Why Does Coldharbor Have A Sun?

OrdoHermetica

starkerealm wrote: »

Olauron wrote: »

Lady_Linux wrote: »

I dont see Talos in that Graphic

Talos is not a real Divine. He doesn't have a planet.

Talos is Lorkhan, still not on the map, though.

...uh...

...maybe you're getting names mixed up? Because Talos started as a human being, and Lorkhan did the whole "trick the Aedra into creating the world" thing well before humans showed up. So... chronologically, that would be rather difficult.

Salix_alba

Olauron wrote: »

Lady_Linux wrote: »

I dont see Talos in that Graphic

Talos is not a real Divine. He doesn't have a planet.

Talos is not a real divine YET.





Yet I still took great pleasure in kicking his smarmy bootlicking follower ulfrics butt all over his own throne room in tes 5 where was talos then?

Olauron

Salix_alba wrote: »

Talos is not a real divine YET.

Talos is not a real divine in any time. There is no planet Talos in 2nd Era, in 3rd Era, in 4th Era, no matter when. Even Mannimarco got his Moon, but Talos as a god has nothing.

RaddlemanNumber7

VaranisArano wrote: »

Which sun?

The Hollow City has sunlight, but that's Meridia's little pocket of space stuck in the middle of Coldharbor.

The rest of it seemed pretty gloomy to me.

I've spent a few hours in Coldharbour over the past few days. It's not like that anymore. The sun is often dazzlingly bright all over Coldharbour. I visited all the wayshrines. I don't remember it being like before. Maybe the sky box got broken somehow.

It's annoying. I've just spent a lot of crowns, gold and time building a Daedric lair on the Surreal Estate. I don't want dazzling sunshine beaming down on my Xykvin while he is performing his dark and diabolical deeds. It's entirely the wrong sort of atmosphere.

edit spelling

starkerealm

siddique wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Olauron wrote: »

Lady_Linux wrote: »

I dont see Talos in that Graphic

Talos is not a real Divine. He doesn't have a planet.

Talos is Lorkhan, still not on the map, though.

Talos is not Lorkhan.

Kinda is, actually. Lorkhan is Shor. Hjalti Early-Beard (who would later become known as Tiber Septum) mantled Shor to become a Divine, effectively becoming a new incarnation of Shor, and by extension Lorkhan.

Except, mantling is kinda weird, because the processes is also, apparently, retroactive. So, either Tiber Septum was always a Shezzarine, or he became one in the process of mantling.

TES's metaphysics are bonkers when you dig into them.

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO

imagine going to the other celestial bodies...this starts to feel like Warhammer 40k.

Zorgon_The_Revenged

It's actually a giant cheese wheel Molag won from Sheogorath in a game of cards.

Blackbird_V

Yeah had this happen and unable to recreate this. It was kind of cool tbh.
If anyone finds a way to re-create it let me know. Actually nice being there with the sun and blue sky.

Sylvermynx

Valkyn_Eltrys wrote: »

Yeah had this happen and unable to recreate this. It was kind of cool tbh.
If anyone finds a way to re-create it let me know. Actually nice being there with the sun and blue sky.

I can imagine.... I really get mondo dismo'd by Colharbour. So not my fav place to hang out.

starkerealm

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO wrote: »

imagine going to the other celestial bodies...this starts to feel like Warhammer 40k.

Remember when 40k was explicitly part of WHF? Yeah, kinda like that at times.

Michael Kirkbride's contribution to the lore is bonkers on many levels. I love it; it's what gives TES its unique identity.

TempPlayer

I'm surprise it doesn't have a blight red sun all over the realm. Vampire is attribute to good Mol here and guess what object up in the sky is consider torture for vampire.

Jayman1000

VaranisArano wrote: »

Which sun?

The Hollow City has sunlight, but that's Meridia's little pocket of space stuck in the middle of Coldharbor.

The rest of it seemed pretty gloomy to me.

The sun you see in Hollow City is there also in all of coldharbour. Just go there and look at that sun inside the Hollow City then run out in coldharbour while still looking at the sun. It's still there, it does not disappear. As to the question why is there sun? Well, we can but only assume that all realms exist in a solar system, but then not necessarily the same one.

starkerealm

Jayman1000 wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Which sun?

