Magicka > Stamina Users

Commandment

universal_wrath wrote: »

Commandment wrote: »

GRXRG wrote: »

In BGs stamina dominated every patch and even this one is dominating.
Why? Break free cost over 5k stamina in no-CP and stamina builds have way higher burst combos. Most magicka builds run from 10k to 16k stamina. In the recent period you pretty much get CC'ed off cooldown, so at you the conclusions.
There are some exceptions like magsorcs (especially fury spammers) will just get tons of kills from range and the more your team is good the more they are effective.
But overall stamcro stamplar stamden and stamdk are the kings of BGs.
If you play against 2 decent stamdks which coordinate and time their leaps you are pretty much facerolled.
Stamcros and stamdens can kite 2 or 3 people and don't die while bursting like crazy, stamplars provides off heals and they have the easiest combo burst in the game to pull off.

If you have a problem with shields and magsorcs use shield breaker set from imperial city or guild stores, I don't know which class do you play so i cannot give you a more specific advice.

So your explanation is you need 2 stam DK's not 1 who are well coordinated, with ulti up, to kill a single sorc? Okay... Very compelling argument.

When you reach higher MMR you see more, and more staffs.

My pvp gear is already good. And when I say gear, I mean geared, all yellows. Don't need any lessons, I was having my fun in low MMR with stam, but you have to go with the current meta, and currently Magicka is where it's at in BG's

It is very weird that you speak of high MMR and mag sorc, I almost never saw either mag or stam sorcs in high MMR pre-harrowstorm. Stam sorc lacked survivability and dmg which is why they were gone and mag sorc combo was very predictable they almost never kill anyone especialy if playing against healing bots. I only remmember seeing 1 sorc who occassionaly apoear in BGs, he was a gank stealth sorc which he did have kills only 4-5 and dies twic as much. I don't know how high the mmr now you talking about so I can't know for sure as I have never seen your name before, I have seen @Iskiab or someone with similar name and people like duskPK, Mayorz, or Xziii many times fought with and against them. Maybe your in game user is just different the yours in forum like me, or maybe you play NA more than EU.

Moment you said prehorrowstorm I stopped reading. Sorry we are talking about post horrowstorm. Get out of the past my dude. That was the time where people can que up with there friends and make neat battleground builds. THANK GOODNESS ESO made this game a solo player game in BG's now people will run the best build to hope they don't get stomped.

So this is more like a public announcement, run magicka, tired of seeing stamina users that go negative deaths and no kills.

Commandment

Joinovikova wrote: »

Commandment wrote: »

Change my mind

Ever since the implementation of solo que only in BG's everyone and there mother's are rerolling staff's, now everyone rolls the sweaty builds Note this is directed to BG battles.

Stamina User: If your a warden, don't read this, you were blessed by the ESO God's to be a immortal tank with damage.
Pros:
1. You look cool
2. In the real world, you can do massive damage in pve.

Cons:
1. You're a stamina user.
2. You have to go close range most of the time, and if not, arrows are only good against other stamina charaters
3. You only have a tick heal, unless your a warden, in matter of fact if your a warden your probably the only viable stamina user.
4. You melt like butter to anyone with a staff.
5. You rdamage mitigation abilities dodge/break free/block uses up your attack resources.
6. You are using foam swords and branches when you fight against a magicka user, except when you fight other stamina characters.

Magicka User
Pros:
3. MASSIVE DAMAGE, PEW PEW PEW I HAVE NO CONSEQUENCES FOR BEING FAR RANGED!!
4. MASSIVE SHIELDS YOU CAN WEAVE ALL THE TIME INTO YOUR COMBO'S, Laughing at stamina users as they hit you with there foam swords and shoot you with twigs
5. If your a sorc you have HIGH MOBILITY
6. Can knock back those pesky stamina users! and blast them to hell with a few shots
7. Your light attacks do a lot of damage!
8. You have ALL the stamina in the world to break free and dodge, since you don't really use it for fighting. So you not only have massive heals and shields, you can dodge way more freely
9. Class variations will be your cherry on top, specifically if your a sorcerrard or templard

Con's:
1. There are other magicka users
2. Stamina Users will grief and become magicka users to spite the game design.




Suggestion for a way to change this. Make a set that either breaks shields fast, or ignore shields that only works for stamina abilties so magicka users can't abuse it. Or add a stamina abilities that completely negates shields.

