Patch v5.1.5 is a joke

Agenericname

Kel wrote: »

Changes are a staple of any MMO. From FFXIV, to WoW, Neverwinter, to ESO. Armor, skills, classes themselves...all are subject to change.

No game in this genre stays the same. If you ever think a class or build will stay the same, you're only fooling yourself.
Maybe the MMO genre isn't for you....
(You in a general sense, not personal)

Yes, change is inevitable. Water is required for life. Deadly when inhaled. Sun light is a requirement also and can kill you from over exposure.

HowlKimchi

A lot of changes that seem to be changes for change's sake.

Why make heavy overload un-bashable? Why turn entropy, a perfectly fine utility skill into a super potent buff? Why rework power surge to suddenly be a healing skill? None of these contribute to balance.

I also notice that the write up of the recent patch notes are needlessly lengthy and try to use highfalutin words. Just be concise man.

Really not happy with the direction this combat team is going. I can't see how waiting for this "audit" of theirs to be complete to suddenly fix everything. They way they are standardizing everything sucks because they aren't achieving balance at all, but they're making every single class blander and blander after every update.

TheHsN

Kel wrote: »

Changes are a staple of any MMO. From FFXIV, to WoW, Neverwinter, to ESO. Armor, skills, classes themselves...all are subject to change.

No game in this genre stays the same. If you ever think a class or build will stay the same, you're only fooling yourself.
Maybe the MMO genre isn't for you....
(You in a general sense, not personal)

But they don't do that every 2 months... They do that every year with one big fat patch... So you can actually play with your build that you gave too much time and money. And you can enjoy it for 1 year... Not ONLY 2 MONTHS

SosRuvaak

they effectively killed 2 of my toon's builds and play styles with this patch.

Lylith

SosRuvaak wrote: »

they effectively killed 2 of my toon's builds and play styles with this patch.

only two?

j/k, i really haven't checked all mine, but i've had to adjust every one i've looked at so far.

seems like the more i read the tooltips, the worse it gets, too.

WaltherCarraway

Fengrush had played for less than two hours yesterday and people started asking him what’s the meta what’s the build lol

Kel

Look, no one said you have to like the changes. You absolutely don't. You're also completely free to think it's the stupidest thing ever...I know I do.

I've said it thousands of times, each and every patch/update/chapter.

I'm never surprised by changes. Im always surprised players don't think changes will happen.

We as players certainly don't have to like it. But we do have to accept its inevitability.

The frequency of changes or weither or not we agree with them is irrelevant.

Saucy_Jack

I guess what I don't understand about the OP's rant is this: they're complaining that the build that they've worked so hard to get and improve to gold is useless, and now they have to start all over - but then they say they'd be OK with the CP cap on gear going up to 200.

You know that if the gear cap was increased to CP 200, then all your CP 160 gear - which you worked so hard to get and improve to gold - would be just as, if not more, obsolete? Either way you'd be starting from the ground up.

Jagdkommando

MaleAmazon wrote: »

IMO changes are fine... or at least decent. Take Nightblade Relentless Focus. They made it so it is now a useful buff and you have the choice to spend the buff for burst damage. The 3% mitigation was a bit over the top, 2% is fine. Some people wanted it to stay the same as it always was, well tough. It´s not like it´s unheard of, in fact I don´t remember a multiplayer game regularly patched that didn´t have these kinds of changes (Teuton TCs in AoE2, I remember you...).

The problem for me is this: there is virtually nowhere in the game where the skills really matter;

I play quests, well you shred everything including bosses. Pledges? I can shred through on normal and most of the veteran rewards don´t seem good enough for me to sit in a queue for 15 mins, also I don´t want to invest in a guild for vet trials at the moment. PvP? Meh, been there done that.

I´ll just semi-hijack this thread and say that what this game needs is a new arena like Maelstrom, a veteran mode for questing, and maybe something like a 'survive for as long as you can vs waves of enemies'-zone. Something to keep the interest up for those of us who have finished the SP portions of the game and don´t feel like investing so much time into getting skins, motifs, whatever.

Now just for the people saying 'it´s an MMO moron, M for multiplayer'. Well, ESO was always marketed as a game where you could have a single player experience. It has just been woefully neglected over the years and I for one won´t subscribe again until the SP portion of the game grabs my interest again.