The Hollow City has sunlight, but that's Meridia's little pocket of space stuck in the middle of Coldharbor.

The rest of it seemed pretty gloomy to me.

The sun you see in Hollow City is there also in all of coldharbour. Just go there and look at that sun inside the Hollow City then run out in coldharbour while still looking at the sun. It's still there, it does not disappear. As to the question why is there sun? Well, we can but only assume that all realms exist in a solar system, but then not necessarily the same one.

Alternately, Coldharbour is supposed to be a twisted reflection of Tamriel, so it carries that there's a sun there.

Aliyavana

starkerealm wrote: »

Olauron wrote: »

Lady_Linux wrote: »

I dont see Talos in that Graphic

Talos is not a real Divine. He doesn't have a planet.

Talos is Lorkhan, still not on the map, though.

Nope

Mayrael

In 500 years, someone will dig up this thread and will wonder, what this religion was called?

Guyle

NERDS!

8P

Mitrenga

That's Black Hole Sun.

Galarthor

VaranisArano wrote: »

Which sun?

The Hollow City has sunlight, but that's Meridia's little pocket of space stuck in the middle of Coldharbor.

The rest of it seemed pretty gloomy to me.

So what's up with the sun in the Coldharbour Surreal Estate?

Lady_Linux

So we can all hold hands and sing the sesame street theme song, why else?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfQSp92L88I

siddique

starkerealm wrote: »

siddique wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Olauron wrote: »

Lady_Linux wrote: »

I dont see Talos in that Graphic

Talos is not a real Divine. He doesn't have a planet.

Talos is Lorkhan, still not on the map, though.

Talos is not Lorkhan.

Kinda is, actually. Lorkhan is Shor. Hjalti Early-Beard (who would later become known as Tiber Septum) mantled Shor to become a Divine, effectively becoming a new incarnation of Shor, and by extension Lorkhan.

Except, mantling is kinda weird, because the processes is also, apparently, retroactive. So, either Tiber Septum was always a Shezzarine, or he became one in the process of mantling.

TES's metaphysics are bonkers when you dig into them.

No, he isn't.

Vhozek

Lady_Linux wrote: »

siddique wrote: »

Lady_Linux wrote: »

Vhozek wrote: »

The "sun" is a hole in the fabric of mundus (the universe) which separates it from the realm of magic (aetherius). It was made by a being named Magnus as he tried to escape mundus due to its creation coming at the cost of his and everyone else's powers. Magnus' followers also escaped and created smaller holes which are the stars. That's how magic flows into the universe.
So yes, practically anything in Mundus will have a sun and stars.

I dont see Talos in that Graphic

Also you're assertion is that the so called divines are subject to daedric princes?

How are they subject to daedric princes?

according to the graphic they exist at a level higher than the divines, closer to atherius

Daedra are actually stronger than the divines.
The creation of Mundus drained away some of the divines' powers and practically binded them to the realm. The Daedra are the ones that didn't want anything to do with the creation of Mundus so they were not involved in its creation and not present when the energy was being sucked out of everyone.

starkerealm

siddique wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

siddique wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Olauron wrote: »

Lady_Linux wrote: »

I dont see Talos in that Graphic

Talos is not a real Divine. He doesn't have a planet.

Talos is Lorkhan, still not on the map, though.

Talos is not Lorkhan.

Kinda is, actually. Lorkhan is Shor. Hjalti Early-Beard (who would later become known as Tiber Septum) mantled Shor to become a Divine, effectively becoming a new incarnation of Shor, and by extension Lorkhan.

Except, mantling is kinda weird, because the processes is also, apparently, retroactive. So, either Tiber Septum was always a Shezzarine, or he became one in the process of mantling.

TES's metaphysics are bonkers when you dig into them.

No, he isn't.

RaddlemanNumber7

Let's talk about Lorkhan...

The Dreamer = one God with many faces. Ascended Lorkhan is The Dreamer. He is the union of all the Divines. After the end of the Dawn era the Divines are merely faces that Lorkhan wears, components in his Dream of the Aurbis.

Daddy Lorkhan slaps Daedric Princes down when they get out of line. He uses avatars to do that, because it makes it more personal. Avatars like the Vestige.

