We are currently investigating issues some players are having on the megaservers. We will update as new information becomes available.
We are currently investigating issues some players are having with the ESO Store and Account System. We will update as new information becomes available.
In response to the ongoing issue, the North American and European megaservers are currently unavailable while we perform maintenance.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/8235739/
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/8235739/
In response to the ongoing issue, the ESO Store and Account System have been taken offline for maintenance.
how do you think pvp would play if healing was gutted to near useless?
-
StShoot✭✭✭✭As long as ZOS keep selfhealing somewhat untouched I think it can be ok to SLIGHTLY reduce the amount of cross-healing that you can do. But knowing ZOS they'll most likely go with 50-70% reduced healing for literally everything because oUr StAnDaRdS.
THAT, exactly that.
I think fengrush had an interesting idea, when he streamed the last patchnotes. Just prevent crosshealing outside from groups and cap the group size to 12 (maybe 16).
This would have the consequence that we see a larger amount of "small" groups instead of one mega sized zerg. And maybe it would even encourage them to spread out on the map instead of steamroling the same keeps/outposts over and over (ales->bleak->Chal/ash->nikel->Roe/AlEsSiA BrIdGe)
Maybe it would even help with the lag, if the server doesnt have to figure out the target for 30 rapid generations and 20 vigors.1 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭ThePhantomThorn wrote: »Well, we will find out. Because heals are pretty strong now, and we see a lot of babies crying about that, so in order to please these babies and save the game, they (ZOS) will blindly cut down healing abilities by about - well let's say the usual percentage, some 40-70% I guess?
Nothing is ever done gradually in this game. So expect some "healing nerf" update soon, where healing will be but a memory.
us babies, happen to be trying to balance the game. healing is (imo) too strong atm. so strong in fact that i quit cp pvp. no cp is much better. less heal crits.
Actually, from a quick pass through the forums, everything is too strong...healing, vampire drain, tanks, snipe, sorcs (always), templars, proc sets, harmony traits, damage shields, block, DK leap, magcros (wth?)...It is not about balance with that many people complaining about that many different things.
Healing will get nerfed about the same percentage as DOTs were nerfed around 40-60% across the board.
In open world PVP, healers will be just as powerful as before, groups will just carry more of them, but ranged mag sorcs and stamblades will be really strong. People will complain about whatever floats to the top of the next meta just like they always do.
Maybe. You can usually tell what will be OP from the patch notes, you don’t even need to log in. If there’s something coming up soon for the next expansion notes might be up soon.
I’m pretty sure there will be something soon too. The whininess is up which coincides with PTS notes.
The funny part is that some things have been TRULY overpowered, and everyone stated so during PTS and the dev's go live anyway. Rune Cage, the DoT buffs, Sloads, are examples.
I still expect we get a radical nerf to healing next PTS, which may balanced for and work in no-CP kindergartens where complexity and group size are hard capped, but will actually make zergs more powerful in AvA (more healers), and will make some burst classes even stronger. As always there will be the unintended consequences of the nerfs that make The Next Thing powerful.
I think we might also see mitigation/defense nerfs and some continued nerfing of targeted CC. I'm less confident of that than the healing nerfs which they pretty much telegraphed in the PTS.
Sometimes it’s the nerfing during PTS that makes things powerful or underpowered.
PTS introduces a set that cleanses dots -> players whine on PTS about the set so it’s changed -> goes live and players whine about dots
Healing ward has a strong hot -> players whine on PTS -> Magblade suffers from weak self healing
Stuff like that. Some things like dizzy they were having problems with and even the patch notes said it’d be OP when it went live and it was. Sometimes there are things classes need and other classes pile on to make sure they never happen. Sometimes it’s stuff like anti-Zerg tools like time stop where the cost goes up so only groups can afford it, this one I really don’t get... you mean people can use abilities against me too?
Some players just give crappy suggestions/complaints and are the catalyst for their own undoing. Need more constructive responses then ‘Buff if I use it, nerf if I don’t use it’.Edited by Iskiab on December 30, 2019 2:55AMLooking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten0 -
Major_Lag✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Be careful what you wish for.(...) Just prevent crosshealing outside from groups and cap the group size to 12 (maybe 16).
This would have the consequence that we see a larger amount of "small" ball groups instead of one mega sized zerg. And maybe it would even encourage them to spread out stack up on the map instead of steamroling the same keeps/outposts over and over (ales->bleak->Chal/ash->nikel->Roe/AlEsSiA BrIdGe)
Because in nerfing zergs, that would be a huge buff to ballgroups.
Let's take a closer look at what and how would that change:- Random "pugs" from their own faction would no longer siphon any heals away from ballgroups. This is a buff to ballgroups.
- Such a healing change would nerf zonechat LFG groups to some degree. Indirectly, this is a buff to ballgroups, since not-very-organized groups would be even less able to compete with ballgroups than they are already (regardless of any numerical advantage they might have).
- It would also nerf faction stacks in general. Again, indirectly buffing ballgroups by weakening their opposition.
