Heavy armor in pvp
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Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
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Amazing.
What is amazing is the resistance some people have to the idea that toxicity in PvP actually affects the way people play the game.#CAREBEARMASTERRACE1 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Play in No-CP. There's no such thing as "Tank meta" there.
If you build as tanky as possible (in No-CP) you're going to be just that. A Tank. Your sustain is going to be garbage and you're gonna deal no damage whatsoever.
CPs are the reason the tank meta exists. It has nothing to do with heavy armor. Light and Medium Armor builds can surpass Heavy Armor survivability while still having great sustain and damage. Trying to balance CP PvP is futile.
Nothing as a "tank meta" in NO-CP........high mmr BG's would like a word with you1 -
geonsocal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭usmguy1234 wrote: »I guarantee you'd see a lot more glass cannon type builds in pvp if the game didn't run like hot garbage.
man, is this ever the sad truth...there are times when the game gets real "choppy" I'll spam heals and shields and just hope for the best...PVP Campaigns Section: Playstation NA and EU (Gray Host) - This Must be the Place2 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭usmguy1234 wrote: »I guarantee you'd see a lot more glass cannon type builds in pvp if the game didn't run like hot garbage.
This. If we could rely more on evasion and avoiding damage, we could build more into full damage glass canons, but when your defenses are shut down by server performance we have lots of HIGH RESISTANCE builds (it's bolded because tankiness in this game can be achieved in any type of armor).Say no to Toxic Casuals!
I am doing my best, but I am not a native speaker, sorry.
"Difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including A Realm Reborn-tier overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver&Gold as a "you think you do but you don't"-tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game." - @AlexanderDeLarge2 -
Pauls✭✭✭✭✭
So I tried to make such build on paper but it wasnt easily, guess there's one or two combos to reach these stats. And it makes sustain suffering, because we need all weapon damage buff sources.Ragnarock41 wrote: »You can easily reach these stats in no-cp. Sustain will suffer depending on class though.
As it was mentioned before, medium armor stamsorc with 28k resists, 6200 WPD, 1k hp regen, no bloodspawn. Looks like nord is only choice because of its racial bonus for resistance. Almost 28k res on front bar requires aegis, also need 2 pieces of resistance monster sets. 6200 weapon damage reached with fully buffed Fury and damage enchant proc. NMA is must have for damage but makes 1400 stam regen look pathetic.
And yeah, we use golden infused jewelry. Overall, this build has these stats (in short time window of maxed Fury + damage enchant) at cost of low stam pool, low hp pool, bad sustain. Doubtful that it will work well in openworld no-cp.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=194084
Could you give any advice on making this build better while keeping damage and resistance, or suggest any other, which is easily reached? Thanks.0 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭So I tried to make such build on paper but it wasnt easily, guess there's one or two combos to reach these stats. And it makes sustain suffering, because we need all weapon damage buff sources.
As it was mentioned before, medium armor stamsorc with 28k resists, 6200 WPD, 1k hp regen, no bloodspawn. Looks like nord is only choice because of its racial bonus for resistance. Almost 28k res on front bar requires aegis, also need 2 pieces of resistance monster sets. 6200 weapon damage reached with fully buffed Fury and damage enchant proc. NMA is must have for damage but makes 1400 stam regen look pathetic.
And yeah, we use golden infused jewelry. Overall, this build has these stats (in short time window of maxed Fury + damage enchant) at cost of low stam pool, low hp pool, bad sustain. Doubtful that it will work well in openworld no-cp.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=194084
Could you give any advice on making this build better while keeping damage and resistance, or suggest any other, which is easily reached? Thanks.
Chudan is redundant in this build. It wont stack with major resolve from hurricane. Replace it with Blood Spawn or Balorgh depending on which better suits you.
Oh you use 2 parts
Ok then, but I still would use bloodspawn in this scenario. You gain over 130 stam regen, more resistances (bloodspawn is like 80% up in fights anyway) + sick ult gen Edited by Mayrael on November 27, 2019 11:41AMSay no to Toxic Casuals!
I am doing my best, but I am not a native speaker, sorry.
"Difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including A Realm Reborn-tier overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver&Gold as a "you think you do but you don't"-tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game." - @AlexanderDeLarge0 -
Artorias24✭✭✭✭✭
✭So I tried to make such build on paper but it wasnt easily, guess there's one or two combos to reach these stats. And it makes sustain suffering, because we need all weapon damage buff sources.
