AD PVP Guild Kicked me for playing with my bro.

bellanca6561n

Yes, it's a strange exercise in human psychology. It's like that blue-eyed brown-eyed exercise Jane Elliott, a primary school teacher in Iowa devised in '68. Told that the blue-eyed kids were superior, they almost immediately treated their brown-eyed classmates badly. Then she switched the rules and the reverse happened.

Yellow, Red, and Blue factions go back to 1986 and the first MMO, Air Warrior. It seemed strange to me that each faction would attribute definitively negative traits to players on the other two. And these factions did not have elaborate names or backstories like the Dominion, Pact, and Covenant. They were simply called countries A, B, and C.

The more important issue here is the absurdity of being locked to a faction FOREVER, even if you've played the story through Cadwell Gold and have played for all three in the story game. The point of that was that who you fight for and against is matter of happenstance.

Why no ability to change factions, even though the option is right there in race change tokens and appearance change tokens? After all, we cannot know which PvP guild will be the one we'll find a home in until much later.

Creative Director, Rich Lambert was asked about this during one of those ESO Live interviews. He said the fact that faction didn't matter in trials and group dungeons rendered the matter moot.

Yes, he actually said that.

He's a very able developer but he's not his predecessor, Paul Sage, who understood the importance of the actual MMO portion of this game, namely Cyrodiil. And while so, so much content and countless useful features have been added to the game under Lambert's guidance, he doesn't understand the MMO, alas.

ESO is what they used to call a MUSH - a multi-user shared habitat. Group play is limited multiplayer and has been removed entirely from Battle Grounds. BGs are now PUG-only affairs.

This is why a segment of the player population legitimately believes they've been reduced to second rate customers. And it may make business sense to do that.

But what you went through with your brother demonstrates just how little the developers understand true massively multiplayer gaming, sadly.

Joy_Division

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

The dominion is weak.

Well when everyone sheeps to certain factions to avoid actual difficult fights, what do you expect.

So you are saying there are no difficult fights when fighting dominion players?

There are a lot of potatoes and Legolas wannabes on AD ...

Carespanker

bellanca6561n wrote: »

Yes, it's a strange exercise in human psychology. It's like that blue-eyed brown-eyed exercise Jane Elliott, a primary school teacher in Iowa devised in '68. Told that the blue-eyed kids were superior, they almost immediately treated their brown-eyed classmates badly. Then she switched the rules and the reverse happened.

Yellow, Red, and Blue factions go back to 1986 and the first MMO, Air Warrior. It seemed strange to me that each faction would attribute definitively negative traits to players on the other two. And these factions did not have elaborate names or backstories like the Dominion, Pact, and Covenant. They were simply called countries A, B, and C.

The more important issue here is the absurdity of being locked to a faction FOREVER, even if you've played the story through Cadwell Gold and have played for all three in the story game. The point of that was that who you fight for and against is matter of happenstance.

Why no ability to change factions, even though the option is right there in race change tokens and appearance change tokens? After all, we cannot know which PvP guild will be the one we'll find a home in until much later.

Creative Director, Rich Lambert was asked about this during one of those ESO Live interviews. He said the fact that faction didn't matter in trials and group dungeons rendered the matter moot.

Yes, he actually said that.

He's a very able developer but he's not his predecessor, Paul Sage, who understood the importance of the actual MMO portion of this game, namely Cyrodiil. And while so, so much content and countless useful features have been added to the game under Lambert's guidance, he doesn't understand the MMO, alas.

ESO is what they used to call a MUSH - a multi-user shared habitat. Group play is limited multiplayer and has been removed entirely from Battle Grounds. BGs are now PUG-only affairs.

This is why a segment of the player population legitimately believes they've been reduced to second rate customers. And it may make business sense to do that.

But what you went through with your brother demonstrates just how little the developers understand true massively multiplayer gaming, sadly.

This is single-handedly the greatest post ever made on these forums and I hope for Zos's sake its seen by the right people before a mod removes it.

MusCanus

Carespanker wrote: »

bellanca6561n wrote: »

Yes, it's a strange exercise in human psychology. It's like that blue-eyed brown-eyed exercise Jane Elliott, a primary school teacher in Iowa devised in '68. Told that the blue-eyed kids were superior, they almost immediately treated their brown-eyed classmates badly. Then she switched the rules and the reverse happened.

Yellow, Red, and Blue factions go back to 1986 and the first MMO, Air Warrior. It seemed strange to me that each faction would attribute definitively negative traits to players on the other two. And these factions did not have elaborate names or backstories like the Dominion, Pact, and Covenant. They were simply called countries A, B, and C.

