Is dragon leap so versitale, that in any situation the user is at a advantage?

oXI_Viper_IXo

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

I play at a high level in the game

Just curious, what do you consider to be a high level? Your posts certainly lead one to believe quite the opposite.

Sanguinor2

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

I dont agree with the logic that a stun is needed on a gap closer. There are plenty of stuns in the game that are devastating to use in combo with a gap closer. A stun on a gap closer simple lowers reaction time and provides to much advantage as we as bar space to the user. Also this topic is on the advantage upon use of a dk ultimate and if there is a situation in which a dk is not positive advantage on use.

So ults are supposed to put you at a disadvantage? Or why is it bad that using leap is an Advantage? Come to think of it, which ult is not an Advantage when you use it?

azjuwelz

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

I dont agree with the logic that a stun is needed on a gap closer. There are plenty of stuns in the game that are devastating to use in combo with a gap closer. A stun on a gap closer simple lowers reaction time and provides to much advantage as we as bar space to the user. Also this topic is on the advantage upon use of a dk ultimate and if there is a situation in which a dk is not positive advantage on use.

So ults are supposed to put you at a disadvantage? Or why is it bad that using leap is an Advantage? Come to think of it, which ult is not an Advantage when you use it?

The "new and improved" Incapacitating Strike. (/sarcasm)

OP, not sure if you were around then, but that Ult used to stun as well, with only 70k cost, which is why ZOS nerfed it. And I've noticed they've been on a trend of nerfing class ultimates lately, so yeah, this is why these discussions aren't popular.

Back on topic, I've started playing StamDK, and so far in pvp it's a struggle to get the Ult needed to even consider the Leap. Having no class execute really bites. So I agree--play the class, and THEN discuss if something is actually OP or not.

Joy_Division

Legit confused about the title.

Like if I use an ultimate, I should be at a disadvantage?

Dk leap used to have an even longer range and even enabled a user to jump on a castle wall, and we managed just fine with fighting against it.

Abyssmol

The OP is a sorc that likes to play from far and does not like to get CC from a gap closer; so he could streak away CC you in the process and continue the fight from a distance...

ZarkingFrued

Oh boy here comes the next nerf thread. You guys can have this game. Any suggestions on something better to play?

ZarkingFrued

Dragon leap is NOT the best ult in the game. Dragon leap is NOT overperforming. You are underperforming. DKS deserve a decent Ulti, and honestly on Mag the damage is lacking. ONSLAUGHT is the best ulti in the game hands down for every single class.

Joy_Division

ZarkingFrued wrote: »

You are underperforming.

Going to quote this in every nerf thread that claims anything is overperforming from now on. 😆

TrinityBreaker

Joy_Division wrote: »

ZarkingFrued wrote: »

You are underperforming.

Going to quote this in every nerf thread that claims anything is overperforming from now on. 😆

Saaaaaame

Nord_Raseri

Joy_Division wrote: »

Legit confused about the title.

Like if I use an ultimate, I should be at a disadvantage?

Dk leap used to have an even longer range and even enabled a user to jump on a castle wall, and we managed just fine with fighting against it.

I miss the days of DKs and werewolves leaping onto a castle wall during siege. Both as attacker and defender. Watching people leaping up and some of them getting javelin or dizzy swing and fall back off.Made fights very entertaining.

Wyrd88

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

I would like to see counter play that is on par with this skill and the stun removed from this ultimate or because this skill player lock at a far distance. A 3 sec q like meteor. That the leap is coming.

Joy_Division wrote: »

Like if I use an ultimate, I should be at a disadvantage?

Just imagine 3 seconds cast time on Leap lol

robpr

Nord_Raseri wrote: »

I miss the days of DKs and werewolves leaping onto a castle wall during siege. Both as attacker and defender. Watching people leaping up and some of them getting javelin or dizzy swing and fall back off.Made fights very entertaining.

So sad its gone, along with NB telly strike. Only joy when crowd scatters when you drop Storm Atro on top of the wall remain.

Fur_like_snow

Leap is not OP. It has counterplay from blocking. On my stam sorc if I time it right I can streak while the DK is mid flight and he will land 15m behind me dealing no damage no stun and a wasted ult.

JumpmanLane

Fur_like_snow wrote: »

Leap is not OP. It has counterplay from blocking. On my stam sorc if I time it right I can streak while the DK is mid flight and he will land 15m behind me dealing no damage no stun and a wasted ult.

I’ve actually seen that happen lol. WHILE the guy has a Fossilize on him. Lol.

ketsparrowhawk

Incap has already been ruined. Please leave this beautiful ult alone.

I’m guessing you don’t have any DK chars? Can’t imagine you’d draw this conclusion if you did.

