Why Does ESO Not Feel Like Skyrim? (MMO vs RPG)

madeeh91rwb17_ESO

I play this game a lot.
All because of it's highly intricate and no-skillcap PvP.

Even tough in the beginning I mainly got it to play an "Online Skyrim".
But I HAVE now gotten over the fact that it just sadly is not and never will be. (Fingers Crossed for ESO-2)

I created this thread just because I want to know from a game design/environment perspective, what exactly are all the things that makes it different.
Everything from bandits taunting you about "counting all your coin", to the way the NPCs don't give a crap about their friends being beaten 5 meters away.

whitecrow

Well, the main thing is that nothing stays dead.

SidraWillowsky

The world is not built around you. When you log off, the game doesn't stop--it continues to move forward. You're never really alone, aside from a few solo instances. So when you're out exploring Eastmarch, for example, there's no way to feel the utter isolation that you do in Skyrim because there are always players around.

Things like Dwemer ruins are the same way... You simply cannot feel the haunting loneliness when surrounded by others. Stuff like that.

This is an MMO first and an Elder Scrolls game second. I try to tell anyone wanting to play the game for the TES element this, and to not expect Skyrim 2. It's not the same, and while there's a lot of great TES lore, it will never feel the same as a single player game.

Turelus

Most of the game systems are what make it not Skyrim.

At launch they tried to go for a TES/MMO hybrid but ended up in this weird place where it wasn't very good at being either. Over the years they've done a lot of reworking to make it an MMO and it's now a very solid MMO, but had to give up a lot of the TES styles of gameplay for that.

The biggest difference I would say is the combat system, with TES games not having skills and heavy/light attacks being more focused as damage. ESO moved the focus onto skill rotations and light attack weaving as the combat system.

nafensoriel

Entirely different engine.
Entirely different asset focus.
Loss of dev time due to multiplayer additions.
Loss of dev time due to monetization additions.
The requirement for interaction between users.
Forced lower maximum specification ceiling due to being a multiplayer game.
Forced Class simplicity due to performance concerns.

From a developer perspective just about every single aspect of the game is different. They are not comparable.
It would be easier to ask what is the same honestly. The list is far shorter.

Things that are the same:
Art Aesthetics.
Some Lore Aesthetics.
Some World Aesthetics.

CaffeinatedMayhem

It's not Skyrim nor intended to be "Skyrim with friends."?

This is an MMO, not a single player game.

RefLiberty

Simple.
No skimpy sexy outfits and armors as on Nexus.
That's more or less it.

Bad jokes aside, as this is a mmorpg, comparison is useless, completely different mechanics.

Gilvoth

so far in the answers i do not believe anyone has answered his question.

Gilvoth

when we look up the definition of an mmo it is vague and has no true definition in difference TO a single player game other than it simply has other people compared to only 1 person in a single player game.

Danikat

Turelus wrote: »

Most of the game systems are what make it not Skyrim.

At launch they tried to go for a TES/MMO hybrid but ended up in this weird place where it wasn't very good at being either. Over the years they've done a lot of reworking to make it an MMO and it's now a very solid MMO, but had to give up a lot of the TES styles of gameplay for that.

The biggest difference I would say is the combat system, with TES games not having skills and heavy/light attacks being more focused as damage. ESO moved the focus onto skill rotations and light attack weaving as the combat system.

Agreed.

I remember being really confused during the betas because playing ESO always made me want to stop and play Skyrim or Guild Wars 2 instead (only because that's my other MMO, I'm sure you could substitute any other), when in theory it should have felt kind of like playing both together and better for me than either on it's own.

I get the impression this game had a somewhat odd development process, early on it seemed like they were making a generic MMO set in Tamriel (if you can find screenshots from the alpha version which were included in articles and previews it basically looks like WoW), then Skyrim was such a massive success they really tried to make it as similar to that as possible, then over the years since release they've drifted back towards making it more of an MMO.

I'm ok with that - Skyrim was quite different from Oblivion, which was different to Morrowind, which was very different to Daggerfall and I assume that was different to Arena but I never played Arena so I can't comment. There's things I prefer about Skyrim (and the previous TES games) and things I prefer in ESO, but ultimately they're different games and it makes sense they wouldn't be totally identical.

jircris11

madeeh91rwb17_ESO wrote: »

I play this game a lot.
All because of it's highly intricate and no-skillcap PvP.

Even tough in the beginning I mainly got it to play an "Online Skyrim".
But I HAVE now gotten over the fact that it just sadly is not and never will be. (Fingers Crossed for ESO-2)

I created this thread just because I want to know from a game design/environment perspective, what exactly are all the things that makes it different.
Everything from bandits taunting you about "counting all your coin", to the way the NPCs don't give a crap about their friends being beaten 5 meters away.