... Stamina set ups are much far stronger than magica in one on one or small scale like BG.. try to also some mag char first..... big L2P issue... Every stam class is now immortal tank with masive burst.. not only warden..

Hey sure, they are when fighting other stamina's players in LOW MMR

Joinovikova wrote: »

Shaloknir wrote: »

BaiterOfZergs wrote: »

In bgs mag has always had a strong group presence with stam having high kill potential. If you get into a bg with a good amount of mag players that work well together and are in sync then they’ll easily outplay stam. Although in the more chaotic matches stam has the advantage.

I think Zerg has it right.

My stam tank DK has killed by 3 high cooperating mag players. and I am not kill them with single leap.. hmm magica is total op need to be nerfed.. the main content o this QQ sesion anyone who play mag and stam.. seee ..

3. MASSIVE DAMAGE, PEW PEW PEW I HAVE NO CONSEQUENCES FOR BEING FAR RANGED!!

Commandment wrote: »

Change my mind

Ever since the implementation of solo que only in BG's everyone and there mother's are rerolling staff's, now everyone rolls the sweaty builds Note this is directed to BG battles.

Stamina User: If your a warden, don't read this, you were blessed by the ESO God's to be a immortal tank with damage.
Pros:
1. You look cool
2. In the real world, you can do massive damage in pve.

Cons:
1. You're a stamina user.
2. You have to go close range most of the time, and if not, arrows are only good against other stamina charaters
3. You only have a tick heal, unless your a warden, in matter of fact if your a warden your probably the only viable stamina user.
4. You melt like butter to anyone with a staff.
5. You rdamage mitigation abilities dodge/break free/block uses up your attack resources.
6. You are using foam swords and branches when you fight against a magicka user, except when you fight other stamina characters.

Magicka User
Pros:
3. MASSIVE DAMAGE, PEW PEW PEW I HAVE NO CONSEQUENCES FOR BEING FAR RANGED!!
4. MASSIVE SHIELDS YOU CAN WEAVE ALL THE TIME INTO YOUR COMBO'S, Laughing at stamina users as they hit you with there foam swords and shoot you with twigs
5. If your a sorc you have HIGH MOBILITY
6. Can knock back those pesky stamina users! and blast them to hell with a few shots
7. Your light attacks do a lot of damage!
8. You have ALL the stamina in the world to break free and dodge, since you don't really use it for fighting. So you not only have massive heals and shields, you can dodge way more freely
9. Class variations will be your cherry on top, specifically if your a sorcerrard or templard

Con's:
1. There are other magicka users
2. Stamina Users will grief and become magicka users to spite the game design.




Suggestion for a way to change this. Make a set that either breaks shields fast, or ignore shields that only works for stamina abilties so magicka users can't abuse it. Or add a stamina abilities that completely negates shields.

My stam tank DK has killed by 3 high cooperating mag players. and I am not kill them with single leap.. hmm magica is total op need to be nerfed.. the main content o this QQ session anyone who play mag and stam.. seee ..

3. MASSIVE DAMAGE, PEW PEW PEW I HAVE NO CONSEQUENCES FOR BEING FAR RANGED!!
coopare dmg potential of stam (which is masive higher than mag) and mag builds.. (ranged? on f.e. mag Dk?)

Sheild also were overnerfed... high cost low protection.. and reqiuire to use light armor due to high cost.. so low resistance

"Can knock back those pesky stamina users! and blast them to hell with a few shots" aonly case of stamina set ups.. no posible on mag..

" Your light attacks do a lot of damage! " stamina has much stronger LA than magica.. (also in case when u use bows....)

"You have ALL the stamina in the world to break free and dodge, since you don't really use it for fighting. So you not only have massive heals and shields, you can dodge way more freely" but mag class cannot have decent stam regen, becuase they need to invest to mag regen, and it much more easieer to drain mag builds from stam then stam build...

Lol Okay, yeah MY NECRO USED COLOSSAL AND KILLED 8 APPOSING TEAM MEMBERS yeah!!!! Yeah right, at least I can admit I have team members at my back supporting me. Anyone can spew numbers out, pretty sure 90% of that match you were dying when you had no dragon leap.

LOL When someone says people are cooperating in a SOLO QUE ONLY bg, yeah nice story.

Thogard

Iskiab wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

@Iskiab just stop.

High MMR last patch was nothing but mag sorcs, magcros, magplars, and magdens, with a sprinkling of Stam toons queueing in groups.

