ZoS - Why the silence on housing?
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Aurie✭✭✭✭✭
✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »Greetings, there seems to be a lot of concern and misconception about the closure of several housing threads. We'd like to clarify that creating threads that simply bash the dev team and are not constructive in any way are not permitted. In addition, threads or posts that are discussing moderation action are also not permitted.
These rules have always been pillars in our community forum guidelines and we uphold them across all topics discussed on the ESO forums.
We hope everyone understands that they are free to discuss their opinion on housing suggestions or changes, as long as the conversation can remain constructive and civil. This means suggestions or critiques are provided without personal insults directed at either the dev team or other community members who may not share your opinion. If you ever have a question related to forum moderation, we encourage you to reach out to a moderator for clarification on an action that was taken. We are more than happy to discuss it with you.
How about someone on your staff engage the community in actual dialogue regarding the problem, instead of just saying "be nice". Making paying customers feel like their complaints and concerns aren't important is the easiest way to lose those customers.
Indeed.
The above member of staff did go to a bit more trouble to express a view, which is unusual and somewhat refreshing, whether we agree with it or not, and even though it doesn’t do anything to solve any concerns. Maybe we should be thankful for that if nothing else.
But normally one gets the impression that ZOS moderators find it less trouble just to post a rather generic copy/paste ‘be nice’ few lines (to put it politely), instead of actually addressing problems and taking the time and effort to talk to the paying community.
1 -
Royaji✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »Greetings, there seems to be a lot of concern and misconception about the closure of several housing threads. We'd like to clarify that creating threads that simply bash the dev team and are not constructive in any way are not permitted. In addition, threads or posts that are discussing moderation action are also not permitted.
These rules have always been pillars in our community forum guidelines and we uphold them across all topics discussed on the ESO forums.
We hope everyone understands that they are free to discuss their opinion on housing suggestions or changes, as long as the conversation can remain constructive and civil. This means suggestions or critiques are provided without personal insults directed at either the dev team or other community members who may not share your opinion. If you ever have a question related to forum moderation, we encourage you to reach out to a moderator for clarification on an action that was taken. We are more than happy to discuss it with you.
How about someone on your staff engage the community in actual dialogue regarding the problem, instead of just saying "be nice". Making paying customers feel like their complaints and concerns aren't important is the easiest way to lose those customers.
Indeed.
The above member of staff did go to a bit more trouble to express a view, which is unusual and somewhat refreshing, whether we agree with it or not, and even though it doesn’t do anything to solve any concerns. Maybe we should be thankful for that if nothing else.
But normally one gets the impression that ZOS moderators find it less trouble just to post a rather generic copy/paste ‘be nice’ few lines (to put it politely), instead of actually addressing problems and taking the time and effort to talk to the paying community.
Because forum moderators are just forum moderators. They are here to deal with the forum rules and are not authorised to talk about and probably have as little clue as you do about the development side of things.3 -
darthgummibear_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »Greetings, there seems to be a lot of concern and misconception about the closure of several housing threads. We'd like to clarify that creating threads that simply bash the dev team and are not constructive in any way are not permitted. In addition, threads or posts that are discussing moderation action are also not permitted.
These rules have always been pillars in our community forum guidelines and we uphold them across all topics discussed on the ESO forums.
We hope everyone understands that they are free to discuss their opinion on housing suggestions or changes, as long as the conversation can remain constructive and civil. This means suggestions or critiques are provided without personal insults directed at either the dev team or other community members who may not share your opinion. If you ever have a question related to forum moderation, we encourage you to reach out to a moderator for clarification on an action that was taken. We are more than happy to discuss it with you.
How about someone on your staff engage the community in actual dialogue regarding the problem, instead of just saying "be nice". Making paying customers feel like their complaints and concerns aren't important is the easiest way to lose those customers.
Indeed.
The above member of staff did go to a bit more trouble to express a view, which is unusual and somewhat refreshing, whether we agree with it or not, and even though it doesn’t do anything to solve any concerns. Maybe we should be thankful for that if nothing else.
But normally one gets the impression that ZOS moderators find it less trouble just to post a rather generic copy/paste ‘be nice’ few lines (to put it politely), instead of actually addressing problems and taking the time and effort to talk to the paying community.
Because forum moderators are just forum moderators. They are here to deal with the forum rules and are not authorised to talk about and probably have as little clue as you do about the development side of things.
Don't you realize that actually makes it worse? We have practically zero communication from the actual dev team.3 -
Royaji✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »Greetings, there seems to be a lot of concern and misconception about the closure of several housing threads. We'd like to clarify that creating threads that simply bash the dev team and are not constructive in any way are not permitted. In addition, threads or posts that are discussing moderation action are also not permitted.
These rules have always been pillars in our community forum guidelines and we uphold them across all topics discussed on the ESO forums.
We hope everyone understands that they are free to discuss their opinion on housing suggestions or changes, as long as the conversation can remain constructive and civil. This means suggestions or critiques are provided without personal insults directed at either the dev team or other community members who may not share your opinion. If you ever have a question related to forum moderation, we encourage you to reach out to a moderator for clarification on an action that was taken. We are more than happy to discuss it with you.
How about someone on your staff engage the community in actual dialogue regarding the problem, instead of just saying "be nice". Making paying customers feel like their complaints and concerns aren't important is the easiest way to lose those customers.
Indeed.
The above member of staff did go to a bit more trouble to express a view, which is unusual and somewhat refreshing, whether we agree with it or not, and even though it doesn’t do anything to solve any concerns. Maybe we should be thankful for that if nothing else.
But normally one gets the impression that ZOS moderators find it less trouble just to post a rather generic copy/paste ‘be nice’ few lines (to put it politely), instead of actually addressing problems and taking the time and effort to talk to the paying community.
Because forum moderators are just forum moderators. They are here to deal with the forum rules and are not authorised to talk about and probably have as little clue as you do about the development side of things.
Don't you realize that actually makes it worse? We have practically zero communication from the actual dev team.
I'm not sure how it makes anything worse. ZOS and their communication is a meme. Pretty much the same as every other game developer under the sun. Still not sure why people expect forum moderators to fix it...2 -
darthgummibear_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »Greetings, there seems to be a lot of concern and misconception about the closure of several housing threads. We'd like to clarify that creating threads that simply bash the dev team and are not constructive in any way are not permitted. In addition, threads or posts that are discussing moderation action are also not permitted.
These rules have always been pillars in our community forum guidelines and we uphold them across all topics discussed on the ESO forums.
We hope everyone understands that they are free to discuss their opinion on housing suggestions or changes, as long as the conversation can remain constructive and civil. This means suggestions or critiques are provided without personal insults directed at either the dev team or other community members who may not share your opinion. If you ever have a question related to forum moderation, we encourage you to reach out to a moderator for clarification on an action that was taken. We are more than happy to discuss it with you.
How about someone on your staff engage the community in actual dialogue regarding the problem, instead of just saying "be nice". Making paying customers feel like their complaints and concerns aren't important is the easiest way to lose those customers.
Indeed.
The above member of staff did go to a bit more trouble to express a view, which is unusual and somewhat refreshing, whether we agree with it or not, and even though it doesn’t do anything to solve any concerns. Maybe we should be thankful for that if nothing else.
But normally one gets the impression that ZOS moderators find it less trouble just to post a rather generic copy/paste ‘be nice’ few lines (to put it politely), instead of actually addressing problems and taking the time and effort to talk to the paying community.
