PTS Update 22 - Feedback Thread for Dragons

ZOS_GinaBruno

This is the official feedback thread for Dragons! Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• Were you able to find Dragons in Elsweyr?
• Did you find one at a distance and chase it down, or just stumble upon one?
• Did you fight in a group or solo?
• What do you think the most dangerous things about Dragons are?
• Is this something you’re looking forward to when Elsweyr launches?
• Did the loot from Dragons feel satisfying?
• Did the loot feel varied and useful?
• What are your thoughts on the new Dragon crafting ingredients, and the new Alchemy effect?
• Do you have any other general feedback?

highkingnm

Easy to find, clear on the map and sought them all down, first was mid fight, three I was there from start. I can’t really speak to loot and ingredients yet but my general thoughts on the fights.

Overall the fights felt really rewarding. There was the right balance of challenge against accessibility. I expect they may get a bit easier when not everyone is playing Necro DPS (my love of healing springs only grew today). The mechanics were tough but fair, with good but not overdone telegraphs and punishing if missed. Felt that the attack set was a little limited. By fight 4 I did notice a rhythm and, whilst still fun at that point, I do feel that it may lose that fun by fight 20/30.

I will be doing this on live. It was genuinely refreshing and I can’t wait to see a busy live server going mad over them. It was glorious chaos. Felt like the best elements of a World Boss with the punishing nature of a dungeon boss.

Only thing I would say, and this is in many ways related to the limited mechanics, there is not as much randomness in the fights as I would hope. Set arenas, limited moves and predictable fight stages will make the fights get a tad stale. Also, not sure if the plan is for it to go to live as such or I just had odd luck, but all dragons looked identical. Variety would be really useful.

Cireous

My feedback is that I have been refreshing twitch all day long and ... no one is streaming dragons.

Please help, must see. ...

Kamchuk

ZOS - The Dragons have 14M health points but for the most part are just sitting on the ground taking damage from the surrounding players. The outcome is inevitable. If it isn't too late to change your programming, I suggest that they fly around more while distributing their own damage to players. Have them swoop down on players forcing quick evasion. The closer a player is the more damage is dealt to the dragon and vice versa. Something along these lines to force weapon swap, movement, and more of a challenge tactically.

And make the rewards bigger for killing them. For example - 3000 Gold, 3 soul gems, a rare crafting item, or anything that will draw groups to come back again and again and again.

Just some suggestions...

Stranger

I think the dragons are wasting potential being a stationary enemy that turn around and do fire breath wing buffet and tail swipe.

I would love to see some awesome arenas that really high light that yea you are *** a dragon. Having to climb up to the top of a spire to confront a dragon on its home turf would be a start. Allowing careless players to get knocked off.

Having the dragon actually leave the area and move to another arena like Monster Hunter if anyone has played that would be really awesome.

Ultimately I think dragons are THE legendary mythical creature, and right now you could probably put a lot of different enemies in their place and not notice a difference.

DeathStalker

A lot of people are going to be unable to beat the overland dragons if the difficulty isn't lowered. I understand it can't be solo content, but they are like 10x harder than any wb in the game right now.

Universe

Were you able to find Dragons in Elsweyr?
Yes by using the map, showing "Dragon" in red.

Did you find one at a distance and chase it down, or just stumble upon one?
Chased one by using the map.

Did you fight in a group or solo?
Group, though I imagine I could solo it on my PC EU sorcerer character(wasn't copied to PTS).
The dragon has an high health pool(14.7M), but I soloed normal trial bosses which had a bit lower amount of health(10.9M).
You can boost the dragon health by about 35%(so it will be 20M health) and increase its overall damage by 10%.

What do you think the most dangerous things about Dragons are?
The cone AoE is powerful and should be avoided at all cost.

Is this something you’re looking forward to when Elsweyr launches?
Yes.

Did the loot from Dragons feel satisfying?
Yes.
Not disappointing but not too much.


Did the loot feel varied and useful?
You could increase the minimal loot to have a more treasure which can be exchanged for gold, like 1K-2K gold.

What are your thoughts on the new Dragon crafting ingredients, and the new Alchemy effect?
It is a nice addition.

Do you have any other general feedback?
The dragon is a bit weak.
Also, it has an high health pool, but I soloed normal trial bosses which had a bit lower amount of health(10.9M).
You can boost the dragon health by about 35%(so it will be 20M health) and increase its overall damage by 10%.
Furthermore, the CP experience earned is a bit low, you can boost it by 30%.

karekiz

I did three Dragon bosses + two world bosses to compare <Since they feels similar in theory>. I spent over an hour or two killing dragons and moving about. I *will* use skyrim and world bosses/dolemens as a comparison since those are what will be used.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] Were you able to find Dragons in Elsweyr?