Every time I hear you mention high MMR I cringe. I’m sure you’re a nice guy but you really have no idea what you’re talking about. Humble yourself.

Magcro? What player, there aren’t a lot of magcros in BGs period.

High MMR players that I saw a lot and assume off the top of my head are: Bersberg, Mystikkal, MavPK, Akean, MavPK, Haki, Sunspots (can’t remember his name). A high MMR game would be when they’re all in the same BG.

I think because we play at different times you assume you’re higher than me, but if it’s based on games played I’m not even sure. A high MMR game to me is when it’s not lopsided and it’s all people who play BGs a lot.

High MMR doesn’t even exist during the off hours you play. I assume I’m higher than you because I only see you in matches where I get brand new players as teammates. Lately you’ve been on alts.

I’m not saying you’re bad. I’m just saying that because you don’t play primetime you don’t see the strategies that are used when all the high mmr people are playing.

People in your time slot aren’t aggressively third partying and therefore get by with more Stam toons. Your time slot didn’t really mess around with organized 4v4v4.

It’s all a moot point though. I don’t play the game anymore and MMR has reset.

Saubon

LittlePinkDot wrote: »

Bring back CP to BGs

That would make high mmr games very boring with very few kills

universal_wrath

Commandment wrote: »

universal_wrath wrote: »

Commandment wrote: »

GRXRG wrote: »

In BGs stamina dominated every patch and even this one is dominating.
Why? Break free cost over 5k stamina in no-CP and stamina builds have way higher burst combos. Most magicka builds run from 10k to 16k stamina. In the recent period you pretty much get CC'ed off cooldown, so at you the conclusions.
There are some exceptions like magsorcs (especially fury spammers) will just get tons of kills from range and the more your team is good the more they are effective.
But overall stamcro stamplar stamden and stamdk are the kings of BGs.
If you play against 2 decent stamdks which coordinate and time their leaps you are pretty much facerolled.
Stamcros and stamdens can kite 2 or 3 people and don't die while bursting like crazy, stamplars provides off heals and they have the easiest combo burst in the game to pull off.

If you have a problem with shields and magsorcs use shield breaker set from imperial city or guild stores, I don't know which class do you play so i cannot give you a more specific advice.

So your explanation is you need 2 stam DK's not 1 who are well coordinated, with ulti up, to kill a single sorc? Okay... Very compelling argument.

When you reach higher MMR you see more, and more staffs.

My pvp gear is already good. And when I say gear, I mean geared, all yellows. Don't need any lessons, I was having my fun in low MMR with stam, but you have to go with the current meta, and currently Magicka is where it's at in BG's

It is very weird that you speak of high MMR and mag sorc, I almost never saw either mag or stam sorcs in high MMR pre-harrowstorm. Stam sorc lacked survivability and dmg which is why they were gone and mag sorc combo was very predictable they almost never kill anyone especialy if playing against healing bots. I only remmember seeing 1 sorc who occassionaly apoear in BGs, he was a gank stealth sorc which he did have kills only 4-5 and dies twic as much. I don't know how high the mmr now you talking about so I can't know for sure as I have never seen your name before, I have seen @Iskiab or someone with similar name and people like duskPK, Mayorz, or Xziii many times fought with and against them. Maybe your in game user is just different the yours in forum like me, or maybe you play NA more than EU.

Moment you said prehorrowstorm I stopped reading. Sorry we are talking about post horrowstorm. Get out of the past my dude. That was the time where people can que up with there friends and make neat battleground builds. THANK GOODNESS ESO made this game a solo player game in BG's now people will run the best build to hope they don't get stomped.

So this is more like a public announcement, run magicka, tired of seeing stamina users that go negative deaths and no kills.

Bro, what is so different this patch than previous one? Only class that got a buff was stamcro and stamplar. Everyone who was using iceheart got a nerf to deal with. Maybe solo queu is a big hit? But I always though that mag specs are stronger in group plays. I get we waif 1 or 2 months to see how what happens in high MMR queues.

Koensol

@Commandment So lets see, you joined about a month ago and have already made multiple silly posts. This one also is just literally filled with misinformation, false assumptions and l2p issues. Maybe get a firm grasp on the game first before making absolute statements as you do in the OP. And make sure to l2p on both mag and stam, as you will see the lunacy in your post.

Moonsorrow

Iskiab wrote: »

Step 1: Read what your abilities do
Step 2: practice
Step 3: learn how to play
Step 4: post on the forums

Please sticky.

This.