Because forum moderators are just forum moderators. They are here to deal with the forum rules and are not authorised to talk about and probably have as little clue as you do about the development side of things.
Don't you realize that actually makes it worse? We have practically zero communication from the actual dev team.
I'm not sure how it makes anything worse. ZOS and their communication is a meme. Pretty much the same as every other game developer under the sun. Still not sure why people expect forum moderators to fix it...
People don't actually expect forum moderators to wave a magic wand, what they expect is communication from actual developers...you know, the people who actually make these asinine design choices.2 -
Imperial_Voice✭✭✭✭✭
✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »Greetings, there seems to be a lot of concern and misconception about the closure of several housing threads. We'd like to clarify that creating threads that simply bash the dev team and are not constructive in any way are not permitted. In addition, threads or posts that are discussing moderation action are also not permitted.
These rules have always been pillars in our community forum guidelines and we uphold them across all topics discussed on the ESO forums.
We hope everyone understands that they are free to discuss their opinion on housing suggestions or changes, as long as the conversation can remain constructive and civil. This means suggestions or critiques are provided without personal insults directed at either the dev team or other community members who may not share your opinion. If you ever have a question related to forum moderation, we encourage you to reach out to a moderator for clarification on an action that was taken. We are more than happy to discuss it with you.
How about someone on your staff engage the community in actual dialogue regarding the problem, instead of just saying "be nice". Making paying customers feel like their complaints and concerns aren't important is the easiest way to lose those customers.
Indeed.
The above member of staff did go to a bit more trouble to express a view, which is unusual and somewhat refreshing, whether we agree with it or not, and even though it doesn’t do anything to solve any concerns. Maybe we should be thankful for that if nothing else.
But normally one gets the impression that ZOS moderators find it less trouble just to post a rather generic copy/paste ‘be nice’ few lines (to put it politely), instead of actually addressing problems and taking the time and effort to talk to the paying community.
Because forum moderators are just forum moderators. They are here to deal with the forum rules and are not authorised to talk about and probably have as little clue as you do about the development side of things.
Don't you realize that actually makes it worse? We have practically zero communication from the actual dev team.
I'm not sure how it makes anything worse. ZOS and their communication is a meme. Pretty much the same as every other game developer under the sun. Still not sure why people expect forum moderators to fix it...
People don't actually expect forum moderators to wave a magic wand, what they expect is communication from actual developers...you know, the people who actually make these asinine design choices.
You have to ignore him as he literally only comes here to whiteknight ZoS.
Id also like to say I took that moderator up on their offer and PMd her asking a few questions. She refused to answer anything I asked her and told me to send an email to customer support about it instead.6 -
Aurie✭✭✭✭✭
✭Imperial_Voice wrote: »
You have to ignore him as he literally only comes here to whiteknight ZoS.
Id also like to say I took that moderator up on their offer and PMd her asking a few questions. She refused to answer anything I asked her and told me to send an email to customer support about it instead.
1. Yes, that's why I didn't reply to his comment on my post.
2. How extraordinary. Did she give any indication why she wasn't prepared to answer your questions? The trouble is that you won't get any joy out of Customer Support, as we all know. I don't know what questions you asked, but if they were concerned with moderation and after encouraging us to reach out to a moderator with any moderation questions, it sounds very much like passing the buck.1 -
Imperial_Voice✭✭✭✭✭
✭Imperial_Voice wrote: »
You have to ignore him as he literally only comes here to whiteknight ZoS.
Id also like to say I took that moderator up on their offer and PMd her asking a few questions. She refused to answer anything I asked her and told me to send an email to customer support about it instead.
1. Yes, that's why I didn't reply to his comment on my post.
2. How extraordinary. Did she give any indication why she wasn't prepared to answer your questions? The trouble is that you won't get any joy out of Customer Support, as we all know. I don't know what questions you asked, but if they were concerned with moderation and after encouraging us to reach out to a moderator with any moderation questions, it sounds very much like passing the buck.
No she just kept deflecting from my question by talking about unrelated things and finally I asked her why was refusing to answer me she just told me to email customer support and stopped responding.
To be clear, the question was "Why do the devs refuse to communicate with housing forums?"2 -
StabbityDoom✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I think dismissing the free home in elsweyr as a monstrosity is a disservice to zos. Fact is, they gave us a large home - essentially free with elsweyr. If you don’t like it, fine, but it’s still an answer to our requests and even a bonus of being free. What others have said is true - there are indeed problems but we need to acknowledge we are moving in the right direction. As for lack of communication, the reason we got answers in the eso live is because the people who make the decisions were there. It is likely not the devs job to scour the forums for things to answer, mods probably are the only ones paid to do that. So while a communication via forums would be nice, we shouldn’t expect it here and instead push to have the housing dude on eso live again for questions. That might indeed happen!Edited by StabbityDoom on May 25, 2019 6:12PM5 -
Tigerseye✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭StabbityDoom wrote: »I think dismissing the free home in elsweyr as a monstrosity is a disservice to zos. Fact is, they gave us a large home - essentially free with elsweyr. If you don’t like it, fine, but it’s still an answer to our requests and even a bonus of being free. What others have said is true - there are indeed problems but we need to acknowledge we are moving in the right direction. As for lack of communication, the reason we got answers in the eso live is because the people who make the decisions were there. It is likely not the devs job to scour the forums for things to answer, mods probably are the only ones paid to do that. So while a communication via forums would be nice, we shouldn’t expect it here and instead push to have the housing dude on eso live again for questions. That might indeed happen!
No, it's a monstrosity, with a permanently buzzing laser disco ball and immovable stone plinths, which get in the way of any potential furnishing plan and it's not even in a handy location.
The tiny inn room is right near it and in a better location.
Not only that, but I am haemorrhaging gold, because I'm;
a) Fighting dragons all day, just to get a few green plans. Not one purple, please note. Might have got one blue.
When they award very, very little gold and cost you a fortune in repairs/eat through your repair kits.
b) Trying to find the gold to buy a few, highly overpriced, blue plans.
It's hell and what for?
A truly awful house.
Did they fire the Alinor Townhouse people, or something?
Because I simply can't believe the same people, who designed that, designed this.
I have to tell the truth, that is who I am.
I don't want to offend anyone, but there you go.
...and it's not "free" - nothing is - we [over]paid for it, when we bought the xpac.
We are most certainly NOT "moving in the right direction", as far as I am concerned.
Quite the reverse.Edited by Tigerseye on May 26, 2019 2:58AM2 -
Tigerseye✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭So the item cap can't be increased, then how about adding the clutter items we keep asking, which will help with the item count? Like filled bookcases, planters, food dishes, piles of books and scrolls, stairs, filled shelves or cabinets, small tents, etc - all in different styles, not only the new expansion or DLC! Most of these things are already in the game, there are so many threads with pictures with these requests! I think this is the easiest way to "solve" the item cap. Most of us are running out of slots because we want to arrange clutter or create structures which require many many small items. Why don't you allow us to use these items that for the most part, are already in the game for years!
Yes.
...and yet, what do they do?
The opposite.
Instead of introducing a new upholstered sofa in a larger size and different colour (ideally neutral, or maybe pale blue) - which would have been highly appropriate, given the Khajiit invented the only other one in the game - they, instead, only provide completely un-upholstered wooden bench-type "sofas".
Meaning you would need to use, at least, 4 items and anything up to 7, to create a comfortable-looking sofa (with cushions), using them.
If they wanted that bench-type style, despite it being inconsistent with the previous Khajiit sofa, then why didn't they (also) offer the option of a couple of them with several cushions already on them?