The more important issue here is the absurdity of being locked to a faction FOREVER, even if you've played the story through Cadwell Gold and have played for all three in the story game. The point of that was that who you fight for and against is matter of happenstance.

Why no ability to change factions, even though the option is right there in race change tokens and appearance change tokens? After all, we cannot know which PvP guild will be the one we'll find a home in until much later.

Creative Director, Rich Lambert was asked about this during one of those ESO Live interviews. He said the fact that faction didn't matter in trials and group dungeons rendered the matter moot.

Yes, he actually said that.

He's a very able developer but he's not his predecessor, Paul Sage, who understood the importance of the actual MMO portion of this game, namely Cyrodiil. And while so, so much content and countless useful features have been added to the game under Lambert's guidance, he doesn't understand the MMO, alas.

ESO is what they used to call a MUSH - a multi-user shared habitat. Group play is limited multiplayer and has been removed entirely from Battle Grounds. BGs are now PUG-only affairs.

This is why a segment of the player population legitimately believes they've been reduced to second rate customers. And it may make business sense to do that.

But what you went through with your brother demonstrates just how little the developers understand true massively multiplayer gaming, sadly.

This is single-handedly the greatest post ever made on these forums.

Yeah, no wonder why ESO is in the state it is.

January1171

bellanca6561n wrote: »

Yes, it's a strange exercise in human psychology. It's like that blue-eyed brown-eyed exercise Jane Elliott, a primary school teacher in Iowa devised in '68. Told that the blue-eyed kids were superior, they almost immediately treated their brown-eyed classmates badly. Then she switched the rules and the reverse happened.

Yellow, Red, and Blue factions go back to 1986 and the first MMO, Air Warrior. It seemed strange to me that each faction would attribute definitively negative traits to players on the other two. And these factions did not have elaborate names or backstories like the Dominion, Pact, and Covenant. They were simply called countries A, B, and C.

The more important issue here is the absurdity of being locked to a faction FOREVER, even if you've played the story through Cadwell Gold and have played for all three in the story game. The point of that was that who you fight for and against is matter of happenstance.

Why no ability to change factions, even though the option is right there in race change tokens and appearance change tokens? After all, we cannot know which PvP guild will be the one we'll find a home in until much later.

Creative Director, Rich Lambert was asked about this during one of those ESO Live interviews. He said the fact that faction didn't matter in trials and group dungeons rendered the matter moot.

Yes, he actually said that.

He's a very able developer but he's not his predecessor, Paul Sage, who understood the importance of the actual MMO portion of this game, namely Cyrodiil. And while so, so much content and countless useful features have been added to the game under Lambert's guidance, he doesn't understand the MMO, alas.

ESO is what they used to call a MUSH - a multi-user shared habitat. Group play is limited multiplayer and has been removed entirely from Battle Grounds. BGs are now PUG-only affairs.

This is why a segment of the player population legitimately believes they've been reduced to second rate customers. And it may make business sense to do that.

But what you went through with your brother demonstrates just how little the developers understand true massively multiplayer gaming, sadly.

I heard someone say that at one point ZOS said the alliance was so built into the base code for characters, it would be extremely difficult to change it. If someone had a source to back that up, it would be great. Honestly, I'm a little skeptical about it, but it would be an explanation for why ZOS is so unwilling to entertain the idea of a faction change token.

x48rph

Just skimmed the comments so I'm sure others have mentioned as well that lots of guilds have rules about only playing on their faction in whatever campaign they consider their main. It's pretty common so if you jumped in the same campaign on a different faction then yep, I can see exactly why they kicked you and that will normally happen no matter which faction your in.

Now if they didn't spell out those rules for everyone so they knew, that's very poor guild management and it's really poor form to kick someone for breaking rules you never told them about.

FENGRUSH

kindred wrote: »

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0IFENGRUSH wrote: »

The dominion is weak.

Says the guy who took money from Bobby Blaster to focus AD. You let a lot of people down, not all of your twitch audience and contributors were DC, a lot of us were AD. AD is weak? You're weak. DC was in last place every month on Kaal. The only time DC did well was when you logged on and all your fanboys followed.

These are the lies of dominion troops who have been brainwashed and remain in stealth waiting to strike an empty keep.

Under the guidance of champion of the covenant, we are yet again in first place as it has always been for years. That is why the dominion serves the pact in an alliance against the superpower of the covenant who cannot be beat.

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0I

Nomadic_Atmoran

xbobx15 wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

A lot of guilds have strict rules that disallow zerg surfing and faction hopping. I know ours does, however if it isn't in the guild rules, thats a bit silly of them. We made it very clear to our guild that you cannot faction hop on the server we are active in, that's something the guild should do from the get go tho.

honestly, it is kind of ridiculous.

people take this game way too seriously.

