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so, do you hate imperial city yet?

  • Jeremy
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    madman65 wrote: »
    Everybody wants to go into IC but when you get mobbed it tends to discourage the players. The biggest problem is that you cannot reach areas to work on achieving goals or collecting rare items. Therefor the mobs will hoard the areas and progress further. Personally myself, ESO could make an alternate area for solo players. If ESO wants to keep gamers then in all reality, they need to accommodate those gamers.

    If I was in charge (and luckily for zergs I'm not) I would scale the player's stats based on the amount of players attacking them. For example: for every additional player who targets a player beyond the established baseline of what I had calculated to be fair the player's stats would be multiplied by a factor of 1. So if say 6 people tried to gang up on a single player his or her stats would be tripled or quadrupled to compensate. This would give the player a fighting chance.

    It's similar to a what a lot of games do already in respect to their enemy boss monsters - who they scale upward depending on how many players are attacking them to make them more challenging.

    Not sure why this has never been considered in respect to players before. But I believe a system like this would go a long way to making PvP more interesting and fun.
    Edited by Jeremy on September 7, 2019 11:32PM
  • itscompton
    itscompton
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    Jeremy wrote: »
    Wing wrote: »
    for all you that just got it free and got to experience it first hand how did you like it?

    gankers, hunter kill BG groups chasing down solo pve players, raids hiding in stealth waiting to jump groups.

    how long before you raged.

    how long before you said "F this" and left IC

    if your wondering, it has never been good, this is as good as it gets, it will never be enjoyable, other pvp modes are far more fun so I recommend joining in on BG's or cyro, IC is trash, end.

    lol I can relate to saying "F this" and leaving IC.

    But yeah, I agree. It might be fun for gankers and people who run around in zergs slaughtering smaller numbers of players (who seem to enjoy that sort of thing for some reason) but everyone else is likely going to suffer. I consider it trash too. Which is a shame really, cause the zone actually has some decent PvE in it and looks quite cool up in the city.

    I prefer Battlegrounds and even Cyrodil over the Imperial City as well.

    Not true, if you know what you're doing PvP wise it's totally possible to run Solo and have fun. The streets and buildings make great cover to put between yourself and a zerg if you pay enough attention to see them coming and get out of the way.
    Crazy how some PVE players refuse to put the time in to get good and just come complain on the forums. Learning to PVP is just like learning the mechanics of a complicated trial or dungeon. Each class is a different type of boss, the human element just makes thier attack rotations more unpredictable but there still are certain rules and limitations to what they can do.
    I really feel like a huge part of it is ego, people who can beat all the vet dungeons and trials and make the leaderboards get mad when the skills don't translate into instant dominance in PvP.
    It took me a long long time to get good in PvP and there are still 10 to 15 people out of every hundred that can absolutely own me in one on one (and if the players are decent more than two is usually a guaranteed loss since it's pretty hard to kite on a Templar) but I don't cry when I get beat I just try to learn from it and get better.
  • Jeremy
    Jeremy
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    itscompton wrote: »
    Jeremy wrote: »
    Wing wrote: »
    for all you that just got it free and got to experience it first hand how did you like it?

    gankers, hunter kill BG groups chasing down solo pve players, raids hiding in stealth waiting to jump groups.

    how long before you raged.

    how long before you said "F this" and left IC

    if your wondering, it has never been good, this is as good as it gets, it will never be enjoyable, other pvp modes are far more fun so I recommend joining in on BG's or cyro, IC is trash, end.

    lol I can relate to saying "F this" and leaving IC.

    But yeah, I agree. It might be fun for gankers and people who run around in zergs slaughtering smaller numbers of players (who seem to enjoy that sort of thing for some reason) but everyone else is likely going to suffer. I consider it trash too. Which is a shame really, cause the zone actually has some decent PvE in it and looks quite cool up in the city.

    I prefer Battlegrounds and even Cyrodil over the Imperial City as well.