A very tidy one and a more chaotic-looking one, for example.
But, no - just bare benches, with separate cushions.
I think the pattern for one of those cushions (the wide one) is extremely rare, as well (assuming it's even available, in-game).
Despite it being a green quality one and being kind of vital, to try to make a sofa out of a bare wooden bench...
I've just had enough, frankly...
Most of us have spent more than enough money, already, without being expected to fork out even more Crowns/real money for a stupid cushion, which should just have come with the "sofa" in the first place.
Meanwhile, Trial players (many of whom don't even sub, or do housing!) get free furnishing items, which aren't available any other way as far as I know(?), along with their free mount.
You couldn't make it up.Edited by Tigerseye on May 26, 2019 4:20AM3 -
Tigerseye✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Imperial_Voice wrote: »Dont worry guys, theyve obviously listened to our feedback with Elsweyr, thats why they gavr us more giant unfillable houses and a $60 training dummy. Thats exactly what we all wanted right?
If I'm not mistaken, the last 3 houses released were Arena, Frostvault and Snowglobe. 2 out of 3 were medium.
Elsweyr will have 3. One large, one small and ... one free.
...and the only one worth having is the inn room.
Something is definitely wrong, here.
0 -
Tigerseye✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭By the way, I was referring to the 3 Elsweyr ones, when I said only the inn room is worth having.
However, my ambiguity may have been somewhat Freudian, as I am also not a fan of two of the other three.
They seem to have gone down a very traditionally masculine housing path, lately, as opposed to the houses being designed to appeal to everyone equally
I think it was fair enough to go slightly more masculine, with the arena, for those who like that (especially as Summerset was more on the traditionally feminine side), but for one after the other, since then, to be very masculine-feeling is kind of disappointing.
Then, of course, the least masculine of the two Elsweyr Houses (Jode's) will be the one we are expected to pay for.
Not that I like the interior of it much, anyway - but, it's still by far the better of the two (from my perspective, at least).Edited by Tigerseye on May 26, 2019 4:40AM0 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Carbonised wrote: »I wanted to write a long and detailed post explaining my disappointment with housing, and especially the miniscule item slot limit. But you know, F it, I've already made plenty of those posts already, with no results to show for it.
So let me put it as simple as possible, in a language that even ZO$ understands: No increase in item slot limit = no more crown house purchases from me.
If the meager 700 item slot cannot be raised due to "performance reasons", then it is YOUR problem to fix, not mine.
Preach. Between giant EXPENSIVE spaces that can never be appropriately filled and the even worse low player caps housing remains a TERRIBLE value.PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!4 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭VaranisArano wrote: »wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »Not sure if anyone saw this.
ESO Live April 26, 2019
Systems Designer Cullen Lee talked about the new house with Elsweyr and at 17:00 apprx he answers questions like more slots, etc.
And yes, it is not the answers we hoped for. Here's the link.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TiL5MzzniD4
Thank you for posting the actual Dev Comments.
I'm starting to question whether some of the players in this thread have actually listened to it.
I mean, its one thing to say "I disagree with the Devs' decisions and priorities and they should listen to me instead!" But its a whole 'nother thing to act like there's no communication.
These won't be an exact transcript, but close enough, starting at 17:00 to about 21:00
The Devs were discussing the FREE House, obtained through running Elsweyr content.
"When we did the Q&A for Combat, we noticed a lot of Housing questions..."
Item Slots - "One of people's biggest concerns. They are there for performance reasons. We really can't go above current limits right now. We've selected current limits to give people a balance between the different objects you might want to place in your home, and its really important to us that - even if maybe your rig would work at a higher count - that anyone who's playing hte game could still go into your house and have a good experience. Its really important to us that the community can share in that way. So that's the reason for the imits being the way they are right now."
Furnishing Bag - "an additional thing that comes up a lot"
*Devs discuss how players see the Crafting bag and think that because they can make it for one thing, "Why can't you just make it?"*
"The problem with Furnishings, gear or other things like them [video breaks up for me] *begins discussing how 4000 iron ore can just stack up * [video breaks up again for me]
Small, Medium, and Plot Homes - these are the most requested categories
"We've seen a lot of requests" -> "We've been doing a lot of manors."
There's upcoming Frost Vault Chasm - No ETA, as of the ESO Live
New Life Snow Globe was partly in response to this demand, where its a Medium home that they gave the slot limit of a Large home.
"So we are trying to fulfill those desires. We know that they're there and we are paying attention."
Like I said, if you want to disagree with the Devs priorities or the way they've gone about trying to answer some of your concerns, go right ahead. But for me? The Devs just answered my biggest Housing questions right there in that ESO Live video.
I'm satisfied. Maybe not with the answers, because no one likes to here "NO." But I'm satisfied that at leave my questions have an answer.
Thing is, those answers SHOULD be posted here, in a written format, by the devs themselves. And they know it.PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!4 -
Imperial_Voice✭✭✭✭✭
✭MornaBaine wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »Not sure if anyone saw this.
ESO Live April 26, 2019
Systems Designer Cullen Lee talked about the new house with Elsweyr and at 17:00 apprx he answers questions like more slots, etc.
And yes, it is not the answers we hoped for. Here's the link.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TiL5MzzniD4
Thank you for posting the actual Dev Comments.
I'm starting to question whether some of the players in this thread have actually listened to it.
I mean, its one thing to say "I disagree with the Devs' decisions and priorities and they should listen to me instead!" But its a whole 'nother thing to act like there's no communication.
These won't be an exact transcript, but close enough, starting at 17:00 to about 21:00
The Devs were discussing the FREE House, obtained through running Elsweyr content.
"When we did the Q&A for Combat, we noticed a lot of Housing questions..."
Item Slots - "One of people's biggest concerns. They are there for performance reasons. We really can't go above current limits right now. We've selected current limits to give people a balance between the different objects you might want to place in your home, and its really important to us that - even if maybe your rig would work at a higher count - that anyone who's playing hte game could still go into your house and have a good experience. Its really important to us that the community can share in that way. So that's the reason for the imits being the way they are right now."
Furnishing Bag - "an additional thing that comes up a lot"
*Devs discuss how players see the Crafting bag and think that because they can make it for one thing, "Why can't you just make it?"*
"The problem with Furnishings, gear or other things like them [video breaks up for me] *begins discussing how 4000 iron ore can just stack up * [video breaks up again for me]
Small, Medium, and Plot Homes - these are the most requested categories
"We've seen a lot of requests" -> "We've been doing a lot of manors."
There's upcoming Frost Vault Chasm - No ETA, as of the ESO Live
New Life Snow Globe was partly in response to this demand, where its a Medium home that they gave the slot limit of a Large home.
"So we are trying to fulfill those desires. We know that they're there and we are paying attention."
Like I said, if you want to disagree with the Devs priorities or the way they've gone about trying to answer some of your concerns, go right ahead. But for me? The Devs just answered my biggest Housing questions right there in that ESO Live video.
I'm satisfied. Maybe not with the answers, because no one likes to here "NO." But I'm satisfied that at leave my questions have an answer.
Thing is, those answers SHOULD be posted here, in a written format, by the devs themselves. And they know it.
Not to mention those answers are mostly lies and cop outs but whatevs4 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »Greetings, there seems to be a lot of concern and misconception about the closure of several housing threads. We'd like to clarify that creating threads that simply bash the dev team and are not constructive in any way are not permitted. In addition, threads or posts that are discussing moderation action are also not permitted.