- Nothing changes for ballgroup healing or purging.
- Nothing changes for ballgroup vs ballgroup combat.
- Nothing changes re. ballgroup sizes: most of the highly organized groups already run numbers of 10-16 players at most, because of coordination issues and worsening lag at larger sizes.
In the end, this would invariably result in a "ball up or die" meta, since poorly organized groups would have a hard time staying alive long enough to do anything useful. Cyrodiil in primetime would be populated by nothing but ballgroups.
And there would be no real alternative: not grouping wouldn't even be an option, since solo players can't even hope to put a dent in a highly organized group.
Cyrodiil's design already rewards (organized) grouping to a stupidly high degree, what with the broken OP Cleanse which makes it impossible to stick any DoTs or any other debuffs to a ballgroup.
You really don't want to be empowering them any further through what can best be described as very misguided nerfs.
There are many other ways to "fix" group healing to level the playing field and nerf healtank stacking. However, what you are proposing is a very poor and counterproductive way of accomplishing that.2 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The only issue with healing for me is that self healing is also a group healing at the same time with equal strenght and cost. That is an issue when heals are designed to find the target that needs healing the most automatically because at the end You can build for tank or DD role and be healer passively by mashing 1-2 buttons when it's needed while doing also lot of things usually associated with different roles.
In my opinion there should be some restrictions and separations for heals in the game to set apart self healing and group healing so people that wants to play as healers would have to start making choices and people who are playing as DDs or tanks woouldn't be able to hold their allies alive so easily.
What ability are you talking about? Or do you mean other people’s abilities.
I am talking about heals in general with most important being burst heals and strong HoTs.Edited by Juhasow on December 30, 2019 6:14AM1 -
StShoot✭✭✭✭
Be careful what you wish for.(...) Just prevent crosshealing outside from groups and cap the group size to 12 (maybe 16).
This would have the consequence that we see a larger amount of "small" ball groups instead of one mega sized zerg. And maybe it would even encourage them to spread out stack up on the map instead of steamroling the same keeps/outposts over and over (ales->bleak->Chal/ash->nikel->Roe/AlEsSiA BrIdGe)
Because in nerfing zergs, that would be a huge buff to ballgroups.
Let's take a closer look at what and how would that change:- Random "pugs" from their own faction would no longer siphon any heals away from ballgroups. This is a buff to ballgroups.
- Such a healing change would nerf zonechat LFG groups to some degree. Indirectly, this is a buff to ballgroups, since not-very-organized groups would be even less able to compete with ballgroups than they are already (regardless of any numerical advantage they might have).
- It would also nerf faction stacks in general. Again, indirectly buffing ballgroups by weakening their opposition.
- Nothing changes for ballgroup healing or purging.
- Nothing changes for ballgroup vs ballgroup combat.
- Nothing changes re. ballgroup sizes: most of the highly organized groups already run numbers of 10-16 players at most, because of coordination issues and worsening lag at larger sizes.
In the end, this would invariably result in a "ball up or die" meta, since poorly organized groups would have a hard time staying alive long enough to do anything useful. Cyrodiil in primetime would be populated by nothing but ballgroups.
And there would be no real alternative: not grouping wouldn't even be an option, since solo players can't even hope to put a dent in a highly organized group.
Cyrodiil's design already rewards (organized) grouping to a stupidly high degree, what with the broken OP Cleanse which makes it impossible to stick any DoTs or any other debuffs to a ballgroup.
You really don't want to be empowering them any further through what can best be described as very misguided nerfs.
There are many other ways to "fix" group healing to level the playing field and nerf healtank stacking. However, what you are proposing is a very poor and counterproductive way of accomplishing that.
Tbh what do i care about ballgroups ? this is a problem that needs to be resolved in another way (maybe reducing aoe dmg while in a group ?, or even nerfing synergies), as it stands now good ballgroups rule cyro and an zerg can try to kill them with twice or even more player and will fail. the picking order in cyrodiil is 1/smallscale players <Zerg<ballgroups.
But i dont get you argument you say that you are against nerfing the zerg because it would make ballgroups to strong. But thats exactly the way solo or smallscale players feel these days zerg up or die to a zerg. On the otherhand organized Zergs (ballgroups) keep eating the unorganized zerg. And i dont want to say that a solo player should be able to take out a zerg, that would be bad ballancing, my point is that its way to easy for zergs AND ballgroups to heal up their group.
Could you pls mention some of the ways to ballance healing ? because most forumwarriors who are crying in the forum just want healing nerfed. And most of the interesting ideas would also favor ballgroups, because thats just how cyro is build these days: organized groups have an easyer time to adapt.
Moreover stretching players out on the map WOULD help decreasing the effectiveness: less players on one spot->less ap/rewards-> less reasons to form a ballgroup
0 -
Fur_like_snow✭✭✭✭✭
✭How about only allowing a player to have two copies of a HoT active at a time, one cast by the player and another from a group member. That would cut down on redundant healing and server calculations.1 -
Major_Lag✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Sure enough, here you go:(...) And i dont want to say that a solo player should be able to take out a zerg, that would be bad ballancing, my point is that its way to easy for zergs AND ballgroups to heal up their group.