Not a single player game but a mmo so decisions matter not, npcs don't stay dead and you never lead a npc guild.

BlueRaven

Well systematically, there is a lot of differences.

Races:

In Skyrim race gives the player one special ability... And then that's it. If they wanted to play a Bosmer Mage, or an Imperial assassin. The systems in place allowed them to mold their character into anything they wanted them to be. Because most races started with an "head start" in an ability, but that head start can be caught up to and equaled by any other race.

In ESO, those advantages are hard coded in. Want to be good at stealth? There used to be two choices (now only one), but anyway a race with a stealth advantage will ALWAYS have that advantage. No armor, or skill can catchup to them.

Same with things like weapon damage or magicka, a race with an advantage will always have that advantage.

Skills:

The skill trees in ESO are rather linear and limited. All weapon "trees" have five spells, an ultimate, and some passives. Compared to skyrim with the branching skills and the ability to tailor the players builds to what they want. The skill trees in ESO provide very little choice for customization as the only custimazion options are morphs.

(Plus there is some really odd combat skill choices like having frost staves taunt. Why is that in there?)

Combat:

The strength of Skyrim's combat was a certain level of realism and weight in the combat system. Lining up an arrow shot to take out a bandit felt good and very tactile (and important). Meanwhile in ESO most of us just dive in, mostly taking down mobs without thought. Making the mobs existence less meaningful. Mobs in skyrim felt intricate to the game and part the fun. Mobs in ESO feel like just a time sink to slow the player down, while they get to their objective.

Combat in Skyrim feels impactful as all attacks (both foe and the players) were pretty powerful. Meanwhile in ESO... Not so much.

•••

I can go on, but the main problems with ESO (when compared to skyrim) is the poor race design and skill/combat designs.

Gnome_Saiyan

IMO, the more interesting question (and likely controversial answer) is: Will TES6 be more like ESO?

MinuitPro

It doesn't feel like Skyrim because the 2020 Chapter isn't released yet.

idk

madeeh91rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Even tough in the beginning I mainly got it to play an "Online Skyrim".
But I HAVE now gotten over the fact that it just sadly is not and never will be. (Fingers Crossed for ESO-2)

I created this thread just because I want to know from a game design/environment perspective, what exactly are all the things that makes it different.

The answer is pretty simple. Well over 5 years ago the devs stated they were not designing an online skyrim. More specifically they were not designing a MMORPG Skyrim but an MMORPG based on the world of TES. That first and foremost it is an MMORPG.

Saucy_Jack

Skyrim didn't have Pie King.

idk

Gnome_Saiyan wrote: »

IMO, the more interesting question (and likely controversial answer) is: Will TES6 be more like ESO?

Pretty much pointless to discuss and people can only bring up baseless opinions on that subject.

Oakmontowls_ESO

The lack of rag dolls and interaction with the environment beyond looting and other numerous game mechanics that just aren't feasible in an online game.

Schattenfluegel

Because...ESO isnt skyrim?

Aurie

Why Does ESO Not Feel Like Skyrim?

1. It is a totally different genre of game....MMO v. single player.

2. A Skyrim chapter/DLC has not even been released yet in this MMO.

3. Given the above, why should it feel like Skyrim?

SeaGtGruff

You might as well ask why Skyrim isn't like Oblivion, or why Morrowind isn't like Daggerfall.

But I'm not saying that the topic is pointless, because sites dedicated to TES games often do in fact list differences between one game and another, to help players who are new to one game and coming from another get oriented toward the basics such as how the controls work, what differences there are (if any) in classes and races and skills, how things like lock-picking or enchanting or alchemy are different, etc.

BigBragg

Among all these other things. ESO and Skyrim's development cycles did greatly overlap, and they were being done in separate studios. ESO actually had to go back and change it's UI to provide a bit more synergy between the two games.

srfrogg23

madeeh91rwb17_ESO wrote: »

I play this game a lot.
All because of it's highly intricate and no-skillcap PvP.

Even tough in the beginning I mainly got it to play an "Online Skyrim".
But I HAVE now gotten over the fact that it just sadly is not and never will be. (Fingers Crossed for ESO-2)

I created this thread just because I want to know from a game design/environment perspective, what exactly are all the things that makes it different.
Everything from bandits taunting you about "counting all your coin", to the way the NPCs don't give a crap about their friends being beaten 5 meters away.