    Not true, if you know what you're doing PvP wise it's totally possible to run Solo and have fun. The streets and buildings make great cover to put between yourself and a zerg if you pay enough attention to see them coming and get out of the way.
    Crazy how some PVE players refuse to put the time in to get good and just come complain on the forums. Learning to PVP is just like learning the mechanics of a complicated trial or dungeon. Each class is a different type of boss, the human element just makes thier attack rotations more unpredictable but there still are certain rules and limitations to what they can do.
    I really feel like a huge part of it is ego, people who can beat all the vet dungeons and trials and make the leaderboards get mad when the skills don't translate into instant dominance in PvP.
    It took me a long long time to get good in PvP and there are still 10 to 15 people out of every hundred that can absolutely own me in one on one (and if the players are decent more than two is usually a guaranteed loss since it's pretty hard to kite on a Templar) but I don't cry when I get beat I just try to learn from it and get better.

    Sorry, but I just don't buy your argument that people can just run into houses when they see a zerg coming. If that worked for you - then you just got lucky.

    And no one here is crying because they lost a one on one fight. I know I certainly ain't. So I don't know what that bit at the end had to do with my comment.

    Edited by Jeremy on September 7, 2019 11:47PM
  • Ostonoha
    Ostonoha
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    .
    Edited by Ostonoha on September 11, 2019 1:34AM
  • FlopsyPrince
    FlopsyPrince
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    Danikat wrote: »
    I don't mind it, but then I'm not trying to farm tel-var stones. I don't think of it as PvP since real fights are rare, it seems to be mostly groups of gankers who will stealth and run away if anyone fights back (or just if the enemy has equal numbers), so I just ignore them. If they kill me then they've wasted their time because I have no TV stones and I just respawn and carry on.

    More importantly once I knew which bosses counted (and that it's not the mini-bosses like the announcement says) it's a quick way to get tickets. I'd rather do the dungeon but on days like today when I had a total of 25 minutes at home after reset and had to use that time to get changed and packed speed takes priority.

    If you want tel-var stones however I definitely recommend coming back after the event is over, it's usually a dead zone where you can explore in peace.

    The mini bosses do count, at least the ones marked with the crossed swords (IIRC) on the map. I have been exclusively doing those and it has ultimately not been too bad once I got past being ganked multiple times by a group of enemy PvPers that came deep in our area.
    PS4
  • Jeremy
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    itscompton wrote: »
    Jeremy wrote: »
    Cadbury wrote: »
    vamp_emily wrote: »
    omg! I turned the corner and 20 EP were coming at me.

    -- cloak
    -cloak
    -breath
    -mag potion
    -cloak
    -don't move
    -cloak

    Then a freaking nightblade marked me... run run run dodge roll... where is the freaking stairs?!!! Run run run dodge roll!!! cloak cloak run run run..

    My heart is about to explode but I got away with my 14k stones :)

    Hides for a while

    For real, I love moments like that.

    Unfortunately those moments are reserved for Night Blades though - who can invisible at will.

    For other classes, trying to escape a Zerg in Imperial City is probably not going to end well for them.

    I was on my Templar last night in a district and found myself suddenly surrounded by a zerg of yellows with 9k stones on me. I usually see zergs coming so I was quite surprised when every direction I turned were streets filled with AD. But I dodged rolled into popping an immovable potion, ran for the first door I saw, threw down a Ritual of Retribution to snare the pack chasing me, ran upstairs, turned a corner jumped out a window into an empty steet, went right into another building and ran upstairs there and stealthed. A couple of people popped their head in downstairs but since I had broke line-of-sight they didn't know I was really in the building so didn't fully check it out and I was able to use a retreat sigil to get back to the base with all my tel var.

    I said probably not going to end well for them.

    If you are the exception to this rule I can't really debate it. I don't know you and have never seen you roll into houses and leap out windows to successfully escape dozens of people coming after your blood. I'm skeptical - and find it more likely you just got lucky in this one instance (though not to diminish the impressive amount of effort you put in). Because I've never seen a solo Templar successfully escape a large zerg in Imperial City. They just go splat (like nearly everyone else does).

    But like I said - who knows. Maybe you are that good to where you can successfully and reliably evade zergs as a solo Templar in Imperial City. But you'll have to excuse me if I wait to see it before I believe it.