NBrookus

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Fur_like_snow wrote: »

Leap is not OP. It has counterplay from blocking. On my stam sorc if I time it right I can streak while the DK is mid flight and he will land 15m behind me dealing no damage no stun and a wasted ult.

I’ve actually seen that happen lol. WHILE the guy has a Fossilize on him. Lol.

I know it's a latency thing but watching a sorc streak while Fossilized is frustrating a(and funny).

Xvorg

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

Leap pros and cons please explain them.

Pros
-High dmg
-relatively low cost
-It can be comboed

Cons
-easy to counter
-the amount of resources give back through BR are meaningless
-It is used as ultimate so BR itself is pointless (resources given back when you don't need them)
-the most bugged ulti in the game hands down
-hard to combine it with a CC unless you are less than 10 mts from your enemy (and in that case there are much better options such as OS or EotS)

phoenixkungfu

Xvorg wrote: »

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

Leap pros and cons please explain them.

Pros
-High dmg
-relatively low cost
-It can be comboed

Cons
-easy to counter
-the amount of resources give back through BR are meaningless
-It is used as ultimate so BR itself is pointless (resources given back when you don't need them)
-the most bugged ulti in the game hands down
-hard to combine it with a CC unless you are less than 10 mts from your enemy (and in that case there are much better options such as OS or EotS)

Your pros and con should your bias alot. Your missing a ton of pros like it's a gap closer. Your cons are not valid in the topic and or really pros. Like when you said it gives resources back. The pro far far out ways the con and in any set up, any situation steals the turn during combat. The stun set this ultimate in a overload over preforming space, in my opinion

Sanguinor2

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

Your pros and con should your bias alot. Your missing a ton of pros like it's a gap closer. Your cons are not valid in the topic and or really pros. Like when you said it gives resources back. The pro far far out ways the con and in any set up, any situation steals the turn during combat. The stun set this ultimate in a overload over preforming space, in my opinion

Why shouldnt the pros outweigh the cons of you casting an ultimate? Why should it not Benefit you to cast your ult? Why should casting your ult put you at a disadvantage?
Care to answer this time?

Fur_like_snow

One issue with using leap is that the stun knocks enemies AWAY from the impact. This sometimes causes them to move out of danger when teams are timing ult dumps and aoe. If they really wanted to make leap OP they’d make the stun pull enemies into the impact zone rather than push them away.

Xvorg

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

A 3 sec q like meteor. That the leap is coming.

Ok, that's the worst suggestion ever

1. Travel time. Leap has a travel time unless you are in melee range. 3 secs + 1 sec travel time = 4 secs
2. If the objective moves away from the range, you end up with your wings open but no leap is done. A 3 secs cas time on leap = every DK looking like Batman
3. Why you just don't put a 3 secs cast time on every LA you throw with OL?
4. If you look carefully at what Leap does, you will see IT IS NOT A GAP CLOSER!!! IT IS A PROJECTILE in which the DK BECOMES THE PROJECTILE!!! If the target moves away, you can miss Leap. THAT DOESN'T HAPPEN WITH ANY GAP CLOSER!!! You will never miss with any gap close if you move away from the landing area.

Xvorg

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

Leap pros and cons please explain them.

Pros
-High dmg
-relatively low cost
-It can be comboed

Cons
-easy to counter
-the amount of resources give back through BR are meaningless
-It is used as ultimate so BR itself is pointless (resources given back when you don't need them)
-the most bugged ulti in the game hands down
-hard to combine it with a CC unless you are less than 10 mts from your enemy (and in that case there are much better options such as OS or EotS)

Your pros and con should your bias alot. Your missing a ton of pros like it's a gap closer. Your cons are not valid in the topic and or really pros. Like when you said it gives resources back. The pro far far out ways the con and in any set up, any situation steals the turn during combat. The stun set this ultimate in a overload over preforming space, in my opinion

OF COURSE IT IS BIASED!!! IT IS AN ULTIMATE...

U-L-T-I-M-A-T-E



I have no hacking idea of what's a versitale... a tale told in verse? Like a fable?

phoenixkungfu

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

Your pros and con should your bias alot. Your missing a ton of pros like it's a gap closer. Your cons are not valid in the topic and or really pros. Like when you said it gives resources back. The pro far far out ways the con and in any set up, any situation steals the turn during combat. The stun set this ultimate in a overload over preforming space, in my opinion

Why shouldnt the pros outweigh the cons of you casting an ultimate? Why should it not Benefit you to cast your ult? Why should casting your ult put you at a disadvantage?
Care to answer this time?