You *** kidding me right??? You really think Relentless changes are right??? Changing good offense skill nb has in *** defense skill is right???
You probably got no f... idea what im talking about, normal dungeon runner...
Somebody put a tape over MaleAmazon’s mouth, he is spending my time.

AndyMac

WaltherCarraway wrote: »

Fengrush had played for less than two hours yesterday and people started asking him what’s the meta what’s the build lol

Is it stam necro? I note from another thread that the PVE DPS king is stam necro.

Yep - change is a part of the game, but so is selling expansions. And monetisation is a huge part of this game. Call me a cynic but possibly the nerfs are about “encouraging” people to buy
Elsweyr

The last time ZOS introduced a new class - warden In Morrowind- the sustain nerf was massive. I hear 80% of endgame quit lol.

Idk but if your build turns up broken when a new class locked to an expansion is introduced, you probably shouldn’t be too surprised.

Ufretin

Working as intended. You're supposed to farm new gear and grind new skills for every patch to inflate player numbers and activity, number of players logging on daily and hours played. That's what matters, not actual customer satisfaction.

maboleth

Whoever thought that applying degeneration/entropy dot was FUN should've been immediately fired.

But no, it's ZOS' latest invention. Applying entropy is like pressing the button for an elevator or turning on the microwave. You do it to get the job done, not to have fun.

DOTs generally are no fun, but this "skill" line is just terrible. I never minded having it as one of the tools, but now, seeing it as a "must" for mag sorc makes me cringe.

Jagdkommando

AndyMac wrote: »

WaltherCarraway wrote: »

Fengrush had played for less than two hours yesterday and people started asking him what’s the meta what’s the build lol

Is it stam necro? I note from another thread that the PVE DPS king is stam necro.

Yep - change is a part of the game, but so is selling expansions. And monetisation is a huge part of this game. Call me a cynic but possibly the nerfs are about “encouraging” people to buy
Elsweyr

The last time ZOS introduced a new class - warden In Morrowind- the sustain nerf was massive. I hear 80% of endgame quit lol.

Idk but if your build turns up broken when a new class locked to an expansion is introduced, you probably shouldn’t be too surprised.

Wrong: nerfs pushing players to unsub rather rhan buy
Simple example: when maths teacher encouraging student like “Yes you can, its ok you failed, next time you will be the best” this is pushing the student to study harder (pay more money to zos in our case)

And if maths teacher tells opposite like “you dumb, you are doing it wrong, you will never success” student will give up and tell teacher gtfo, and will become painter))

Bouldercleave

I guess I'm just too much of a casual to notice. I played for a good long while last night and the only thing that really annoyed me is that several of my addons need updating.

I noticed almost no significant change in playability.

Jagdkommando

Bouldercleave wrote: »

I guess I'm just too much of a casual to notice. I played for a good long while last night and the only thing that really annoyed me is that several of my addons need updating.

I noticed almost no significant change in playability.

This is why we are getting happy when see cp810+ players in random, and then.... just leaving the dungeon to save our nerves...

And this is why you didnt notice any changes...
Writing this and my fingers and eyes remember that 400ms downbreaker desynchronization...

Casterial

OP, you know nothing. I've been here for years. Anyone who survived the 1.5 to 1.6 change (softcaps to min/max system) had the hardest adapting time.

kargen27

Save all your armor things like this often happen in a circle.

Jeremy

Nemesis7884 wrote: »

Kel wrote: »

Changes are a staple of any MMO. From FFXIV, to WoW, Neverwinter, to ESO. Armor, skills, classes themselves...all are subject to change.

No game in this genre stays the same. If you ever think a class or build will stay the same, you're only fooling yourself.
Maybe the MMO genre isn't for you....
(You in a general sense, not personal)

NONSENSE - i dont know ONE mmo who has so many so frequent so drastic changes to complete overhauls to classes and skills as eso - without direction or purpose that no one asked for and mostly just break things

The eso team has just no direction at all - one team runs to the left and the next runs to the right - their direction is simply horrible if at all existant

Yeah, I agree. It's been ridiculous lately,

Though keep in mind a new combat team has recently taken over. So they have to correct many of the faults the previous one handed off to them. Hopefully once the new team gets settled in these constant nerfs and buffs will be at an end. We'll see how this new team copes with the changes going forward. If they start reverting them back and forth again like the last team I"ll come over to your side of it.

maboleth wrote: »

Whoever thought that applying degeneration/entropy dot was FUN should've been immediately fired.