To the original poster:

For too many the steps 1, 2 and 3 are so hard and would take effort..

(many expect they can just go "own" those who been doing PVP on this game for years and have actually went all the 3 steps on all classes and on both mag and stam specs)

.. so they get rekt and go directly to step 4 and demand nerfs or make statements based on their own limited view on balance, poor skill level and the lack of understanding of even basic mechanics.

Has these people even seen other stamina players, or streamers destroying mag specs (even shield stackers) with like just 3 skills combo timed right with CC?

If others can do it.. then.. maybe there is no issue with Stamina being bad.. but something, or someone.. is bad instead and just, yes: needs to learn to play.

Pro tip: How to deal against mag specs? You can Dodge roll most their damage (projectiles most of them, and all heavy hitting ones). Be on offensive, CC and get your combo right. CC always when cooldown over. Have gap closer. Have pressure, have some form of passive mitigation on top of actives to have constant offensive window more than defensive gcd using. It is that simple. Have real damage. I take down shields with 1 hit. If i can do it, so can you.

Yeah, if they stack shields and Barrier and stuff (lol), they still go down when Barrier is down. Just have enough damage and CC.

(yeah, sorcs will Streak away when in trouble heh, accept it or chase, your choice. Stamina can do the same if in trouble: Dodge and Sprint away in tower stairs, up, down, around, up, downstairs, back to upstairs.. you know the drill if in trouble, same thing, but with speed and LoS usage..)

Stam and Mag are quite balanced in the big picture, best if mixes both, i mean like playing as a duo with mag+stam that have synergy between them.

And if you ask me.. Stamina has right now more specs than magicka, that are highly competitive in a solo & small scale playing. Stamcro, Stamplar, Stamden, StamDK, Stamsorc (imo, while some say it is average tier) are all very strong and can take out ANY mag spec if you have the skills to play it.

Stamblade is top tier too, if the player is top tier and can play really high damage and is good with Shade and kiting. But currently it is a bit harder to play against skilled Msorcs especially that know how to Streak pressure and combo out the Stamblade. Stamblade is also nice for hunting the FOTM Stamcro though.

But yeah, there is a decent balance in the big picture (not just 1vs1 vacuum since cannot balance the game that way, since we have also groups). And the current FOTM is Stamcro, so that should tell you something.. and all the topics that say Stamplar needs nerfs as an example.

So go get some practise and learn to smash them magickas, and play as a magicka and see how other stam specs do it to you. You learn a lot from that perspective if fight against good opponents.

OrderoftheDarkness

It is difficult for a ganker to understand the beauty of possible combo ties...

dazee

Commandment wrote: »

dazee wrote: »

My most successful pvp characters so far have been stam, 100% of the time for the past 5 years. try again.

Sorry we aren't in the past anymore, and we are talking about BG's please try again.

*cough* to date they have been mostly stam. Sure I have one good pvp necro healer now but my WW stamdk is kicking serious ass in pvp and utterly destroying the puny wizards one after the other.

Your argument is based on ignorance of how to play stam builds well in pvp, not on logic.

Cirantille

There was another person claimin the otherwise that stam > magicka

I think they are quite equal, just plays and built differently

Neloth

Iskiab wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Its interesting as people kind of just jump on the stam>magicka thing based on if you look at 1v1 raw kill potential. With the MMR reset and solo only queue; I'm sure there's a lot of selfish versions of the heals and not a lot of echoing vigor. I mean how do you go in with that.when you dont know who you'll get and they cant be trusted to reciprocate

I’ve noticed that some stam are running echoing now in BGs. It’s balanced with a 6 target cap in mind, but they’ll still do about 200k healing per BG and it’s MUCH appreciated.

I don’t know the technical aspect of it and how they run it or or why, maybe to extend the offensive window like I use radiating since it lasts 10 seconds? I use radiating like a buff and imagine they’re doing the same with echoing. The longer duration definitely makes it easier to brawl, who wants to switch to their back bar every 4 seconds to heal.

It's a good point about much large offensive window with radiating, that's why I use it on magblade in combination with other hots and BRP resto.

However, the comparison with vigor is not fair. If you want, you can easily put vigor on your front bar, and 100% uptime of it offensively. But clearly you can't do the same with rapid regen, since resto is not a front bar weapon.

Neloth

Okey, if you really talk about BGs...