These rules have always been pillars in our community forum guidelines and we uphold them across all topics discussed on the ESO forums.
We hope everyone understands that they are free to discuss their opinion on housing suggestions or changes, as long as the conversation can remain constructive and civil. This means suggestions or critiques are provided without personal insults directed at either the dev team or other community members who may not share your opinion. If you ever have a question related to forum moderation, we encourage you to reach out to a moderator for clarification on an action that was taken. We are more than happy to discuss it with you.
How about someone on your staff engage the community in actual dialogue regarding the problem, instead of just saying "be nice". Making paying customers feel like their complaints and concerns aren't important is the easiest way to lose those customers.
Indeed.
The above member of staff did go to a bit more trouble to express a view, which is unusual and somewhat refreshing, whether we agree with it or not, and even though it doesn’t do anything to solve any concerns. Maybe we should be thankful for that if nothing else.
But normally one gets the impression that ZOS moderators find it less trouble just to post a rather generic copy/paste ‘be nice’ few lines (to put it politely), instead of actually addressing problems and taking the time and effort to talk to the paying community.
Because forum moderators are just forum moderators. They are here to deal with the forum rules and are not authorised to talk about and probably have as little clue as you do about the development side of things.
Don't you realize that actually makes it worse? We have practically zero communication from the actual dev team.
The actual dev team, or at least everyone who's spoken about what the housing dev team likes to do, told you that they lurk. That they pay attention to the Housing section, even if they don't post comments or answer questions. When they did speak about housing, it was on ESO Live.
I realize that's not the answer you want, but its the answer you've been given.So the item cap can't be increased, then how about adding the clutter items we keep asking, which will help with the item count? Like filled bookcases, planters, food dishes, piles of books and scrolls, stairs, filled shelves or cabinets, small tents, etc - all in different styles, not only the new expansion or DLC! Most of these things are already in the game, there are so many threads with pictures with these requests! I think this is the easiest way to "solve" the item cap. Most of us are running out of slots because we want to arrange clutter or create structures which require many many small items. Why don't you allow us to use these items that for the most part, are already in the game for years!
Yes.
...and yet, what do they do?
The opposite.
Instead of introducing a new upholstered sofa in a larger size and different colour (ideally neutral, or maybe pale blue) - which would have been highly appropriate, given the Khajiit invented the only other one in the game - they, instead, only provide completely un-upholstered wooden bench-type "sofas".
Meaning you would need to use, at least, 4 items and anything up to 7, to create a comfortable-looking sofa (with cushions), using them.
If they wanted that bench-type style, despite it being inconsistent with the previous Khajiit sofa, then why didn't they (also) offer the option of a couple of them with several cushions already on them?
A very tidy one and a more chaotic-looking one, for example.
But, no - just bare benches, with separate cushions.
I think the pattern for one of those cushions (the wide one) is extremely rare, as well (assuming it's even available, in-game).
Despite it being a green quality one and being kind of vital, to try to make a sofa out of a bare wooden bench...
I've just had enough, frankly...
Most of us have spent more than enough money, already, without being expected to fork out even more Crowns/real money for a stupid cushion, which should just have come with the "sofa" in the first place.
Meanwhile, Trial players (many of whom don't even sub, or do housing!) get free furnishing items, which aren't available any other way as far as I know(?), along with their free mount.
You couldn't make it up.
Wow. You have some extremely specific desires for new furnishings that you want ZOS to design.
I'm not saying your ideas aren't cool, but they are very specific and so I'm not surprised you are disappointed. It seems clear to me that the majority of Housing is reused assets from the Chapter and new zones, not pulled from a laundry list of what Housing players want. And so if cushioned sofas didn't fit the aesthetic the design team wanted for the new content, we probably won't be getting cushioned sofas. Certainly not for free.
And then complaining that ZOS gives trial players trophy furnishings, like ZOS hasn't been expecting players to play ALL of the game for ALL of the rewards, and giving out housing trophies for trials before with the busts? Yeah, again, I'm not surprised at all. They've done it before.
You are entitled to tell it how you see it, of course, and register your disappointment.
I think you are setting yourself up for that disappointment with such specific expectations and then expecting to get all of the furnishings without having to do all of the content - best get to learning the new trial if you want those furnishings (or hope ZOS sells a practically identical version, just like they might do with the mount
) 3 -
Imperial_Voice✭✭✭✭✭
✭VaranisArano wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »Greetings, there seems to be a lot of concern and misconception about the closure of several housing threads. We'd like to clarify that creating threads that simply bash the dev team and are not constructive in any way are not permitted. In addition, threads or posts that are discussing moderation action are also not permitted.
These rules have always been pillars in our community forum guidelines and we uphold them across all topics discussed on the ESO forums.
We hope everyone understands that they are free to discuss their opinion on housing suggestions or changes, as long as the conversation can remain constructive and civil. This means suggestions or critiques are provided without personal insults directed at either the dev team or other community members who may not share your opinion. If you ever have a question related to forum moderation, we encourage you to reach out to a moderator for clarification on an action that was taken. We are more than happy to discuss it with you.
How about someone on your staff engage the community in actual dialogue regarding the problem, instead of just saying "be nice". Making paying customers feel like their complaints and concerns aren't important is the easiest way to lose those customers.
Indeed.
The above member of staff did go to a bit more trouble to express a view, which is unusual and somewhat refreshing, whether we agree with it or not, and even though it doesn’t do anything to solve any concerns. Maybe we should be thankful for that if nothing else.
But normally one gets the impression that ZOS moderators find it less trouble just to post a rather generic copy/paste ‘be nice’ few lines (to put it politely), instead of actually addressing problems and taking the time and effort to talk to the paying community.
Because forum moderators are just forum moderators. They are here to deal with the forum rules and are not authorised to talk about and probably have as little clue as you do about the development side of things.
Don't you realize that actually makes it worse? We have practically zero communication from the actual dev team.
The actual dev team, or at least everyone who's spoken about what the housing dev team likes to do, told you that they lurk. That they pay attention to the Housing section, even if they don't post comments or answer questions. When they did speak about housing, it was on ESO Live.
I realize that's not the answer you want, but its the answer you've been given.So the item cap can't be increased, then how about adding the clutter items we keep asking, which will help with the item count? Like filled bookcases, planters, food dishes, piles of books and scrolls, stairs, filled shelves or cabinets, small tents, etc - all in different styles, not only the new expansion or DLC! Most of these things are already in the game, there are so many threads with pictures with these requests! I think this is the easiest way to "solve" the item cap. Most of us are running out of slots because we want to arrange clutter or create structures which require many many small items. Why don't you allow us to use these items that for the most part, are already in the game for years!
Yes.
...and yet, what do they do?
The opposite.
Instead of introducing a new upholstered sofa in a larger size and different colour (ideally neutral, or maybe pale blue) - which would have been highly appropriate, given the Khajiit invented the only other one in the game - they, instead, only provide completely un-upholstered wooden bench-type "sofas".
Meaning you would need to use, at least, 4 items and anything up to 7, to create a comfortable-looking sofa (with cushions), using them.
If they wanted that bench-type style, despite it being inconsistent with the previous Khajiit sofa, then why didn't they (also) offer the option of a couple of them with several cushions already on them?
A very tidy one and a more chaotic-looking one, for example.
But, no - just bare benches, with separate cushions.
I think the pattern for one of those cushions (the wide one) is extremely rare, as well (assuming it's even available, in-game).
Despite it being a green quality one and being kind of vital, to try to make a sofa out of a bare wooden bench...
