Tired of "fake tanks" in random queues

Wispsister

Honestly the amount of people who queue for tank (and to a lesser degree, healer) in some cases and just do subpar DPS instead of the role they signed up for is super annoying.
If you queue as a tank, just please actually tank. It's common courtesy to do the role you signed up for. I get DPS queues are bad, but I didn't sit in a half-hour long queue either just to die over and over because we don't have a tank redirecting damage.
And before that that "uwu but if it's a normal then who cares" argument crops up, it doesn't matter what difficulty it is. You're still a jerk. Unless you can nuke everything into orbit and "tank" that way, you should just queue with a friend to cut the lines instead. The roles are there for a reason.

VaranisArano

In my experience, normal dungeons are very likely to have new players, inexperienced players, or low level characters who may not have all their self-healing figured out, don't have the confidence to stand and face tank the boss, who don't have the DPS to stack n burn, and who may not even know the mechanics.

In other words, normal dungeons are very likely to have exactly the sort of players who most benefit from an actual tank who holds aggro on the boss.

"Its just a normal dungeon" isn't a good excuse for queuing as a tank who can't hold aggro.

Davor

Another person who thinks they know how to play and others don't. You know lots of people like to play for fun so may not be "good" as you think you are.

Heaven forbid people want to play in a public game. After all, if you are so good, how come you are not making millions in cyber sports game? Ore even real life games and become a sports star?

VaranisArano

Davor wrote: »

Another person who thinks they know how to play and others don't. You know lots of people like to play for fun so may not be "good" as you think you are.

Heaven forbid people want to play in a public game. After all, if you are so good, how come you are not making millions in cyber sports game? Ore even real life games and become a sports star?

Are you talking about the OP? Or fake tanks?

I mean, fake tanks can't/won't even do the most basic job of the role they queued up for. In the process, they might have fun, but they often make the dungeon run less fun for their random group members because, well, someone has to take boss aggro.

redspecter23

Vote to kick a fake tank. If the vote fails, leave group. As long as fake tanks keep getting away with it, the practice will continue.

Either that or group with people you know whenever possible.

buttaface

Davor wrote: »

Another person who thinks they know how to play and others don't. You know lots of people like to play for fun so may not be "good" as you think you are.

Heaven forbid people want to play in a public game. After all, if you are so good, how come you are not making millions in cyber sports game? Ore even real life games and become a sports star?

Found the fake tank.

StormeReigns

buttaface wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Another person who thinks they know how to play and others don't. You know lots of people like to play for fun so may not be "good" as you think you are.

Heaven forbid people want to play in a public game. After all, if you are so good, how come you are not making millions in cyber sports game? Ore even real life games and become a sports star?

Found the fake tank.

Almost as fast as spotting the vegan. Although, i feel this game will offer greater entertainment.

Isojukka

Sometimes when i queue up with guildies we dont get that 4th guy and we happen to be 3 DDs so one of us need to be fake tank.no problem in normal non dlc dungeons.

quadraxis666

SkerKro wrote: »

buttaface wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Another person who thinks they know how to play and others don't. You know lots of people like to play for fun so may not be "good" as you think you are.

Heaven forbid people want to play in a public game. After all, if you are so good, how come you are not making millions in cyber sports game? Ore even real life games and become a sports star?

Found the fake tank.

Almost as fast as spotting the vegan. Although, i feel this game will offer greater entertainment.

There's never enough time to spot a vegan before they just come to you and tell you they're vegan...

morrowjen

Isojukka wrote: »

Sometimes when i queue up with guildies we dont get that 4th guy and we happen to be 3 DDs so one of us need to be fake tank.no problem in normal non dlc dungeons.

I was in a PUG of Moongrave Fane the other night. We wiped on the second boss pretty quickly on the first try. The tank bailed while the rest of us started in before realizing we no longer had a tank. We wound up beating the boss that try without him/her but we'd figured out the mechanics from the first wipe and we were all at a good level of CP. I don't think we could've done the whole dungeon without a tank but for a lot of dungeons you can dds the 'ell out of bosses before mechanics kick your rear end.

The problem with PUGs is you don't always luck out and get a group that has players who can make up for a fake tank or fake healer. If it's a mix of 1 or 2 experienced players with 2 low level ones both tanks and healers really are needed.