    Edited by Jeremy on September 8, 2019 12:31AM
  • Rave the Histborn
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    madman65 wrote: »
    Everybody wants to go into IC but when you get mobbed it tends to discourage the players. The biggest problem is that you cannot reach areas to work on achieving goals or collecting rare items. Therefor the mobs will hoard the areas and progress further. Personally myself, ESO could make an alternate area for solo players. If ESO wants to keep gamers then in all reality, they need to accommodate those gamers.

    There are no rare items and the majority of achievements are PVP or IC specific so you're not getting muscled out of anything. I play majority solo and I have little if any problems.

    Why would they make a solo specific area for an MMO? Why would they so make IC specific solo, when it has the least amount of pure PVE content out of every DLC?
  • Marcus684
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    I’m not very good at PvP, and I have lost zero Tel Var to gankers, and actually gained ~1000 Tel Var helping to kill one. Just build tanky, keep your buffs up, and act like you know what you’re doing. Slot Radiant Magelight/Inner Light and pop it regularly. Most gankers will pass you up for easier targets.
  • Rave the Histborn
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    Dusk_Coven wrote: »
    The design for IC was always "lambs to the slaughter." Seems like the point was to lure in PvE players to get ganked by nightblades.

    No risk vs reward at all. You go out and gank with 0 Tel Var, deposit in the bank, repeat. If you do get killed (unlikely) you lose nothing.

    And this is why the IC is extremely bad design compared to Cyrodiil.
    Cyrodiil is about war objectives and actual PvP OBJECTIVES -- taking land, trying to win the war and becoming emperor. There's a proper context for the PvP activity and AP is the measure of it.

    All the PvP activity in the Imperial City is about MUGGING PEOPLE for Tel Var.

    Tel Var ultimately comes from PvE -- killing PvE monsters.
    So there are people who harvest Tel Var. And then there are people who mug other people for Tel Var. That is exclusively the PvP part of the Imperial City DLC -- mugging people for Tel Var.
    Nothing in the Imperial City furthers the Three Banners War.

    Ironically, if players ONLY focussed on PvE monster-killing, they'd end up with a lot more Tel Var than trying to mug it from people. Without less fear of losing your Tel Var, you could concentrate on increasing your multiplier and killing the comparatively easy PvE monsters.
    Just like in real life, if you continually raid and destroy infrastructure you are just racing to the bottom. Instead, wealth comes from building infrastructure and civilized cooperation.
    But ZOS probably knows people are selfish and stupid and won't farm massive amounts of Tel Var that way.

    @ZOS_GinaBruno Thanks ZOS for a DLC that glorifies base criminal behaviour.

    IC is about small to medium scale player battles. Tell var is a feature and the main selling point is the pvp. It does affect the 3 banners war as you have fight for your factions control of the city. It also finishes up the main storyline with Molag Bal.

    They would have more telvar but they arent aiming for that. They are aiming to battle and if you're a farmer then you're going to get caught in the cross fire sometimes. Without the fear of losing telvar it would be worthless at this point. Just like in real life you have supply and demand. If you had an infinite and much easier to acquire telvar supply you wouldn't bother farming it as the prices for the items associated with it would drop drastically. Just like in real life people project and put their own assertions on things to better understand them, which is why you are so wrong about IC.

    Lol did you really whine and tag an admin overglorifing fake crime? Aside from how crazy and delusional that is, you know the Thieves guild and Dark Brotherhood are also about crime right?
  • Dusk_Coven
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    Lol did you really whine and tag an admin overglorifing fake crime? Aside from how crazy and delusional that is, you know the Thieves guild and Dark Brotherhood are also about crime right?

    Yes but there is a STORY there that actually has you coming out semi-heroic.
    the DB actually stabilized the region for the better, the local authorities contract you, and the sacraments are mostly about killing off bad people.
    The TG is a story about supposed betrayal and not about crime. After the prereqs (which is really a TUTORIAL about the aspects of the Justice System) you can do Spencer's quests to advance in TG.
    IC is about "troops" (more like freelance brigands) running amok pursuing their own looting agenda while there's a war raging.