Commandment wrote: »

3. MASSIVE DAMAGE, PEW PEW PEW I HAVE NO CONSEQUENCES FOR BEING FAR RANGED!!

Pew, pew, no CC from > 15 meters for 5/6 mag classes, and that's if you count crap cage. Idk if you die when your opponent can't CC you, personally I don't. Also, gap closer non existent.

Commandment wrote: »

MASSIVE SHIELDS YOU CAN WEAVE ALL THE TIME INTO YOUR COMBO'S,

Hahah, massive shields in BGs. On my 50k max magicka (in CP, a bit lower in BGs, I don't remember the exact amount) sorc I have 9k shields, which go down faster then I can cast them if I face more then once opponent.

Commandment wrote: »

If your a sorc you have HIGH MOBILITY

and if not? or mag = sorc? And if you are stamina-anything, you have HIGH MOBILITY, change my mind

Commandment wrote: »

Can knock back those pesky stamina users! and blast them to hell with a few shots

nerf flame reach, strongest CC in game

Commandment wrote: »

You have ALL the stamina in the world to break free and dodge, since you don't really use it for fighting. So you not only have massive heals and shields, you can dodge way more freely

With 11k stam in BGs I can roll like a monkey

Commandment wrote: »

Class variations will be your cherry on top, specifically if your a sorcerrard or templard

Magcro class variation is my favourite, I roll stamcros with it 24/7

Iskiab

Cirantille wrote: »

There was another person claimin the otherwise that stam > magicka

I think they are quite equal, just plays and built differently

That was Thogard who made that thread right before the patch, apparently he changed his mind and now he thinks mag > stam.

technohic

So are people seeing the ability delay issue in BGs?

MaxJrFTW

Iskiab wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

There was another person claimin the otherwise that stam > magicka

I think they are quite equal, just plays and built differently

That was Thogard who made that thread right before the patch, apparently he changed his mind and now he thinks mag > stam.

The last time Thogard made a thread was back in september. He's not an idiot, he knows mag has been better than stam for group play since they changed the healing like 3 patches ago. You love giving your opinion about everything, but the fact of the matter is you don't know what you're talking about more often than not. Stop posting and let more knowledgeable players answer the questions.

Iskiab

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

There was another person claimin the otherwise that stam > magicka

I think they are quite equal, just plays and built differently

That was Thogard who made that thread right before the patch, apparently he changed his mind and now he thinks mag > stam.

The last time Thogard made a thread was back in september. He's not an idiot, he knows mag has been better than stam for group play since they changed the healing like 3 patches ago. You love giving your opinion about everything, but the fact of the matter is you don't know what you're talking about more often than not. Stop posting and let more knowledgeable players answer the questions.

I always get a kick out of people who think so black and white. I'll stop answering when people stop giving bad answers.

For some reason even when I'm going winning 80%+ of my BGs there are always people telling me I'm wrong who're on the losing end. Maybe it's time to look in the mirror.

Emma_Overload

Since when do Magicka users have "MASSIVE DAMAGE"?

Rahar

Commandment wrote: »

[...]
Magicka User
Pros:
3. MASSIVE DAMAGE, PEW PEW PEW I HAVE NO CONSEQUENCES FOR BEING FAR RANGED!!
4. MASSIVE SHIELDS YOU CAN WEAVE ALL THE TIME INTO YOUR COMBO'S, Laughing at stamina users as they hit you with there foam swords and shoot you with twigs [...]

Stopped reading. Pretty clear this thread's not going to be very constructive when it started off with hyperbole and wild exaggeration, and it's not really worth formulating a reply.

universal_wrath

Koensol wrote: »

@Commandment So lets see, you joined about a month ago and have already made multiple silly posts. This one also is just literally filled with misinformation, false assumptions and l2p issues. Maybe get a firm grasp on the game first before making absolute statements as you do in the OP. And make sure to l2p on both mag and stam, as you will see the lunacy in your post.

While I disagree with what @Commandment said, your point of discussion is completely invalid imo. Just because someone create a forum account yesterday, does not mean they just started playing yesterday. I played the game since launch and I only knew that the forum exist 2 years ago or so when my friend interduced me to it. Lots of people are like me, either didn't know about the forums or didn't feel the need to voice their opinions before. Accounting someones credibilty through their forum account creation date is unvalid.

Koensol

universal_wrath wrote: »

Koensol wrote: »

@Commandment So lets see, you joined about a month ago and have already made multiple silly posts. This one also is just literally filled with misinformation, false assumptions and l2p issues. Maybe get a firm grasp on the game first before making absolute statements as you do in the OP. And make sure to l2p on both mag and stam, as you will see the lunacy in your post.