Youre free to not join those guilds. Its actually more absurd to join such a guild, that has made it abundantly clear where they stand and what rules they feel strongly about, and to then blatantly break those rules and run to the forums and complain about it.

Carespanker

FENGRUSH wrote: »

kindred wrote: »

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0IFENGRUSH wrote: »

The dominion is weak.

Says the guy who took money from Bobby Blaster to focus AD. You let a lot of people down, not all of your twitch audience and contributors were DC, a lot of us were AD. AD is weak? You're weak. DC was in last place every month on Kaal. The only time DC did well was when you logged on and all your fanboys followed.

These are the lies of dominion troops who have been brainwashed and remain in stealth waiting to strike an empty keep.

Under the guidance of champion of the covenant, we are yet again in first place as it has always been for years. That is why the dominion serves the pact in an alliance against the superpower of the covenant who cannot be beat.

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0I

Always been for years? you haven't won in half a year though lol. Also, why does everyone on DC have to RP? Never got that.

Raudgrani

This is a common practice in many PVP oriented guilds, and for good reason. "Tactical talk" often occurs over guild chat, text or voice. I know a few such guilds where you perhaps could have got away with it, if you told them beforehand, and joined some irrelevant campaign. But far from all would accept even that.
I guess there's nothing wrong with either of this, if you are IN a PVP guild, maybe you should see it coming. Dunno really.

IndianaJames7

As a long term EP player, my thought has always been: ride south for AP, ride west for a good fight.

TheFM

Joy_Division wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

The dominion is weak.

Well when everyone sheeps to certain factions to avoid actual difficult fights, what do you expect.

So you are saying there are no difficult fights when fighting dominion players?

There are a lot of potatoes and Legolas wannabes on AD ...

Potatoes were essential for the survival of certain people on history and Legolas was bad ass. So thank you. 🙃

VaranisArano

January1171 wrote: »

bellanca6561n wrote: »

Yes, it's a strange exercise in human psychology. It's like that blue-eyed brown-eyed exercise Jane Elliott, a primary school teacher in Iowa devised in '68. Told that the blue-eyed kids were superior, they almost immediately treated their brown-eyed classmates badly. Then she switched the rules and the reverse happened.

Yellow, Red, and Blue factions go back to 1986 and the first MMO, Air Warrior. It seemed strange to me that each faction would attribute definitively negative traits to players on the other two. And these factions did not have elaborate names or backstories like the Dominion, Pact, and Covenant. They were simply called countries A, B, and C.

The more important issue here is the absurdity of being locked to a faction FOREVER, even if you've played the story through Cadwell Gold and have played for all three in the story game. The point of that was that who you fight for and against is matter of happenstance.

Why no ability to change factions, even though the option is right there in race change tokens and appearance change tokens? After all, we cannot know which PvP guild will be the one we'll find a home in until much later.

Creative Director, Rich Lambert was asked about this during one of those ESO Live interviews. He said the fact that faction didn't matter in trials and group dungeons rendered the matter moot.

Yes, he actually said that.

He's a very able developer but he's not his predecessor, Paul Sage, who understood the importance of the actual MMO portion of this game, namely Cyrodiil. And while so, so much content and countless useful features have been added to the game under Lambert's guidance, he doesn't understand the MMO, alas.

ESO is what they used to call a MUSH - a multi-user shared habitat. Group play is limited multiplayer and has been removed entirely from Battle Grounds. BGs are now PUG-only affairs.

This is why a segment of the player population legitimately believes they've been reduced to second rate customers. And it may make business sense to do that.

But what you went through with your brother demonstrates just how little the developers understand true massively multiplayer gaming, sadly.

I heard someone say that at one point ZOS said the alliance was so built into the base code for characters, it would be extremely difficult to change it. If someone had a source to back that up, it would be great. Honestly, I'm a little skeptical about it, but it would be an explanation for why ZOS is so unwilling to entertain the idea of a faction change token.

The actual source for ZOS' last stated intentions with faction change is the Elsweyr Q&A, as far as I know.

"I spoke with Rob about breaking alliance choice away from character creation (something I’ve wanted to see in ESO for a long time), we spoke about how there are technical issues (which is why they don’t and won’t offer faction changes) and whilst these could be overcome with a large investment of time ZOS needs to balance between if these would be good use of that time vs other things they could be working on."
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/465498/eso-zos-q-a-information-london-elsweyr-press-event-info/p1

I don't believe the base code part has been confirmed by ZOS as part of those "technical issues", again, as far as I know. However, there are a number of players who like to insist that it must be easy to change the alliance in the database while ignoring the large number of aspects your alliance impacts in ESO - all the way down to which harborage you use or which zones you'll get guild dailies for while you level. Even after One Tamriel, your alliance continues to impact a lot more than just which faction you play for in Cyrodiil.