there should be a balance gameplay play where counter play to any and every ultimate that is viable. As it stand the positive nature of the one using dragon leap is not balance to the very small window of counter play. Also the stun mechanic in general is simply to much of a game breaking mechanic. As a gap closer that stuns. In my opinion

phoenixkungfu

As for the versatile nature of the ultimate upon use of the dragon leap you turn steal. With a force mechanic that drains your stam by stun or block. If a opponent had the dk user on the defense this ultimate act as a saving carry in defense situation where a dk should us a defense move to create, NEUTRAL(like fossilize). Instead this ultimate turns steal and give defense, healing and stun . in this situation leap is overloaded and provides to much high damage, tank utility and stun or stam drain. It's over preforming

TrinityBreaker

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

As for the versatile nature of the ultimate upon use of the dragon leap you turn steal. With a force mechanic that drains your stam by stun or block. If a opponent had the dk user on the defense this ultimate act as a saving carry in defense situation where a dk should us a defense move to create, NEUTRAL(like fossilize). Instead this ultimate turns steal and give defense, healing and stun . in this situation leap is overloaded and provides to much high damage, tank utility and stun or stam drain. It's over preforming

Bet, when ZOS removes stun from streak then we can talk about removing stun from Dragon Leap.

Kel

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

As for the versatile nature of the ultimate upon use of the dragon leap you turn steal. With a force mechanic that drains your stam by stun or block. If a opponent had the dk user on the defense this ultimate act as a saving carry in defense situation where a dk should us a defense move to create, NEUTRAL(like fossilize). Instead this ultimate turns steal and give defense, healing and stun . in this situation leap is overloaded and provides to much high damage, tank utility and stun or stam drain. It's over preforming

And I suppose you think meteor is just peachy, eh?
After all, you get resources and passives just for slotting it, and it also has a stun that needs to be blocked, draining stam.

Funny how comparable it is to leap, and yet you've not mentioned meteor at all. And you want to bring up balance? Seems leap is balanced against meteor just fine.

I main a sorc, and I'm telling you, this is ridiculous.
The only thing overperfoming at the moment is players who's ego can't take a L so they come on the forum crying for nerfs.

phoenixkungfu

Is dragon leap so versatile that in any situation the user is at a advantage? I explained before how to is true for dk. In terms of meter. Once upon a time meter had no q. No 3 sec to alert the player meter was cast on a player it was a nightmare to counter meter. Also casting a meter has a delay that provides no guarantee defense smell window of reaction time. It's always 3 sec. the dev have done a great job create a balance counter play to meter. In terms of dk leap. At a minimum I would like to see a q to show a leap is target lock on you.
HOWEVER, I SIMPLY BELIEVE GAP CLOSER SHOULD NEVER STUN.

TrinityBreaker

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

Is dragon leap so versatile that in any situation the user is at a advantage? I explained before how to is true for dk. In terms of meter. Once upon a time meter had no q. No 3 sec to alert the player meter was cast on a player it was a nightmare to counter meter. Also casting a meter has a delay that provides no guarantee defense smell window of reaction time. It's always 3 sec. the dev have done a great job create a balance counter play to meter. In terms of dk leap. At a minimum I would like to see a q to show a leap is target lock on you.
HOWEVER, I SIMPLY BELIEVE GAP CLOSER SHOULD NEVER STUN.

What. In the hell are you talking about,METEOR always had the visual queue for when it was coming and never was instant cast ultimate. So back to my first question, what in the hell you talking about.

phoenixkungfu

TrinityBreaker wrote: »

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

Is dragon leap so versatile that in any situation the user is at a advantage? I explained before how to is true for dk. In terms of meter. Once upon a time meter had no q. No 3 sec to alert the player meter was cast on a player it was a nightmare to counter meter. Also casting a meter has a delay that provides no guarantee defense smell window of reaction time. It's always 3 sec. the dev have done a great job create a balance counter play to meter. In terms of dk leap. At a minimum I would like to see a q to show a leap is target lock on you.
HOWEVER, I SIMPLY BELIEVE GAP CLOSER SHOULD NEVER STUN.

What. In the hell are you talking METEOR always had the visual aueue for when it was never instant cast ultimate. So back to my first question, what in the are you talking about.

I been waiting for this. Now imagine meter without a queue. Thats leap and even worse. For all the reasons stated before. Because
GAP CLOSER SHOULD NEVER STUN

juhislihis19

There is no way getting through OP's head, he's so biased towards his PetSorc. Look at his other threads.

I mean, you have sooo many non-DK's on this post telling him Leap is not overperforming, but he still doesn't get it. He keeps on blabbering about how Leap is primarily a gap-closer - and like an insane person, just repeats the same thing over and over again. When he's told that the ultimate is not used for gap-closing, because it's extremely unreliable for that, he ignores it and repeats the same mantra.

It was the same thing in the thread earlier.

To think of it, looking at how he constructs his posts, he might actually be Cadwell with that pot on his head.