While I disagree with what @Commandment said, your point of discussion is completely invalid imo. Just because someone create a forum account yesterday, does not mean they just started playing yesterday. I played the game since launch and I only knew that the forum exist 2 years ago or so when my friend interduced me to it. Lots of people are like me, either didn't know about the forums or didn't feel the need to voice their opinions before. Accounting someones credibilty through their forum account creation date is unvalid.

I understand the confusion from how I worded it, but I was just pointing at his posting history so far and that he's not doing a great first impression on the forums judging from that. His posts indicate a severe lack of l2p, and misunderstanding of basic game mechanics. Its hard to take this thread seriously as such.

Koensol

Iskiab wrote: »

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

There was another person claimin the otherwise that stam > magicka

I think they are quite equal, just plays and built differently

That was Thogard who made that thread right before the patch, apparently he changed his mind and now he thinks mag > stam.

The last time Thogard made a thread was back in september. He's not an idiot, he knows mag has been better than stam for group play since they changed the healing like 3 patches ago. You love giving your opinion about everything, but the fact of the matter is you don't know what you're talking about more often than not. Stop posting and let more knowledgeable players answer the questions.

I always get a kick out of people who think so black and white. I'll stop answering when people stop giving bad answers.

For some reason even when I'm going winning 80%+ of my BGs there are always people telling me I'm wrong who're on the losing end. Maybe it's time to look in the mirror.

You get a kick out of people who think black and white, yet you feel you can decide what are good/bad answers, as if thats not black and white... There is a fine line between false or correct and opinion/theory.

I see you all the time on the forums sharing theories as facts and making predictions about upcoming patches, and basing them on anecdotal evidence or solely your own experience: "class X isn't good because I don't see a lot of them in BGs". Or: "stamblade isn't good solo open world, because I never saw one do well". Sometimes you even dismiss an entire class based on a single ability which YOU think is trash. Speaking of black and white again...

Unless you can back it up with actual facts and not anecdotal evidence or personal experience, it is your opinion/pov and it might just be you who ends up being wrong. Your post applies 100% to yourself, but it's funny how you think you are above that somehow.

universal_wrath

I think of us went of topic here and started to attack each other, but I will say this. OP might be right or wrong, only way to find out is went high MMR is set and we see what classes and specs are domeninat in BGs, open world has been set in stone for a long time since they launched the game and it was decided to be mag sorc and whatever comes around after every new patch. I could be wrong myself which it did happen sometimes as nobody is perfect and ww only share opinions and sometimes facts.

Commandment

Koensol wrote: »

@Commandment So lets see, you joined about a month ago and have already made multiple silly posts. This one also is just literally filled with misinformation, false assumptions and l2p issues. Maybe get a firm grasp on the game first before making absolute statements as you do in the OP. And make sure to l2p on both mag and stam, as you will see the lunacy in your post.

You do realize that forums doesnt account for how long you play right? Based on your stupidity, I can assume you have no valid opinion. If thats how your reasoning goes, then be my guest.

If you read anything, I said I play magicka, and I'm rolling on people, just like I'de roll on you.

So instead of saying L2P, how about you L2R if you dont understand that R, it means read. Oh and yes OBVIOUSLY I exaggerated the potential of magicka, ITS HUMOR!!!!! DERRRRRRPPPPPP GERRRR HERRRRRRRPPPPP... I guess snow flakes don't see that.

Iskiab

Koensol wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

There was another person claimin the otherwise that stam > magicka

I think they are quite equal, just plays and built differently

That was Thogard who made that thread right before the patch, apparently he changed his mind and now he thinks mag > stam.

The last time Thogard made a thread was back in september. He's not an idiot, he knows mag has been better than stam for group play since they changed the healing like 3 patches ago. You love giving your opinion about everything, but the fact of the matter is you don't know what you're talking about more often than not. Stop posting and let more knowledgeable players answer the questions.

I always get a kick out of people who think so black and white. I'll stop answering when people stop giving bad answers.

For some reason even when I'm going winning 80%+ of my BGs there are always people telling me I'm wrong who're on the losing end. Maybe it's time to look in the mirror.

You get a kick out of people who think black and white, yet you feel you can decide what are good/bad answers, as if thats not black and white... There is a fine line between false or correct and opinion/theory.