I've just had enough, frankly...
Most of us have spent more than enough money, already, without being expected to fork out even more Crowns/real money for a stupid cushion, which should just have come with the "sofa" in the first place.
Meanwhile, Trial players (many of whom don't even sub, or do housing!) get free furnishing items, which aren't available any other way as far as I know(?), along with their free mount.
You couldn't make it up.
Wow. You have some extremely specific desires for new furnishings that you want ZOS to design.
I'm not saying your ideas aren't cool, but they are very specific and so I'm not surprised you are disappointed. It seems clear to me that the majority of Housing is reused assets from the Chapter and new zones, not pulled from a laundry list of what Housing players want. And so if cushioned sofas didn't fit the aesthetic the design team wanted for the new content, we probably won't be getting cushioned sofas. Certainly not for free.
And then complaining that ZOS gives trial players trophy furnishings, like ZOS hasn't been expecting players to play ALL of the game for ALL of the rewards, and giving out housing trophies for trials before with the busts? Yeah, again, I'm not surprised at all. They've done it before.
You are entitled to tell it how you see it, of course, and register your disappointment.
I think you are setting yourself up for that disappointment with such specific expectations and then expecting to get all of the furnishings without having to do all of the content - best get to learning the new trial if you want those furnishings (or hope ZOS sells a practically identical version, just like they might do with the mount )
I honestly see no reason why people shouldn't be given furnishings for content completion.5 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Imperial_Voice wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »Greetings, there seems to be a lot of concern and misconception about the closure of several housing threads. We'd like to clarify that creating threads that simply bash the dev team and are not constructive in any way are not permitted. In addition, threads or posts that are discussing moderation action are also not permitted.
These rules have always been pillars in our community forum guidelines and we uphold them across all topics discussed on the ESO forums.
We hope everyone understands that they are free to discuss their opinion on housing suggestions or changes, as long as the conversation can remain constructive and civil. This means suggestions or critiques are provided without personal insults directed at either the dev team or other community members who may not share your opinion. If you ever have a question related to forum moderation, we encourage you to reach out to a moderator for clarification on an action that was taken. We are more than happy to discuss it with you.
How about someone on your staff engage the community in actual dialogue regarding the problem, instead of just saying "be nice". Making paying customers feel like their complaints and concerns aren't important is the easiest way to lose those customers.
Indeed.
The above member of staff did go to a bit more trouble to express a view, which is unusual and somewhat refreshing, whether we agree with it or not, and even though it doesn’t do anything to solve any concerns. Maybe we should be thankful for that if nothing else.
But normally one gets the impression that ZOS moderators find it less trouble just to post a rather generic copy/paste ‘be nice’ few lines (to put it politely), instead of actually addressing problems and taking the time and effort to talk to the paying community.
Because forum moderators are just forum moderators. They are here to deal with the forum rules and are not authorised to talk about and probably have as little clue as you do about the development side of things.
Don't you realize that actually makes it worse? We have practically zero communication from the actual dev team.
The actual dev team, or at least everyone who's spoken about what the housing dev team likes to do, told you that they lurk. That they pay attention to the Housing section, even if they don't post comments or answer questions. When they did speak about housing, it was on ESO Live.
I realize that's not the answer you want, but its the answer you've been given.So the item cap can't be increased, then how about adding the clutter items we keep asking, which will help with the item count? Like filled bookcases, planters, food dishes, piles of books and scrolls, stairs, filled shelves or cabinets, small tents, etc - all in different styles, not only the new expansion or DLC! Most of these things are already in the game, there are so many threads with pictures with these requests! I think this is the easiest way to "solve" the item cap. Most of us are running out of slots because we want to arrange clutter or create structures which require many many small items. Why don't you allow us to use these items that for the most part, are already in the game for years!
Yes.
...and yet, what do they do?
The opposite.
Instead of introducing a new upholstered sofa in a larger size and different colour (ideally neutral, or maybe pale blue) - which would have been highly appropriate, given the Khajiit invented the only other one in the game - they, instead, only provide completely un-upholstered wooden bench-type "sofas".
Meaning you would need to use, at least, 4 items and anything up to 7, to create a comfortable-looking sofa (with cushions), using them.
If they wanted that bench-type style, despite it being inconsistent with the previous Khajiit sofa, then why didn't they (also) offer the option of a couple of them with several cushions already on them?
A very tidy one and a more chaotic-looking one, for example.
But, no - just bare benches, with separate cushions.
I think the pattern for one of those cushions (the wide one) is extremely rare, as well (assuming it's even available, in-game).
Despite it being a green quality one and being kind of vital, to try to make a sofa out of a bare wooden bench...
I've just had enough, frankly...
Most of us have spent more than enough money, already, without being expected to fork out even more Crowns/real money for a stupid cushion, which should just have come with the "sofa" in the first place.
Meanwhile, Trial players (many of whom don't even sub, or do housing!) get free furnishing items, which aren't available any other way as far as I know(?), along with their free mount.
You couldn't make it up.
Wow. You have some extremely specific desires for new furnishings that you want ZOS to design.
I'm not saying your ideas aren't cool, but they are very specific and so I'm not surprised you are disappointed. It seems clear to me that the majority of Housing is reused assets from the Chapter and new zones, not pulled from a laundry list of what Housing players want. And so if cushioned sofas didn't fit the aesthetic the design team wanted for the new content, we probably won't be getting cushioned sofas. Certainly not for free.
And then complaining that ZOS gives trial players trophy furnishings, like ZOS hasn't been expecting players to play ALL of the game for ALL of the rewards, and giving out housing trophies for trials before with the busts? Yeah, again, I'm not surprised at all. They've done it before.
You are entitled to tell it how you see it, of course, and register your disappointment.
I think you are setting yourself up for that disappointment with such specific expectations and then expecting to get all of the furnishings without having to do all of the content - best get to learning the new trial if you want those furnishings (or hope ZOS sells a practically identical version, just like they might do with the mount )
I honestly see no reason why people shouldn't be given furnishings for content completion.
ZOS is really good at connecting different areas of the game like that
Like, I know a couple Former Emperor PVPers who have big houses...pretty much to show off that fancy Imperial Throne. My IRL firends guild got a bigger guild hall so we could put all our trophies up that we'd done together.
Its a really good incentive for housing enthusiasts to try different content and also for players who don't usually do much with Housing to get involved so they can do something with their trophies.2 -
Imperial_Voice✭✭✭✭✭
✭VaranisArano wrote: »Imperial_Voice wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »Greetings, there seems to be a lot of concern and misconception about the closure of several housing threads. We'd like to clarify that creating threads that simply bash the dev team and are not constructive in any way are not permitted. In addition, threads or posts that are discussing moderation action are also not permitted.
These rules have always been pillars in our community forum guidelines and we uphold them across all topics discussed on the ESO forums.
We hope everyone understands that they are free to discuss their opinion on housing suggestions or changes, as long as the conversation can remain constructive and civil. This means suggestions or critiques are provided without personal insults directed at either the dev team or other community members who may not share your opinion. If you ever have a question related to forum moderation, we encourage you to reach out to a moderator for clarification on an action that was taken. We are more than happy to discuss it with you.
How about someone on your staff engage the community in actual dialogue regarding the problem, instead of just saying "be nice". Making paying customers feel like their complaints and concerns aren't important is the easiest way to lose those customers.
Indeed.
The above member of staff did go to a bit more trouble to express a view, which is unusual and somewhat refreshing, whether we agree with it or not, and even though it doesn’t do anything to solve any concerns. Maybe we should be thankful for that if nothing else.