ZonasArch

VaranisArano wrote: »

In my experience, normal dungeons are very likely to have new players, inexperienced players, or low level characters who may not have all their self-healing figured out, don't have the confidence to stand and face tank the boss, who don't have the DPS to stack n burn, and who may not even know the mechanics.

In other words, normal dungeons are very likely to have exactly the sort of players who most benefit from an actual tank who holds aggro on the boss.

"Its just a normal dungeon" isn't a good excuse for queuing as a tank who can't hold aggro.

Would you agree that holding aggro to take damage is then good enough for queueing as a tank? Because I've been doing this slotting inner fire back bar, in a "if you can't win, join them" kinda deal. Got tired if waiting but I'm not a complete ***, and I can still pull at least a solid 20k doing "tanking" while self healing. Also have a few debuffs on bar, which helps.

Is this ok, to you? And others? Nobody has ever complained, tbh, as I'm used to real tanking and kinda know what to do,. Calling mechanics and all that...

MartiniDaniels

Carry 1 tanking set with S&B in your bag/banker, in case tank is fake just snap it and tank yourself. With exception maybe of MHK and couple of others you may tank as dps/wo problems in normals. Hell, pretty sure you may tank just by slotting inner fire/rage and using block/dodge/shield in majority of random normals.

So algorithm:
1. write in chat you will tank if they kick fake
2. kick fake, start tanking yourself

Davor

VaranisArano wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Another person who thinks they know how to play and others don't. You know lots of people like to play for fun so may not be "good" as you think you are.

Heaven forbid people want to play in a public game. After all, if you are so good, how come you are not making millions in cyber sports game? Ore even real life games and become a sports star?

Are you talking about the OP? Or fake tanks?

I mean, fake tanks can't/won't even do the most basic job of the role they queued up for. In the process, they might have fun, but they often make the dungeon run less fun for their random group members because, well, someone has to take boss aggro.

I am talking about the original poster. I didn't get the feeling he was talking about what you said, but that he/she was better than others so they shouldn't be a tank then. After all, if people are being fake, then why doesn't he/she become a tank? Or maybe he is a healer and the rest of the group think he is a fake healer or DPS?

From reading his post to me it screams "I am good, why are you not?" Who is to say he/she is any better?

buttaface wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Another person who thinks they know how to play and others don't. You know lots of people like to play for fun so may not be "good" as you think you are.

Heaven forbid people want to play in a public game. After all, if you are so good, how come you are not making millions in cyber sports game? Ore even real life games and become a sports star?

Found the fake tank.

Nope. I don't do dungeons because of people like you the 4 others who agree and original poster. I play for fun, not to be a sport jock. So nope you haven't found the Tank.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO

Wispsister wrote: »

Honestly the amount of people who queue for tank (and to a lesser degree, healer) in some cases and just do subpar DPS instead of the role they signed up for is super annoying.
If you queue as a tank, just please actually tank. It's common courtesy to do the role you signed up for. I get DPS queues are bad, but I didn't sit in a half-hour long queue either just to die over and over because we don't have a tank redirecting damage.
And before that that "uwu but if it's a normal then who cares" argument crops up, it doesn't matter what difficulty it is. You're still a jerk. Unless you can nuke everything into orbit and "tank" that way, you should just queue with a friend to cut the lines instead. The roles are there for a reason.

If we talking about vet or Normal DLC dungeons can see your argument.
But if we talk normal non DLC dungeons, I cannot think of any that needs anything other than a taunt, even if that's inner rage.

The biggest issue is fake DDs. Those who cannot do 20K between them, yet they try to do HM vet dungeons. And the moment the tank complains that Rkugamz takes too much time to die, after 15 minutes grinding is still 50%, you get verbally abused and kicked during the fight.

Wispsister

Davor wrote: »

I am talking about the original poster. I didn't get the feeling he was talking about what you said, but that he/she was better than others so they shouldn't be a tank then. After all, if people are being fake, then why doesn't he/she become a tank? Or maybe he is a healer and the rest of the group think he is a fake healer or DPS?

From reading his post to me it screams "I am good, why are you not?" Who is to say he/she is any better?