I see you all the time on the forums sharing theories as facts and making predictions about upcoming patches, and basing them on anecdotal evidence or solely your own experience: "class X isn't good because I don't see a lot of them in BGs". Or: "stamblade isn't good solo open world, because I never saw one do well". Sometimes you even dismiss an entire class based on a single ability which YOU think is trash. Speaking of black and white again...

Unless you can back it up with actual facts and not anecdotal evidence or personal experience, it is your opinion/pov and it might just be you who ends up being wrong. Your post applies 100% to yourself, but it's funny how you think you are above that somehow.

You say that like I’ve been wrong. ‘My theories’ about upcoming patches have usually been right.

Called magplar being strong when people said they were weak, called magblade being weak, called stamblade being weak, called MagWarden being good.

A LOT of people on the forums don’t play enough and have outdated opinions. They hold those opinions and keep spouting them long after the game has changed. As someone who is still playing, of course I’m going to disagree with people who’s opinion is outdated. Add in all the try hards who just parrot others instead of playing/trying different things and it’s hard not to disagree with most of what’s written.

Moonsorrow

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Since when do Magicka users have "MASSIVE DAMAGE"?

Heh yeah, not that "massive" if wanna actually sustain too, and as a Msorc and Magblade as an example both need some sacrifices to be able to "brawl" (fight at melee range) since most often against good opponents you cannot Cloak and Streak also is not an auto-saved button, good stam players are on your melee range all the time, gap closes and keeps pressure up, and their Dizzy/Class delayed damage skill+ulti+executioner is actually "massive damage" compared to what mag specs can reliably do most often.

But, Msorc, Magblade, Magden.. can have rather good damage if they are let to do their combo + light attack weaving properly without pushing them to the defensive. Being ranged has advances, it is a fact, and also many Mag specs got good healing, so if group has some good Mag players, there WILL be plenty of cross-healing that helps the whole team to stay on the offensive.

Still, personally if i right now made a "dream team" premade (impossibruuuu on this patch heh) it would have 2 Stam+ 2 Mag. So quite balanced in that view IMO.

Mag and Stam just play differently and they should not be thought in a just Mag vs Stam vacuum same as not in a 1vs1 vacuum.

The truth is: a good Stam (any class) vs a good Mag (any class) can go either way, depending on skill loadout and if the other makes even a tiny mistake. Most such 1vs1 just end up in a tie after a 15 minutes when both decide that it was enough of trying and go their separate ways.

And yes yes, bgs full mag teams like 2x Magplar & 2x Msorc (with Matriarch) or 2x Magden can be a pain to deal with since so much cross-healing.

But, if full Stam team of bursty players that know how to CC+combo and access to Defiles (in extreme cases of enemy having a full healbot in healtank gear), both Minor and Major. FOTM Stamcro even as 2x of them can DESTROY full mag teams. Seen it and done it myself. I loved also when on same team happened to get a StamDK that used the Shifting Standard and Stamsorc with a Negate.

I LOVE Stamsorcs who have Negate on their back bar. And then they use it at just the right moment and Streak through the enemy Mag team instantly when its down. It gives such warmness in the uhh.. middle zone of my body when that alone can with help of others in the burst attack at same time melt the entire enemy Mag team (or stam/mag mix, their healbots gone then, so are the rest of them). It is getting hot in here even when i think about those moments when it all clicks perfectly. I go check if i have any icecream..



PS. I always keep Negate on my Stamsorc (and Msorc too), while it not always helps you on some 1vs1 scenarios or at the open fields of Cyro (sweetness on inner keeps and breaches though, and flag games and Deathmatches at bgs when used in certain tight hot spots), and takes away something like Atronach or Psijic ulti Minor Prot slotted benefit from defensive bar.. but, it is ALWAYS worth it imo. Funny fact, in Cyrodiil often hear things "am i the only sorc with Negates??!" when people try to deal with certain groups. Too many sorcs (both specs) not slot it, sadly. I know there are reasons for it. But, i still rather use it and sacrifice the other thing for it. Because even on current situation and with ballgroup gear/setup/realities.. it can be often a game changer that ends the battle short in your favor. So slot it dear Stamsorcs (and Mag too) if feel like wanna end battles. Just using it at the right time/place is the key, and challenging for many until experienced so can pre-emptively already know where enemy team gonna move next and so on and if see others ready for such. No use to put it down when there are only some Snipe/la pew pew as your "team" and 1 dude shooting with Iceball treb.