But normally one gets the impression that ZOS moderators find it less trouble just to post a rather generic copy/paste ‘be nice’ few lines (to put it politely), instead of actually addressing problems and taking the time and effort to talk to the paying community.
Because forum moderators are just forum moderators. They are here to deal with the forum rules and are not authorised to talk about and probably have as little clue as you do about the development side of things.
Don't you realize that actually makes it worse? We have practically zero communication from the actual dev team.
The actual dev team, or at least everyone who's spoken about what the housing dev team likes to do, told you that they lurk. That they pay attention to the Housing section, even if they don't post comments or answer questions. When they did speak about housing, it was on ESO Live.
I realize that's not the answer you want, but its the answer you've been given.So the item cap can't be increased, then how about adding the clutter items we keep asking, which will help with the item count? Like filled bookcases, planters, food dishes, piles of books and scrolls, stairs, filled shelves or cabinets, small tents, etc - all in different styles, not only the new expansion or DLC! Most of these things are already in the game, there are so many threads with pictures with these requests! I think this is the easiest way to "solve" the item cap. Most of us are running out of slots because we want to arrange clutter or create structures which require many many small items. Why don't you allow us to use these items that for the most part, are already in the game for years!
Yes.
...and yet, what do they do?
The opposite.
Instead of introducing a new upholstered sofa in a larger size and different colour (ideally neutral, or maybe pale blue) - which would have been highly appropriate, given the Khajiit invented the only other one in the game - they, instead, only provide completely un-upholstered wooden bench-type "sofas".
Meaning you would need to use, at least, 4 items and anything up to 7, to create a comfortable-looking sofa (with cushions), using them.
If they wanted that bench-type style, despite it being inconsistent with the previous Khajiit sofa, then why didn't they (also) offer the option of a couple of them with several cushions already on them?
A very tidy one and a more chaotic-looking one, for example.
But, no - just bare benches, with separate cushions.
I think the pattern for one of those cushions (the wide one) is extremely rare, as well (assuming it's even available, in-game).
Despite it being a green quality one and being kind of vital, to try to make a sofa out of a bare wooden bench...
I've just had enough, frankly...
Most of us have spent more than enough money, already, without being expected to fork out even more Crowns/real money for a stupid cushion, which should just have come with the "sofa" in the first place.
Meanwhile, Trial players (many of whom don't even sub, or do housing!) get free furnishing items, which aren't available any other way as far as I know(?), along with their free mount.
You couldn't make it up.
Wow. You have some extremely specific desires for new furnishings that you want ZOS to design.
I'm not saying your ideas aren't cool, but they are very specific and so I'm not surprised you are disappointed. It seems clear to me that the majority of Housing is reused assets from the Chapter and new zones, not pulled from a laundry list of what Housing players want. And so if cushioned sofas didn't fit the aesthetic the design team wanted for the new content, we probably won't be getting cushioned sofas. Certainly not for free.
And then complaining that ZOS gives trial players trophy furnishings, like ZOS hasn't been expecting players to play ALL of the game for ALL of the rewards, and giving out housing trophies for trials before with the busts? Yeah, again, I'm not surprised at all. They've done it before.
You are entitled to tell it how you see it, of course, and register your disappointment.
I think you are setting yourself up for that disappointment with such specific expectations and then expecting to get all of the furnishings without having to do all of the content - best get to learning the new trial if you want those furnishings (or hope ZOS sells a practically identical version, just like they might do with the mount )
I honestly see no reason why people shouldn't be given furnishings for content completion.
ZOS is really good at connecting different areas of the game like that
Like, I know a couple Former Emperor PVPers who have big houses...pretty much to show off that fancy Imperial Throne. My IRL firends guild got a bigger guild hall so we could put all our trophies up that we'd done together.
Its a really good incentive for housing enthusiasts to try different content and also for players who don't usually do much with Housing to get involved so they can do something with their trophies.
Zos is decent with ideas but a complete and utter failure on the follow through1 -
Tigerseye✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭VaranisArano wrote: »
Wow. You have some extremely specific desires for new furnishings that you want ZOS to design.
I'm not saying your ideas aren't cool, but they are very specific and so I'm not surprised you are disappointed. It seems clear to me that the majority of Housing is reused assets from the Chapter and new zones, not pulled from a laundry list of what Housing players want. And so if cushioned sofas didn't fit the aesthetic the design team wanted for the new content, we probably won't be getting cushioned sofas. Certainly not for free.
And then complaining that ZOS gives trial players trophy furnishings, like ZOS hasn't been expecting players to play ALL of the game for ALL of the rewards, and giving out housing trophies for trials before with the busts? Yeah, again, I'm not surprised at all. They've done it before.
You are entitled to tell it how you see it, of course, and register your disappointment.
I think you are setting yourself up for that disappointment with such specific expectations and then expecting to get all of the furnishings without having to do all of the content - best get to learning the new trial if you want those furnishings (or hope ZOS sells a practically identical version, just like they might do with the mount )
Um, what?
Do you actually do furnishing in any serious way, already?
No, of course you don't.
Because, if you did, you would know that the Khajiit ALREADY have the only upholstered sofa in the game (a red velvet one).
So, it is not, in any way "specific" to expect that some more Khajiit, in another Khajiit area, would (almost certainly!) have another upholstered sofa design (probably, in a different colourway).
Because, that is the way furnishing in this game tends to work.
Also, it is not a suitable replacement to replace an upholstered sofa with a wooden bench and several cushions, because:
a) You have to use multiple items to produce the same look, in a game where furnishing slots are a rare commodity.
b) You can no longer use the sit function on a bench you have put cushions on.
But then, if you already did furnishing, to any extent at all, you would already know all this and I wouldn't have to be telling you, would I?
...and no, I will not be doing the trial and I will be taking my money elsewhere if this gimmicky, grindy, lacking in function and/or style and overly exclusive housing direction continues.
I don't even particularly want giant dragon statues, as I tend to work on a smaller, more homely, scale; but, there is a fundamental principle at stake, here.
In fact, there are several.Edited by Tigerseye on June 1, 2019 10:17PM3 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭VaranisArano wrote: »
Wow. You have some extremely specific desires for new furnishings that you want ZOS to design.
I'm not saying your ideas aren't cool, but they are very specific and so I'm not surprised you are disappointed. It seems clear to me that the majority of Housing is reused assets from the Chapter and new zones, not pulled from a laundry list of what Housing players want. And so if cushioned sofas didn't fit the aesthetic the design team wanted for the new content, we probably won't be getting cushioned sofas. Certainly not for free.
And then complaining that ZOS gives trial players trophy furnishings, like ZOS hasn't been expecting players to play ALL of the game for ALL of the rewards, and giving out housing trophies for trials before with the busts? Yeah, again, I'm not surprised at all. They've done it before.
You are entitled to tell it how you see it, of course, and register your disappointment.
I think you are setting yourself up for that disappointment with such specific expectations and then expecting to get all of the furnishings without having to do all of the content - best get to learning the new trial if you want those furnishings (or hope ZOS sells a practically identical version, just like they might do with the mount )
Um, what?
Do you actually do furnishing in any serious way, already?
No, of course you don't.
Because, if you did, you would know that the Khajiit ALREADY have the only upholstered sofa in the game (a red velvet one).
So, it is not, in any way "specific" to expect that some more Khajiit, in another Khajiit area, would (almost certainly!) have another upholstered sofa design (probably, in a different colourway).