    So no, not the same. As usual, PvE has better alternatives.

    As for finishing up the Molag Bal story line -- that's PVE. Nothing to do with the PvP activity that goes on there. Nice try.

    Edited by Dusk_Coven on September 8, 2019 4:35AM
  • StormChaser3000
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    Dusk_Coven wrote: »
    The design for IC was always "lambs to the slaughter." Seems like the point was to lure in PvE players to get ganked by nightblades.

    No risk vs reward at all. You go out and gank with 0 Tel Var, deposit in the bank, repeat. If you do get killed (unlikely) you lose nothing.

    And this is why the IC is extremely bad design compared to Cyrodiil.
    Cyrodiil is about war objectives and actual PvP OBJECTIVES -- taking land, trying to win the war and becoming emperor. There's a proper context for the PvP activity and AP is the measure of it.

    All the PvP activity in the Imperial City is about MUGGING PEOPLE for Tel Var.

    Tel Var ultimately comes from PvE -- killing PvE monsters.
    So there are people who harvest Tel Var. And then there are people who mug other people for Tel Var. That is exclusively the PvP part of the Imperial City DLC -- mugging people for Tel Var.
    Nothing in the Imperial City furthers the Three Banners War.

    Ironically, if players ONLY focussed on PvE monster-killing, they'd end up with a lot more Tel Var than trying to mug it from people. Without less fear of losing your Tel Var, you could concentrate on increasing your multiplier and killing the comparatively easy PvE monsters.
    Just like in real life, if you continually raid and destroy infrastructure you are just racing to the bottom. Instead, wealth comes from building infrastructure and civilized cooperation.
    But ZOS probably knows people are selfish and stupid and won't farm massive amounts of Tel Var that way.

    @ZOS_GinaBruno Thanks ZOS for a DLC that glorifies base criminal behaviour.

    Grinding people in IC is more fun than grinding monsters. Also, you get AP points when killing enemy faction players. The latter is more important for me personally.
  • Morgul667
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    I love IC

    Reminds me of old days mmo with risk and reward

    One of the few dlc i truely enjoy and advise to players
  • xF1REFL1x
    xF1REFL1x
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    Been at it everyday since event started... haven't seen one enemy... lol.

    Just got my tickets today and again never saw anyone. The sewers are pretty cool.
    Edited by xF1REFL1x on September 8, 2019 5:45AM
  • Rave the Histborn
    Rave the Histborn
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    Dusk_Coven wrote: »
    Lol did you really whine and tag an admin overglorifing fake crime? Aside from how crazy and delusional that is, you know the Thieves guild and Dark Brotherhood are also about crime right?

    Yes but there is a STORY there that actually has you coming out semi-heroic.
    the DB actually stabilized the region for the better, the local authorities contract you, and the sacraments are mostly about killing off bad people.
    The TG is a story about supposed betrayal and not about crime. After the prereqs (which is really a TUTORIAL about the aspects of the Justice System) you can do Spencer's quests to advance in TG.
    IC is about "troops" (more like freelance brigands) running amok pursuing their own looting agenda while there's a war raging.

    So no, not the same. As usual, PvE has better alternatives.

    As for finishing up the Molag Bal story line -- that's PVE. Nothing to do with the PvP activity that goes on there. Nice try.

    Yes, but there's also a STORY there that has you coming out completely heroic. You help the drake of blades light the sublime brazier setting up the future 3rd Empire vs you become semi-heroic to CRIMINAL ENTERPRISES IC isn't even real criminal activity, you're looting warriors of other factions so those are fairly won spoils of war. There's no comparison.

    To join the Dark Brotherhood you have to be willing to murder an innocent person. Even if it does stabilize the region for the better the criminality is worse. You then get contracted by a corrupt organization to carry out their corruption. The sacraments are ways to carry out vendettas as well, they're in no way heroic.

    The TG story is entirely about crime as you have to continually break into residential properties and steal things. It is only a story about honor and betrayal among thieves. I'm not sure you've actually played it.