Koensol

Iskiab wrote: »

Koensol wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

There was another person claimin the otherwise that stam > magicka

I think they are quite equal, just plays and built differently

That was Thogard who made that thread right before the patch, apparently he changed his mind and now he thinks mag > stam.

The last time Thogard made a thread was back in september. He's not an idiot, he knows mag has been better than stam for group play since they changed the healing like 3 patches ago. You love giving your opinion about everything, but the fact of the matter is you don't know what you're talking about more often than not. Stop posting and let more knowledgeable players answer the questions.

I always get a kick out of people who think so black and white. I'll stop answering when people stop giving bad answers.

For some reason even when I'm going winning 80%+ of my BGs there are always people telling me I'm wrong who're on the losing end. Maybe it's time to look in the mirror.

You get a kick out of people who think black and white, yet you feel you can decide what are good/bad answers, as if thats not black and white... There is a fine line between false or correct and opinion/theory.

I see you all the time on the forums sharing theories as facts and making predictions about upcoming patches, and basing them on anecdotal evidence or solely your own experience: "class X isn't good because I don't see a lot of them in BGs". Or: "stamblade isn't good solo open world, because I never saw one do well". Sometimes you even dismiss an entire class based on a single ability which YOU think is trash. Speaking of black and white again...

Unless you can back it up with actual facts and not anecdotal evidence or personal experience, it is your opinion/pov and it might just be you who ends up being wrong. Your post applies 100% to yourself, but it's funny how you think you are above that somehow.

You say that like I’ve been wrong. ‘My theories’ about upcoming patches have usually been right.

Called magplar being strong when people said they were weak, called magblade being weak, called stamblade being weak, called MagWarden being good.

A LOT of people on the forums don’t play enough and have outdated opinions. They hold those opinions and keep spouting them long after the game has changed. As someone who is still playing, of course I’m going to disagree with people who’s opinion is outdated. Add in all the try hards who just parrot others instead of playing/trying different things and it’s hard not to disagree with most of what’s written.

Not going into a debate about whether or not you were wrong or right. Thats not the point. The point here is, you post things as fact which aren't facts and then call others who don't agree with your views as "people who don't adapt", thereby already labeling your opinion as the standard that others are judged by. Just show a bit more nuance in your posts and people might actually take them seriously. I am not bashing or w/e, but your tone and the way you assume yourself as the authority on a number of subjects just reeks of narcissism. Anyway, made my point. I'll stop derailing this thread now.

Koensol

Commandment wrote: »

Koensol wrote: »

@Commandment So lets see, you joined about a month ago and have already made multiple silly posts. This one also is just literally filled with misinformation, false assumptions and l2p issues. Maybe get a firm grasp on the game first before making absolute statements as you do in the OP. And make sure to l2p on both mag and stam, as you will see the lunacy in your post.

You do realize that forums doesnt account for how long you play right? Based on your stupidity, I can assume you have no valid opinion. If thats how your reasoning goes, then be my guest.

If you read anything, I said I play magicka, and I'm rolling on people, just like I'de roll on you.

So instead of saying L2P, how about you L2R if you dont understand that R, it means read. Oh and yes OBVIOUSLY I exaggerated the potential of magicka, ITS HUMOR!!!!! DERRRRRRPPPPPP GERRRR HERRRRRRRPPPPP... I guess snow flakes don't see that.

Already clarified what I meant in a later post. But tbh, I have my doubts that you actually play magicka on a regular basis if you post things like "On mag you have stam for days to break free and dodge, because you don't need it for damage". Every mag player that isn't talking out of his ass will admit that stam management is actually a very important factor in how to play a mag build. Especially in no CP it can be a challenge and especially when solo. Yes, you don't need stam for damage, but your pool will also be a lot smaller than on a stamina builds, plus lower recoveries/cost reduction. That point alone shows you didnt really think about what you were posting.

Also, humor? Thats a lame cop-out if I ever heard one. Why would you purposefully weaken your argument with "humor" when you could have actually tried to make valid points? Your entire OP is just overexaggerated CAPS LOCK statements that don't hold any actual substance, and more often than not aren't even backed up with examples. You just shout things and expect others to believe you? Lol.

[Deleted User]

Hello everyone,

With this thread derailing from all sides with flaming and baiting, we're going to go ahead and close it down. For future posts be sure to stay constructive and respectful with the Forum Rules in mind to avoid thread derailment or action on one's own account.

Thank you for understanding.