As it was mentioned before, medium armor stamsorc with 28k resists, 6200 WPD, 1k hp regen, no bloodspawn. Looks like nord is only choice because of its racial bonus for resistance. Almost 28k res on front bar requires aegis, also need 2 pieces of resistance monster sets. 6200 weapon damage reached with fully buffed Fury and damage enchant proc. NMA is must have for damage but makes 1400 stam regen look pathetic.
And yeah, we use golden infused jewelry. Overall, this build has these stats (in short time window of maxed Fury + damage enchant) at cost of low stam pool, low hp pool, bad sustain. Doubtful that it will work well in openworld no-cp.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=194084
Could you give any advice on making this build better while keeping damage and resistance, or suggest any other, which is easily reached? Thanks.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=113366
Couldnt find new resist potions in builder so just add 5k resist ontop in your mind.
I maybe overshot the weapon damage so you can ofc switch some wp damage enchants for regen.Edited by Artorias24 on November 27, 2019 12:01PM0 -
Nicalas✭✭✭My question is there a need for it in PvP? Do we need tanks in PvP? tanks that can output a very close amount of damage compared to light or medium. IMO no we do not. you come to PvP to fight not bash your head against someone with high resists, high heals, high damage.
My suggestion allow the set items on jewelry weapons but the player cannot wear 5 piece into PvP zones. Max 2 for undaunted passive.
This would be a very unpopular decision coming from the current meta of things but would stop all the tank meta in its tracks for the most part. I do understand there are light sets that can cause resists as high as heavy but they would not get all the healing passives to carry them to safety.
Heavy armor and damage should not be in the same sentence.
Time to see all the hate from this post lets goooooo.
Let's clarify. Are you talking about heavy armor healers and tanks? Block casting BOL and unkillable DKs? Or are you talking about the typical stamden or stamdk damage build?
I think you would be quite surprised to find out that almost nobody run's heavy armor. I have been asked quite often if I run heavy or heard people say I'm tanky after a 1v1. I run 5 medium and 2 heavy w/BS. That's it. 3k Impen and a few points in medium armor passive. I sit at roughly 20k resists before my BS proc. Competent players don't drop buffs or HOTS. A lot of damage looks like it's mitigated because it's healed so quickly. You're whip hits me 6k but my vigor crit heals for 5k per second.
Edited by Nicalas on November 27, 2019 12:34PM3 -
Nerftheforums✭✭✭✭✭
✭So I tried to make such build on paper but it wasnt easily, guess there's one or two combos to reach these stats. And it makes sustain suffering, because we need all weapon damage buff sources.
As it was mentioned before, medium armor stamsorc with 28k resists, 6200 WPD, 1k hp regen, no bloodspawn. Looks like nord is only choice because of its racial bonus for resistance. Almost 28k res on front bar requires aegis, also need 2 pieces of resistance monster sets. 6200 weapon damage reached with fully buffed Fury and damage enchant proc. NMA is must have for damage but makes 1400 stam regen look pathetic.
And yeah, we use golden infused jewelry. Overall, this build has these stats (in short time window of maxed Fury + damage enchant) at cost of low stam pool, low hp pool, bad sustain. Doubtful that it will work well in openworld no-cp.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=194084
Could you give any advice on making this build better while keeping damage and resistance, or suggest any other, which is easily reached? Thanks.
Beware, ransack doesn't give minor resolve anymore since a couple patches. Instead, it provides minor protection (which is actually better).
Moreover, if I were you, I'd remove the 2 1pc monster sets and replace it with bloodspawn. Your recovery will increase a bit, and you'll actually have more resistances when it'll proc.0 -
LonePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MCBIZZLE300 wrote: »Heavy comes at a cost of poor sustain and less damage. It is simply un true that you can deal close to as much damage as a medium or light user, the passives from medium and light boost damage significantly. The healing in dragonhold is the problem not the armor.