    It doesn't matter what you wanna call the players in the IC it isn't criminal activity in any way, it's spoils of war which happens in real life as well. You just don't like it.

    As usual, a PvE player assumes something that isn't true because he's only experienced PvE.

    "Nothing in the Imperial City furthers the Three Banners War."
    "As for finishing up the Molag Bal story line"

    Freeing the Imperial City furthers the Three Banners War because the banner forces would then be able to focus on fighting each other and not the daedra too. It doesn't have to do directly with PVP, but if you actually played IC you'd know that. Nice try though.
  • VaranisArano
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    Dusk_Coven wrote: »
    Lol did you really whine and tag an admin overglorifing fake crime? Aside from how crazy and delusional that is, you know the Thieves guild and Dark Brotherhood are also about crime right?

    Yes but there is a STORY there that actually has you coming out semi-heroic.
    the DB actually stabilized the region for the better, the local authorities contract you, and the sacraments are mostly about killing off bad people.
    The TG is a story about supposed betrayal and not about crime. After the prereqs (which is really a TUTORIAL about the aspects of the Justice System) you can do Spencer's quests to advance in TG.
    IC is about "troops" (more like freelance brigands) running amok pursuing their own looting agenda while there's a war raging.

    So no, not the same. As usual, PvE has better alternatives.

    As for finishing up the Molag Bal story line -- that's PVE. Nothing to do with the PvP activity that goes on there. Nice try.

    The Molag Bal storyline in IC is only technically PVE because quests are by necessity limited to NPCs.

    That doesn't actually make it PVE. Its solidly PvPvE.

    The vast majority of the questline takes place in the PvPvE areas of the Districts and the Sewers. You can and probably will fight other players while completing the quest objectives. In fact, look at the Arena quest boss fight. There's an achievement for killing players in the arena! ZOS fully intended for PVP to be a part of the quest in a very organic, environmental way.

    The only PVE-only quest was the instanced Sublime Brazier at the end.
  • Vlad9425
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    I don’t mind IC actually and honestly it’s better when there isn’t as much people in there because it’s fun when you can get into some small scale fights but during the event there’s just zergs running over smaller groups...
  • lordrichter
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    Dusk_Coven wrote: »
    Ironically, if players ONLY focussed on PvE monster-killing, they'd end up with a lot more Tel Var than trying to mug it from people.

    Not as true as you might think.

    A PVE focused player might be killing a dozen or more mobs in the sewers, but the PVP ganker can get half of that simply by killing the PVE focused player once. Or by killing the PVP player that just killed the PVE player.



    PC North America since March 2014
    PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say NO to Crown Crates! You should be able to buy directly. Better yet, cosmetics should be in-game rewards!
    I collect free, unopened, virgin Crown Crates! 331, so far!

  • vamp_emily
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    I really think they should change IC a bit.. too many sissy boys running around trying to kill but they have 0 stones. Man Up! sissy boys! I know I am a coward NB but at least if you kill me you get rewarded.

    I think they should restrict the districts.. maybe lock them unless you are carrying 10k stones. Sissy boys can play in the sewers.

    If you want a friend, get a dog.
    AW Rank: Legate Grade 2 ( level 40 )

  • MajBludd
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    @xeha_arwen11 what you said about pvp can be said about pve.
    PVE has the biggest population of meek individuals I've ever seen.
    Care bear really is an appropriate tag.
    Edited by MajBludd on September 8, 2019 12:41PM
  • master_vanargand
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    IC is a *** simulator.
  • FlopsyPrince
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    Losing some Tel Var is fine. Losing it all or large chunks of it, so quickly is ludicrous.

    I just ran with several large zergs. Made barely any Tel Var when with the group, but lost the bunch we got for killing a huge mob in an instant with one death.

    Yeah, that will motivate me to play more IC, right? Not likely in the slightest.

    I can earn it in the sewers, but then one ganker and all my work is gone, so why bother?
    PS4
  • Mr_Walker
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    Dusk_Coven wrote: »
    Ironically, if players ONLY focussed on PvE monster-killing, they'd end up with a lot more Tel Var than trying to mug it from people.

    Not as true as you might think.