Easily and quickly. I like that you can tell when one is engaged.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] Did you find one at a distance and chase it down, or just stumble upon one?

Didn't really "find" one or ever feel like I stumbled on one since its slammed onto the map screen. In skyrim you feel like they found you usually and that you were just lucky/unlucky enough to catch one. That feeling seems lost now. Feels more like you can form a triangle Al'ikr dragon party in the future.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] Did you fight in a group or solo?

I fought Group/solo/duo. Group killed - Solo failed - duo might have worked eventually, but others joined.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] What do you think the most dangerous things about Dragons are?

Damage output is noticible to me. I had chudan + max CP on a toon I do Vet HM DLC content with <Just missing frostvault atm> and fireballs hit for 13-14K. W/o Chudan dmg increased to about 16K a pop. The damage felt noticible unlike other open world encounters <World bosses>

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] Is this something you’re looking forward to when Elsweyr launches?

The content. Raid/dragon hunting.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] Did the loot from Dragons feel satisfying?

Not really.

It feels the overworld drops could either be boosted or motifs should drop from dragons themselves. I look at things like the tank set and go "Plaguedoctor/Mothers sorrow etc should be something worthy of a dragon". It would make more sense.

I would prefer either revamping the gear or making it so dragons are dropping motifs themselves.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

*] Did the loot feel varied and useful?

Explained above - It does feel varied, but not useful to me.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

*] What are your thoughts on the new Dragon crafting ingredients, and the new Alchemy effect?

I haven't explored it yet.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] Do you have any other general feedback?

It WILL be compared with skyrim.

In comparison with Skyrim there are definitely things I miss. The chaotic nature of dragons invading towns where you "feel safe" is missing. They seem like static world bosses waiting to die. The scripted nature of them feels a bit too heavy handed.

I love the fact they are *not* as easy as world bosses. I killed three dragons over the course and went and kill one Else WB <Chicken boss> and one summer set boss <Lizard boss> to compare the two since I don't do that content. I was able to easily solo the two WB's without fear of death. The dragon is a no go. I have to actively try and keep my defenses up to avoid too much damage.

The HP seems right. I don't want to waltz into these things and feel like we just two shotted a dragon. Dragons have 14 mil hp and I swear one had 16 mil <Could be wrong as I had to alter settings to show hp mid fight>. WB's had around 2 mil <Those I killed that is>. So they feel like a craglorn normal trial boss, even some of the DLC normal bosses which I find refreshing for overland.

There is an opportunity to make these something very casual guilds can "raid" with large number of people or small sets <6-14 for example>. I do hope reward is taken into account for it.

Cireous

Rumor has it that dragons have a chance of dropping furnishing recipes and transmute stones! Is it weird to say that I love you, Zenimax? Because I am so in love with you right now. I was also able to watch a dragon fight on Twitch (finally!) and it seemed really exciting. People were dying over and over again (which is awesome) and the dragon wasn't killed off too quickly at all. He even flew up in the air a few times letting everyone pelt him a bit from range. I have no complaints here. I have heard, however, that all the dragons are exactly the same, which is a little disappointing. Um, can some be blue and shoot ice, too? I mean, there should be a little variation, right?

Either way, I'm super excited and I cannot wait until this content comes out. I hope, in the future, you will consider adding similar events to the older Tamriel zones which came out at launch. I'll take dragons, but any big boss fight randomly appearing somewhere, causing amazing chaos, and dropping furnishing recipes would make me happy.

OtarTheMad

Were you able to find Dragons in Elsweyr?
Yes, it was very easy. I loved that.

Did you find one at a distance and chase it down, or just stumble upon one?
Both, which was cool.

Did you fight in a group or solo?
Both, solo failed epically.

What do you think the most dangerous things about Dragons are?
Fire breath attacks and the fus-ro-dah attack. Both hit pretty hard and can wipe a group (depending on size of course)

Is this something you’re looking forward to when Elsweyr launches?
Yes, but I fear that so many players will be at the Dragon attack sites that the difficulty will be irrelevant and it'll be too easy to kill them. Yesterday I usually ended up fighting with about 6-8 other players at these sites and that seemed almost perfect. The dragons messed us up a lot of course that could also be the newness of the dragon attacks and players not knowing what to avoid yet.

