Update 25 Combat Adjustments

Faunter

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

The last time there was a leak of patch notes, ZOS claimed that they were fake, yet they turned out to be accurate. So we are understandably skeptical of any claim that the latest leak is "fake", and the points brought up in this overview seems to suggest that ZOS may be lying yet again with these claims that they are "fake".

The patch notes haven't been sent to anyone to leak out. Anything you're seeing that discuss them are fake, because nobody except me has them currently.

Does the patch note game still exist? The one where you give us a sneak peek with a small one

Shantu

Good to see that sustain issues created by the overkill in AOE costs are being addressed. I'm hoping that "a revised standard between Single Target DoTs and AE DoTs" will translate to a boost in DOT damage. Currently, unless used for secondary affects like returning health or resources, their damage offers no benefit over a couple of spammables that take up less than 20% of the DOT damage time.

I heartily encourage the reevaluation of sustain issues introduced in U24. Of course, one should not be able to abuse the combat system by spamming higher costing AOE skills, but one should be able to adequately sustain with a thoughtful rotation and gear setup without fighting the system itself. Few things suck the joy out of combat more than watching your resources fall away simply because you have a couple of AOE skills in a standard rotation.

After being smacked with all the nerfs and higher skill costs via U24, I'm hoping some refinement will bring back some of the joy in a potentially terrific combat system.

Sandman929

Frankly the fact that ZOS can say anything without mentioning stuck in combat is kind of insulting. So many persistent bugs that we're just supposed to consider the norm now.
AoE smart healing, zergs all healing each other...tackle that seriously and stop dinking around with the high server stress of blocking

xaraan

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

The last time there was a leak of patch notes, ZOS claimed that they were fake, yet they turned out to be accurate. So we are understandably skeptical of any claim that the latest leak is "fake", and the points brought up in this overview seems to suggest that ZOS may be lying yet again with these claims that they are "fake".

The patch notes haven't been sent to anyone to leak out. Anything you're seeing that discuss them are fake, because nobody except me has them currently.

You should leak them to us Gina.

Valykc

I

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

The last time there was a leak of patch notes, ZOS claimed that they were fake, yet they turned out to be accurate. So we are understandably skeptical of any claim that the latest leak is "fake", and the points brought up in this overview seems to suggest that ZOS may be lying yet again with these claims that they are "fake".

The patch notes haven't been sent to anyone to leak out. Anything you're seeing that discuss them are fake, because nobody except me has them currently.

You can share them with me and I’ll give you a sweet roll! @ZOS_GinaBruno

I’d also like to see some animation buffs with light and heavy attacks sometime in the future, two handed specifically

Neoauspex

Too many grammar errors in those fake patch notes, Gina would never allow that.

Tannus15

@Captain_Slaymore I'm pretty sure ZoS are looking at what's actually lagging their servers, not what's lagging your client.

If a significant chunk of the server processing is been taken up with most people on the server doing some sort of block constantly then that's worth fixing, even though we might not individually see it as an issue on our end.

FWIW looking over ESOLogs it's not uncommon to see healers literally blocking weaving every single skill.

ZOS_GinaBruno

frozywozy wrote: »

When are we going to see an acknowledgement of the memory leak and an ongoing fix?

We actually have a fix for a memory leak in this week’s PC incremental patch.

nafensoriel

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

The last time there was a leak of patch notes, ZOS claimed that they were fake, yet they turned out to be accurate. So we are understandably skeptical of any claim that the latest leak is "fake", and the points brought up in this overview seems to suggest that ZOS may be lying yet again with these claims that they are "fake".

The patch notes haven't been sent to anyone to leak out. Anything you're seeing that discuss them are fake, because nobody except me has them currently.

This one is curious if you are open to... let us say gifts.
I could provide much coffee, pizza, and kittens for access to nachpotes

(no I'm not being serious I just couldn't help myself)

provkinse

When will you do another skill lines for mages (Weapons). They have just 1 instead 3 for stamina. I like in Skyrim it was like schools of destruction and so on...
I hope in future DLC we will go in Winterhold College when we get new skill lines and at last PvP will be balanced.

Turelus

Sounds good, interested in seeing the set tweaks.

Qbiken

Turelus wrote: »

Sounds good, interested in seeing the set tweaks.