Cirantille

So?

You acknowledge guild rules when you apply to them and if you were to play for other faction you should let your guild masters know about it. You should have told them that you are playing with your brother.

At least that is how it works in my guild because what is the point of being in AD guild if you are going to fight against them.

Krec

FENGRUSH wrote: »

kindred wrote: »

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0IFENGRUSH wrote: »

The dominion is weak.

Says the guy who took money from Bobby Blaster to focus AD. You let a lot of people down, not all of your twitch audience and contributors were DC, a lot of us were AD. AD is weak? You're weak. DC was in last place every month on Kaal. The only time DC did well was when you logged on and all your fanboys followed.

These are the lies of dominion troops who have been brainwashed and remain in stealth waiting to strike an empty keep.

Under the guidance of champion of the covenant, we are yet again in first place as it has always been for years. That is why the dominion serves the pact in an alliance against the superpower of the covenant who cannot be beat.

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0I

did some watery tart throw a sword at you?

Danikat

Yeah it happens. Years ago a guild kicked me simply for having characters in other alliances. I'd agreed to their rule that you don't play PvP for anyone except DC - at the time I didn't play PvP at all and had no intention of starting, which I told them, and said that meant it wouldn't be a problem. But later they saw me logged into my crafter, who is AD, and insisted I couldn't play any non-DC character, even in PvE, even just as a crafter because it still meant I was capable of entering Cyrodiil as a different Alliance and apparently that was too much of a risk. They told me I had to delete all my non-DC characters or leave the guild, and the only delay in making that decision was trying to find the button to leave the guild.

If this was a serious PvP or role-playing guild I could understand it, but they'd advertised themselves as a casual-friendly PvX guild open to anyone, so it came as a bit of a surprise that they were that paranoid about possible spies.

Ultimately it's up to each guild to decide their rules and as long as it doesn't break the TOS they can make that whatever they want. If someone wanted to make a guild where everyone has to wear white at all times and you'll be kicked if you're ever seen wearing black that's their choice, they just might have a hard time recruiting. But guilds really need to make their rules clear, and IMO should be a bit more lenient with first offences, especially if the person has been in the guild for a long time and/or seems surprised that they've done anything wrong.

BRogueNZ

win win by the sounds of it
EP get another spy troll and we lose another traitor
Should have been hung

Brandathorbel

Nomadic_Atmoran wrote: »

xbobx15 wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

A lot of guilds have strict rules that disallow zerg surfing and faction hopping. I know ours does, however if it isn't in the guild rules, thats a bit silly of them. We made it very clear to our guild that you cannot faction hop on the server we are active in, that's something the guild should do from the get go tho.

honestly, it is kind of ridiculous.

people take this game way too seriously.

Youre free to not join those guilds. Its actually more absurd to join such a guild, that has made it abundantly clear where they stand and what rules they feel strongly about, and to then blatantly break those rules and run to the forums and complain about it.

it just cracks me up because i don't doubt that there are a lot of people that actually think who is winning actually matters.

BRogueNZ

Carespanker wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

kindred wrote: »

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0IFENGRUSH wrote: »

The dominion is weak.

Says the guy who took money from Bobby Blaster to focus AD. You let a lot of people down, not all of your twitch audience and contributors were DC, a lot of us were AD. AD is weak? You're weak. DC was in last place every month on Kaal. The only time DC did well was when you logged on and all your fanboys followed.

These are the lies of dominion troops who have been brainwashed and remain in stealth waiting to strike an empty keep.

Under the guidance of champion of the covenant, we are yet again in first place as it has always been for years. That is why the dominion serves the pact in an alliance against the superpower of the covenant who cannot be beat.

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0I

Always been for years? you haven't won in half a year though lol. Also, why does everyone on DC have to RP? Never got that.

Don't mind him, he's the King of his own wee dream land

Carespanker

BRogueNZ wrote: »

Carespanker wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

kindred wrote: »

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0IFENGRUSH wrote: »

The dominion is weak.

Says the guy who took money from Bobby Blaster to focus AD. You let a lot of people down, not all of your twitch audience and contributors were DC, a lot of us were AD. AD is weak? You're weak. DC was in last place every month on Kaal. The only time DC did well was when you logged on and all your fanboys followed.