Haven't you had, like, 6 years to come to terms with the fact that these are two different genres of game?

redgreensunset

As others have said and I will repeat, ESO is an mmorpg, Skyrim (and all the other TES games) were single player games, they were never going to be similar except in world building/aesthetics. And if ever there isan ESO 2 it won't look or feel like Skyrim or anyother single player game either, and trying to make it would be a bad thing. Yes I'm hoping we get a TES 6 at some point too, nut I do not want that to be ESO 2 or an mmo in any form.

redlink1979

Here, I googled it for you:

https://www.google.com/search?q=difference+between+eso+and+skyrim&rlz=1C1GCEU_pt-PTPT820PT820&oq=difference+between+eso+and+skyrim&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l3.9655j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

https://www.ign.com/wikis/elder-scrolls-online/Elder_Scrolls_Online_vs_Skyrim_Comparison

https://elderscrollsonline.info/eso-vs-skyrim

https://v1.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/video-games/previews/10975-3-Things-Skyrim-Players-Need-to-Know-About-ESO

Gilvoth

what is a description of an mmo?

gatekeeper13

Well, in my opinion these are some elements that make the two games feel different:

1) Graphics. In my pov, Skyrim graphics are more realistic and mature and I prefer them any time from ESO's. ESO graphics look more simplistic, generic and colorful as if they were made to catch a broader audience, including younger ages.
2) Atmosphere. Skyrim is more atmospheric and has really built a world around you. Darker and more foggy areas make the game world feel ominous, while ESO is sunny and feels fun all the time. World sound effects in Skyrim were nice, in ESO they are laughable.
3) Enviroment design. Skyrim's world is far more detailed, dense and feels "alive", while ESOs vast areas are there just to let you get to certain points of interest.
4) Plot & Characters. Skyrim has a far better structured and presented plot, with way more interesting characters. You are truly part of the quest and your actions define the world around you. In ESO, the quests look formulaic and exist as if to help you get skill points and keep you occupied and logged in. Characters are blunt and you kinda feel like if you dont a quest, its perfectly fine. But in Skyrim, you truly feel inside the plot.
5) Skyrim soundtrack is the definition of epicness. ESO soundtrack sounds generic to me, with the exception of some pretty nice tracks.

Ofc, there is an explanation for all these. Skyrim was made to house 1 player at a time. ESO was made to house hundreds of players at the same area.Which inevitably makes everything larger, more generic and less "cozy".

SeaGtGruff

Gilvoth wrote: »

what is a description of an mmo?

That's difficult to pin down, since without "RPG" after it, it could basically be any online game that lets massive numbers of people play with or against each other. I mean, a lot of people on this forum keep bringing up the "It's a MMO" argument as though that explains what ESO is or should (in their opinion) be, but that doesn't actually explain anything.

It's like if someone were to ask, "Why isn't Legends more like ESO?" and people answered with "Because it's a card game!" So is it like Poker? Is it like Crazy Eights, or Go Fish? Maybe it's like 52 Pickup? Those are all card games, too, aren't they?

The explanation does make sense in a very broad and general way, but one could perhaps argue that the explanation is so broad and general as to be largely meaningless.

srfrogg23

Gilvoth wrote: »

what is a description of an mmo?

Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.

The biggest differences between the two are caused by the fact that ESO is a persistent online game world shared by millions of people simultaneously and has to account for things like server load and lag. That's why they chose the soft-lock targeting system as opposed to Skyrim's hit-box oriented system. That system would be far less reliable and janky than the soft-lock system.

ESO also varies up gameplay mechanics by using ground based templates, unlike Skyrim. That's the reason people primarily play ESO in third person as opposed to first person.

Skyrim has a difficulty selection system in its menu and mods out the wazoo, so people can heavily customize their gameplay experiences. ESO, being a shared gameplay experience, can't afford to allow people to do that.

Two very different genres of game that, apparently, people are still having trouble wrapping their head's around even 5 years, and counting, later.

mairwen85

Because it isn't?
Skyrim doesn't feel like oblivion.
Oblivion doesn't feel like morrowind.
Morrowind doesn't feel like daggerfall.
Daggerfall doesn't feel like arena.

Could be that they're different games... Weird.

Faulgor

You can get lost in technicalities about this, but the top reasons why it doesn't feel like Skyrim or any single player TES game are, imo:

1. Other players everywhere. You never feel like you are thrown into a strange world on your own because there are other people running around wherever you go. It's not really exploration when wherever you go, someone has been there before you.
2. Civilization is everywhere. What this means is that there is effectively no wilderness to explore, no deep and unknown, potentially dangerous cavern or dungeon. This is partly because of reason #1, the fact that zones are designed with a quest location every few hundred meters, and the lenient fast travel and inventory system which don't require a lot of planning before venturing somewhere.

In short,
Skyrim is Siberia - lonely and unknown
ESO is Disneyland - crowded and signposted