Did the loot from Dragons feel satisfying?
Yeah, it was exciting to see what you got.

Did the loot feel varied and useful?
Yes.

What are your thoughts on the new Dragon crafting ingredients, and the new Alchemy effect?
I have not tested them yet but just from getting them I am excited today to make some potions. It could be interesting.

Do you have any other general feedback?
The dragon fights were fun and at certain size groups feels hard, especially when they do the fire and fus-ro-dah attacks cause both hit hard and kudos for doing that, watching others flying into the air is hilarious, one poor soul even got one shot... I guess always pay attention to your food/drink buff hahaha.

However the ground attacks could hit harder and also put in a few adds during this time, most likely big group will be at these things and the dragon will be melted in no time during this phase. Also when the dragon is perched he does not seem to do anything, an attack here would be dangerous to a group.

Lord_Eomer

Make Dragons drop some unique rare items, currently monster drops in ESO are very rationalized and no Hype to kill drgaon if similar loot can be obtained from different ways.

Joy_Division

• Were you able to find Dragons in Elsweyr? Yep. Although the cross swords combat sticks around after they die.
• Did you find one at a distance and chase it down, or just stumble upon one? Followed the map.
• Did you fight in a group or solo? Both. I think with practice I can be soloed.
• What do you think the most dangerous things about Dragons are? The unpurgable Fire Dot (note: I hate it when monsters are immune to my class abilities. The tail swipe and Wing attack aren't very dangerous and the Fus Ro Dah has too long of a telegraph.
• Is this something you’re looking forward to when Elsweyr launches? Yeah, I think the dragon difficulty should scale higher the more people are there though.
• Did the loot from Dragons feel satisfying? I like the new alchemy ingredients, but think we should get more than just one or two.
• Did the loot feel varied and useful? I'd have to do more, seem to be lots of green stuff though.
• What are your thoughts on the new Dragon crafting ingredients, and the new Alchemy effect? Nice addition, think more should drop though.
• Do you have any other general feedback? The add phase is kind of boring because the atros arent very dangerous and the dragon pretty much just sits there.

Mojmir

pretty good fight, i like the fire aura thats keeps melee back a bit. they are still too stationary for what dragons should be.

Red_Feather

I think the fire trails should last longer and do more damage. Making the situation more tense as the fight goes on.

D0PAMINE

Doing it on a Stamina Necromancer for the first time was punishing. The fight was great through. I would bet they can be soloed.

Strider__Roshin

They're so boring to fight. Way too passive. Might as well be a target dummy honestly. They barely fight back!

Wildberryjack

The icon is very plain and easy to see. The problem is the dragons die too fast. By the time I get there they are already dead. The other thing is the icon persists for quite a while after the dragon is dead and really it should vanish off the map the instant the dragon goes down so we know to not waste our time continuing to head that way only to find a dead dragon.

Ashryn

Were you able to find Dragons in Elsweyr?
They were well marked on the map and I like that it shows when there are people fighting them.

Did you find one at a distance and chase it down, or just stumble upon one?
I chased them down.

Did you fight in a group or solo?
I am a bit of a glass canon, so no soloing dragons for me. I died plenty fighting them in-group.

What do you think the most dangerous things about Dragons are?
The fire breath attack.

Is this something you’re looking forward to when Elsweyr launches?
Definitely!

Did the loot from Dragons feel satisfying?
Almost... Could have better then green items and would be nice to have random rare motifs drop at times.

Did the loot feel varied and useful?
Varied...but useful remains to be seen.

What are your thoughts on the new Dragon crafting ingredients, and the new Alchemy effect?
Haven't tested it yet, but it looks interesting

Do you have any other general feedback?
I enjoyed the dragon fight; liked that they spawn in different places (although that could be improved to cover a zone-wide
area); liked that they fly and at times are difficult to reach.

Nolic1

Were you able to find Dragons in Elsweyr? Yes it was easy enough to find with the symbols on the map.

Did you find one at a distance and chase it down, or just stumble upon one? Both found and stumbled upon them.

Did you fight in a group or solo? Both, They have enough challenge for a small group of 4 to 6 to be tough and for more it feels less of a challenge but solo it was a fail even though I can solo alot of the games group content.

What do you think the most dangerous things about Dragons are? There shouts hurt but there 90k damage AOE is a bit much other then that there mechanics seem good.

Is this something you’re looking forward to when Elsweyr launches? Yes I have been waiting for a long time for a good over land challenge.