Talos ascends to achieve union with The Dreamer. This union changes The Dream, a bit, but after that Talos becomes just another Divine face of the The Dreamer, not really an independent actor at all.

Doesn't it all just make sense?

starkerealm

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

Avatars like the Vestige.

Okay, so we just took a huge, sideways, step.

It's pretty easy to say that the single player characters like the Nerevarine, the Dragonborn, even the Imperial Champion and the Blades Agent are all Shezzarine. Aside from The Dragonborn, it's kinda sketchy, and there's nothing you can point to say, "yeah, definitive proof." There's also a pretty credible argument that the Dragon Break is the result of reloading saves and replaying content.

Outside of that, we do have a few other Dragonbreaks which the player doesn't interact with. So, that's fine, that's a thing.

The problem is, while it's easy enough to say that the Vestige isn't a normal character, that's a long road from saying they're a Shezzarine.

siddique

Anu and Padomay, equal but opposite forces.
Mingled together. Birthed their souls.
Anu-El and the Dread Father, Sithis

Anu-El and Sithis, Light and Darkness, mingled together. Created Aurbis (the universe). Birthed their souls.
Auri-El and Lorkhan
Time began.

The Aedra are both Anuic and Padomic, whereas the Daedra were created with the blood of Padomay alone.

Everything else is inferior.

RaddlemanNumber7

starkerealm wrote: »

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

Avatars like the Vestige.

Okay, so we just took a huge, sideways, step.

It's pretty easy to say that the single player characters like the Nerevarine, the Dragonborn, even the Imperial Champion and the Blades Agent are all Shezzarine. Aside from The Dragonborn, it's kinda sketchy, and there's nothing you can point to say, "yeah, definitive proof." There's also a pretty credible argument that the Dragon Break is the result of reloading saves and replaying content.

Outside of that, we do have a few other Dragonbreaks which the player doesn't interact with. So, that's fine, that's a thing.

The problem is, while it's easy enough to say that the Vestige isn't a normal character, that's a long road from saying they're a Shezzarine.

Obviously the "proof" is very sketchy, because that's the way the devs write the game, to give players the opportunity to analyse, invent and choose (or not to analyse, invent or choose). I don't think the devs would want people to feel they were locked in to playing their character as an avatar of Lorkhan.

So the things in lore that link the Vestige to Lorkhan are very few. There's the "paragon" of Nirn idea from the book Chaotic Creatia: The Azure Plasm, Lorkhan being the "Spirit of Nirn". And the Prophet linking skyshards and the "essence of Nirn" they contain to Lorkhan. That's about it, I think.

But then, my choice to acknowledge that my character is a Sezzarine is mostly based on empirical evidence, on the fact that it makes so much sense of so many things that I experience while playing the game, which would otherwise make no sense at all. Here are a few examples...

Lack of choice in quests and dialogue makes sense for a doom-driven hero. And when you do get a choice, whatever you choose nearly always turns out to be the right choice as if that was reality all along.

It's easy to see Lorkhan as the divine polymath, and The Vestige too knows pretty much everything when they need to without having to learn it, e.g. in the Morvunskar tombs in Eastmarch, when the Vestige is matching a loose page to a book, Nirnhild’s ghost comments, “Who knew you could read Ancient Nord.” This also explains why The Vestige can learn skill lines, like the Psijiic skill line, with little or no training. It's like the Vestige is remembering rather than learning these skills.

Lorkhan is the "Missing" god, and The Vestige seems to inherit some of that veil of misdirection, e.g. NPC's do not react to the appearance of the Vestige, as if they are not allowed to notice. If they could actually see they were talking to a big hairy Orc in a pink tutu I think they would react to that (that's not one of my characters by the way). No one is allowed to notice the totality of what the Vestige has achieved, they just see a rootless wander. Even Sotha Sil cannot see, although he comes tantalisingly close with his prisoner analogy.

Making my character a Shezzarine is like choosing the path of least resistance through the game. For me, it is the happiest choice.

xxthir13enxx

https://youtu.be/Yop62wQH498

siddique

Vestige or not, you are not Lorkhan nor is Talos. Fake news.