I do not know what game you’re playing but it is not ESO. The damage from heavy armor Stamina based weapon skills in PVP far outpaces the damage from light armor Magicka skills in almost all circumstances. Run around Cyrodiil or IC engaging in solo fights or small groups. Almost all of the enemies you encounter will be Stamina based weapon damage players because that is what deals the most damage. I run 5L-2H (chest and legs) and Stamina weapon single target skills always hit me for 3K-5K+ more than single target Magicka skills, except for the occasional Crystal Frags. If you are Magicka based, you cannot push your Magicka and Spell Damage go anywhere close to the extreme values you can with Stamina and Weapon Damage - and those values can be achieved with Heavy Armor. Look up thread for different examples of this. Plus it is easier to generate high Stamina Regeneration with those high Stamina and Weapon Damage values than it is to pair high Magicka Regeneration with high Magicka and Spell Damage. You can have high Magicka Regeneration or high Magicka/Spell Damage: but not both. By all means, feel free to prove me wrong with any 33K+ Magicka, 5K+ Spell Damage, 2K+ Magicka Regeneration and 13K+ Health/Stamina build you can craft.
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Artorias24✭✭✭✭✭
✭LonePirate wrote: »
I do not know what game you’re playing but it is not ESO. The damage from heavy armor Stamina based weapon skills in PVP far outpaces the damage from light armor Magicka skills in almost all circumstances. Run around Cyrodiil or IC engaging in solo fights or small groups. Almost all of the enemies you encounter will be Stamina based weapon damage players because that is what deals the most damage. I run 5L-2H (chest and legs) and Stamina weapon single target skills always hit me for 3K-5K+ more than single target Magicka skills, except for the occasional Crystal Frags. If you are Magicka based, you cannot push your Magicka and Spell Damage go anywhere close to the extreme values you can with Stamina and Weapon Damage - and those values can be achieved with Heavy Armor. Look up thread for different examples of this. Plus it is easier to generate high Stamina Regeneration with those high Stamina and Weapon Damage values than it is to pair high Magicka Regeneration with high Magicka and Spell Damage. You can have high Magicka Regeneration or high Magicka/Spell Damage: but not both. By all means, feel free to prove me wrong with any 33K+ Magicka, 5K+ Spell Damage, 2K+ Magicka Regeneration and 13K+ Health/Stamina build you can craft.
You are comparing heavy stamina against light magicka. Those are two completly different things.
And how magsorc can hit me with 6k frags while i have 33k resist? By your theory this shouldnt be possible....5 -
Ragnarock41✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭So I tried to make such build on paper but it wasnt easily, guess there's one or two combos to reach these stats. And it makes sustain suffering, because we need all weapon damage buff sources.
As it was mentioned before, medium armor stamsorc with 28k resists, 6200 WPD, 1k hp regen, no bloodspawn. Looks like nord is only choice because of its racial bonus for resistance. Almost 28k res on front bar requires aegis, also need 2 pieces of resistance monster sets. 6200 weapon damage reached with fully buffed Fury and damage enchant proc. NMA is must have for damage but makes 1400 stam regen look pathetic.
And yeah, we use golden infused jewelry. Overall, this build has these stats (in short time window of maxed Fury + damage enchant) at cost of low stam pool, low hp pool, bad sustain. Doubtful that it will work well in openworld no-cp.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=194084
Could you give any advice on making this build better while keeping damage and resistance, or suggest any other, which is easily reached? Thanks.
Remove the chudan-warden and get blood spawn or balorgh instead. Use armor potions aaand there you have it.Edited by Ragnarock41 on November 28, 2019 10:59AM0 -
Tolino✭✭✭✭✭LonePirate wrote: »I do not know what game you’re playing but it is not ESO. The damage from heavy armor Stamina based weapon skills in PVP far outpaces the damage from light armor Magicka skills in almost all circumstances. Run around Cyrodiil or IC engaging in solo fights or small groups. Almost all of the enemies you encounter will be Stamina based weapon damage players because that is what deals the most damage. I run 5L-2H (chest and legs) and Stamina weapon single target skills always hit me for 3K-5K+ more than single target Magicka skills, except for the occasional Crystal Frags. If you are Magicka based, you cannot push your Magicka and Spell Damage go anywhere close to the extreme values you can with Stamina and Weapon Damage - and those values can be achieved with Heavy Armor. Look up thread for different examples of this. Plus it is easier to generate high Stamina Regeneration with those high Stamina and Weapon Damage values than it is to pair high Magicka Regeneration with high Magicka and Spell Damage. You can have high Magicka Regeneration or high Magicka/Spell Damage: but not both. By all means, feel free to prove me wrong with any 33K+ Magicka, 5K+ Spell Damage, 2K+ Magicka Regeneration and 13K+ Health/Stamina build you can craft.
You just forgot something very important!!!
Light Armor Increases your Spell Penetration! With Stamina you need to invest a lot to have so much penetration.