How much do you all want to bet that ZOS will nerf Bloodspawn?

relentless_turnip

Qbiken wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Sounds good, interested in seeing the set tweaks.

How much do you all want to bet that ZOS will nerf Bloodspawn?

I don't use BS but I don't see them doing this... as it doesn't directly damage the enemy I imagine it would be better to change other monster sets to create competitive choices. A lot need changing not buffing as there are so many damage monster sets that just add you bonus proc damage. It would be nice if there were more sets that passively increase your damage potential or other elements of your build.

susmitds

What about the NB class identity update?

Elsonso

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

The last time there was a leak of patch notes, ZOS claimed that they were fake, yet they turned out to be accurate. So we are understandably skeptical of any claim that the latest leak is "fake", and the points brought up in this overview seems to suggest that ZOS may be lying yet again with these claims that they are "fake".

The patch notes haven't been sent to anyone to leak out. Anything you're seeing that discuss them are fake, because nobody except me has them currently.

Oooh. That is confirmation that we are really close to having U25 on PTS...

Strider__Roshin

susmitds wrote: »

What about the NB class identity update?

NB identity is to remain invisible. I'd argue that their identity has never been more fulfilled lol.

haelene

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

While making these fixes, many of the item sets affected have also been updated to fall in line with our item set or ability standards to ensure their overall power remains closer to their intended design.

This makes me very nervous. Any time things are "updated to fall in line" it just means a hefty nerf that actually just makes things worse than the things that weren't touched and not "in line with".

As for the rest, glad to see sustain getting another look, especially as a mag Dps main. I don't know how I feel about the block changes just yet, I'll have to see it in action on the pts.

Edit : fixed auto correct mistakes

technohic

I honestly dont care about what they do for balance so long as performance truly gets fixed. I'd be willing to try anything they do at that point with an open mind as I think this game could be great if Cyrodiil functioned well. Problem is; I expect more nerfs and the same server lag.

Rehdaun

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

Finally, we are addressing Magicka/Stamina sustain, especially in encounters where longer fights or prolonged damage in specific areas are required. With that in mind, we are reducing the cost of Area of Effect Damage over Time (AE DoT) abilities to reduce the pressure on your Magicka/Stamina while utilizing a rotation involving an AE DoT. This does result in a revised standard between Single Target DoTs and AE DoTs which we will be evaluating with the live game and on the PTS.

Why do I get the feeling that they aren't telling us the full story? So, what's getting nerfed? My bet is single target dots and spamables. Both will do less damage while keeping the same cost, while aoe dots get a cost reduction.

On a positive note, first time in long time a specific class wasn't called out. Everyone knows it's a guaranteed nerf when that happens.

KappaKid83

Trying to fix server performance by "fixing" how skills work seems great and all but it doesn't really address the core issue, the SERVER. There has to be a point where someone in charge says "Ya know what, lets improve these servers" instead of these constant band aid fixes to skills and passives and sets etc.

Anhedonie

Please rework BlastBones. This skill is terrible in design, unresponsive and bugged to oblivion.

ZOS_Volpe

Greetings

We've removed some comments as they were non-constructive or supported spreading misinformation. As stated by Gina, these patch notes are fake.

Please make sure to keep commentary constructive and adhere to our community rules.

Thank you for your understanding

nafensoriel

KappaKid83 wrote: »

Trying to fix server performance by "fixing" how skills work seems great and all but it doesn't really address the core issue, the SERVER. There has to be a point where someone in charge says "Ya know what, lets improve these servers" instead of these constant band aid fixes to skills and passives and sets etc.

Except its already been said many times the servers are not the issue the software running on them is.
Hardware upgrades don't do what you think they do. Adding more VMs doesn't increase performance past a certain point.

They are fixing the problem. The problem is their software. They could run ESO on tranquility3(the most powerful gaming server on the planet) and still have exactly the same problems they are having because it has nothing whatsoever to do with the hardware.

So far all their code refactors that have been released have been night and day improvements to the game as a whole. I expect this will again be a night and day improvement.

redgreensunset

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

When are we going to see an acknowledgement of the memory leak and an ongoing fix?

We actually have a fix for a memory leak in this week’s PC incremental patch.

This is much appreciated.

Lorkhan

BohnT2 wrote: »

I too like playing an overly tanky patch that's fueled by overperforming defensive options while also supporting an overtuned offensive skill in accelerating drain.