These are the lies of dominion troops who have been brainwashed and remain in stealth waiting to strike an empty keep.

Under the guidance of champion of the covenant, we are yet again in first place as it has always been for years. That is why the dominion serves the pact in an alliance against the superpower of the covenant who cannot be beat.

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0I

Always been for years? you haven't won in half a year though lol. Also, why does everyone on DC have to RP? Never got that.

Don't mind him, he's the King of his own wee dream land

Ill have you know the DC identify themselves as "Lords" in dreamland.

barney2525

xWarbrain wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

The dominion is weak.

The Dominion. It's a proper noun. Show some respect.

Didn't they get their buts kicked by the Federation ?

As to the OP, that does sound like a lot of sour grapes. Would like to hear the other side of the story. But I can understand being upset since that was the only guild anyone can join....

<he said sarcastically>

Salvas_Aren

FENGRUSH wrote: »

kindred wrote: »

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0IFENGRUSH wrote: »

The dominion is weak.

Says the guy who took money from Bobby Blaster to focus AD. You let a lot of people down, not all of your twitch audience and contributors were DC, a lot of us were AD. AD is weak? You're weak. DC was in last place every month on Kaal. The only time DC did well was when you logged on and all your fanboys followed.

These are the lies of dominion troops who have been brainwashed and remain in stealth waiting to strike an empty keep.

Under the guidance of champion of the covenant, we are yet again in first place as it has always been for years. That is why the dominion serves the pact in an alliance against the superpower of the covenant who cannot be beat.

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0I

Wow, your alliance is topdog on one map for 5 minutes. Impressive.

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

Hey kiddo,

Join the Pact!
Here we just punch each other in the face and all is good!



*Those filthy milk drinks*

barney2525

Salvas_Aren wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

kindred wrote: »

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0IFENGRUSH wrote: »

The dominion is weak.

Says the guy who took money from Bobby Blaster to focus AD. You let a lot of people down, not all of your twitch audience and contributors were DC, a lot of us were AD. AD is weak? You're weak. DC was in last place every month on Kaal. The only time DC did well was when you logged on and all your fanboys followed.

These are the lies of dominion troops who have been brainwashed and remain in stealth waiting to strike an empty keep.

Under the guidance of champion of the covenant, we are yet again in first place as it has always been for years. That is why the dominion serves the pact in an alliance against the superpower of the covenant who cannot be beat.

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0I

Wow, your alliance is topdog on one map for 5 minutes. Impressive.

well, it was actually 3 minutes and 58 seconds and after a glitch that dcd 75% of all the opposition characters.

BUT THAT DOESN'T MATTER !

Salvas_Aren

barney2525 wrote: »

Salvas_Aren wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

kindred wrote: »

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0IFENGRUSH wrote: »

The dominion is weak.

Says the guy who took money from Bobby Blaster to focus AD. You let a lot of people down, not all of your twitch audience and contributors were DC, a lot of us were AD. AD is weak? You're weak. DC was in last place every month on Kaal. The only time DC did well was when you logged on and all your fanboys followed.

These are the lies of dominion troops who have been brainwashed and remain in stealth waiting to strike an empty keep.

Under the guidance of champion of the covenant, we are yet again in first place as it has always been for years. That is why the dominion serves the pact in an alliance against the superpower of the covenant who cannot be beat.

https://imgur.com/a/nVY8j0I

Wow, your alliance is topdog on one map for 5 minutes. Impressive.

well, it was actually 3 minutes and 58 seconds and after a glitch that dcd 75% of all the opposition characters.

BUT THAT DOESN'T MATTER !

Well, so mass-DCing respectively CTDing the enemies of the covenant is not just an EU thing? How about scrolls flying cross the map while trying 10 times to relog in?

Env_t

@FENGRUSH but tell me why DC always sucking at PC EU?

L_Nici

@Env_t Actually DC isn't as bad as AD at least on Blackreach, there are actually insanely good players. The only reason the DC is only second place right now is that some Vivec Zerg from AD came to Blackreach zerging the almost empty map with 30+ people. They are basically attacking empty keeps with 30 people, because they got absolutely destroyed with balanced numbers.

And even with that 30+ Zergs they fail as soon as DC defends, even if it is just 5 people. Those AD Vivec zergs are laughable in actual PvP, they can't do nothing as soon as there is any kind of defence.

MentalxHammer

Imagine being a faction loyalist RPer XD

StormeReigns

Better to be yellow belly coward AD than milk drinking inbred EP or window licking slackjawed DC

oXI_Viper_IXo

MentalxHammer wrote: »

Imagine being a faction loyalist RPer XD

Imagine playing an MMORPG and expecting people not to RP.