But no, it's ZOS' latest invention. Applying entropy is like pressing the button for an elevator or turning on the microwave. You do it to get the job done, not to have fun.

DOTs generally are no fun, but this "skill" line is just terrible. I never minded having it as one of the tools, but now, seeing it as a "must" for mag sorc makes me cringe.

What's the difference in using entropy vs say shards? Isn't it basically the same thing? You target the player - hit the hotkey for Entropy - player gets hit. Isn't that how most other abilities work?

I don't play sorcerer so I can't really comment directly. But Entropy needed some buffs. It was pretty awful before. Now it's a powerful spell in its own right. And considering the limited amount of abilities you can equip on this game I believe it's important to make them all good. Otherwise no one is going to give up a precious spot on their hotbar to use it.

SosRuvaak

Lylith wrote: »

SosRuvaak wrote: »

they effectively killed 2 of my toon's builds and play styles with this patch.

only two?

j/k, i really haven't checked all mine, but i've had to adjust every one i've looked at so far.

seems like the more i read the tooltips, the worse it gets, too.

The senche set was a pretty big core to my build that is now screwed.

GhostofDatthaw

Just be like me. Horde every set for a single spec, mag or Stam. Then only play mag or Stam toons. I only play mag toons. They nerf one set I go to my mule and grab a different one.

Is it ideal? No. But with limited inventory and limited will to farm... As Spock says, it's only logical

Jaraal

You youngsters don't know how good it used to be! Back in my day, a Bosmer sorcerer werewolf was a force to be reckoned with! We could steal, and kill, and raid, and win....... we were invincible! (Well, except for those loading screens every 30 seconds in Cyrodiil, we never could figure those out...) So don't cry and moan, learn to adapt! You can be great once again! Find that new meta (until the next quarter) and kick some behinds!


*steps off soapbox, logs in to claim his daily reward, logs out....*

HowlKimchi

Jeremy wrote: »

But Entropy needed some buffs. It was pretty awful before. Now it's a powerful spell in its own right. And considering the limited amount of abilities you can equip on this game I believe it's important to make them all good. Otherwise no one is going to give up a precious spot on their hotbar to use it.

I disagree. Not every skill should be super powerful that makes it an auto-include. What every skill should have is a good niche. Which entropy pre-scalebreaker had. It was an easy way to get major sorcery for classes with no reliable way to get the buff, that had some minor synergies with skoria/ele drain. Now it's a super powerful dot that also gives major sorcery which is an auto-include, which leads to boring build crafting and low diversity.

master_vanargand

ZoS was hijacked by Joker.
Batman! Please save Tamriel.

Jeremy

HaruKamui wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

But Entropy needed some buffs. It was pretty awful before. Now it's a powerful spell in its own right. And considering the limited amount of abilities you can equip on this game I believe it's important to make them all good. Otherwise no one is going to give up a precious spot on their hotbar to use it.

I disagree. Not every skill should be super powerful that makes it an auto-include. What every skill should have is a good niche. Which entropy pre-scalebreaker had. It was an easy way to get major sorcery for classes with no reliable way to get the buff, that had some minor synergies with skoria/ele drain. Now it's a super powerful dot that also gives major sorcery which is an auto-include, which leads to boring build crafting and low diversity.

I didn't say "auto-include". But it does need to be good enough to the point people would actually want to use it. It might be a little high at the moment. But converting it into an ability you would actually want to use for damage was a good change in my opinion.

Rake

You know, in elder scrolls legends if they nerf some cards they refund you.
Would be nice to see compensation for now dead sets in some sort.

maboleth

Jeremy wrote: »

Nemesis7884 wrote: »

Kel wrote: »

Changes are a staple of any MMO. From FFXIV, to WoW, Neverwinter, to ESO. Armor, skills, classes themselves...all are subject to change.