Don't just look at the Tooltips!
Magsorc: Tôlino (Wardless)
Magden: Wa-Uller
Stamsorc: Tolino Sturmfalke0 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭So I tried to make such build on paper but it wasnt easily, guess there's one or two combos to reach these stats. And it makes sustain suffering, because we need all weapon damage buff sources.
As it was mentioned before, medium armor stamsorc with 28k resists, 6200 WPD, 1k hp regen, no bloodspawn. Looks like nord is only choice because of its racial bonus for resistance. Almost 28k res on front bar requires aegis, also need 2 pieces of resistance monster sets. 6200 weapon damage reached with fully buffed Fury and damage enchant proc. NMA is must have for damage but makes 1400 stam regen look pathetic.
And yeah, we use golden infused jewelry. Overall, this build has these stats (in short time window of maxed Fury + damage enchant) at cost of low stam pool, low hp pool, bad sustain. Doubtful that it will work well in openworld no-cp.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=194084
Could you give any advice on making this build better while keeping damage and resistance, or suggest any other, which is easily reached? Thanks.
I changed it up a bit and forgoe Nord for Dunmer and swapped stuff like Mundus and traits around, got slightly better stats but also a different skill loadout.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=194279Edited by Chilly-McFreeze on November 28, 2019 12:00PM0 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
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You just forgot something very important!!!
Light Armor Increases your Spell Penetration! With Stamina you need to invest a lot to have so much penetration.
Don't just look at the Tooltips!
Stam you use mace and that's the penetration you miss from light.
Magicka generally tends to go higher main stat rather than spell damage, but stam has options there as well. I feel magicka also gets shorted in every magicka weapon being ranged with numbers like a bow. Still want a melee magicka optionEdited by technohic on November 28, 2019 3:50PM0 -
Rave the Histborn✭✭✭✭✭
✭Emma_Overload wrote: »
What is amazing is the resistance some people have to the idea that toxicity in PvP actually affects the way people play the game.
I think it's hard to imagine because anyone active in PVP has had things negatively said to them and they are able to continue playing without it affecting their game. There's also this quick jump to table everything as "toxic", which is the 2019 buzzword to just lump things together and paint them negatively. If you're using the same word to represent major and minor transgressions how do you know which is worse?
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LonePirate✭✭✭✭✭
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I didn't forget that at all. I run around in Cyrodiil and IC in 5 Light. I know all about that Spell Penetration passive and it adds very little to the mix. Even with it, 35K+ Magicka and over 3K+ Spell Damage, I still hit for roughly 60% of what Heavy/Medium Stamina based weapon skills hit. I have a Magplar with 5 Heavy and I still take far more damage from Stamina weapon skills than almost all Magicka skills, with the occasional Crystal Frags or Magicka Detonation bomber being the rate exceptions.Again, the solo/duo people you see running around in PVP are almost always Stamina based. Do people in this thread actually think they play that way because it is a low damage challenge for them? There is so much gaslighting going on by people pushing nonsense such as Heavy Armor Stamina builds are weak in PVP.
You just forgot something very important!!!
Light Armor Increases your Spell Penetration! With Stamina you need to invest a lot to have so much penetration.
Don't just look at the Tooltips!
Edited by LonePirate on November 28, 2019 7:34PM0 -
Strider__Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Rave the Histborn wrote: »
I think it's hard to imagine because anyone active in PVP has had things negatively said to them and they are able to continue playing without it affecting their game. There's also this quick jump to table everything as "toxic", which is the 2019 buzzword to just lump things together and paint them negatively. If you're using the same word to represent major and minor transgressions how do you know which is worse?
Buzz words are favored by simpletons. A lot of people are echo chambers and lack original thought. And since we live in a PC culture our ability to respectfully debate has greatly diminished. Unfortunately most people prefer the bumper sticker approach even it comes to dialogue; as in "this is my opinion, and I really don't care about yours!"0 -
doomette✭✭✭✭✭
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Maybe it affects some people. I chuckle and roll my eyes when I get teabagged, especially when when I’m playing a lowbie alt some high-ranking PVPer has valiantly slain with an ult dump and all that.Emma_Overload wrote: »
What is amazing is the resistance some people have to the idea that toxicity in PvP actually affects the way people play the game.
No, it’s not silly teabaggers that has me thinking about getting tankier, but the fact that about every third time I die the game freezes in the respawn load screen. That makes me want to die less.
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