BUT,

Take off the addons, do this again, so we all can see the "real time" needed to clear those


Congrats!

The only addon we used was Alpha Gear. It is PTS, there are hardly any add-ons that work with the trial (and the one that does exist is unreliable). One addon that swaps gear for you won't make a 13 minute difference.

And yet on your screenshot we can see cmx, hodor and lui probably raid notifier and any addon with skill timers were working so not exactly "only Alpha Gear". I know some of these addons are like standard on pc but consoles have harder job to do without them, no doubt about that

MaddPowered

Czekoludek wrote: »

MaddPowered wrote: »

caesarvs wrote: »

Impressive for sure...

BUT,

Take off the addons, do this again, so we all can see the "real time" needed to clear those


Congrats!

The only addon we used was Alpha Gear. It is PTS, there are hardly any add-ons that work with the trial (and the one that does exist is unreliable). One addon that swaps gear for you won't make a 13 minute difference.

And yet on your screenshot we can see cmx, hodor and lui probably raid notifier and any addon with skill timers were working so not exactly "only Alpha Gear". I know some of these addons are like standard on pc but consoles have harder job to do without them, no doubt about that

LUI, Reflexes and CMX does not affect the speed or performance of the group. And raid notifier is not updated for KA. I don't understand your argument

Czekoludek

MaddPowered wrote: »

Czekoludek wrote: »

MaddPowered wrote: »

caesarvs wrote: »

Impressive for sure...

BUT,

Take off the addons, do this again, so we all can see the "real time" needed to clear those


Congrats!

The only addon we used was Alpha Gear. It is PTS, there are hardly any add-ons that work with the trial (and the one that does exist is unreliable). One addon that swaps gear for you won't make a 13 minute difference.

And yet on your screenshot we can see cmx, hodor and lui probably raid notifier and any addon with skill timers were working so not exactly "only Alpha Gear". I know some of these addons are like standard on pc but consoles have harder job to do without them, no doubt about that

LUI, Reflexes and CMX does not affect the speed or performance of the group. And raid notifier is not updated for KA. I don't understand your argument

It is easier to keep up with rota if you have timers (game without addons have timers too but they are awful and don't help much). Hodor allows groups to perfectly time their colossus so this is an advantage that affects group performance. Cmx is basically a great tool for checking which attacks hits harder, where rota needs to be adjusted, etc. Logs do it better but consoles don't have access to them. Not sure about raid notifier but addons like code combat alerts are already updated to inform about some of the mechanics from new trial (for example tidebreaker weave timer).
Glad that you did trifecta but saying that your team did it without any important addons when we can even see one of essential ones on your screen is pretty weak. Overall I'm intrested of consoles feedback, are they gonna have the same thoughts as your group

stileanima

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

PandaPalace wrote: »

I'm fine with balancing for top players but it shouldn't be for pc only. U all have add-ons that let u know when mechanics are happening, when to block, get to change skills/gear/cp with 1 button. These achievements need to be balanced around no add-ons so console players can get a fair shot at them too.

That is true. vKA is one of the easiest DLC trials mechanically, but is has the poorest telegraphs of any content ever released. No-death will be nearly impossible on consoles without any addons.

I disagree with this. Sure, telegraphs for things like how wide/long a conal cleave is or how big a radius the Tidebreaker's Crashing Wave attack has are missing, but the tells that important mechanics are incoming are indicated clearly. When they are performing these attacks, all enemies have pretty exaggerated movements that are easy enough to see once you know what to look for. You will die to these kinds of things for a bit until you figure out where not to stand and when exactly you need to block or dodge, but that's to be expected.

There were plenty of people in 4D who cleared every run up until now without having any mechanic-indicating addons to help them. I don't think console players will have problems being able to tell which mechanics are coming or struggle with being able to prepare for or avoid them.