Did the loot from Dragons feel satisfying? I do think for it being more of a Trial type health boss and being hard for solo and smaller then 4 in a group the reward is not enough maybe make it drop a purple gear or jewelry would help. The rest of the reward stuff is good.

Did the loot feel varied and useful? Yes this was one thing I like was how you got a mix of llot and even the dragon crafting mats.

What are your thoughts on the new Dragon crafting ingredients, and the new Alchemy effect? Still need to test this but so far its cool.

Do you have any other general feedback? I feel they need to be more random in there locations and maybe have the different color ones do different attacks other then that no not really that I did not explain above.

Ozby

They need more health and more resists as they feel to easy right now and need to be more epic.

TheValkyn

Loot was not interesting. If they dropped motif pages or special ingredients then I'd be interested.

Elong

Definitely need their attacks to be more random in nature, and take to the air more frequently or even just move from the spot they're stuck on.

mingimingi

Found the dragons easily enough, zone is beautiful,

but the fight just seems so easy and too stationary. No real challenge. I feel like this will become a dead world boss. Right now, it's too far to get to without it already being killed because it's so easy to defeat.

If there were some way to have the dragons with a bunch of health fly over a city, one with actual traders, or ways to hide, smithing stations, wayshrines, making it an actually dangerous long fight, that would be awesome. I would love to see like 40 +people struggle to take this dragon down.

I want to be forced to cooperate with people, possibly killed while going about my day.

thank you for giving us the opportunity to leave feedback

MaximusDecimus

Were you able to find Dragons in Elsweyr?
Yes.

Did you find one at a distance and chase it down, or just stumble upon one?
They were clearly marked on the map and I like the addition of the icon only appearing when they are up.

Did you fight in a group or solo?
It was a zerg of necromancers summoning a horde of the undead.

What do you think the most dangerous things about Dragons are?
The conal tickles a little bit but these are DRAGONS. I know you want these to be accessible to new players but they are a joke. They sit there like a 14M target dummy and occasionally sneeze at you. Now I absolutely love the dragon shouts BUT they need to hurt. I want them to require a 1H and Shield plus heavy armor to live. Not like a fully buffed main tank but just enough damage that it requires a tank. Right now if you were of the mind you could solo a dragon. We are not the dragon born. It should take 15-20 people with at least 1 healer and 1 tank. Each dragon should flash a warning across your screen warning you that they are not easy. We have world bosses already for soloable open world content.

Is this something you’re looking forward to when Elsweyr launches?
If they are more difficult and maybe had better drops I'd run them nonstop.

Did the loot from Dragons feel satisfying?
I think the rewards should be more impactful. They are okay now but they don't entice me to do them. Add like the alchemical satchels from ICP into the adventurer bags and I'd be much more inclined.

Did the loot feel varied and useful?
I guess same answer as above. Close but not enough to bring me in on loot alone. I think the loot might have to be adjusted with the difficulty of the dragon as well. If you actually make them hard (for casuals) so that it requires like 6 people to gather in a group and one person to volunteer to taunt the boss it should be similar to a trial reward (but a little less). Maybe like 2K-4K Undaunted Plunder garunteed.

What are your thoughts on the new Dragon crafting ingredients, and the new Alchemy effect?
Haven't tested this yet.

Do you have any other general feedback?
Please, pleeeeaasseee make them hard. These dragons should be in a class of their own in terms of difficulty. Overland Mobs<Delve Bosses<World Bosses<DLC World Bosses<Dragons<Trials Bosses. That's where they should fall visually. Basically on par with a normal trials boss.

Vapirko

dkbates wrote: »

ZOS - The Dragons have 14M health points but for the most part are just sitting on the ground taking damage from the surrounding players. The outcome is inevitable. If it isn't too late to change your programming, I suggest that they fly around more while distributing their own damage to players. Have them swoop down on players forcing quick evasion. The closer a player is the more damage is dealt to the dragon and vice versa. Something along these lines to force weapon swap, movement, and more of a challenge tactically.

And make the rewards bigger for killing them. For example - 3000 Gold, 3 soul gems, a rare crafting item, or anything that will draw groups to come back again and again and again.

Just some suggestions...

Agreed. Dragons shouldn’t be so tough that they can be overcome by a pug group putting out a decent amount of damage but their attacks should be punishing. WBs rn are a bit too easy for groups because most of their attacks aren’t that strong or easily avoided. I agree that dragons should have periods of battle where they are out of attack ransge but can burn down players.

Elissae

After the initial wow-factor, I do feel kinda disappointed by the static nature of their spawn.
I was honestly hoping for them being a randomly occurring, zone-wide threat.
Also, scaling HP would prevent them from being too zerg-able.