No game in this genre stays the same. If you ever think a class or build will stay the same, you're only fooling yourself.
Maybe the MMO genre isn't for you....
(You in a general sense, not personal)

NONSENSE - i dont know ONE mmo who has so many so frequent so drastic changes to complete overhauls to classes and skills as eso - without direction or purpose that no one asked for and mostly just break things

The eso team has just no direction at all - one team runs to the left and the next runs to the right - their direction is simply horrible if at all existant

Yeah, I agree. It's been ridiculous lately,

Though keep in mind a new combat team has recently taken over. So they have to correct many of the faults the previous one handed off to them. Hopefully once the new team gets settled in these constant nerfs and buffs will be at an end. We'll see how this new team copes with the changes going forward. If they start reverting them back and forth again like the last team I"ll come over to your side of it.

maboleth wrote: »

Whoever thought that applying degeneration/entropy dot was FUN should've been immediately fired.

But no, it's ZOS' latest invention. Applying entropy is like pressing the button for an elevator or turning on the microwave. You do it to get the job done, not to have fun.

DOTs generally are no fun, but this "skill" line is just terrible. I never minded having it as one of the tools, but now, seeing it as a "must" for mag sorc makes me cringe.

What's the difference in using entropy vs say shards? Isn't it basically the same thing?

No. Shards are fun. You get the sense of "hit", of damage, of fight, of something being done. There's a sound of crushing, etc. You also wait for it to be charged.

With entropy it's just... nothing. 'Okay I pressed it to drain the HP of the enemy.' The end. No sense of any fight, challenge or FUN. I have nothing against Entropy as a niche tool for some builds, but now it's overused be so many people because it's strong. It's like - oh you have to use it if you are mag sorc.

psycoprophet

Kel wrote: »

Changes are a staple of any MMO. From FFXIV, to WoW, Neverwinter, to ESO. Armor, skills, classes themselves...all are subject to change.

No game in this genre stays the same. If you ever think a class or build will stay the same, you're only fooling yourself.
Maybe the MMO genre isn't for you....
(You in a general sense, not personal)

Gw2 does and it gets so stale because of it. I hate nerf patches as much as anyone but I agree overall change is good even if sometimes effects u relatively it's still a better outcome than the the game being stagnant.

Gandrhulf_Harbard

psycoprophet wrote: »

Gw2 does and it gets so stale because of it. I hate nerf patches as much as anyone but I agree overall change is good even if sometimes effects u relatively it's still a better outcome than the the game being stagnant.

The abilities on your skill bar are not what makes a game stale, the content of the game is.


All The Best

yodased

Uryel wrote: »

Artanonh wrote: »

You build up a char for a long time laboriously and costly, experimenting with armor and skills until you finally have your char so that he is optimal. Spends a lot of gold to get the armor (just for jewelry) on Legendary.
And then one day Zeni comes along and throws half of everything over the pile

Funny that, when people who had spent over 4 years building their Bosmer thief complained about the loss of their stealth, most reactions were like "bah, who cares, Bosmers are better that way" (which they are not), "nobody cares about RP" (that's gameplay, actually) and whatnot.

But a small adjustment to armors and skills, that merely requires to change a few habits and tweak some gear, as opposed to completely breaking and removing a race bonus that can NOT be replaced by any mean, is now cause for significant outcry ?

I really don't understand people. Oh, yeah, actually I do. Nerfing s*** to hell and back is okay if it doesn't happen to them.

Can you even enter a post without mentioning bosmers? We get it you love bosmer stealth and are upset.

To the OP this is a horizontal progression game. If they didn't do what they do ypu probably would quit from boredom and if they raised gearcap arbitrarily all you are doing is refunding the same meta gear in higher stats.

Its fluid and they aren't done. Take a break for 6 months and come back it will be different again.

Tandor

JahneeO wrote: »

Man, this happens every update.

The only thing that changes is who is doing the complaining.
As someone said above, this stuff only matters when it happens to you.

Well, it happens to everyone, I'm pretty sure when these changes hit the XboneX, I won't even notice.
But, then again, I am just a filthy casual who plays this game to have fun.

Agreed.

As with all updates, 5% think "it's the worst patch ever", 5% think "it's the best patch ever", and 90% think "what patch?"