I play all 3 roles, so that assumption wasn't very on point. Sometimes I don't want to sign up as a tank. And lately that has meant a 50/50 dice roll on having a bad experience simply because people want to cut queue times.
I'm also not understanding why my expecting the player who signed up as a tank to actually perform the role he, once again, manually signed up for, makes me better than everyone, so please explain. I'll listen.

If you have an issue with what I said, then you're part of the problem and our queues are better off without you.

Wispsister

VaranisArano wrote: »

In my experience, normal dungeons are very likely to have new players, inexperienced players, or low level characters who may not have all their self-healing figured out, don't have the confidence to stand and face tank the boss, who don't have the DPS to stack n burn, and who may not even know the mechanics.

In other words, normal dungeons are very likely to have exactly the sort of players who most benefit from an actual tank who holds aggro on the boss.

"Its just a normal dungeon" isn't a good excuse for queuing as a tank who can't hold aggro.

Yeah, and I'm not talking about the people who are new and might not know you need sword/board for tanking or whatever. You have to learn and start somewhere. I'm talking about the people who start quipping and being rude in chat after you point out they aren't doing what they're supposed to.

Tryxus

ZonasArch wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

In my experience, normal dungeons are very likely to have new players, inexperienced players, or low level characters who may not have all their self-healing figured out, don't have the confidence to stand and face tank the boss, who don't have the DPS to stack n burn, and who may not even know the mechanics.

In other words, normal dungeons are very likely to have exactly the sort of players who most benefit from an actual tank who holds aggro on the boss.

"Its just a normal dungeon" isn't a good excuse for queuing as a tank who can't hold aggro.

Would you agree that holding aggro to take damage is then good enough for queueing as a tank? Because I've been doing this slotting inner fire back bar, in a "if you can't win, join them" kinda deal. Got tired if waiting but I'm not a complete ***, and I can still pull at least a solid 20k doing "tanking" while self healing. Also have a few debuffs on bar, which helps.

Is this ok, to you? And others? Nobody has ever complained, tbh, as I'm used to real tanking and kinda know what to do,. Calling mechanics and all that...

For random normal? That's def enough. It's the basics, but it's enough

I never expect much whenever I queue for dungeons, but I do hope that they at least can do the minimum that is required for their selected role: tanks holding aggro and not being overly squishy, healers keeping HP up and DPS doing damage and not being a dumdum

MrGhosty

Davor wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Another person who thinks they know how to play and others don't. You know lots of people like to play for fun so may not be "good" as you think you are.

Heaven forbid people want to play in a public game. After all, if you are so good, how come you are not making millions in cyber sports game? Ore even real life games and become a sports star?

Are you talking about the OP? Or fake tanks?

I mean, fake tanks can't/won't even do the most basic job of the role they queued up for. In the process, they might have fun, but they often make the dungeon run less fun for their random group members because, well, someone has to take boss aggro.

I am talking about the original poster. I didn't get the feeling he was talking about what you said, but that he/she was better than others so they shouldn't be a tank then. After all, if people are being fake, then why doesn't he/she become a tank? Or maybe he is a healer and the rest of the group think he is a fake healer or DPS?

From reading his post to me it screams "I am good, why are you not?" Who is to say he/she is any better?

buttaface wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Another person who thinks they know how to play and others don't. You know lots of people like to play for fun so may not be "good" as you think you are.

Heaven forbid people want to play in a public game. After all, if you are so good, how come you are not making millions in cyber sports game? Ore even real life games and become a sports star?

Found the fake tank.

Nope. I don't do dungeons because of people like you the 4 others who agree and original poster. I play for fun, not to be a sport jock. So nope you haven't found the Tank.

That isn't how I read it at all. "Fake Tank" is referencing someone who queues up as a tank to get faster match times into dungeons and then proceeds to not do the job of a tank. On most normal dungeons this isn't a huge deal, but even normal dlc dungeons can be rough when you're not maxxed out and with people who don't know the encounters.

This isn't a "i'm better at this than other people" post, it's a post of frustration that has bitten all of us at one time or another.

VaranisArano

ZonasArch wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

In my experience, normal dungeons are very likely to have new players, inexperienced players, or low level characters who may not have all their self-healing figured out, don't have the confidence to stand and face tank the boss, who don't have the DPS to stack n burn, and who may not even know the mechanics.

In other words, normal dungeons are very likely to have exactly the sort of players who most benefit from an actual tank who holds aggro on the boss.