Olauron

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

• Do you have any other general feedback?

First I'd like to share my personal habits regarding World Bosses as a whole and Dragons in particular. Usually I'm questing and exploring the zone alone and when near the WB I may stop if I don't have an achievement. If I already cleared this WB then I don't care. If this WB is not cleared then I will wait 5 minutes max for somebody to appear (because soloing Summerset or Vvardenfell WBs not on a tank is not an option when even regular hit removes 90% of my health). If nobody appears then I move on questing or exploring.
I've been doing Vvardenfell about 1.5 years after its release and after the Summerset. I have to say that there was no situation ever when someone appeared at the WB approximately at the same time as me. Not a single time. Only such events as this week event bring some people to WB sites.
Having said that I understand the desire to make WBs and dragons in particular difficult but I'd like to remind that you should not only look for the first weeks of hype then the zone is full of players who are eager to kill a WB.

Edit: rephrasing to make post more clear.

BaylorCorvette

I like how they are implementing these "roaming" dragons. They are not super easy however I DEFINITELY do not think they need to be made easier. In fact, I'd support them being stronger. Last night on PTS about 8 of us PUGs took down a dragon fairly easy.

Glory

Were you able to find Dragons in Elsweyr?
Yes, very easily!
Did you find one at a distance and chase it down, or just stumble upon one?
They were resting, although I was following one when it was flying which was very cool.
Did you fight in a group or solo?
Group
What do you think the most dangerous things about Dragons are?
I died once when they were flying from their ground AoEs.
Is this something you’re looking forward to when Elsweyr launches?
For the beginning, although they kind of feel like Dolmens which are currently really only done for completion/grind.
Did the loot from Dragons feel satisfying?
Honestly I didn't check every time, but when I did check it felt somewhat overwhelming - 4 gold(!), 2 alchemy ingredients, and a meh set piece. Again, felt like a dolmen.
Did the loot feel varied and useful?
See above, I think the only thing I may have actually used would be the alchemy items.
What are your thoughts on the new Dragon crafting ingredients, and the new Alchemy effect?
I like that you're adding in more, I personally wish that there were more magicka based potions in the game (pretty much all the heroism potions from these new ingredients favor stam (restore stam, lingering health, AND heroism?? where is the magicka?)
Do you have any other general feedback?
I would love to see their dangerousness increased significantly. I feel like my group of 4 friends was more than easily able to kill a dragon in PvP gear, because we barely got hit. I feel like there are going to be giant dolmen sized groups of people easily killing these dragons, and I also feel like I could probably solo it easily (and I suck at PvE). I want to be scared to attack these things, and I would recommend having more attacks/larger radiuses (the damage felt about right if I stood in it!) so that I actually have a decent chance of dying to these dragons if it attacks me.

O-Los_Zulis

Were you able to find Dragons in Elsweyr?
Oh-yea, right there on the map.

Did you find one at a distance and chase it down, or just stumble upon one?
You can chase them down? The spots are sorta tucked in you can barely see the glow of the fight in the distance.

Did you fight in a group or solo?
Group. Solo would take too long.

What do you think the most dangerous things about Dragons are?
Don't blink or you will die from his breath attacks.

Is this something you’re looking forward to when Elsweyr launches?
Yea baby! This is neat as cane be

Did the loot from Dragons feel satisfying?
Not really. Don't get me wrong it is a good amount. I mostly looted green items. Maybe the dragon loot system could be explained.You know what would be cool a Dragon Kill Points system. Where we would have a choice for the treasure items we get now to sell to the merchants; we also have an option to collect them and turn-in to an award merchants for items. Just another idea.

Did the loot feel varied and useful?
The container loot is a great idea.

What are your thoughts on the new Dragon crafting ingredients, and the new Alchemy effect?
Have not used them yet but seems to be a great idea.

Do you have any other general feedback?
It needs to scale more. When there is 15 or more player in the encounter it should be ultra hard mode. I want to see GOT ashes everywhere. Also, the reset if everyone dies is too fast with the new rez-ghost thing we need to have delay timer before the reset.

Calarax

Give each Dragon a unique name and achievement. I would like to see them occasionally roam around the zone and blast you from above if you are not paying attention. I have played other games in the past where that happened. It always is an interesting story to say...there i was just fighting this mob and boom...toast from above. As someone who does housing extensively I would like to see some of the new plans drop from the Dragons. I did get an older "original release" plan from one I helped kill, but would love to see it be a new plan instead.