Because, that is the way furnishing in this game tends to work.
Also, it is not a suitable replacement to replace an upholstered sofa with a wooden bench and several cushions, because:
a) You have to use multiple items to produce the same look, in a game where furnishing slots are a rare commodity.
b) You can no longer use the sit function on a bench you have put cushions on.
But then, if you already did furnishing, to any extent at all, you would already know all this and I wouldn't have to be telling you, would I?
...and no, I will not be doing the trial and I will be taking my money elsewhere if this gimmicky, grindy, lacking in function and/or style and overly exclusive housing direction continues.
I don't even particularly want giant dragon statues, as I tend to work on a smaller, more homely, scale; but, there is a fundamental principle at stake, here.
In fact, there are several.
Sorry, my tastes in sitting room furnishings run to the Redguard sofa and all the Redguard cushions. IMO, the old Khajiit stuff just doesn't hold up in terms of graphics. But then I don't really care to argue the "seriousness" of how we prefer decorating our houses, since I figure it all comes down to personal taste. You apparently really wanted a neutral or pale blue upholstered kahjiit sofa...and the design team didn't want that in their vision of Elsweyr. The design team doesn't make items to order, as far as I can tell. plus, A) using more furnishing slots to create a "scene" is an excellent way to get non subscribers to subscribe for extra slots and B.) certainly inconvienent, and I don't have a solution.
The way I see it, housing has been grindy, gimmicky, lacking in function, and overly exclusive more or less from the beginning by design. Because that's what makes ZOS the most money for the least effort and as long as it sells to enough players, they have zero incentive to change, even if they lose a few dedicated housing players over it (not so different from a relative few players quitting when their class/race gets nerfed while ZOS happily carries on.)
As for fundamental principles, take a look at how ZOS is handling events, and consider that one of the fundamental principles of ESO is that if you want ALL of the rewards, you have to experience ALL of the content. Not everyone likes that - witness the complaints of PVEers during a PVP event or vice versa- but ZOS seems pretty wedded to that idea. And why not? It encourages players to try out more of their game! Not every player tries everything, of course, but enough try new things for ZOS to stick with it.
Maybe I'm too cynical, and don't have your hope that ZOS will design a neutral or blue upholstered khajiit sofa just because it would look nice and fits previous furnishings. I'm certainly cynical enough to think that ZOS isn't going to change a grindy, gimmicky, most cosmetic system that's making them profit from a wide variety of players just because some dedicated housing players are unhappy enough to consider quitting.
Ultimately, this is just me being the cynic. I hope you get your desired sofa with all the cushions you want for as few slots as you want. I'm not sure I can muster any realistic hope that ZOS will change their approach to Housing monetization, though.Edited by VaranisArano on June 2, 2019 4:02AM2 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Anyways, @Tigerseye, I don't expect us to agree on decorating, furnishings or the likely future of housing, and I feel like I'm being too harsh and cynical for a productive conversation. Sorry about that.
I do think you've got some creative ideas and I hope you enjoy your housing projects now and in the future!
Have a great day!1 -
Tigerseye✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭VaranisArano wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »
Wow. You have some extremely specific desires for new furnishings that you want ZOS to design.
I'm not saying your ideas aren't cool, but they are very specific and so I'm not surprised you are disappointed. It seems clear to me that the majority of Housing is reused assets from the Chapter and new zones, not pulled from a laundry list of what Housing players want. And so if cushioned sofas didn't fit the aesthetic the design team wanted for the new content, we probably won't be getting cushioned sofas. Certainly not for free.
And then complaining that ZOS gives trial players trophy furnishings, like ZOS hasn't been expecting players to play ALL of the game for ALL of the rewards, and giving out housing trophies for trials before with the busts? Yeah, again, I'm not surprised at all. They've done it before.
You are entitled to tell it how you see it, of course, and register your disappointment.
I think you are setting yourself up for that disappointment with such specific expectations and then expecting to get all of the furnishings without having to do all of the content - best get to learning the new trial if you want those furnishings (or hope ZOS sells a practically identical version, just like they might do with the mount )
Um, what?
Do you actually do furnishing in any serious way, already?
No, of course you don't.
Because, if you did, you would know that the Khajiit ALREADY have the only upholstered sofa in the game (a red velvet one).
So, it is not, in any way "specific" to expect that some more Khajiit, in another Khajiit area, would (almost certainly!) have another upholstered sofa design (probably, in a different colourway).
Because, that is the way furnishing in this game tends to work.
Also, it is not a suitable replacement to replace an upholstered sofa with a wooden bench and several cushions, because:
a) You have to use multiple items to produce the same look, in a game where furnishing slots are a rare commodity.
b) You can no longer use the sit function on a bench you have put cushions on.
But then, if you already did furnishing, to any extent at all, you would already know all this and I wouldn't have to be telling you, would I?
...and no, I will not be doing the trial and I will be taking my money elsewhere if this gimmicky, grindy, lacking in function and/or style and overly exclusive housing direction continues.
I don't even particularly want giant dragon statues, as I tend to work on a smaller, more homely, scale; but, there is a fundamental principle at stake, here.
In fact, there are several.
Sorry, my tastes in sitting room furnishings run to the Redguard sofa and all the Redguard cushions. IMO, the old Khajiit stuff just doesn't hold up in terms of graphics. But then I don't really care to argue the "seriousness" of how we prefer decorating our houses, since I figure it all comes down to personal taste. You apparently really wanted a neutral or pale blue upholstered kahjiit sofa...and the design team didn't want that in their vision of Elsweyr. The design team doesn't make items to order, as far as I can tell. plus, A) using more furnishing slots to create a "scene" is an excellent way to get non subscribers to subscribe for extra slots and B.) certainly inconvienent, and I don't have a solution.
The way I see it, housing has been grindy, gimmicky, lacking in function, and overly exclusive more or less from the beginning by design. Because that's what makes ZOS the most money for the least effort and as long as it sells to enough players, they have zero incentive to change, even if they lose a few dedicated housing players over it (not so different from a relative few players quitting when their class/race gets nerfed while ZOS happily carries on.)
As for fundamental principles, take a look at how ZOS is handling events, and consider that one of the fundamental principles of ESO is that if you want ALL of the rewards, you have to experience ALL of the content. Not everyone likes that - witness the complaints of PVEers during a PVP event or vice versa- but ZOS seems pretty wedded to that idea. And why not? It encourages players to try out more of their game! Not every player tries everything, of course, but enough try new things for ZOS to stick with it.
Maybe I'm too cynical, and don't have your hope that ZOS will design a neutral or blue upholstered khajiit sofa just because it would look nice and fits previous furnishings. I'm certainly cynical enough to think that ZOS isn't going to change a grindy, gimmicky, most cosmetic system that's making them profit from a wide variety of players just because some dedicated housing players are unhappy enough to consider quitting.
Ultimately, this is just me being the cynic. I hope you get your desired sofa with all the cushions you want for as few slots as you want. I'm not sure I can muster any realistic hope that ZOS will change their approach to Housing monetization, though.
I would have preferred a neutral colour, or pale blue, because ALL the other sofas in the game are red.
I wasn't putting in an "order", lol.
Although, if they want to bear it in mind that some colour other than red and (ideally) a suitable neutral would be quite nice, then that would obviously be great.
I prefer the Khajiit, as I find the red of the Redguard (wooden) sofas to be too bright and the dark wooden frame to be a bit too conservative-looking.
The Khajiit has a softer colour and feel to it and a velvety look, which I like.