"Its just a normal dungeon" isn't a good excuse for queuing as a tank who can't hold aggro.

Would you agree that holding aggro to take damage is then good enough for queueing as a tank? Because I've been doing this slotting inner fire back bar, in a "if you can't win, join them" kinda deal. Got tired if waiting but I'm not a complete ***, and I can still pull at least a solid 20k doing "tanking" while self healing. Also have a few debuffs on bar, which helps.

Is this ok, to you? And others? Nobody has ever complained, tbh, as I'm used to real tanking and kinda know what to do,. Calling mechanics and all that...

Personally, my base expectations for a real tank are "hold boss aggro and stay alive". It sounds like you do that and more!

VaranisArano

Davor wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Another person who thinks they know how to play and others don't. You know lots of people like to play for fun so may not be "good" as you think you are.

Heaven forbid people want to play in a public game. After all, if you are so good, how come you are not making millions in cyber sports game? Ore even real life games and become a sports star?

Are you talking about the OP? Or fake tanks?

I mean, fake tanks can't/won't even do the most basic job of the role they queued up for. In the process, they might have fun, but they often make the dungeon run less fun for their random group members because, well, someone has to take boss aggro.

I am talking about the original poster. I didn't get the feeling he was talking about what you said, but that he/she was better than others so they shouldn't be a tank then. After all, if people are being fake, then why doesn't he/she become a tank? Or maybe he is a healer and the rest of the group think he is a fake healer or DPS?

From reading his post to me it screams "I am good, why are you not?" Who is to say he/she is any better?

buttaface wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Another person who thinks they know how to play and others don't. You know lots of people like to play for fun so may not be "good" as you think you are.

Heaven forbid people want to play in a public game. After all, if you are so good, how come you are not making millions in cyber sports game? Ore even real life games and become a sports star?

Found the fake tank.

Nope. I don't do dungeons because of people like you the 4 others who agree and original poster. I play for fun, not to be a sport jock. So nope you haven't found the Tank.

You misinterpreted the OP. No offense meant here, but if you don't do dungeons, then I'm not surprised you don't understand the valid complaint the OP is making.

A fake tank or a fake healer is someone who deliberately queues up for the role of tank or healer with no intention of filling that role. They refuse to do so even when that makes the dungeon run harder or when asked by their group members to fill their role because they would rather be a damage dealer (and very often, their damage dealing is nothing to write home about.)

When players queue with the intention of "faking" by not filling the role they queued for in random groups, its essentially selfishly jumping the slower DD queue without caring about their random group members, and in many cases, expecting that their random group members will pick up the slack caused by not having a real tank to hold aggro or a real healer providing heals.

Its not a matter of "Just go make a tank, then!" I have a tank. My main character is a tank. But sometimes I like to play my DDs or my healer, and then, I want an actual tank who will hold boss aggro instead of my healer having to face tank the boss or frantically heal whatever inexperienced DD is panicking because they got boss aggro.

(I make an exception for pre-made groups, who can consent to running without a tank or healer. There's no fakery when everyone agrees to it, after all. But we're complaining about random groupings here.)

Between the problems having a fake tank or healer can cause for an unprepared group, the aggravation of having to face tank boss aggro on a non-tank, and the inherent rudeness of deliberately not filling the role you queued up for...its no surprise that players have complained about fake tanks and fake healers for years.

I hope that explains the matter at hand to you so you understand where the OP and most of us are coming from with our disdain for fake tanks and fake healers.

And as final word of advice, next time you might not want to be quite so insulting when you don't have the experience to understand the topic being discussed.

VaranisArano

Wispsister wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

In my experience, normal dungeons are very likely to have new players, inexperienced players, or low level characters who may not have all their self-healing figured out, don't have the confidence to stand and face tank the boss, who don't have the DPS to stack n burn, and who may not even know the mechanics.

In other words, normal dungeons are very likely to have exactly the sort of players who most benefit from an actual tank who holds aggro on the boss.

"Its just a normal dungeon" isn't a good excuse for queuing as a tank who can't hold aggro.

Yeah, and I'm not talking about the people who are new and might not know you need sword/board for tanking or whatever. You have to learn and start somewhere. I'm talking about the people who start quipping and being rude in chat after you point out they aren't doing what they're supposed to.