Could you pls mention some of the ways to ballance healing ? because most forumwarriors who are crying in the forum just want healing nerfed. And most of the interesting ideas would also favor ballgroups, because thats just how cyro is build these days: organized groups have an easyer time to adapt.Some broad ideas:- reduce outgoing (cross) heals proportionally to the caster's damage resistances, thus forcing healers to build maximally squishy to maximize group healing effectiveness - OR making a compromise in being more tanky but significantly less effective at healing their group,
- (exponentially) reduce effectiveness of every additional active cross healing effect on players by X% relative to the previous one (thus making "blob stacking" of more than 2-3 healers increasingly inefficient),
- reduce healing done, and particularly cross healing done, when blocking (IN PvP ONLY = via battle spirit)
IMO, any changes to group healing should be done in such a way as to make the PvP healer role more interesting and involving actual compromises on the build and gameplay level - instead of the current "build tanky AF, spam group heals left and right, blockcast burst heals when focused" approach which seems to be quite prevalent nowadays.
You know a game has a serious balancing problem, when the most optimal approach for dealing with enemy groups is to focus their DDs first, since focusing the healtanks first is rather counterproductive in the current meta.
Oops, ZOS didn't get the memo... and now we have the hammer which does the exact opposite thingMoreover stretching players out on the map WOULD help decreasing the effectiveness: less players on one spot->less ap/rewards-> less reasons to form a ballgroup
HoT's aren't the (main) problem in ballgroups, they get a substantial share of their insane healing from PBAoE direct heals and the Cleanse %HP heal. With another significant chunk coming from ground placed AoE HoTs.Fur_like_snow wrote: »How about only allowing a player to have two copies of a HoT active at a time, one cast by the player and another from a group member. That would cut down on redundant healing and server calculations.
Player applied HoTs like Vigor or Regeneration only account for a fraction of the healing done in ballgroups. Nerfing those would, ironically, affect smaller and/or less organized groups far more heavily than it would affect the ballgroups.Edited by Major_Lag on December 31, 2019 4:03AM3 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
Sure enough, here you go:(...) And i dont want to say that a solo player should be able to take out a zerg, that would be bad ballancing, my point is that its way to easy for zergs AND ballgroups to heal up their group.
Could you pls mention some of the ways to ballance healing ? because most forumwarriors who are crying in the forum just want healing nerfed. And most of the interesting ideas would also favor ballgroups, because thats just how cyro is build these days: organized groups have an easyer time to adapt.Some broad ideas:- reduce outgoing (cross) heals proportionally to the caster's damage resistances, thus forcing healers to build maximally squishy to maximize group healing effectiveness - OR making a compromise in being more tanky but significantly less effective at healing their group,
- (exponentially) reduce effectiveness of every additional active cross healing effect on players by X% relative to the previous one (thus making "blob stacking" of more than 2-3 healers increasingly inefficient),
- reduce healing done, and particularly cross healing done, when blocking (IN PvP ONLY = via battle spirit)
IMO, any changes to group healing should be done in such a way as to make the PvP healer role more interesting and involving actual compromises on the build and gameplay level - instead of the current "build tanky AF, spam group heals left and right, blockcast burst heals when focused" approach which seems to be quite prevalent nowadays.
You know a game has a serious balancing problem, when the most optimal approach for dealing with enemy groups is to focus their DDs first, since focusing the healtanks first is rather counterproductive in the current meta.
Oops, ZOS didn't get the memo... and now we have the hammer which does the exact opposite thingMoreover stretching players out on the map WOULD help decreasing the effectiveness: less players on one spot->less ap/rewards-> less reasons to form a ballgroup
HoT's aren't the (main) problem in ballgroups, they get a substantial share of their insane healing from PBAoE direct heals and the Cleanse %HP heal. With another significant chunk coming from ground placed AoE HoTs.Fur_like_snow wrote: »How about only allowing a player to have two copies of a HoT active at a time, one cast by the player and another from a group member. That would cut down on redundant healing and server calculations.
Player applied HoTs like Vigor or Regeneration only account for a fraction of the healing done in ballgroups. Nerfing those would, ironically, affect smaller and/or less organized groups far more heavily than it would affect the ballgroups.
Pretty much, except Stamwarden healers use echoing vigor as one of their main tools for healing.
Ground based hots also suck, a good ball group never stops moving.
Edit - thinking about it except thicket in certain builds (but is still debatable), ritual is good because of the synergy, and refreshing path gets used because NBs lack other tools.Edited by Iskiab on December 31, 2019 4:36AMLooking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten0 -
relentless_turnip✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I agree with the majority... Self healing isn't so much of an issue, though I wouldn't be upset if they tweeked it. Regarding organised PvP it can be a bit of a nightmare... I think this is even apparent when you end up in a BG with premades with 2 healers and 2 DPS.
1