Its more subtle colour can also lend itself to both pink and orange based colour schemes without looking too clashy.
Yes, ZOS can choose to "happily carry on", in their Alice Through the Looking Glass kind of way, where they do almost everything (mysteriously!) in pretty much exactly the opposite way to that which is needed.
However, if they choose to do that, we can all decide to "happily move on" if we like, too, can't we?
We don't have to hang around in red sofaland/unusable 6 slot benchland forever.
I'm not optimistic, or pessimistic, but I am going to carry on telling them exactly what is wrong and how I feel about it, whenever I feel like it.Edited by Tigerseye on June 2, 2019 4:37AM2 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭VaranisArano wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »
Wow. You have some extremely specific desires for new furnishings that you want ZOS to design.
I'm not saying your ideas aren't cool, but they are very specific and so I'm not surprised you are disappointed. It seems clear to me that the majority of Housing is reused assets from the Chapter and new zones, not pulled from a laundry list of what Housing players want. And so if cushioned sofas didn't fit the aesthetic the design team wanted for the new content, we probably won't be getting cushioned sofas. Certainly not for free.
And then complaining that ZOS gives trial players trophy furnishings, like ZOS hasn't been expecting players to play ALL of the game for ALL of the rewards, and giving out housing trophies for trials before with the busts? Yeah, again, I'm not surprised at all. They've done it before.
You are entitled to tell it how you see it, of course, and register your disappointment.
I think you are setting yourself up for that disappointment with such specific expectations and then expecting to get all of the furnishings without having to do all of the content - best get to learning the new trial if you want those furnishings (or hope ZOS sells a practically identical version, just like they might do with the mount )
Um, what?
Do you actually do furnishing in any serious way, already?
No, of course you don't.
Because, if you did, you would know that the Khajiit ALREADY have the only upholstered sofa in the game (a red velvet one).
So, it is not, in any way "specific" to expect that some more Khajiit, in another Khajiit area, would (almost certainly!) have another upholstered sofa design (probably, in a different colourway).
Because, that is the way furnishing in this game tends to work.
Also, it is not a suitable replacement to replace an upholstered sofa with a wooden bench and several cushions, because:
a) You have to use multiple items to produce the same look, in a game where furnishing slots are a rare commodity.
b) You can no longer use the sit function on a bench you have put cushions on.
But then, if you already did furnishing, to any extent at all, you would already know all this and I wouldn't have to be telling you, would I?
...and no, I will not be doing the trial and I will be taking my money elsewhere if this gimmicky, grindy, lacking in function and/or style and overly exclusive housing direction continues.
I don't even particularly want giant dragon statues, as I tend to work on a smaller, more homely, scale; but, there is a fundamental principle at stake, here.
In fact, there are several.
Sorry, my tastes in sitting room furnishings run to the Redguard sofa and all the Redguard cushions. IMO, the old Khajiit stuff just doesn't hold up in terms of graphics. But then I don't really care to argue the "seriousness" of how we prefer decorating our houses, since I figure it all comes down to personal taste. You apparently really wanted a neutral or pale blue upholstered kahjiit sofa...and the design team didn't want that in their vision of Elsweyr. The design team doesn't make items to order, as far as I can tell. plus, A) using more furnishing slots to create a "scene" is an excellent way to get non subscribers to subscribe for extra slots and B.) certainly inconvienent, and I don't have a solution.
The way I see it, housing has been grindy, gimmicky, lacking in function, and overly exclusive more or less from the beginning by design. Because that's what makes ZOS the most money for the least effort and as long as it sells to enough players, they have zero incentive to change, even if they lose a few dedicated housing players over it (not so different from a relative few players quitting when their class/race gets nerfed while ZOS happily carries on.)
As for fundamental principles, take a look at how ZOS is handling events, and consider that one of the fundamental principles of ESO is that if you want ALL of the rewards, you have to experience ALL of the content. Not everyone likes that - witness the complaints of PVEers during a PVP event or vice versa- but ZOS seems pretty wedded to that idea. And why not? It encourages players to try out more of their game! Not every player tries everything, of course, but enough try new things for ZOS to stick with it.
Maybe I'm too cynical, and don't have your hope that ZOS will design a neutral or blue upholstered khajiit sofa just because it would look nice and fits previous furnishings. I'm certainly cynical enough to think that ZOS isn't going to change a grindy, gimmicky, most cosmetic system that's making them profit from a wide variety of players just because some dedicated housing players are unhappy enough to consider quitting.
Ultimately, this is just me being the cynic. I hope you get your desired sofa with all the cushions you want for as few slots as you want. I'm not sure I can muster any realistic hope that ZOS will change their approach to Housing monetization, though.
I would have preferred a neutral colour, or pale blue, because ALL the other sofas in the game are red.
I wasn't putting in "an order", lol.
Although, if they want to bear it in mind that some colour other than red and (ideally) a suitable neutral would be quite nice, then that would obviously be great.
I prefer the Khajiit, as I find the red of the Redguard (wooden) sofas to be too bright and the wooden frame to be a bit too conservative-looking - the Khajiit has a softer colour and feel to it and a velvety look, which I like.
Its more subtle colour can also lend itself to both pink and orange based colour schemes without looking too clashy.
Yes, ZOS can choose to "happily carry on", in their Alice Through the Looking Glass kind of way, where they do almost everthing (mysteriously!) in pretty much the opposite way to that which is needed.
However, if they do that, we can all decide to "happily move on" if we like, too, can't we?
We don't have to hang around in red sofaland/unusable 6 slot benchland forever.
I'm not optimistic, or pessimistic, but I am going to carry on telling them exactly what is wrong and how I feel about it, whenever I feel like it.
Yeah. All of the above is a fine preference in furniture, and as you say, we can also "happily move on" if we are unhappy enough...and if enough housing players actually do that instead of continuing to buy or grind for housing items here and there, maybe ZOS will actually pay attention
Anyways, best of luck to you with your housing projects!1 -
Tigerseye✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Thank you.
Also, as I mentioned before, on another thread, if they are married to the bench and cushions idea (which, admittedly, looks quite nice), they could have chosen to offer us the option of benches with cushions already on them.
They could have offered one option with tidy cushions on it and another one with messy cushions on it (and a third one without either, obviously), just like they do with some of the bookshelves (with books).
As you say, they're probably hoping to get us to buy lots of cushions from the crown store; which I find particularly cynical, seeing as they will actually prevent sitting, when placed on a bench/sofa.
It almost feels like a scam to try to encourage people to buy cushions that will actually remove the functionality of a sofa/bench.
Either that, or they're just utterly clueless and/or have hired new staff who have no idea how the game works.
Neither option is reassuring.3 -
LadySinflower✭✭✭✭✭Personally I am very happy to be receiving a free home, even if it is a huge monstrosity. But I'm not someone who has millions in gold or has memorized most of the available furnishing plans. I take what they give us and am grateful for it. I'm sure that as soon as I reach the level where I could really decorate a house in a cool and different way, the limitations and lack of communication will start to frustrate me. But at the moment I'm fine with how things are. But, I definitely don't discount the anger and frustration shown here and am ultimately on your side.
The limited time crown store only model they've created for so many homes and furnishings does anger me, because I can't afford to buy that many crowns and by the time my ESO+ crowns could be saved the item I want is gone. That's why they do it, I realize - because if we really want the item we will have to pay money. I'm not happy with that at all. I'm glad to support them and help them pay their expenses, but they don't have to monetize literally everything! That's what really bugs me.
Hopefully they will give us at least a compromise. We'll see.3