    A PVE focused player might be killing a dozen or more mobs in the sewers, but the PVP ganker can get half of that simply by killing the PVE focused player once. Or by killing the PVP player that just killed the PVE player.

    Uh, mathematically, he's right. Player kills only redistribute TV, not create it. A focus by players on pure TV collecting would yield more, overall, as people would not be distracted and wasting time chasing each other around.

  • Holycannoli
    Holycannoli
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    xF1REFL1x wrote: »
    Been at it everyday since event started... haven't seen one enemy... lol.

    Just got my tickets today and again never saw anyone. The sewers are pretty cool.

    How is that possible? Are you playing during off-hours in an unpopular campaign on an underpopulated platform? I see enemies all the time on PC NA, soloers to small groups to large zergs.
  • Marcus684
    Marcus684
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    xF1REFL1x wrote: »
    Been at it everyday since event started... haven't seen one enemy... lol.

    Just got my tickets today and again never saw anyone. The sewers are pretty cool.

    How is that possible? Are you playing during off-hours in an unpopular campaign on an underpopulated platform? I see enemies all the time on PC NA, soloers to small groups to large zergs.

    Probably playing while their alliance is zerging the sewer right outside their base. Takes a pretty ballsy ganker, or a large group, to face large numbers right outside the base, where if you die you can just respawn and come back out with nothing to lose.
  • Rave the Histborn
    Rave the Histborn
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    Mr_Walker wrote: »
    Dusk_Coven wrote: »
    Ironically, if players ONLY focussed on PvE monster-killing, they'd end up with a lot more Tel Var than trying to mug it from people.

    Not as true as you might think.

    A PVE focused player might be killing a dozen or more mobs in the sewers, but the PVP ganker can get half of that simply by killing the PVE focused player once. Or by killing the PVP player that just killed the PVE player.

    Uh, mathematically, he's right. Player kills only redistribute TV, not create it. A focus by players on pure TV collecting would yield more, overall, as people would not be distracted and wasting time chasing each other around.

    The gankers focus isn't to create tel var, that's just a reward for the gank, which is his original goal. I'm not saying your math is wrong, just the focus of pvp vs pve.
  • azjuwelz
    azjuwelz
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    Wow, that was crazy--and fun. Got to experience true PvPvE tonight when all 3 factions were going after the district boss. Players trying to kill the boss and trying to kill each other while the boss is trying to kill everyone. No event tickets for me on that one because of the reset timing, but got some AP and Tel Var and did manage to loot the boss.

    Yesterday was my first time in IC, though I've run around Cyrodil and I'm getting fairly good at bgs. I'm still mostly a PVE player. I wasn't thrilled by my 1st time in, but one I understood how to navigate the place, I started to enjoy it. Tried it both on my dps stamblade and my lower lvl warden healer.

    So for me it was "Do you like IC yet?"
    Edited by azjuwelz on September 9, 2019 4:47AM
  • barney2525
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    Great time earlier today. Got some achievements I was missing, killed some players, got killed by some players.

    Btw: why would a player not geared for PVP (pve player) go to a zone for PVP?



    (Not taking the bait, just stating the obvious for op, have stock in Orville Redenbacher 😉)


    Killing players is a little harsh.

    I just kill their characters


    :#
  • Mayrael
    Mayrael
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    I love it! Last event I've made almost 2 MIL Tel vars from soloing bosses. This time I am not killing any bosses because crowd is like 3 time higher (I believe it's because of event tickets) and you recieve funny amounts of TVs even with 4x multiplier and all 6 districtis.

    So what I do this year? I am killing people. Yes I gank them, I kill solo players, I kill 4 man groups slaughtering them without mercy. As for now my average score is around 80-90k Tel Vars per day 300 kills and about 20-30 deaths (mostly by zergs) ;) Much lower than soloing bosses but so much fun! I simply love it!.
    I am doing my best, but I am not a native speaker, sorry.

    Wow, that's good ZOS keeps an eye on such gamebreaking bugs!

    PTS 5.2.1 notes:
    "Fixed an issue where Mudcrabs in Hew’s Bane did not animate while moving."
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