This!!!! @ZOS_BrianWheeler CMON MAN!!!!

Thevampirenight

[removed quote]

[removed for misinformation]

Instead of shutting players out of the process and forcing certain players under an nda for this type of thing that should be for the entire player base to help out on. This shows they only are wanting to go so far with it. They want to do it themselves and want to do what they want to do instead of listening to feed back or looking for it they do it in a passive manner that really isn't beneficial at all. The communication is a big issue still on the combat part and passives part. They need to be more hands on and more active on the forums on these issues.. I do think they fear players abusing things to the point content they made not to be easy is made easy I think this is the prime focus on their part in some of the changes that the do. Performance is a big thing this time because they have not choice if they want to keep the game running for many many years to come they know that. So they are working on it and making these changes to fix that problem they are having with it. The good thing is they are keeping players in the loop on this issue. Even if its not with the combat they are with the performance. With the combat I think the main issue is trying to not upset the community in some cases but not always since it does seem to upset the community when they do something major that really hurts their ingame builds.

What should be under Nda, Storyline content dlc content, other stuff like that. Combat not so much that shouldn't be fully under Nda protection unless its a new skilline or class then I understand it for that reason.

Combat should be openly discussed. Where they take our feed back communicate on that feed back and try to see what can be done about issues openly and not behind closed doors. Threads like this one should be placed more often here and also where they place in changes like what they want to reduce or nerf or even fix or buff. Players should be able to give feed back up to a point for a limited time in a constructive manner then they close the thread and make another for another issue. They don't need to do this for everything just the big stuff that would be very important for them to discus stuff with us about.

Say like important abilties player need to use for their builds and the Changes they want to do with them and the reasons why. Like for example the changes to healing springs like you can only have one of them that happened during one of the patches that would have been something they could have openly communicated with the player base on before official release on any patch notes or making their minds on it. Stuff like that will help build up trust and make the community better along with the game everyone won't get what they want of course but at least they would know before they make these decisions what the player bases mind is on it. That is what I hope they will at least do in the future. Interact with their player base get to know their player base give feed back of their own on certain things. Telling them no that isn't feasible or yes that is something we can look into. That is the type of communication that should be applied here.

hobicabobjob

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

Hello all!
Block is an ability that everyone can use at any time, which means it can create a lot of traffic for the server to handle.

Can we just disable block in Cyrodiil please?

nafensoriel

hobicabobjob wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

Hello all!
Block is an ability that everyone can use at any time, which means it can create a lot of traffic for the server to handle.

Can we just disable block in Cyrodiil please?

You want to randomly die before your character even registers the damage?
Bombers would absolutely love this.

Starlock

Some thoughts:

• You mention abilities will still fire when block cancelled. Is changing this something you now have the ability to do? That abilities still fire when block cancelled is easily the most bizarre thing to me about this game. I understand some players consider it a mainstay, but I for one wouldn't shed any tears if it went away entirely. Perhaps something best reserved for an ESO2 if that's on the horizon as there'd be less of a whinefest to do this in a new game.
• I look forward to AoE DoTs not being ridiculously expensive for my poor lightning mage. That said, I still deeply miss him actually having a real choice between utility (a stun) and damage on Destructive Clench. The stun on that ability really, really needs to come back. There's currently no utility to lightning staff Destructive Clench and I doubt that was intended; instead it's just a weak Impulse.
• The retooling and standardizing of proc sets makes me nervous. I don't doubt it'll bring some good things, but as some of my character concepts hinge heavily on their choice of proc sets to flesh out their design, well... I'm just really hoping it doesn't break my character designs. On the upshot, standardizing proc set conditions will be incredibly useful because right now it's about as clear as mud. Does this mean Morkuldin might actually work again?

Casterial

Starlock wrote: »

Some thoughts:

• You mention abilities will still fire when block cancelled. Is changing this something you now have the ability to do? That abilities still fire when block cancelled is easily the most bizarre thing to me about this game. I understand some players consider it a mainstay, but I for one wouldn't shed any tears if it went away entirely. Perhaps something best reserved for an ESO2 if that's on the horizon as there'd be less of a whinefest to do this in a new game.

ESO would be too slow for its fast paced combat. Block Cancel at some point became a "Skill Ceiling" and it is even taught in tutorials. Removing this would just make pvp even more dull.