I totally agree.

I'm super happy to help a brand new tank figure out what to do.

But when its a normal dungeon and the high CP "tank" won't hold boss aggro so the level 25 DD gets the boss in his face and panics, then I'm less happy. With the tank. The "tank" ought to be doing his job, instead of letting the boss run rampant on other players.

The worst one I ever had was a fake tank who was yelling at the DD with aggro to "stand still!" Like, if he really wanted the boss to stay still, maybe he should have slotted a taunt...

ZonasArch

VaranisArano wrote: »

Wispsister wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

In my experience, normal dungeons are very likely to have new players, inexperienced players, or low level characters who may not have all their self-healing figured out, don't have the confidence to stand and face tank the boss, who don't have the DPS to stack n burn, and who may not even know the mechanics.

In other words, normal dungeons are very likely to have exactly the sort of players who most benefit from an actual tank who holds aggro on the boss.

"Its just a normal dungeon" isn't a good excuse for queuing as a tank who can't hold aggro.

Yeah, and I'm not talking about the people who are new and might not know you need sword/board for tanking or whatever. You have to learn and start somewhere. I'm talking about the people who start quipping and being rude in chat after you point out they aren't doing what they're supposed to.

I totally agree.

I'm super happy to help a brand new tank figure out what to do.

But when its a normal dungeon and the high CP "tank" won't hold boss aggro so the level 25 DD gets the boss in his face and panics, then I'm less happy. With the tank. The "tank" ought to be doing his job, instead of letting the boss run rampant on other players.

The worst one I ever had was a fake tank who was yelling at the DD with aggro to "stand still!" Like, if he really wanted the boss to stay still, maybe he should have slotted a taunt...

I get yelling at a cp810 DD to stand still(still a jerk move, but I get it), any max level DD should be able to take some punishment, but yelling at lowbies is just evil, doesn't even matter of you're a fake tank or not. Panicking is to be expected if you see a hugeass boss jumping on your face and you dont have the skills to take it.

Face tanking can be scary!

Austinseph1

Its the worst when a fake tank ques with another person and you literally cant even kick them. There goes my 40 min wait because there is nothing else I can do. Literally the only solution is to be a tank or not use the group finder. Im not built to face tank bosses and refuse to do so for another person's impatience.

Facefister

As long as there are fake DDs, there will be fake tanks. Deal with it. I won't take a 45 minutes tour through my daily random when I can burn through it with slotted vigor and inner fire in 10 minutes

VaranisArano

Facefister wrote: »

As long as there are fake DDs, there will be fake tanks. Deal with it. I won't take a 45 minutes tour through my daily random when I can burn through it with slotted vigor and inner fire in 10 minutes

Hey, as long as you hold aggro and don't die when the boss looks at you, you've met my basic requirement to be a real tank.

Zatox

Fake tank is not a problem, remove fake dd ( <40k DPS) from queue first.

TumlinTheJolly

If the 'fake tank' is taunting the bosses and not dying, then I don't see the problem. The extra dps is really nice.

Stebarnz

Random normal - doesn't need tank.
Random normal dlc - sometimes needs tank.
Random vet - sometimes needs tank.
Random vet dlc - always needs tank.

That is all.

Austinseph1

TumlinTheJolly wrote: »

If the 'fake tank' is taunting the bosses and not dying, then I don't see the problem. The extra dps is really nice.

A fake tank is somebody without a taunt or any form of crowd control that a tank would normally utilize. If you que as tank and dont have either thats the worst kind of person. I waited in line for my que, and I pull plenty of dps. But then my time is wasted and im stuck face tanking bosses because of it.

Wispsister

TumlinTheJolly wrote: »

If the 'fake tank' is taunting the bosses and not dying, then I don't see the problem. The extra dps is really nice.

If the "fake tank" is taunting then he isn't that fake. I mean those who don't hold aggro and don't bring any meaningful dps to the table, and make their group suffer for it. Which is how it is 9/10 times.

Canned_Apples

On normal difficulty, you only need a "real" tank for dlc dungeons and some part II dungeons- so as long as he has a taunt- you'll be fine.

I queue as a "tank" for all the pledges I know I can "fake tank" and only switch to my 0k dps tank when I need to do something that requires an actual tank.